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Knothead
Jul. 26, 2011, 09:08 AM
No excuse to not be able to find a rule on this except that I'm at work and we're on trial right now -- this is probably a question for rule gurus or a T.D. -- if you've entered a rec show and you decide before your class (reasonable amount of time, like 15-20 mins) that you want to change your status for your NEXT test that you have not ridden yet to "HC", is it permitted?

Velvet
Jul. 26, 2011, 10:50 AM
Never seen a problem with changing to HC--ever. As long as show management knows about it before the ride, it's fine. That just lets them know not to have your scores go towards placings for ribbons. The judge does not need to know that you're riding HC. They don't care. They are scoring your ride based on what happens in the ring. The only thing HC does is keep you from getting a placing and maybe a ribbon.

No problem switching to HC. I don't know that I would wait until 20-15 minutes before the class, though. If you know you want to ride HC, why not just tell them when you show up for the day at the show grounds?

Knothead
Jul. 26, 2011, 11:42 AM
Well, mainly I want to see how my first ride goes before deciding. But, I'll ask the TD upon my arrival and see what her preference is for notice.

Velvet
Jul. 26, 2011, 11:50 AM
Well, mainly I want to see how my first ride goes before deciding. But, I'll ask the TD upon my arrival and see what her preference is for notice.

Not the TD, the show secretary. As them when you get to the show grounds. The TD doesn't care. The show secretary does! :yes:

Knothead
Jul. 26, 2011, 12:33 PM
Ah -- figured the TD would give me the "rule", but either way. They are usually found in the office with the show secretary in any event. Thanks.

Spectrum
Jul. 26, 2011, 12:37 PM
Remember that if you ride HC, all the rest of your rides for the show under that entry must be HC!

Once you go HC, you can't go back later in the show. So you only want to do that if you don't need/want any more scores for the weekend.

As a show secretary, I think if you wanted you could probably walk in and tell the judge prior to your ride that you are riding HC- as long as its designated prior to going down centerline, I think you could do it.
Spectrum.

SillyHorse
Jul. 26, 2011, 12:41 PM
As a show secretary, I think if you wanted you could probably walk in and tell the judge prior to your ride that you are riding HC- as long as its designated prior to going down centerline, I think you could do it.
Spectrum.
It makes sense that the show secretary would need to know, but why would the judge need (or even want) to know?

Knothead
Jul. 26, 2011, 12:51 PM
Remember that if you ride HC, all the rest of your rides for the show under that entry must be HC!

Once you go HC, you can't go back later in the show. So you only want to do that if you don't need/want any more scores for the weekend.

As a show secretary, I think if you wanted you could probably walk in and tell the judge prior to your ride that you are riding HC- as long as its designated prior to going down centerline, I think you could do it.
Spectrum.

Oh THAT I didn't know (all rides have to be HC on that entry). Okay, well that sort of settles it then. Ride it or scratch it! :-) Thanks.

DutchDressageQueen
Jul. 26, 2011, 01:37 PM
What does HC mean?

dragonharte8
Jul. 26, 2011, 01:58 PM
HC stands for the French "hors de concourse," which means "out of competition." People typically ride "HC" when they want to ride for a judge and be scored, but they don't want the score posted or be considered for placings/ribbons.

honeylips
Jul. 26, 2011, 02:19 PM
It is hors concours

rothmpp
Jul. 26, 2011, 02:22 PM
I believe it is the show manager (who may or may not be the secretary) who gets the final say about HC.

I know that sometimes it used to be used by trainers for naughty AA or JR horses, so that they could ride the horse in a AA or JR slot, but now the rule reads that once the horse is ridden HC, that horse is HC for the rest of the show, NOT the horse/rider combo.

I have seen some show managers be very stingy about allowing HC, and some that don't care.

Velvet
Jul. 26, 2011, 02:52 PM
Stingy about HC? Why in the world would they be stingy? It means you pay for a class but they don't have to record anything and you won't be getting a chance at a ribbon. Not seeing why they wouldn't want to allow it.

BTW, HC means something more like "except competitiion." So, you are an exception and are not competing.

We used to term it "without honors" because you are riding and getting a score, but are not competing.

rothmpp
Jul. 26, 2011, 05:18 PM
Stingy about HC? Why in the world would they be stingy? It means you pay for a class but they don't have to record anything and you won't be getting a chance at a ribbon. Not seeing why they wouldn't want to allow it.



I've heard it explained this way - there are a certain amount of pros that will enter a show hoping to get a higher scoring judge. When the schedule comes out and they got the judge that doesn't like their horse or just scores tougher overall, the pro will want an HC so as to get the ride and comments, but not blow their average for the year on that horse. Not that I agree with being difficult about allowing HC, just I've heard a couple different managers say that they have had experience with some riders not wanting to ruin their average if the show is not scoring as they would like. Though not wanting to hurt your average is not really a reason to HC in my book. I pretty much take my lumps if I deserve them that weekend.

And really the only thing they might not have to do is give you a $2 ribbon. The rest is still happening. The HC is reported to the USEF/USDF, so there is still the paperwork involved. Everyone still does the work except for maybe 2 minutes at the scoring table. So, a HC saves a show $2 and 2 minutes.