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regalace
Jun. 6, 2011, 12:22 PM
I was having a discussion with my barn owner this weekend and it got me wondering what is correct. Sorry for the cross-post to the eventing forum, I'm an eventer and she is H/J and I'm wondering if there are differences.

We had set up a gymnastic that is an X 9' to a ground pole, 9' to a small (18" or 2') vertical. Basically a one-stride with placing pole. We also have been making it into two small verticals and riding it in either direction.

Recently I set up another rail behind the vertical so that it was an X, 9' to ground pole, 9' to small square oxer (maybe 18" high and 12" to 18" wide). The barn owner isn't comfortable jumping that b/c she says the distance to an oxer should be longer than to a vertical. I haven't actually ridden this gymnastic yet--we ended up working on dressage that day instead--but I don't want to put up an incorrect distance that will hurt the horses. The barn owner tends to be not much for variety in gymnastics, while I'm a little in the opposite direction, I tend to set stuff up to see how it works out, but I'd like to know what's correct and fair for the horses.

Thoughts? How do you add small oxers into gymnastics correctly? (BTW, I have both Jimmy Wofford's gymnastic book and the 101 Jumping Exercises book, just don't have them with me right now.)

fordtraktor
Jun. 6, 2011, 12:26 PM
No, you are right -- I regularly jump mine over oxers as you have set it up, though I rarely use the placing pole.

If anything the distance to the front rail of an oxer should be shorter, because the arc of the jump will crest beyond it. No need at this level/distance, though, 18' is standard.

ETA: you are trotting in, right? This is the distance for a trot gymnastic, not a canter one.

Give and Take
Jun. 6, 2011, 12:30 PM
i would get a verbal agreement with the BO about setting distances directly out of those books and keeping them with you at the barn - although you will need to adjust for size of horse/ pony.

gymnastics are a great exercise for helping horses figure out their feet and for riders to stay still. but gymnastics set wrong, even at 2' high can be very risky.

i keep both of those books in my trunk and have a 100' tape.

JB
Jun. 6, 2011, 12:32 PM
18' after an X is about the right distance, assuming the horse has an average stride, if you trot in to the X.

if you canter in, it's going to be short. If short is what you're after, go for it, but that's pretty short!

regalace
Jun. 6, 2011, 12:43 PM
Yes, to clarify, we are trotting in! The 18' distance with placing pole has been working very well.

The awkward thing is that her horse and mine are very different--hers is shorter-strided and she's been working hard to open up his topline and get him stretching over the jump. My guy gets long and flat and on his forehand, so I go for a slightly shorter distance to rock him back and get him to not leave from a mile away. But then too, I have been known to feel as though the horse is running or pulling when in fact he's just striding out comfortably, so I don't want to go too short. (Part of the point of gymnastics for me is to balance the horse and get me comfortable with a longer stride.)

fourmares
Jun. 6, 2011, 06:46 PM
The simplest version is to do pole, 9ft, cross rail, 18ft, verticle, 21 ft, oxer. (remember that the horse took a canter stride between the cross rail and the verticle.) 18ft to 18 ft is a different exercise, and while not entirely incorrect, it is more difficult.

DMK
Jun. 6, 2011, 10:22 PM
just to give you an idea, in this video (http://www.youtube.com/user/dmklinger#p/u/6/G2bPTtUsDf4) it's 18 feet between the X and the oxer. I'm thinking if you had an 2' high oxer it would be easier. ;)

Janet
Jun. 6, 2011, 11:54 PM
as a rule of thumb, the distance to an oxer should ideally be about 6" SHORTER than the distance to a vertical. But "the same" is fine for a gymnastic.

Unles there is very specific reason that I can't think of of the top of my head, I wouldn't make the distance to the oxer LONGER than the distance to the vertical.

But I might make the oxer WIDER (up to twice as wide as it is tall).

If you look at the books on gymnastics, they describe specific exercises "to open up his topline and get him stretching over the jump" and to " rock him back and get him to not leave from a mile away".

fourmares
Jun. 7, 2011, 02:04 AM
The reason the second distance is set longer is that the horse isn't trotting into it. Why not try it both ways and see which one feels better to you.

alibi_18
Jun. 7, 2011, 08:24 AM
But I might make the oxer WIDER (up to twice as wide as it is tall).".

I wouldn't personaly do that as the horse might think he can put its feet in the large gap that such oxer would create.
I can't find if there is a x/y rule regarding this but in the FEI rules oxers can only be 1m70 high x 2m wide.

Oxers can be a bit larger than taller but not that much. If you want to go wider, do a Triple bars or a Fan.

GingerJumper
Jun. 7, 2011, 10:09 AM
In USEF rules an oxer can only be 6" wider than the jump is tall (so, a 3'6 oxer could be 4' wide, etc) and FEI rules are as alibi stated. Unless you have some serious fillers or even a liverpool, keep the oxer close to the same width as height.

Janet
Jun. 7, 2011, 04:52 PM
I wouldn't personaly do that as the horse might think he can put its feet in the large gap that such oxer would create.
I can't find if there is a x/y rule regarding this but in the FEI rules oxers can only be 1m70 high x 2m wide.

Oxers can be a bit larger than taller but not that much. If you want to go wider, do a Triple bars or a Fan.
I am talking about it as a GYMNASTIC EXERCISE, not in competition.

There are LOTS of things you do in gymnastic exercises that are not legal for the show ring- bounces for instance.

Jimmy Wofford definitely has exercses with oxers 2' high and 4' wide. you start with it sqare, and gradually make it wider. You can put a rail diagonally across the top to make it clear the horse is supposed to jump the whole thing.

It is much more inviting than it sounds.

Janet
Jun. 7, 2011, 05:07 PM
In USEF rules an oxer can only be 6" wider than the jump is tall (so, a 3'6 oxer could be 4' wide, etc) and FEI rules are as alibi stated. Unless you have some serious fillers or even a liverpool, keep the oxer close to the same width as height.
That may be true for USEF straight Show Jumping, but not true for other disciplines.

In Eventing Show Jumping, oxers can be 10 inches wider than they are tall (2'7" high, 3'5" wide for BN up to 4'1" high, 4'11" wide for Advanced).

In Eventing cross country, they can be even wider at the upper levels (3'11" high and 5'11" wide at Advanced)

Gilberto11
Jun. 20, 2011, 02:45 AM
It is better to go with the try and test model. Do what you feel right, also get suggestions from expert. Make sure that you use good quality equipments.