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Kdash1228
Aug. 18, 2011, 09:48 AM
I was speaking with one of my dressage trainers a week ago regarding a new dressage bit for my horse (for several reasons). She recommended the KK Ultra Loose Ring and uses it for all the horses she rides/trains because of the great success she has had with it. It is for sale at Dover for $120 and while that is more than what I truly want to pay for a bit, I definitely will if it is worth the money (which, from what I have heard, it is).

I saw that there were other similar bits of different brands. Has anyone had any success with them? I don't want buy a bit just to save a little bit of cash, only to end up buying the KK, because the cheaper ones caused more harm than good.

These were the others I was looking at:
Stübben Sweet Copper Loose Ring ($65) -- ideally, this is the one I am leaning more towards
AlBaCon Elite Loose Ring ($37) -- ?? had 3 great reviews ??

Any opinions, recommendations, experiences with any of these, or even any other bit with the "bean" in the middle.

Rhiannonjk
Aug. 18, 2011, 09:54 AM
I can't tell from the pictures of those, but the advantage of the KK Ultra is that the connections between the long pieces and the short pieces is at an angle that [I'm sure somebody else here can explain the "why" better than me] um... provides softer contact?

All I know is that when you start comparing the KK to other bits that "Look" the same, what you look for is that angle in the connector piece.

hopper20
Aug. 18, 2011, 09:54 AM
The JP Korsteel loose ring is even cheaper (less than $30). My very small-mouthed, flat-palated horse goes quite well in the eggbutt version.

Kdash1228
Aug. 18, 2011, 10:13 AM
Thank you both! I wasn't sure exactly what the difference was between the three bits, other than the possible size of the short piece from the pictures.

Can someone explain if/how an eggbutt effects the horse differently than a loose ring?

netg
Aug. 18, 2011, 10:13 AM
The JP Korsteel loose ring is even cheaper (less than $30). My very small-mouthed, flat-palated horse goes quite well in the eggbutt version.

I don't remember for sure if I have that or the Albacon (I think the Albacon) but my horse liked both - and hated the KK.

My trainer uses the KK on most of her horses, and most love it. Put it in my horse's mouth, and he makes the most horrible gagging faces, mouth open as far as he can get it and tongue sticking out, rolling his eyes back in his head. Yes, he's a drama queen, but the point is very clear - even with no rider, he HATES the bits. He's small-mouthed with a flat palate, and the KKs my trainer has were just too thick for him.

Kdash1228
Aug. 18, 2011, 10:20 AM
Does anyone know Dover's policy on returning bits? If I remember correctly, my horse's current bit (that was custom made.. spoiled brat..) has a pretty decent thickness to it. Now I am starting to think I don't want to spend $120 on a bit when I could have spent much less for something that works better..

I hate buying new things....

TheHotSensitiveType
Aug. 18, 2011, 11:13 AM
If you buy a new bit, it is yours. You do not have the option to return it (at least that was everyone's policy when I was looking for a bit a year ago).

Will your instructor let you borrow the KK Ultra for a few rides? A friend's mare goes great in that bit, but my mare? Head shaking and bucking! Yes it was all related to the bit because the head shaking and bucking stopped when I switched bits. I am so thankful my friend let me borrow that bit before I bought it.

Eggbutts are more "stable" in the horses mouth meaning it does not have the potential to pinch the corners of the horses mouth like a loose-ring and the bit is in a fixed position in relation to a horse's mouth. Loose-rings obviously allow the bit to move around the rings, making it annoying to horses that prefer things to stay. I read somewhere that loose rings can be great for horses that tend to lean because the bit moves making it harder for them to lean, but of course I can not find the reference now.

FWIW, my mare dislikes loose rings, hates single jointed bit, did ok in the JP Korsteel curved eggbutt french link snaffle (other mare goes brilliantly in this bit!), and is doing better in a french link baucher. If at all possible, really, really try to borrow bits before your buy! Otherwise you will spend a fortune.

betonbill
Aug. 18, 2011, 11:20 AM
There are always some on E-bay.

Kdash1228
Aug. 18, 2011, 11:32 AM
THST - Thank you so much! I will definitely see if I can borrow the bit. Going to a KK loose ring will mean going to a complete opposite type of bit for me, and I sure don't want to spend a ton of money on bits I am never going to use.

Betonbill - I actually saw several KK's on ebay a week ago for half off that would have fit my horse. But they are no longer there :(

Tegan
Aug. 18, 2011, 11:39 AM
Also, Bit of Britain does a rental program on the Sprenger bits, so you can send them back if it doesn't work out.
http://www.bitofbritain.com/Herm_Sprenger_Bit_Rental_Program_s/357.htm

I have the KK Ultra and love it, but I had to buy the 14mm one, as my mare has a small mouth. I tried the Sprenger Dynamic before and HATED it, my mare was so strong and completely ran through it.

Kdash1228
Aug. 18, 2011, 11:56 AM
Thanks Tegan! I just might give that a try!

LittleblackMorgan
Aug. 18, 2011, 01:15 PM
Once you use one, you probably won't use anything else. I'm a fan of a bargain, never pay retail.

I tried it on both more horses (a friends). I now own 2 KK's (not ultras) and 1 Ultra.
All 3 were bought used on Ebay for $70 or less.

It's not going to wear out. It is a GOOD bit and holds its value used. If you dont like it, sell it on Ebay.

Seriously, I recommend it. My mare hated the regular KK, she was sucking back and avoiding. The Ultra is wonderful on her, she relaxes right to it.

My pony has the knock off version, a big fat Korsteel. He LOFFS it. Chomp chomp chomps on it.

mbm
Aug. 18, 2011, 01:34 PM
many tack shops will allow bit returns. just ask. i have been known to buy many and try them all on and return all that didnt work. of course this was a local shop so shipping wasnt a problem.

you can also find used bits online peridically at a discount - maybe $75 or so. use a bit of sprenger bit polish and tehyy look literally good as new.

sprenger bits are very worth the $$ altho i give them a ding on cred for trying to be so trendy with all the new bit designs... the kk is truly a classic bit that works with almost every horse.

and fwiw, the difference between HS bits and others is

a) quality of the product
b) quality of the workmanship
c) they just fit better somehow!
d) the angles and different on the links so the bit lies differently in the horses mouth.
e) they hold their value very very well :)

Kdash1228
Aug. 18, 2011, 01:40 PM
Thanks everyone!! I have a Dover store 5 minutes from my house (its on my way to the barn :uhoh:) and just asked the online rep. and they informed me that the bit can be returned :D I'm definitely going to try the KK and am praying he likes it!

Manni01
Aug. 18, 2011, 02:22 PM
I use the KK Ultra for all my horses and it works perfectly!! I would never use anything else. But it has to fit. I returned several bits until I found the right one for each horse... They last if used regularly for about 7 to 8 years...

esdressage
Aug. 18, 2011, 02:59 PM
Just another endorsement for the KK Ultra. My mare LOVES it!

SecondInCommand
Aug. 18, 2011, 03:05 PM
I use the KK Ultra for all my horses and it works perfectly!! I would never use anything else. But it has to fit. I returned several bits until I found the right one for each horse... They last if used regularly for about 7 to 8 years...

Manni, I've had mine for longer than that, and it's used maybe 5-6 times per week. What signs do you see when they are wearing out? There's nothing I see on mine that worries me, nor is my horse protesting the bit. Is there anything specific I should be watching for with a KK? This is the first time I've ever heard someone say they wear out so quickly...

Janet
Aug. 18, 2011, 03:41 PM
Depends on the horse.
I have one mare that definitely prefers the KK Ultra (strainght arms, angled center oval).

I have another who definitely prefers the JP (curved arms, non-angled, flat center piece) (The JP is also available with the oval center)

cuatx55
Aug. 18, 2011, 03:54 PM
The JP Korsteel loose ring is even cheaper (less than $30). My very small-mouthed, flat-palated horse goes quite well in the eggbutt version.



Yes, I was just going to post this. Love the JP bits

Manni01
Aug. 18, 2011, 03:57 PM
Manni, I've had mine for longer than that, and it's used maybe 5-6 times per week. What signs do you see when they are wearing out? There's nothing I see on mine that worries me, nor is my horse protesting the bit. Is there anything specific I should be watching for with a KK? This is the first time I've ever heard someone say they wear out so quickly...

Well of course I´m overanxious.:o but IMO after that time the edges of the hole for the ring get sharp because the rings used up the material of the bit. I made the same observation in the middle of the bit. After I got the new one, I could see a distinct difference.

Actually these bits last much longer than the traditional broken bits we used before. They tended to get sharp edges much sooner....
So I´m quite happy with their durability...

luvmydutch
Aug. 18, 2011, 04:24 PM
I use the JP Korsteel eggbutt with the copper bean on my dutch wb. She LOVES it. i've tried lots of different herm sprenger bits and none of them are as comfortable for my mare as this one. I think the fact that it's anatomically curved and fairly thin make it really comfy in their mouths. Highly recommend it :)

hopper20
Aug. 18, 2011, 04:28 PM
I use the JP Korsteel eggbutt with the copper bean on my dutch wb. She LOVES it. i've tried lots of different herm sprenger bits and none of them are as comfortable for my mare as this one. I think the fact that it's anatomically curved and fairly thin make it really comfy in their mouths. Highly recommend it :)

Yes, this is the exact same bit I use, but I haven't used any of the others because I'm cheap.

Kdash1228
Aug. 18, 2011, 08:39 PM
Oh decisions, decisions!!!

Just curious, how did everyone decide on the width for the KK they use? My trainer said the 16 or 18 would be fine (depending on the width of my current bit, she told me to find the one that's closest to the current width). I was told my horse used to be heavy in the mouth, which is why he has a custom lift bit (that Ive decided to only use for jumping), so I wasn't sure if anyone had any experience with determining the width. I'm going this weekend to Dover and of course am going to keep trying bits til I find the one that fits well with my horse.

3Hanns
Aug. 18, 2011, 09:21 PM
I have many HS bit's including the KK, but my horse prefers the Albacon bits....they are super bits! They are a bit lighter than the HS's (weight wise) if that helps you at all....try it!

3Hanns
Aug. 18, 2011, 09:40 PM
I have many HS bit's including the KK, but my horse prefers the Albacon bits....they are super bits! They are a bit lighter than the HS's (weight wise) if that helps you at all....try it!

purplnurpl
Aug. 19, 2011, 10:16 AM
I was speaking with one of my dressage trainers a week ago regarding a new dressage bit for my horse (for several reasons). She recommended the KK Ultra Loose Ring and uses it for all the horses she rides/trains because of the great success she has had with it. It is for sale at Dover for $120 and while that is more than what I truly want to pay for a bit, I definitely will if it is worth the money (which, from what I have heard, it is).

I saw that there were other similar bits of different brands. Has anyone had any success with them? I don't want buy a bit just to save a little bit of cash, only to end up buying the KK, because the cheaper ones caused more harm than good.

These were the others I was looking at:
Stübben Sweet Copper Loose Ring ($65) -- ideally, this is the one I am leaning more towards
AlBaCon Elite Loose Ring ($37) -- ?? had 3 great reviews ??

Any opinions, recommendations, experiences with any of these, or even any other bit with the "bean" in the middle.

there are a few tack shops that have the rental program.

but all I have to say is: once you go KK you'll never go back.
There is no comparison.
They are made of a soft metal and are also very heavy. The wieght of the bit is a huge deal for me. Love them.

Don't be fooled by other bits that "look" the same.

ebay has good listings.
just search KK bit

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sprenger-KK-conrad-ultra-Aurigan-bit-size-5-18-mm-/270792868983?pt=UK_Horse_Wear_Equipment&hash=item3f0c834477

I like this one a lot too.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sprenger-KK-conrad-Aurigan-loose-ring-bit-5-18-mm-/270800375140?pt=UK_Horse_Wear_Equipment&hash=item3f0cf5cd64

holly cow!!! great deal.
this curb alone is over 200 bucks!!!
full double bridle with both bits for under 200 here!!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Tony-Slater-Saddlery-Rolled-Double-Bridle-KK-bits-/280723591667?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item415c6e11f3

ThegoodLife
Aug. 19, 2011, 12:59 PM
I bought the KK ultra loose ring with the roller thingy, for my guy about a month ago.
I bought it, because my coach lent me the KKDee ring, which he went pretty well in.
I found the KK ultra loose ring, used, for $100.
Like others said above, try a KK out before you buy.
The type of metal thats used in KK's is a much heavier, higher quailty than in less exspensive bits, which is why theyre so pricey.

My horse LOVED the loose ring, and with in a week of riding in it, he was a completely different horse.
Buuuut, all horses are different, so what works on one, might not work on another.

Kdash1228
Aug. 21, 2011, 01:32 PM
Thanks everyone! Turns out my horse lovvess the KK bit. Tried two other bits before and he fought them a little bit. The instant I tried the KK he was a happy horse and was glad to give to the bit.

I found one on eBay that's the perfect size - so let's hope I win :) but if anyone knows of any other 5.5" 16mm for sale, I'm very interested! Thanks everyone!!!

Dressage_Diva333
Aug. 22, 2011, 01:03 AM
Another vote for the KK Ultra's :D ALL of my horses go in KK Ultra Loose Ring French Links :yes: My double set are also Herm Sprenger... I found those used in a tack consignment shop for $80 :)

I really do see a difference though. The horses seem to stay softer, and happier throughout the ride. They are all very light and responsive. I discovered the KK's about 6 years ago when I had a little Arab mare who just didn't seem happy in any other bit I tried. I didn't know much about them at this point, but they had a french link loose ring in the size I needed, so I figured I'd try it. INSTANT difference! I was so pleased. I've had many similar results.

LLong
Aug. 22, 2011, 10:00 AM
I have a KK french link loose ring that I was planning on sticking up on ebay.

It's a little too big and fat for my tb's petite mouth. I think it's probably 5.5" or 5.25". If you (or anyone else) is interested in it I can take a picture of it and measure it. PM me if you are!

Cruisesmom
Aug. 24, 2011, 10:13 PM
I tried the koresteel, and the stubben goldwing. Neither got the effect the KK ultra did. Well worth its weight in gold! (i got it on ebay too for $65.00!!!)

quietann
Aug. 24, 2011, 10:46 PM
What do you do with a horse who does not like heavy bits? I tried one of the HS Eggbutts with an Aurigan mouthpiece -- very heavy -- and miss horse said NO! I currently am trying a borrowed KK D-ring on her and she seems to like it, but it's an older one, not Aurigan, and not so heavy. (She seems happier in a D-ring or eggbutt than a loose ring.)

NJRider
Aug. 25, 2011, 12:58 PM
Great deals on the KK Sprenger Conrads

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Herm-Sprenger-KK-Conrad-Bit-/270805082653?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f0d3da21d


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Herm-Sprenger-KK-Conrad-Bit-5-25-5-1-4-/270805793981?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f0d487cbd

stolen virtue
Aug. 25, 2011, 07:57 PM
I use the KK Sprenger on my guy and my young OTTB. I started my older TB with loose rings and keep him in them. I have a half moon copper loose ring Pessoa because it seems to help him with his tongue playing (he puts his tongue over the bit and then under, then over....).

I am pretty committed to less is more for bits, and I have tried many bits. Friends can help if you want to try bits but I will always have the KK Sprenger in my bit collection.