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Carol O
Sep. 27, 2011, 08:42 PM
Nice to see this in the October issue!

Velvet
Sep. 27, 2011, 09:13 PM
What is it? Free advertising for DT this week? :lol:

Carol O
Sep. 27, 2011, 10:34 PM
What is it? Free advertising for DT this week? :lol:

When you have a quality edition, word of mouth follows,.

Velvet
Sep. 27, 2011, 11:58 PM
Um, yeah. Quality since when? :lol:

The last topic shows just exactly the quality that you'd expect. Talking about getting more men in dressage because it's so sorely lacking that it's suffering from a lack of them? :no:

ToN Farm
Sep. 28, 2011, 08:30 AM
Agree with Velvet. I don't like the mag, but someone bought a subscription for me for a Christmas present. I find it geared toward beginner riders and the rest is all advertisement. When they have a pro write an article, there is never anything really 'new' in the articles. Boring.

I liked Axel's critiques the best of all that have done them. I am not a Zettl fan and I did not like his advice to these riders which was basically to ride your horse all strung out.

YogaFriend
Sep. 28, 2011, 08:33 AM
Velvet, have u read the article? It interviews many pros about the problems men face getting into the sport. What exactly is poor quality, besides that u might not like it?

The only poor quality I saw on the other thread was people being inappropriate about the whole topic and giving incorrect info about the article. Someone referred to being gay as "Gal" in one post and u r complaining about the article?!?!? Come on.

LaraNSpeedy
Sep. 28, 2011, 09:09 AM
I dont think it is geared towards BEGINNER riders - I think its geared towards lower level riders which is completely different. Its assumes people have an independent seat and reads like it assumes the reader is a solid intermediate or beginner intermediate. IMO. When running a business, you have to ask yourself who your audience is and how to reach as many as possible - to get as many subscribers as possible so you can make some money and stay in business.

If its all old news to you - dont buy the magazine.

The article about canter work I like. Not because I learned something new about the exercises but the bits of philosophy woven through the descriptions.

I have liked the new addition of riders sharing about difficult horses or issues they have worked with - usually high level riders. The last 3 issues, I copied the articles and gave them to a young woman who has a horse that she has spent 2-3 years patiently trying to work through some things. They really have inspired her. She is far better than a beginner rider.

The clinic is 'ok' usually - I have not read them in a while because I do feel that when someone sends in a picture in dressage - they will pick one that makes them look the best and when judging dressage I prefer to see a moving picture not a snapshot. You CAN read more in a snapshot of someone over a jump in PH I think but in dressage - I would rather see a 30 second clip at least. I guess I have not read the clinic in a while because I did not care for it.

Most magazines are filled with advertisements. Its what keeps the magazines going and keeps the price down for subscribers. Also, SOMETIMES a new product is out there and its nice to know about it.

quietann
Sep. 28, 2011, 09:20 AM
The clinic is 'ok' usually - I have not read them in a while because I do feel that when someone sends in a picture in dressage - they will pick one that makes them look the best and when judging dressage I prefer to see a moving picture not a snapshot. You CAN read more in a snapshot of someone over a jump in PH I think but in dressage - I would rather see a 30 second clip at least. I guess I have not read the clinic in a while because I did not care for it.


Don't the clinic subjects usually also have a test video online?

I will admit, I generally like DT (though this issue was disappointing), but then again I am very much a smurf when it comes to dressage.

Sandy M
Sep. 28, 2011, 09:26 AM
Welllll...I get free copies, so while I'm not impressed most of the time, it/s not as if I were wasting any money. However,I do find some of thearticles almost amusing: Something like "improving your canter zig-zags." Ummm..like someone at that level is going to look to a magazine article for helP? And it sure isn/t particularlyuseful(though it may be interesting) for lower level riders. (Sorry for typos) using one of those split/angled keyboards for ther first time)

Velvet
Sep. 28, 2011, 09:37 AM
Nope. Haven't read the article and I think it's in really poor form to advertise that mag out here on The Chronicle of the Horse . It's a competing mag and really shouldn't be advertised out here. If you have an article we all can read, that's one thing. Talking about one to generate more sales is another.

angel
Sep. 28, 2011, 10:38 AM
I do not find someone mentioning an article that they found useful to be advertising. As to the amount of ads found in any publication, it generally takes between 70% and 80% of the magazine to be ads, or the magazine would be losing money.

I have not subscribed to any horse magazine for many years, because as TonF said, lots of the information tends to be redundant.

I did not see the article to which the original poster refers. But, I have seen Walter Zettl do clinics. From the multiple clinics I have seen through the years, I find his to be amoung the most productive for the rider during that clinic. Whether they can take what he has taught them home to make it their own, I cannot say.

HorseNOTbicycle
Sep. 28, 2011, 10:39 AM
Dear Velvet,

You are a party foul. Everyone was having a nice book-club style conversation about an article they saw in a magazine and you had to go an ruin it. I have spent enough time dealing with those horrible barn women that feel it is their duty to suggest who people ride with, what they do with their horses and what saddle they should ride in. Don't you dare tell me what I can and can't talk about on a public space that you don't own.

suzy
Sep. 28, 2011, 10:48 AM
I haven't seen this month's issue yet. However, I don't see this thread as an advertisement but as a sharing of info on an article someone found interesting. DT only has a small overlap with COTH regarding their customer base, so I'm not sure there is any conflict here. I guess that's really the mods' call anyway. I think DT is improving--last month had a great article with Heather Blitz, and I enjoy anything written by Courtney King-Dye. Some of the stuff is redundant--that's the nature of dressage training. But refreshers can be helpful and sometimes I see the same info worded somewhat differently, making it more impactful. JMHO of course.

Gloria
Sep. 28, 2011, 10:49 AM
I audited Mr. Zettle's clinic once. During the recess, I approached him with a difficult problem I had with my horse. Now it was years ago and I was a rank beginner. He picked up my hand, held it, and showed me how to handle the reins.

That few seconds was one of the most amazing moments in my horsey career.

I don't know how to describe it, but it was gentle, senitive, and firm all at the same time. I felt I was about to purr and for some reason I simply wanted to do what he suggested, that I would not dare refuse it. I can see why horses would work their hearts out for him.

Regardless your "political" agenda, please give a master his due. He really IS a master.

tm
Sep. 28, 2011, 11:55 AM
Don't the clinic subjects usually also have a test video online?


Having the video submission along with the still photo was Axel's idea for his column. He is of that same mind as LaraNSpeedy, that it is difficult to critique a still photo in the context of dressage. Having a side by side submission of stills + video gives the magazine something that is printable (the still) and gives him enough information (the video) to make informative comments about the horse and rider. Besides, being married to me, he sees the beautiful photos that I've captured from movements which were ... not so beautiful.:lol:

The problem is, we need more submissions! The magazine is getting plenty of still photos, but not enough accompanying video clips. So as soon as there are more video + still submissions, we are all over it! :yes:

CapitolDesign
Sep. 28, 2011, 12:47 PM
Thank you Terri :) Yes, DT needs submissions with videos!

SillyHorse
Sep. 28, 2011, 12:50 PM
Dear Velvet,

You are a party foul. Everyone was having a nice book-club style conversation about an article they saw in a magazine and you had to go an ruin it. I have spent enough time dealing with those horrible barn women that feel it is their duty to suggest who people ride with, what they do with their horses and what saddle they should ride in. Don't you dare tell me what I can and can't talk about on a public space that you don't own.
What are you spouting about? What "everyone" was having this "nice conversation" of which you speak? Velvet's post was the second one in the thread. :lol:

HorseNOTbicycle
Sep. 28, 2011, 01:58 PM
What are you spouting about? What "everyone" was having this "nice conversation" of which you speak? Velvet's post was the second one in the thread. :lol:

I was referring to her second post - post #10 - that was complaining about what we should/shouldn't be able to post on the forum. Are you ok with her telling everyone they should not be discussing magazine articles from other publications on this forum, because I am not.

Velvet
Sep. 28, 2011, 02:24 PM
I was referring to her second post - post #10 - that was complaining about what we should/shouldn't be able to post on the forum. Are you ok with her telling everyone they should not be discussing magazine articles from other publications on this forum, because I am not.

:rolleyes: Since YOU were not a part of the conversation at all, are you a new alter for Carol or someone else out here? Must be. You only have a few posts and yet you spewed at me immediately.

I'm guessing this is another person wanting to keep on "nice" alter and then have one "mean" alter in their pocket. :rolleyes: Yet another reason I'm so happy I have the ignore feature!

It is advertising when there is NO mention of the topic at all. Not book club type posts since it mentions an article but not what is in it. It's closed off to anyone who has not read the article. Has no details for the general COTH forum populace. Thus, I stand by my first conclusion that it's a way of sneaking in advertising to bump circulation for DT.

Carol O
Sep. 28, 2011, 02:28 PM
I did something new when I read the clinic yeaterday. I looked at the photos and jotted down my own critique, then I read the commentary. At first I just jotted down the faults, but after reading WZs commentary I went back and commented on the correct stuff too. Sorry, spoil-sports, but I enjoyed the activity and the commentary.

I enjoy DT, and no, I am not getting a kick back for saying this.

I really liked the story on Chuck Grant. When I was younger and riding hunters his was one of those names you saw once in a while. Now I wish I had paid more attention! What an interesting guy!

WZ has been a bit out of sight for a while. I wonder if he is free from other obligations now.....

alicen
Sep. 28, 2011, 07:33 PM
You only have a few posts and yet you spewed at me immediately.

Please do tell, Velvet. What is the requisite number of posts required for spewing at you?

ToN Farm
Sep. 29, 2011, 09:10 AM
Thank you Terri :) Yes, DT needs submissions with videos!
I think if there was a way a person could send in a video and not have their name and that of their horse published, you might get more submissions. I realize the problem this presents, in that somebody could send in a video of someone else they were not authorized to share. Perhaps there is some way to get around this. CapitolDesign, you show; why don't you send in a video of your test? I'm guessing it is for the reason I stated.

angel
Sep. 29, 2011, 10:29 AM
I do not think that one really needs a video to see what is wrong with a ride. But, I would suggest three "stills,"...one at walk, one at trot, and one at canter....each done on a straight line. These kind of shots are very telling...as much as a video in my mind.

tm
Sep. 29, 2011, 12:17 PM
Angel, it depends on who is taking the photos! ;) I could submit 10 pictures from a test, and they would all be at the moment of the best balance and engagement that the horse & rider could muster. Someone else might send in 10 pictures and they might all be at less optimal moments. But neither option would be a complete view of the ride.

It is harder to pick out a "moment" when it's a video being critiqued.

CFFarm
Sep. 29, 2011, 12:19 PM
I like the "clinics" a lot more since Lisa's not doing the fashion news anymore.

I also enjoy "My biggest training problem" (do I have the right magazine?).

That's about it though. Since I'm not showing nowadays, I think I'll probably let my subscription run out.

I always recommend the "Matter of Trust" series to beginning dressage riders. I love WAZ even though.......I won't go there.:sadsmile:

tm
Sep. 29, 2011, 12:30 PM
I think if there was a way a person could send in a video and not have their name and that of their horse published, you might get more submissions. I realize the problem this presents, in that somebody could send in a video of someone else they were not authorized to share. Perhaps there is some way to get around this. CapitolDesign, you show; why don't you send in a video of your test? I'm guessing it is for the reason I stated.

Thanks for the input, ToN. It never occurred to me that the folks who submit images/video might want anonymity: most have been very open in sharing their names, where the horse came from, their history together, etc. (*edited to add that we've only use riders' first names in print.) But if anonymity is an issue, I'm sure that DT would be more than happy to give the rider an alias, as long as the rider identified herself privately. The rider can protect their own identity by setting up a youtube channel under a screen name as well.

Anyone else? Is this something that should be addressed?

katarine
Sep. 29, 2011, 12:39 PM
Having the video submission along with the still photo was Axel's idea for his column. He is of that same mind as LaraNSpeedy, that it is difficult to critique a still photo in the context of dressage.
The problem is, we need more submissions! The magazine is getting plenty of still photos, but not enough accompanying video clips. So as soon as there are more video + still submissions, we are all over it! :yes:

Would there be a willingness to consider a still of a TWH and a video of Training 2....on a gaited horse :) ?

tm
Sep. 29, 2011, 12:45 PM
Would there be a willingness to consider a still of a TWH and a video of Training 2....on a gaited horse :) ?

I honestly don't know the answer!

katarine
Sep. 29, 2011, 12:55 PM
Well, we're going to find out :)

angel
Sep. 29, 2011, 01:27 PM
TM....most pictures "stills" do give away problems that are occuring throughout a whole test. The rider's position results in certain problems, which means that the observer must understand how the rider's balance inpacts the horse. The horse's head, neck, footfall, shown in most stills shows the results as the horse and rider tend to mimic each other's crookedness. What a still does actually is capture in greater detail problems of which an onlooker might not be aware when watching the motion, itself. The motion can trick the eye. Yes, I agree a skilled photographer can hide certain flaws...for instance, by taking the picture from the horse's left side. But, even then, one only has to look at the fashion the feet of the horse are landing.

Let's take a photo from the left and one done from the right. The better appearing body of the horse will be from this left side as you cannot see that the horse's left hip is falling in. What you can see is that the horse's hind legs are striking too far apart, with the right hind really trailing. If we could flip that photo so that the right side of the horse were to be seen in the same position, you would now think the footfalls were correct due to the distortion of the angle, but you would clearly be able to see that the horse's left hip is falling to the outside. Similarly, you could see position flaws in the rider that also indicate a problem, especially if the rider's toes point toward the ground...definitely a horse on the forehand.

tm
Sep. 29, 2011, 03:56 PM
Thank you for the lesson in looking at dressage photos, Angel. :winkgrin: