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mimiwenk
Jun. 3, 2011, 08:39 PM
I have heard (posted at show and on dressage daily's site) that the scores are available online immediately. I can't find them on the website; does anyone know where they are?

J-Lu
Jun. 3, 2011, 10:13 PM
Check out the results for the regular show and the CDI here:

http://www.cdi-raleigh.com/ridetimes.shtml

Just click through to the class you are interested in. They update in real time.

mimiwenk
Jun. 4, 2011, 08:23 AM
thanks!

MediaMD
Jun. 5, 2011, 12:45 AM
It was wonderful to see such great rides tonight at the Raleigh CDI/Y/J Capital Dressage Classic. Although all the freestyles were very watchable and choreographed to music that took some chances, Susan Dutta's and hometown hero Jim Koford's were my favorite.

Anybody else go?

GreyStreet
Jun. 5, 2011, 12:51 AM
I watched with a group - loved all the rides, but especially thought the winning ride was lovely! I just wish there had been more competitors in the Grand Prix freestyle, but only because I would have loved to watch more!

catosis
Jun. 5, 2011, 10:50 AM
Loooveeeddd Robin Brueckmann's ride. Her music was awesome! I know she didn't do GP, but it was still a really good ride. Everyone watch out for the I-1 Freestyles today!

Live Scoring
(http://www.foxvillage.com/FVDShowResults/(5iywiri2rwwjwh2s5hwhyv55)/ClassList.aspx?sh=240&st=1)

mimiwenk
Jun. 6, 2011, 07:59 AM
Some REALY low scores from one of the judges. Lots of scratches from those riding under her.

Commander Cody
Jun. 6, 2011, 01:17 PM
Seemed like a ton of scratches in some of the classes without obvious cause like bad weather. But not all under the same judge.

PiaffePlease
Jun. 6, 2011, 02:35 PM
I too saw ALOT of scratches. Sometimes half the class scratched. I saw alot of low scores too. But, I saw several tests that I wasnt impressed with at all (lower level horses ridden by pros) and when I checked their score, they won the class with a nice score. So, it kinda seemed all over the place.

There were alot of really nice horses there showing the lower levels. I dont think there was one I wouldnt like to have in my barn.

mimiwenk
Jun. 6, 2011, 03:06 PM
agree about the nice horses. Quality has definitely improved.

PiaffePlease
Jun. 6, 2011, 03:14 PM
Either the quality has improved or the people with mediocre horses aren't competing.

Hidden
Jun. 6, 2011, 04:33 PM
I didn't attend the Saturday night show with the musical freestyles, but what I heard was not rave reviews. What went on? Someone said parts looked like a bad medieval times? Many folks said the new management did not put on a good show and they were not going to attend next year.

Cartier
Jun. 6, 2011, 06:13 PM
We were there, got video of Robin with Timmy earlier in the day, and of her Freestyle with Sasha... and Elly's with Oyente... and possibly one other. Jim's Freestyle stands out in my mind, possibly because his music really suits Rhett. My impression was that the crowd loved all of it, and yes, probably would have loved more. :yes:

There was a bit of entertainment with two gentlemen in medieval garb... it was all in fun, maybe not the most scintillating performance, but it was brief.:cool:

I am so thankful for the people who put on shows like this, doing so is hard work. For some reason people are much more likely to pass on criticism than praise. Whatever imperfections, it was a very enjoyable weekend. I hope this show is around for years and years to come. :)

JennNC
Jun. 6, 2011, 07:44 PM
As for the Saturday night show...did you hear anything about the 82nd Airborne Division's All-American Chorus? They were pretty awesome. They opened the evening with the Star Spangled Banner while a color guard presented the American flag. And while we waited for the final results and the awards ceremony, they performed three more songs, finishing with "God Bless the USA" (the song by Lee Greenwood). I thought they were very good. The crowd certainly seemed to appreciate them!

As for the Grand Prix musical freestyles, there were only four this year, but they were pretty good with Susan Dutta winning on Currency DC.

This year is a qualifier for the Pan Am games, so the Intermediare class was the largest. The CDI was actually FULL, so the CDI turnout was great. I was sorry that the national part of the show (The Capital Dressage Classic) was down in numbers, but the economy has affected so many of our shows.

The Grand Prix horse numbers are larger when they need to qualify for the World Cup or the Olympics. This was not that year.

Plantagenet
Jun. 6, 2011, 09:19 PM
I didn't attend the Saturday night show with the musical freestyles, but what I heard was not rave reviews. What went on? Someone said parts looked like a bad medieval times? Many folks said the new management did not put on a good show and they were not going to attend next year.

can you tell me more about how the management didn't put on a good show? am interested in going next year and would like to know why folks wouldn't want to repeat.

GreyStreet
Jun. 6, 2011, 09:26 PM
I don't get why people were so critical of the jousting exhibition (mostly via comments I've heard off the board) - I mean, look, the show's organizers were obviously trying to incorporate additional entertainment into the mix. Sure, it was different - but, I enjoyed it. It was obvious between the exhibition and the Airborne Division that the show's organizers were making an effort to entertain attendees. Ostensibly the stars of the show were the freestyle riders, but I appreciated the organizers' efforts. And I also think it's a little silly to mock the exhibitors - I'm pretty sure the day I try to pick up a humongous pole and try to mount my horse, I might get put on the ground. It's just a different sector of the horse world, and I hope the exhibitors don't feel they wasted their time.

I sure wish there had been more Grand Prix freestyle competitors, but I enjoyed what I watched. I have attended every year I can, and I plan to attend next year.

MediaMD
Jun. 7, 2011, 08:30 AM
I'm just a volunteer working behind the scenes but I was responsible for getting the "entertainment" for Saturday night. The 82nd Airborne Color Guard and Airborne Chorus are extremely popular and generally only go to very large venues like the Indy 500 or huge crowds. They travel all over the world as ambassadors for the 82nd Airborne and are themselves active duty Special Forces paratroopers.This is one of the very smallest events they have ever performed and because of our time constraints they didn't have the chance to do their other songs that include precision marching etc. If you have an opportunity to hear them I would definitely do so. They did us a huge favor to come from Ft Bragg to perform for us.

Regarding the Lance of St Anthony. They are a local group of soldiers and law enforcement guys who do this for fun in their spare time and compete at tournaments all over the country who offered to come for free so we would have something for people to watch while waiting for the scores to be done. On Monday before the show they called me to cancel as their most experienced jousting horse got a puncture wound in the pasture.

That cancelled the jousting portion which was the MAIN part of the exhibition as it takes a very long time to train horses to gallop straight at each other as you can imagine. Rather than simply have nothing they agreed to try to show some of the training with a much less experienced horse and rider. They are usually much better than this but you can't joust with one horse and as we wanted to keep the crowd-- which included a fair number of children--entertained they pulled something together in 4 days.

Was it what we had planned? No. But to their credit they didn't leave us with an empty arena, and I'm sure if this was what they did as a full time job as it is with the Medieval Times they would provide an equally professional show.

I hope this helps put that part of the evening's entertainment into perspective and of course as others have said, the freestyles were terrific which is the main focus anyway.

catosis
Jun. 7, 2011, 07:48 PM
As an army brat, I really appreciated the choir knowing how much work they probably put in to each and every performance they do. They were some REALLY talented singers. And as for the medieval troop, those guys are doing that [I]on top their jobs[I]. Show a little respect for their effort! Sure, it wasn't cirque du soleil, but how many of the people making fun of them would get up in front of an audience of experienced horse people and do what they did?

Spiritpaws
Jun. 8, 2011, 08:00 AM
Perhaps had Raleigh had live scoring as the CDI's in Florida do, entertaining the audience would not have been necessary. The wait time for scores at a CDI *** was really inexcusable.

Stabling CDI horses in excessive heat inside a stuffy, low-ceiling barn, with no air circulation rather than using the outside stalls was ridiculous. Showed absolute disregard for the welfare of the horses. It was such a small show, that there was plenty of stabling to create another CDI barn and let the horses all have outside stalls.

This was no where near the quality of show that Raleigh used to be.

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 8, 2011, 08:49 AM
I want the show to be successful and huge and something that I can invite all my non-horsey friends to for an evening of celebrating the sport, so in that regard: can we turn the big ass fans on full blast?
Because I DID invite all my non-horsey friends, but I felt the need to warn them that they would be sitting in a puddle of their own sweat for an evening.

Or if suggestions are being forwarded to the new management at the horse complex - what about smaller fans that blow on the audience, like the heaters?

BaroquePony
Jun. 8, 2011, 08:52 AM
Spiritpaws and Rhiannonjk, thank you for posting what some of the problems really were.

MediaMD
Jun. 8, 2011, 11:13 AM
Spiritpaws--Did you happen to go on the CDI-Raleigh.com website and click on the link to the live scoring on Fox Village? Those scores were constantly updated throughout the show so I'm baffled at your comment that they were not available.

Regarding the stalls. Yes, we all wish we could wave a magic wand and completely tear down those old stalls and build newer bigger barns with more ventilation etc. You may not realize that this is a NC State Fairgrounds facility and lost 2.4million dollars in funding for the 2011 fiscal year during the last budget.

Like many other states NC is broke and building new stalls at the Hunt Horse Complex is comparatively low on the priority list. That has been on the master plan for several years now but with the economy in a free fall it just isn't going to happen. The show ground guys have gone above and beyond to make the facility as best and competitor/horse friendly as they possibly can with limited funds, and for that we can only be grateful.

As far as having more than 1 barn as a CDI barn, although the CDI portion of the show was full, there was not enough to rent another entire barn and provide the 24 hr security that was required. The office staff truly bent over backwards to attempt to accomodate every request for stabling (both with and far away from) but even then we had CDI competitors who literally ripped the names off the stall doors despite notices not to do so, and used shavings that had been purchased by other competitors, creating unnecessary chaos.

I am truly sorry that you had a bad experience and wish we had been able to please you while you were there. On the contrary we had many many positive comments from several of the large groups from Florida who were quite happy having come from the CDI circuit there and told us our show compared very favorably.

Rhiannonjk--thank you so much for coming and supporting the Saturday evening entertainment. Yes it was very hot and stuffy! We wanted the fans to be on higher too and I can't honestly say why they weren't except that the complex management has control over them and I am sure it has been addressed with them already. We'd love the smaller fans too but again, the fairgrounds are operating in a severe deficit and with the complete overhaul of the electrical system and the paving of the aisles in Barns C and D, they just ran out of money. The hazards of setting up temporary individual fans on stands for the audience were just too legion with people moving about and cords everywhere so that idea was discarded.

I am working with the NC Dept of Agriculture in my OTHER free time to set up a foundation that would allow corporate and private donations to the complex to address these very issues. I would very much love to include you in those discussions and committees so your input would be valued and put to use. Please send me a PM if you'd like to be included in the discussions. I have a meeting next week with the Deputy Secretary of Agriculture and we'd love to have you join us.

Thank you to all who came and supported the show--especially Saturday night. All proceeds from the evening will go to the Airborne Scholarship Foundation to help send kids of active duty military families to college. It's the least we can do for them.

Cartier
Jun. 8, 2011, 12:16 PM
It would have been nice if exhibitors had a cadre of personal fanners, to follow them around and keep the breezes flowing :lol:... but it just wasn’t on anyone list of things worth doing. ;)

Events like this one do not just magically happen, nor are they cheap to put on. Given the economy and the general public’s view that this is an elitist sport for the very few spoiled and indulged rich, I can’t envision any politician voting to increase funding for a more pleasant barn, and a larger a/c bill, when the state needs funding for better schools, safer communities, better roads etc.

I think that participants and spectators alike should be appreciative of what we have, rather than being so frickin critical of what we did not. :yes:

DinkDunk
Jun. 8, 2011, 12:33 PM
Totally agree with Cartier.

Maybe it's b/c I'm from NC and the comment about the entertainment rubbed me the wrong way, but the bitching about how crappy all the shows are is irritating. Host your own show and let us critique it.

Good grief. How will we ever get more funding if folks keep publicly blasting the effort put forth, making the potential competitors decide not to come next year? I'm sure those air conditioned stalls will be built in no time, at this rate.

Send improvement recommendations privately to the mgmt. and thank the volunteers in public.

Cartier
Jun. 8, 2011, 12:39 PM
I agree with you (agreeing with me :lol:). When you think of all the costs associated with putting on that show, including costs for insurance, power, water, security, supplies, having that facility open and staffed… cleaned, etc... all for an event that appeals to such a proportionally tiny segment of the population… I think complaining that one didn’t get more bells and whistles is beyond ungrateful... it is totally disconnected from economic reality in 2011. There was so much that was done right, and so much to be appreciative of. Here is a huge thanks to all who busted their butts to make the event happen. :):yes:

Maria
Jun. 8, 2011, 01:50 PM
First of all I would like to say I have NO bones to pick with past CDI-W Raleigh management nor new CDI-W management. I call past management my friend and I hope I have made a new friend with the new management.

I have been involved with the CDI-W Raleigh since the first year it was put on, ohhhh how many years ago I forget.

Putting on a show of this magnatude is a GREAT undertaking one that the average person doesn't really realize nor understand. There are only a hand full of people in the States qualified to manage a CDI. Only an hand full. A decision was made to seek out new management. A manager was found. There were things that went on that not all were/are privey to. It doesn't matter what those things were/are, they just were. So the new management and the new committee members did the ABSOLUTE best they could with the knowlege they had.

Were mistakes made? Yes. Are those mistakes going to be addressed? Yes I believe they will be. I personally spoke with the new manger several times this past weekend and you can believe me when I say, she is ON BOARD to make the CDI-W Raleigh the best it can be. I was asked to take on a different roll for next year, a challenge for me, but I'll give it a shot. :D

I also talked with a couple vendors and some competitors. I have their ideas and my exchange with them will not be forgotten and most of it has already been passed on.

Change is difficult. Very difficult. This year was a VERY large learning curve.

I guess it comes down to this...Do we want to lose this CDI? Or do we want to try another year and see if we have learned from our mistakes?

It's not in my power to give the official okey dokey to go another year, but I ask, do you give us another chance? My vote is yes.

suzy
Jun. 8, 2011, 02:02 PM
Totally agree with Cartier.

Maybe it's b/c I'm from NC and the comment about the entertainment rubbed me the wrong way, but the bitching about how crappy all the shows are is irritating. Host your own show and let us critique it.

Good grief. How will we ever get more funding if folks keep publicly blasting the effort put forth, making the potential competitors decide not to come next year? I'm sure those air conditioned stalls will be built in no time, at this rate.

Send improvement recommendations privately to the mgmt. and thank the volunteers in public.

I'm not from NC either, but totally agree with DinkDunk and Cartier. I think it's fine to privately contact the organizers with suggestions for improvements, however, to publicly lambast them is poor form. It is also a de-motivator. If we want good CDI shows, we have to be agents of positive change, not a bunch of whiney, impossible to please bystanders.

I have never been to the Raleigh show, but I love the idea that they tried to provide entertainment that would appeal to a broader audience. This is what will get more spectators to dressage shows. If shows in my area offered entertainment, I would have a much easier time of getting family and friends to accompany me.

Most of the people who organize and work at these competitions are unpaid volunteers. Imagine how you would feel if you went to a tremendous effort and gave up a lot of YOUR free time to help with this show only to hear people trash it.

norton
Jun. 8, 2011, 03:55 PM
Horse shows are hot. Or cold. Or wet. Or windy. If you're not a fan of weather, maybe horse shows aren't your thing. The Raleigh CDI is extremely important to the mid-Atlantic region. It's one of the last opportunities to ride qualifiers and riders come from New England and Florida for the opportunity.

If you study the scores, you can see important riders emerge at this show and go on to dominate the scene for that season. I've seen Young Riders win at Raleigh and then win or place well at NAJYRC. Tami Batts ruled the Intermedate tests and I'll bet she does well at Gladstone. She's in the running for the Pan Am team with her results at Raleigh.

As far as the fans being on high for the freestyles - you wouldn't have been able to hear the music. If you can't hear the music, what's the point? I've seen freestyle video from the show and can't hear much over the fans as it is.

I don't think anyone, anywhere, should ever complain about a show until they've organized one.

PiaffePlease
Jun. 8, 2011, 04:35 PM
Ive volunteered at the Hunt Complex during a USDF show (but not the CDI). Management does an awesome job. Its a tough, thankless job. The spectators are hot? Well, guess what, its hot outside. Dont you think the judges, riders, volunteers, TDs are hot too? They make those little hand held battery operated fans for only a few bucks, buy one of those and keep your mouth shut.

We are extremely lucky to have the CDI and Capital Dressage Classic show in Raleigh. Ive lived in rural TN where no one within 2 hours has heard of dressage so having this at my back door is awesome. Sure the USDF show numbers were low, but thats how its been lately. And yes, there were alot of scratches, but if you can afford to pay all that money and scratch, you shouldnt be that worried about it.

The show was well run, the managment/volunteers were nice, and there were some kids giving out free icecream on Saturday.

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 8, 2011, 04:43 PM
Ive volunteered at the Hunt Complex during a USDF show (but not the CDI). Management does an awesome job. Its a tough, thankless job. The spectators are hot? Well, guess what, its hot outside. Dont you think the judges, riders, volunteers, TDs are hot too? They make those little hand held battery operated fans for only a few bucks, buy one of those and keep your mouth shut.

I have no problem coming and sweating it out, as I said. I just wish that I could invite all the other people that I'm sure would enjoy it, and perhaps be introduced to the sport, if there were ways to make it a little more comfortable. But go on and snark, making me want to haev nothing to do with the whole affair.

I've volunteered at the CDI. I've volunteered all over the NCDCTA. I was one of the very last to leave the Saturday Night exhibition, and sitting in the judge's booth to scribe at the Fenridge Horse Trials the next morning. and I've emailed MediaMD about my experiences, and explained how I made that decision to devote my time.

@norton - I was THERE and I couldn't hear the fans. The music was quiet in the videos because the music wasn't that loud - but I assumed it was where the competitors wanted it in the sound checks.

Maria
Jun. 8, 2011, 06:40 PM
There is little anyone can do about the facility,it is a State owned and State run facility. People who want to have shows there rent the indoor, the covered and pay per stall used. It ain't cheap. The horse complex manager works well with management to get the arena dragged and watered, the work with us to get the footing correct. Every organization wants something different. I know in the past the CDI has had to pay to bring in footing for the indoor,covered and the arena up on the hill when they were used.

The horse complex has always been the red headed step child as far as the fair grounds are concerned.

Several months ago a horse was electrocuted in one of the barns, from what I understand they are redoing the wiring, that may have had something to do with using the indoor stalls in the CDI barns.

If you had ever been down in the indoor arena before they got the Big Ass Fans, you would realize how much better it is down in that hole now verses before.

Perhaps we have all gotten a little spoiled by the luxuries we have all grown so accustomed. Put on a little extra deodorant grab an ice cold coke or beer and sit back and enjoy the show.

Seriously folks you need to have more correct information before you go criticizing so much.

BaroquePony
Jun. 8, 2011, 06:50 PM
Several months ago a horse was electrocuted in one of the barns, from what I understand they are redoing the wiring, that may have had something to do with using the indoor stalls in the CDI barns.


I understand that was the second horse that was a victim of an electrical failure in a stall down there.

That is not the only problem.

North Carolina has it's own unique set of political problems that effectively render the state, especially around the Raleigh area, not particularly desireable.

The *attitude* is the biggest problem.

PiaffePlease
Jun. 8, 2011, 11:22 PM
I have no problem coming and sweating it out, as I said. I just wish that I could invite all the other people that I'm sure would enjoy it, and perhaps be introduced to the sport, if there were ways to make it a little more comfortable. But go on and snark, making me want to haev nothing to do with the whole affair.

I've volunteered at the CDI. I've volunteered all over the NCDCTA. I was one of the very last to leave the Saturday Night exhibition, and sitting in the judge's booth to scribe at the Fenridge Horse Trials the next morning. and I've emailed MediaMD about my experiences, and explained how I made that decision to devote my time.


This certainly wasnt directed specifically at you. Now that I look back, it does seem that way, but it wasnt. There was alot of complaining going around and I wanted to state how nice the show actually was. No show is perfect and there isnt much that can be done about the heat.

And yes, a horse was electrocuted in one of the stalls last year. I believe the horse was very upset, thrashing around, banged it's head into the wall and was then electrocuted somehow. Thats how I understand it. So, the horse wasnt simply standing there and then got shocked. The barns all went through a strict check to make sure they were safe.

BaroquePony
Jun. 9, 2011, 06:53 AM
I heard that the last horse to get electrocuted actually got a severe shock from something metal that was in contact with some electrical wiring that was shorting out/arching. The horse reacted with *lightneing speed*, as horses will when taken off gaurd, and it jumped back so fast and hard from the shock it slammed it's head into the wall and died from a fractured skull or neck.

The horse that was killed the year before had some experience that was attributed to faulty wiring also.

Have they actually redone the wiring as of now? Or is that just lip service?

Spiritpaws
Jun. 9, 2011, 07:15 AM
My comments on live scoring have nothing to do with fox village! Go to some Florida CDI's, or Gladstone, or California CDI's or Devon and see that there is live scoring on the grounds at the ring. There is a portable live scoreboard that is ringside. Scribes have laptops that transmit the scores per movement. No waiting for runners to pick up test sheets, no waiting endlessly for the scorers to score and the announcer to announce.

I am no stranger to the organization and amount of work involved with shows including regionals, BLMs, and charity events. I have supported the Raleigh CDI as both a competitor and a vendor in past years. I am no stranger to this show.

By the way, in past years of high heat, all CDI horses were stabled in outside stalls.

Another question that comes to mind is why was the open show so small?
That used to be 4 or 5 rings going from morning till night. Why did so many North Carolinians not show at Raleigh? Including some of the notable professionals?

As one CDI competitor said to me: "this is like being at a schooling show."

The organizers have every right to get defensive, but that doesn't solve anything. In my mind it's far better to listen to what has been criticized and then asses how to rectify or not to rectify.

JennNC
Jun. 9, 2011, 07:45 AM
As one who was there working as a volunteer all three days of the show, I appreciate those of you who realize that the show is a LOT of work and that you enjoyed it!

However, criticism is not a bad thing if it helps to make improvements for the future. So...friendly, constructive criticism that aims to accomplish that is welcome by me!

And, believe me, we are already talking about ways to improve. Given the fact that this was the first year for this management team to work together here in Raleigh, I think it went quite well!

Volunteerism was up for this show, which is a great sign as to the enthusiasm behind our NC folks who want to see this show succeed.

As for the low numbers in the national part of the show, the numbers are down at most all the shows. I was shocked at how small one of NC's biggest, most popular shows was this past May. The management hadn't changed, the competitor's party was still fabulous, but the numbers were WAY down. It's the danged economy combined with the number of shows we have to choose from.

We have SOOO many shows in NC now. I heard two competitors say that they chose one show over the CDI/CDC because of the higher cost of stabling at the Raleigh show. Well, I can understand that, but the costs to put on the Raleigh show are very high and the stabling has to reflect it.

Secondly, I have heard SEVERAL competitors say that they chose not to come BECAUSE it was a CDI and that they don't like to show when it is a CDI because they know the judging will be harsher. Understood.

And one competitor told me that she specifically chose not to come due to ONE judge that was harsh to her once before.

Mind you, these folks who told me this were all there volunteering!! yay!

We have the right to pick and choose our shows, and here in NC, we are fortunate to have so many to choose from!!

I hope we continue to put on a CDI, and if you feel the same way, please make this opinion known by contacting NCDCTA board members. It is a huge financial risk each year and the board has to weigh the value of this show against the financial risk every year.

Jennifer Mitchell

NCDCTA CDI Committee/Competition Committee
NCDCTA, past president

grayarabpony
Jun. 9, 2011, 08:19 AM
I don't think anyone, anywhere, should ever complain about a show until they've organized one.

ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Now THAT attitude makes me want to stay home and not enter classes at any show.

btw, is anyone going to answer Baroquepony's questions about faulty wiring in the barn? Was the problem properly addressed?

Maria
Jun. 9, 2011, 09:23 AM
AGAIN, the Hunt Horse Complex is a STATE Owned facility. The NCDCTA nor the CDI-W Raleigh has ANYTHING to do with updating the wiring of the facility. We can only go by what we are told has and has not been done to the facility.

I know the wiring has been addressed. Since I am the one who threw out the wiring idea, I don't know if that is the reason the inside stalls were used instead of the outside stalls for the CDI barns.

The manager of the Hunt Horse Complex goes out of his way to make EVERY show a success. They want the numbers. They want the income. Horses getting killed by electrocution is not good.

So, I throw out this question: How would you have made the show better?

grayarabpony
Jun. 9, 2011, 10:07 AM
Have people around with better attitudes than "suck it up", for one thing.

BaroquePony
Jun. 9, 2011, 10:16 AM
Maria, thank you for addressing my question about whether or not the wiring problems had/have been addressed. I am not sure I would believe the State without having seen the work being done in progress. Sorry to be so cynical.

I have lived in the area for longer than I would have liked, so I know quite a bit about some of the politics in the State of NC.

If the State of NC is charging a lot of money (and I am not surprised) then that is something that needs to be addressed in and of it's own right.

Next is to find out why the more comfortable stalls were not used.

I am not sure if I understood *this* correctly, but competitors were not allowed to plug in their own individual fans for their horses in the stalls? (please ignore the bad sentence structure).

I couldn't even show my horse if he had to stand in an enclosed box stall without a fan in the summer. Not with the heat and humidity we have here. And if the stalls that were being used are the ones I am thinking of, they are fully enclosed except for bars in the front? Those stalls do not have good air circulation at all.

MediaMD
Jun. 9, 2011, 10:45 AM
A complete and thorough inspection and electrical upgrade costing in excess of $50K was performed and completed by a 3rd party electrical contractor in March 2011. All 4 barns, the arenas, vendor areas, RV parking and other critical areas were completely inspected, repaired and upgraded to current codes--some beyond what was called for in state law.

I have the work orders and certificates of completion on pdfs should anyone want to see them. They are a matter of public record and I requested and was sent them this morning by the contractor through the NC State Construction office.

If anyone would like a personal tour of the facility to inspect the work themselves, they can contact Ray Frost, facilities manager of the NC State Fairgrounds, Hunt Horse Complex. He would be happy to lay to rest any further concerns about the safety of the showgrounds and in my experience will go above and beyond any request in a professional and gracious way.

oops. Meant to say 5 barns. I forgot Barn E but all of them were done. Also, I didn't hear anything about not using box fans. We used one and no one told us not to and we were in Barn B.

grayarabpony
Jun. 9, 2011, 11:03 AM
Thank you MediaMD. That is very good to know.

BaroquePony
Jun. 9, 2011, 11:16 AM
MediaMD, thank you for posting a thorough answer :yes:.

BaroquePony
Jun. 9, 2011, 11:38 AM
More questions ...

Who was responsible for the horses NOT being allowed to use the more well ventilated stalls??

Why was there not a proper Leaderboard/scoreboard set up ??

If I am not mistaken, the viewing audience gets in for *free*, right?

norton
Jun. 9, 2011, 11:38 AM
A wise and very well-known rider once said to me that dressage organizations have a way of cannabilizing their best members. The best members of a club volunteer hundreds of hours so that a few individuals can ride a 5 minute test or take a clinic lesson.

Dressage is a very small world. There's a ripple effect when people start complaining after organizers make a huge effort on their behalf. Organizers get discouraged and decide they have better things to do with their lives. Shows and clinics begin to disappear from the scene and the behind-the-scenes support we all need to practice the sport fades away.

You don't actually have the right to complain, especially in an anonymous public forum. Go to organizers and talk to them, which is not the same thing as complaining. Say you have a fix for the problem and volunteer to see that it's done at the next show. Be pro-active in a positive way and you'll protect the growth of dressage in your community.

If you live in the Raleigh area, chip in to take the organizers and volunteers out to dinner and tell them how much you appreciate their effort and time. Fix what you didn't like at the next show.

Complaints will kill the sport.

Riders everywhere are scratching because of the EHV outbreak, whether the fear may be justified or not...

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 9, 2011, 11:43 AM
@norton Who says we aren't?
I'm not that anonymous...

grayarabpony
Jun. 9, 2011, 11:47 AM
You don't actually have the right to complain, especially in an anonymous public forum.

Who died and left you queen. Geez, this kind of attitude makes me not give a damn if there are dressage shows or not.

gailbyrd
Jun. 9, 2011, 11:59 AM
The CDI barn was allowed to use fans. Can't speak for the other barns. And the CDI part of the show had enough horses that both the inside and outside stalls were used and had to be used.

Maria
Jun. 9, 2011, 11:59 AM
More questions ...

Who was responsible for the horses NOT being allowed to use the more well ventilated stalls??

Why was there not a proper Leaderboard/scoreboard set up ??

If I am not mistaken, the viewing audience gets in for *free*, right?



I don't know the answer to question #1.

Question #2, the Hunt Horse Complex to my knowledge does not own a Leaderboard, nor does the NCDCTA, nor do they own the electronics/computers/laptops needed for this service. Serveral years ago I asked about a leaderboard, at that time I was told to rent one would cost in the neighborhood of $10,000. Whether that price point is true or not I have not investigated. Therefore no Leaderboard. But there were live updates on the CDI website. Also scores were announced regularly, Sat evening the delay was usually only one horse behind.

Question #3, I believe only Saturday night the viewing public paid to attend the show. Proceeds from the sale of tickets went to Airborne Scholarship Association.

eggbutt
Jun. 9, 2011, 12:13 PM
First of all I would like to say I have NO bones to pick with past CDI-W Raleigh management nor new CDI-W management. I call past management my friend and I hope I have made a new friend with the new management.

I have been involved with the CDI-W Raleigh since the first year it was put on, ohhhh how many years ago I forget.

Putting on a show of this magnatude is a GREAT undertaking one that the average person doesn't really realize nor understand. There are only a hand full of people in the States qualified to manage a CDI. Only an hand full. A decision was made to seek out new management. A manager was found. There were things that went on that not all were/are privey to. It doesn't matter what those things were/are, they just were. So the new management and the new committee members did the ABSOLUTE best they could with the knowlege they had.

Were mistakes made? Yes. Are those mistakes going to be addressed? Yes I believe they will be. I personally spoke with the new manger several times this past weekend and you can believe me when I say, she is ON BOARD to make the CDI-W Raleigh the best it can be. I was asked to take on a different roll for next year, a challenge for me, but I'll give it a shot. :D

I also talked with a couple vendors and some competitors. I have their ideas and my exchange with them will not be forgotten and most of it has already been passed on.

Change is difficult. Very difficult. This year was a VERY large learning curve.

I guess it comes down to this...Do we want to lose this CDI? Or do we want to try another year and see if we have learned from our mistakes?

It's not in my power to give the official okey dokey to go another year, but I ask, do you give us another chance? My vote is yes.

Maria, you took the words right out of my brain!!!! I did not attend this year's CDI*** for a variety of reasons so I can't speak to specifics of the show....I'm hearing the same talk and rumors most others are hearing.

I also have been involved with the previous CDI's for too many years to count and loved every single second spent working on those previous shows. I absolutely know the amount of work, effort, blood, sweat and tears (MANY tears) it has always taken to put on a truly incredible CDI in Raleigh. I honeslty believe many with NCDCTA thought it was an easier undertaking than it is and I'm sure they felt that pressure this year with the "new" CDI. Keep in mind Janine Malone ran this show from beginning to end with a hand full of volunteers before opening day --- all with years and years of local experience (and we all know you can't top the "rules guru", Janine for perfection!!).

I do hope NCDCTA takes all feedback to heart and continue to work to build the fantastic show it's always been. I admire Regina for filling Janine's shoes this year and applaud NCDCTA for their efforts.

This show has always had such "status" on the east coast, primarily because everyone knew what to expect every year without fail. I know many competitors who actually begin saving months in advance to be able to afford to enter the show. Perhaps this year they opted to take a "wait and see" attitude before commiting their finances to the show with new management. Gas prices were astronomical as we all know!

One complaint I have heard that does concern me was the time it took for EMT's to get to a competitor during the show. If it did take an unreasonable amount of time to respond, those reasons should be addressed and never allowed to happen in the future (and I have no doubt that has been done).

Kudos for a first attempt! Our state needs this caliber show and I encourage anyone able to volunteer and become involved with the organization of the show to learn what it takes to put on a show of this magnitude. It definitely isn't a walk in the park but sure can be rewarding!!:)

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 9, 2011, 12:24 PM
I also wanted to add that I will completely totally volunteer to arrive as early as needed on the saturday exhibition next year to track down whoever is responsible and ensure that the Big Ass Fans are as high as they can be without blowing the competitors off their horses or the judges off their chairs.

owagner2501
Jun. 9, 2011, 02:00 PM
The number one concern that I would like to personally address is the EMT and Ambulance response time. By the end of the weekend the rumor going around the facility was that it took around 35 min for the ambulance to arrive, which is nor correct.

The actual response times were as follows: The EMT took a little less than 5 min to arrive at the far ring. Unfortunately he was in the indoor when the call came in, which is at the opposite end of the facility.

and, It took the ambulance 16 min to arrive from the time that they were summoned.

****
"Who was responsible for the horses NOT being allowed to use the more well ventilated stalls"

I was responsible for stabling and I have bend over backwards at this show to accommodate everyone stabling request/concern. Some competitors requested indoor stalls some requested outside stalls. Once on the show grounds, a small number of competitors requested to switch stalls, mainly from outside to inside where it was cooler. All move/change requests where accommodated as they came in.

****

Olga Wagner

dalpal
Jun. 9, 2011, 03:18 PM
My comments on live scoring have nothing to do with fox village! Go to some Florida CDI's, or Gladstone, or California CDI's or Devon and see that there is live scoring on the grounds at the ring. There is a portable live scoreboard that is ringside. Scribes have laptops that transmit the scores per movement. No waiting for runners to pick up test sheets, no waiting endlessly for the scorers to score and the announcer to announce.

I am no stranger to the organization and amount of work involved with shows including regionals, BLMs, and charity events. I have supported the Raleigh CDI as both a competitor and a vendor in past years. I am no stranger to this show.

By the way, in past years of high heat, all CDI horses were stabled in outside stalls.

Another question that comes to mind is why was the open show so small?
That used to be 4 or 5 rings going from morning till night. Why did so many North Carolinians not show at Raleigh? Including some of the notable professionals?

As one CDI competitor said to me: "this is like being at a schooling show."

The organizers have every right to get defensive, but that doesn't solve anything. In my mind it's far better to listen to what has been criticized and then asses how to rectify or not to rectify.

Two of our biggest trainers have left the area (although one was showing a couple horses at the show)

I have to say, after what happened to the horse with electrocution, I would have big reservations about keeping my horse in a stall there until renovations on the wiring are completed.

Just my two cents.

Edited...I see MediaMD answered the question about wiring...thank you.

BaroquePony
Jun. 9, 2011, 03:36 PM
Which two trainers would those be?

Using the CoTH BB is a great opportunity for the dressage community, not only for the Raleigh area, NC in general, but the whole country.

Some of the answers that have been graciously provided on this thread seem to be quite diplomatic and to the point.

It sounds to me like some effort has gone into fixing the electrical problems at Hunt Horse Complex. MediaMD seems to have taken the very important step in tracking down documentation to verify this. Probably would be a good idea to get more copies and post them .. at least somewhere that they can be downloaded by those interested.

I am a firm believer in transparency. I have found it most often can be a waste of time to track down individuals to discuss this or that. Many, but certainly not all, will say one thing to your face and another behind your back. I just do not have the time for that sort of behavior.

I think that some of the problems are common across the nation and can and should be fixed ... for the benefit of *correct* more or less Classical Horsemanship and the horses.

I think this is a very important thread, as long as it stays polite and constructive ... I do think complaints should be aired. I have seen nothing but positive changes coming from both the eventing and dressage communities that do post here. Sometimes aren't as fast as I would like to see, but I have begun to actually trust some of the posters on CoTH. That is saying a lot for me :yes:.

eggbutt
Jun. 9, 2011, 05:19 PM
The number one concern that I would like to personally address is the EMT and Ambulance response time. By the end of the weekend the rumor going around the facility was that it took around 35 min for the ambulance to arrive, which is nor correct.

The actual response times were as follows: The EMT took a little less than 5 min to arrive at the far ring. Unfortunately he was in the indoor when the call came in, which is at the opposite end of the facility.

and, It took the ambulance 16 min to arrive from the time that they were summoned.

****

****

Olga Wagner

THANK YOU Olga!!! Apparently it "felt" longer to those on the scene than it really was! I honestly appreciate your comments about this particular rumor!

dalpal
Jun. 9, 2011, 05:23 PM
Which two trainers would those be?

Using the CoTH BB is a great opportunity for the dressage community, not only for the Raleigh area, NC in general, but the whole country.

Some of the answers that have been graciously provided on this thread seem to be quite diplomatic and to the point.

It sounds to me like some effort has gone into fixing the electrical problems at Hunt Horse Complex. MediaMD seems to have taken the very important step in tracking down documentation to verify this. Probably would be a good idea to get more copies and post them .. at least somewhere that they can be downloaded by those interested.

I am a firm believer in transparency. I have found it most often can be a waste of time to track down individuals to discuss this or that. Many, but certainly not all, will say one thing to your face and another behind your back. I just do not have the time for that sort of behavior.

I think that some of the problems are common across the nation and can and should be fixed ... for the benefit of *correct* more or less Classical Horsemanship and the horses.

I think this is a very important thread, as long as it stays polite and constructive ... I do think complaints should be aired. I have seen nothing but positive changes coming from both the eventing and dressage communities that do post here. Sometimes aren't as fast as I would like to see, but I have begun to actually trust some of the posters on CoTH. That is saying a lot for me :yes:.

That would be Jim Koford and Brendan Curtis. Those two always brought a good sized group to the local shows.

grayarabpony
Jun. 9, 2011, 05:28 PM
I also wanted to add that I will completely totally volunteer to arrive as early as needed on the saturday exhibition next year to track down whoever is responsible and ensure that the Big Ass Fans are as high as they can be without blowing the competitors off their horses or the judges off their chairs.

:lol: Now that's the spirit!

BaroquePony
Jun. 9, 2011, 05:43 PM
dalpal, thank you. I figured (and hoped it wasn't true) that Koford might be one. I am not familiar with Brendan Curtis.

Some of the *players* have changed, but the biggest problem is why serious riders are leaving this area.

I think this needs addressing. It is a very important aspect of what the Triangle is dealing with (or not dealing with depending on how you see it).

Sorry my last post was a bit rambling and not quite what I was trying to say.

I am in a battle with my new Cannon Multifunction Machine :lol:. It was giving me a hard time and I was not multi-tasking very well :no:.

dalpal
Jun. 9, 2011, 05:50 PM
dalpal, thank you. I figured (and hoped it wasn't true) that Koford might be one. I am not familiar with Brendan Curtis.

Some of the *players* have changed, but the biggest problem is why serious riders are leaving this area.

I think this needs addressing. It is a very important aspect of what the Triangle is dealing with (or not dealing with depending on how you see it).

Sorry my last post was a bit rambling and not quite what I was trying to say.

I am in a battle with my new Cannon Multifunction Machine :lol:. It was giving me a hard time and I was not multi-tasking very well :no:.

They are moving to places with names such as Hassler, etc so that they can continue their own riding educations. It's sad. :( Well, sad for us.

Commander Cody
Jun. 10, 2011, 07:15 AM
[QUOTE Riders everywhere are scratching because of the EHV outbreak, whether the fear may be justified or not...[/QUOTE]

Have to respond to this. We ran a show the very same weekend up in NOVA (the Young Horse Selection Trials) and the show was HUGE, overfull with riders on waiting lists for scratch times. They were definitely not scratching and having run 2 big shows this year and attended 2 others, I'd say entries are overall down a bit but not that much and seem to be improving so perhaps our long cold winter had as much to do with low entries at early shows as the economy or EHV1.

And BTW we have changed our dates for next year to a week later to no longer conflict with the Raleigh show. We hope everyone will go to Raleigh and then come up to us the next week. :)

Alison (VADA/Nova)

BaroquePony
Jun. 10, 2011, 07:29 AM
Posted by CommanderCody:

And BTW we have changed our dates for next year to a week later to no longer conflict with the Raleigh show. We hope everyone will go to Raleigh and then come up to us the next week. :)

This ^ is being thoughtful :yes:. Thank you for thinking of us *down here* :lol:.

I think the Raleigh CDI is very important, but there needs to be some more dialog on how the affair can become professional in its entirity, and step away from the *schooling show* mentality.

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 10, 2011, 08:33 AM
This ^ is being thoughtful :yes:. Thank you for thinking of us *down here* :lol:.

I think the Raleigh CDI is very important, but there needs to be some more dialog on how the affair can become professional in its entirity, and step away from the *schooling show* mentality.

Ditto on the thanks.

But in regards to the schooling show mentality - I think the fact that the CDI competitors were very happy says a lot. So what would the goal of making it "more professional" be - what makes it feel not professional?
I think that if a show feels laid back and not-stressful, that is a good thing. That will encourage more of the national-level riders to come. I have to say the reason I don't make any effort to come to this show is that I remember it being so stressful.

So, in general, is there a line where more "professionalism" is needed, that doesn't make it seem uninviting?

Maria
Jun. 10, 2011, 08:45 AM
CommanderCody, you touched on one thing that slipped my mind, yes there were other shows the same weekend as the CDI, so there is one reason the number of competitors was down in the national show.

Just a little update; we are reading all the comments here and we are making notes of the problems and will be addressing those that we can. Plans are well underway to make next years potential CDI-W Raleigh a show we all can be proud of being a part.

Many Thanks to those who have given us your constructive reviews. It's very much appreciated. So if you have any more thoughts please post them or pm me. I WILL pass them along. :D

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 10, 2011, 08:48 AM
The response and dedication from the management that has been shown on this thread is fabulous. I hope you decide to continue the CDI in future years!

BaroquePony
Jun. 10, 2011, 07:33 PM
It has been mentioned that there were numerous scratches. I am under the impression that those occured AFTER the competitors had paid their entry fees and were already on the Hunt Horse Complex grounds. Am I understanding this correctly?

Pony Fixer
Jun. 10, 2011, 09:00 PM
I'm not sure if I should say this or not, but...deep breath...here goes.

The negativity surrounding the CDI has been extremely damaging to the NCDCTA, starting with the board and will be trickling down.

I'm not saying that some of that negativity wasn't deserved-- it was quite an undertaking and mistakes were made (omission and commission). But like any HUGE endeavor, there was a gigantic learning curve, (and, darn it, we didn't have a playbook left by Janine :)) and all problems have been hashed out, mea culpa-d, etc. the absolute BEST they could be.

I volunteered 2 of the days, but was in the coliseum, so I didn't get out to the national show much. What I saw inside was great. Most of the competitors rolled with any "issues". Ditto most spectators. But the "grumbling" is always the quickest to spread and easy to dish out. I LOVE LOVE LOVE that I can drive 15 minutes to see riders who will likely represent us in the PanAm games and future Olympics, etc. for one glorious weekend!

But if it means enduring the "wrath" of those quick to crucify the NCDCTA board then I don't want the show to be sponsored and run by the NCDCTA anymore. It's not worth it (and believe me, I can take some heat) to plan for 9 months for something (and again, I'm not belittling the real problems that occurred) that is over in 4 days if it is going to cripple our board and membership.

So if you want the CDI in your backyard, I suggest you start lobbying the NCDCTA board now, and be prepared to put your money where your mouth is--because I sit on the board and I'm pretty sure I'm "done" with the CDI.

There, I said it. As much as it hurts me to see the Raleigh CDI become a faint memory, it's not worth watching the people who work hard and volunteer dozens upon dozens of hours of their time get put through the wringer. We take this stuff personally, as anyone who put so much into something would.

J-Lu
Jun. 10, 2011, 10:38 PM
CommanderCody, you touched on one thing that slipped my mind, yes there were other shows the same weekend as the CDI, so there is one reason the number of competitors was down in the national show.

Just a little update; we are reading all the comments here and we are making notes of the problems and will be addressing those that we can. Plans are well underway to make next years potential CDI-W Raleigh a show we all can be proud of being a part.

Many Thanks to those who have given us your constructive reviews. It's very much appreciated. So if you have any more thoughts please post them or pm me. I WILL pass them along. :D

I attended the show as a spectator but also watched several USDF classes. It seemed to me that several people scratched due to the heat (the USDF classes were outside). I heard several riders complaining about the heat and one complaining directly to the TD to waive coats. He was very responsive. I also saw a few obviously off horses who ended up scratching (kudos to owners).

Previous CDIs attracted more riders, but I also think many riders are rather conservative regarding which shows they are attending right now. I thought the Pan Am qualifying classes were well populated and were very enjoyable/educational to watch. They were the highlight of the show for me. The warmup and arena rings were very easy for anyone to access.

I don't personally know people who showed this time but I know people who showed in teh CDI in the past and had no complaints about the stabling or the show.

I honestly could care less about live scoring. I didn't find it difficult at all to keep track of the announcers scoring or simply walk to the day sheets to see the scores. The show office provided free printouts of the classes - it was easy to keep track on our own if we didn't want to get up and walk to the day sheets. I would have liked more information on each horse's breeding, though. I don't think the announcer always announced that. But there were enough people with programs who were willing to share that I had no problems at all investigating bloodlines.

Kudos for the bilingual announcer, esp. for the Venezuelan competitors.

I had a great time with the vendors.

This IS a very laid back and accessible show for a variety of reasons. It would be an utter shame if it did not continue as a CDI.

Pony Fixer, you live in Raleigh???? Really? Huh! I would be willing to put in my 2 cents to the board about keeping the CDI if it meant anything.

J.

Spiritpaws
Jun. 11, 2011, 07:03 AM
I would encourage NCDCTA board members to attend Devon (both for the fun of that show, and as a kind of fact finding mission). See what the Devon organizers do, how the main CDI ring is presented, how the live scoring is done, the sponsorships they get, how incredibly well organized the show is.

Because of the economy, it is even more important that organizers of a CDI with an open show really start thinking of creative ways to attract riders, to build a new reputation as a fantastic show to go to.

Bogey2
Jun. 11, 2011, 07:44 AM
I honestly could care less about live scoring.

I agree, the score boards are very expensive to rent/buy (Devon has it's own).

eggbutt
Jun. 11, 2011, 08:59 AM
There, I said it. As much as it hurts me to see the Raleigh CDI become a faint memory, it's not worth watching the people who work hard and volunteer dozens upon dozens of hours of their time get put through the wringer. We take this stuff personally, as anyone who put so much into something would.

Bingo Pony Fixer! You've hit the nail on the head for how Janine Malone must have felt all the years she ran the show with a handful of volunteer staff!!! She asked very little from NCDCTA except for volunteers during the show and help packing up afterwards.

Shows of this caliber are extremely difficult to organize and run correctly - whether it's a first attempt or a twenty-fifth attempt. I completely agree with you if NCDCTA can not run the show relatively seamlessly it should be dropped from the calendar and allow other private professionals to pick it up if they desire.

Isabeau Z Solace
Jun. 11, 2011, 11:11 AM
I am sure people scratched for a variety of reasons. I know one woman who scratched her young/3rd level horse because he had been sick the week prior. Another friend did not go because her barn in NJ did not go. Things did not go as well as hoped for them at NJ horsepark the week or two prior.

BaroquePony
Jun. 11, 2011, 11:45 AM
Posted byn J-Lu:

Kudos for the bilingual announcer, esp. for the Venezuelan competitors.

The bilingual announcer should have been expected. It would have been very inconsiderate not to have had one.

The idea of having the 82nd Airborne Division's All-American Chorus as part of the program deserves Five Star Kudo's. This was an outstanding idea. The 82nd Airborne is a top-notch group and being able to perform the National Anthem and the Star Spangled Banner LIVE sets the stage for a very high quality American venue.

The idea for having an amateur jousting exhibition was maybe not such a good idea. I respect that the jousters at least tried their best to show up after their main horse went lame (I think I understood this right), but the idea of *amateur* anything at this show was not being respectful of the CDI competitors in general. Plain and simple. High caliber deserves high caliber.

That is part of what makes, or should make, the entire experience HIGH QUALITY and getting the word out that Raleigh takes quality serioisly.

Things do not have to be perfect in some areas, but the entire program needs to be well thought out and any *funky* areas should be met with a creative solution that makes everyone feel comfortable.

Comfort being a very key element here.

BIG FANS need to be TURNED UP to high.

I do not know of any horse that hasn't seen a fan that doesn't know what that steady hum is and they love it.

Now, any horse unfamiliar with a fan is going to have a problem, but this is not really a venue for horses that are *half broke*.

Someone mentioned they thought the riders were ok with the low volumn of the music at the sound check. Well, do they know the riders were ok with it or this that just an assumption. Did anyone take the time to discuss the FANS and the VOLUMN?? Really these are experienced freestyle riders ... volumn is half the fun.

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 11, 2011, 01:33 PM
I assumed it - I know that freestyle riders are given an opportunity to have a sound check at shows like this, and heard some having their sound check at some point over the weekend, so I assumed the CDI riders would have their sound checked.
And perhaps incorrectly, I assumed the volume that we heard was agreed upon at the sound checks.
Because I thought the volume was very low for the freestyles.

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 11, 2011, 01:34 PM
And as for an amateur exhibition - I clearly remember being at this competition long ago and the enterntainment involving people in a horse suit doing a pretend freestyle. Would you not approve of that either? It was very entertaining.

Maria
Jun. 11, 2011, 02:54 PM
And as for an amateur exhibition - I clearly remember being at this competition long ago and the enterntainment involving people in a horse suit doing a pretend freestyle. Would you not approve of that either? It was very entertaining.



Pretend freestyle? We were out to get a spot on team! The only thing that "might" have been a concern was the questionable drug test. I recall someone whispering something about alcohol.

I deny that of course.

BaroquePony
Jun. 11, 2011, 03:15 PM
Posted by Rhiannonjk:

And as for an amateur exhibition - I clearly remember being at this competition long ago and the enterntainment involving people in a horse suit doing a pretend freestyle. Would you not approve of that either? It was very entertaining.

How about something like a Quadrille or some type of exhibition ride that is beautiful and experienced? Or some variation of the beauty of the horse with beautiful lighing and music to match?

Dancing with horses or whatever .. ??

This is just off the cuff because I am supposed to be over at someone else's barn right now instead of typing on this computer.

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 11, 2011, 03:47 PM
Those require professionals to donate their time during a competition that is already lacking attendence (assuming that it is professionals doing these quadrilles that you are talking about) - and if they aren't donating, those are extra costs.
I don't feel that performers have to be professional to be fun and enjoyable and respectful. Vaulting is always a pleasure to watch, no matter how high the level. I thought the SCA demo was fun, though.
Heck, bring in a leadline exhibition during breaks and half the women I know in the crowd would be pulled from the vendors just to oogle at little girls on ponies.

evenstar
Jun. 11, 2011, 04:09 PM
Didn't we have freestyles in costumes awhile back? Open to all levels, and they were always fun. People come on Saturday night to see horses, so something like that could have added some value given that the actual Grand Prix Freestyle class had so few rides.

Anyway, I went to the show to hang out and watch the Prix St. George class on Friday (a rare year when I was not volunteering), and I quite enjoyed myself. Don't need a leader board, myself. I actually like to "judge" the rides myself, think about what final % I might come up with, and then see how my judgment stacks up against the real judges.

I thought the show had a very friendly atmosphere, and things seemed to be running well. I appreciated having an announcer for the two outside rings when I checked out some of the classes for the Classic. I was left thinking that this was a show where I'd like to compete.

Spiritpaws
Jun. 12, 2011, 06:11 AM
There was a soundcheck for the GP freestyle, but it was done, of course, when the arena was empty. Once you add people in the stands, more sound is absorbed. So what sounded loud in an empty arena, is not so loud when there are a good contingent of spectators.

The speakers in that arena are not directed down to the ring, so the higher you sit in the stands, the louder the music sounds; and because the announcer sits so high in the coliseum, he is hearing the music at a decent sound level.
It's the kind of situation that the riders needed a representative to be with the announcer, jacking up the volume levels.

In my humble opinion, if Raleigh wants to be a one * CDI then an electronic score board is not necessary. But a *** is a different kettle of fish. Remember in the span of 30 days there are now three CDIs: Kentucky, New Jersey, and Raleigh. Maybe NCDCTA does not want a prestigious CDI. That's really for the members to decide and the Board to act on the members' collective wishes.

Plantagenet
Jun. 12, 2011, 07:41 AM
You know, as a member of the NCDTA, I've been proud of the Raleigh CDI***. If it becomes a one star however, it will be a very different show.

Ask the lamplight crowd what happened to entries this year after downgrading. Ky was a one star, did they upgrade? I knew they were trying. NJ had an upgrade at the last minute last year (I felt so sorry for the show secretary, she was a trooper) and they got a lot more entries than they expected.

Only 3* CDIs count for usef GP long list scores. So that means if someone of that caliber needs a score at the end of the season, they won't be coming to Raleigh if it's a 1*. If NJ stays a 3*' they'll most likely stay up there (many of our east coast long listed riders are in the northeast any way.)

Raleigh was bouncing back this year after a year off. The show needs time to get back on everyone's radar IMHO. The new organizers need to learn the quirks of the facility. I'm hoping that next year will be even better and that the NCDCTA can make it even better than before!

S A McKee
Jun. 12, 2011, 09:03 AM
I don't know the answer to question #1.

Question #2, the Hunt Horse Complex to my knowledge does not own a Leaderboard, nor does the NCDCTA, nor do they own the electronics/computers/laptops needed for this service. Serveral years ago I asked about a leaderboard, at that time I was told to rent one would cost in the neighborhood of $10,000. Whether that price point is true or not I have not investigated. Therefore no Leaderboard. But there were live updates on the CDI website. Also scores were announced regularly, Sat evening the delay was usually only one horse behind.

Question #3, I believe only Saturday night the viewing public paid to attend the show. Proceeds from the sale of tickets went to Airborne Scholarship Association.

Not to pick on you Maria but your post brings up a few issues.
Starting in 2012 all H/J shows have to operate within certain standards. If the show can't meet the standards for their current rating they will be downgraded or even denied a license. This is a new USEF rule. At this point it only applies to H/J shows but I'd bet that Eventing and Dressage aren't far behind.

And yes, things like electronic scoreboards and jumbotrons are on the list for large, high rated shows. If the facility doesn't provide the needed equipment that will no longer be acceptable. You have to meet the requirements no matter how you acquire them.
There are specific requirements for stabling. If the facility doesn't meet them then get a new facility or rent from a vendor that is up to spec.

http://www.ushja.org/documents/rules/2011HJCompStandards.pdf

BaroquePony
Jun. 12, 2011, 09:53 AM
Of course the State of North Carolina has been advertising itself as a great horsey mecca, including the Raleigh area (so they aren't just relying on Southern Pines and Tryon as the *draw*).

The Raleigh area wants to draw people to the Research Triangle Park to increase their Tax Base, so they do boast about the Hunt Horse Complex and the NC State Vet School.

Pony Fixer
Jun. 12, 2011, 05:38 PM
So what I am gathering is...

The fans were not high enough. The fans were too loud. The music was too soft. The music was just fine. The entertainment was too amateurish. The entertainment was just fine.

Clearly there is no pleasing everyone. Or maybe anyone. This makes it hard to run a "big" show.

I can't speak for everyone (or anyone) on the NCDCTA board, but not only have I been to Devon, I have SHOWN there. Another board member rides GP and spends the winters in Welly world. There is a great depth and breadth of knowledge on the board, I assure you.

I keep hearing about the "rumors" about how the show was "so bad". This thread is no better, and being commented on by some who I'll bet weren't there at all the whole weekend. There were some issues, mostly with the NATIONAL show, not the CDI portion. The show will not be a financial success, but that was not the goal--all shows are suffering financially.

Hmm...supportive and wanting to help or complaining and nitpicking the weaknesses...

Have fun traveling to KY, PA and NJ to see a CDI...that's where this is heading...

Rhiannonjk
Jun. 12, 2011, 05:49 PM
Pony Fixer,

I thought we were engaged in some constructive conversation here, but if you only see it as nitpicking and negativity, I'll gladly step away. I know from experience that when you are very closely involved in something that every non-positive comment feels like negativity and disrespect, but that in no way is my intention.

Though I read your post as VERY negative, and it makes me think of the NCDCTA board, as a whole, in a bad light, even though I know many of you and think otherwise of some board members' individual efforts.

Pony Fixer
Jun. 12, 2011, 07:07 PM
You are right, there was some constructive discussion and some things that prove you can be "wrong" in some people's eyes no matter what you do.

But, to paint the NCDCTA board with a broad brush because I make one borderline "negative" comment is not fair. Seriously, that is like saying an entire choir sucked because one person had a cold.

At the end of the day, we are VOLUNTEERS. And we RUN the organization so that the MEMBERS can BENEFIT. If there is something we can actually fix, feel free to let us know. If there is something you would prefer, feel free to let us know but be warned that it may or may not happen.

Input is great. Regardless there are only so many hours in a day and we all have "day jobs" in addition to the countless hours (And I speak for everyone when I say countless. There are times of the year that my work for the NCDCTA constitutes a second job in addition to my "real" work, my horse, my family, etc. etc.). We hired EXPERIENCED CDI management--things still could have been better, and indeed would be improved upon if we do this again going forward. But it is an *IF* in no small part because we've had a lot of "negative" commentary, and very little "I want this to succeed, what can I do to help" mentality.

My point is if you value a local CDI, then make a list of what you think could be improved, and then be prepared to help make those improvements happen. And then convince us that you can't live without a CDI in your backyard. I'm not yet convinced. ;)

J-Lu
Jun. 12, 2011, 11:00 PM
Pony Fixer,

i was at the show and I posted positive comments on this thread. Would be happy to talk further via PM or in person (I guess we live near each other).

J.

MediaMD
Jun. 13, 2011, 12:04 AM
Thank you all who came, who sponsored, who volunteered, who competed and who are now providing us feedback on our recent CDI***Y/J Capital Dressage Classic. We are also grateful to our new manager Regina Antonioli and her team who had to work with us long distance for the last year, and then come into an unfamiliar facility and try to make this show a success in a difficult economic environment.

We are listening, and will incorporate all that we are able within our financial means and abilities for next year, if we do indeed move forward with a CDI in 2012. I'm in the media business, so hearing feedback is always valuable, whether positive or negative, and genuinely appreciated.

Over the next month or so we will be weighing the pros and cons, and certainly the final P and L numbers to determine whether NCDCTA is realistically able to continue to be one of the few GMOs in the country to host a show of this magnitude. I will not be President of NCDCTA in 2012 so will not be as involved as I have been this last year, so my voice will be somewhat muted. However, I will continue to volunteer as I am able within the confines of new responsibilities with my company.

As a Board we have a responsibility to provide the best possible value for our members through clinics, symposiums, scholarships and showing opportunities. I personally hope that mission will include continuing to host a CDI, but it will be up to the Board as a whole to weigh this decision with as much wisdom and foresight as we can garner, and then move forward with confidence and courage that we made the right choice.

Stay tuned, COTH community you'll be among the first to know. ;-)

clover
Jun. 13, 2011, 05:46 PM
Maybe I missed something but I didn't see any criticism here that is extreme enough for the NCDCTA board to react so negatively to hosting this again next year. Were there things that could have gone better, sure --- but overall I think it was a successful show. I volunteered all day on Saturday and everyone seemed to be having a good time and things seemed to be running smoothly more or less. Maybe I am just not privy to the big issues (I didn't see any show stoppers in this thread) but it seems to me we should learn from this and move on to next year. The first time is always going to be the hardest. There are lots of experienced volunteers available in this area help if the NCDCTA board is feeling overwhelmed -- I personally didn't see NCDCTA asking for a lot of help prior to the actual show weekend but maybe I missed it.

evenstar
Jun. 13, 2011, 06:23 PM
Maybe I missed something but I didn't see any criticism here that should is extreme enough for the NCDCTA board to react so negatively to hosting this again next year. Were there things that could have gone better, sure --- but overall I think it was a successful show. I volunteered all day on Saturday and every one seemed to be having a good time and things seemed to be running smoothly more or less. Maybe I am just not privy to the big issues (I didn't see any show stoppers in this thread) but it seems to me we should learn from this and move on to next year. The first time is always going to be the hardest. There are lots of experienced volunteers available in this area help if the NCDCTA board is feeling overwhelmed -- I personally didn't see NCDCTA asking for a lot of help prior to the actual show weekend but maybe I missed it.

Thank you for saying that. My positive comments seemed to have been dismissed as unimportant, and I've volunteered for many past CDIs so I know what the CDI can be. The main problem to me was the combination of the economy (which I think hurt the open show), the other show going on the same weekend, and the skipped year, which took took the CDI out of view as a "must".

I learned when I was at the show on Friday that a lot of the lists of volunteers from past years weren't available to help new management (and new volunteer coordinators), which explained why I was never asked about volunteering (so I assumed they just didn't want me anymore ((sniff))).

You know, Janine had many years to make this CDI what it came to be. It is unrealistic to think that new management coming from a very different state, no matter how experienced, is going to right away give us (as competitors and as spectators) exactly what we want. My money is on them putting on a fantastic event in 2012. And maybe by then the economy will have improved and more are encouraged to enter the open show as well (I remember well the years we had 5 rings going well into the evening).

As an aside, when Pony Fixer comes on here as a member of the NCDCTA board, she represents the voice of the board, good or bad. Thanks, MediaMD, for trying to repair some of the damage.

JennNC
Jun. 13, 2011, 07:52 PM
I would like to add, Evenstar, that I did note your positive comments as well as plenty of other posters who have posted favorably towards the show. And those with criticism, were, for the most part, offering it constructively.

A few things I would like to add after reading the thread thus far:

1) I don't know how much the show at Morven Park in Virginia hurt our numbers (probably not that much), but I am glad to hear from Commander Cody that VADA/NOVA agreed to move to another weekend (Thanks, guys!!). I do know that at least one of our more prominent trainers was at that show for the Young Horse Selection Trials. Our CDI has hosted a Young Horse Selection Trial in the past, so losing it this year certainly affected us. But them's the breaks!

2) To the poster who recommended that we check out Devon to see how a top show is run...well, while we didn't check out Devon, our NCDCTA president, Suzanne Mullen, went to the Del Mar International Dressage Show in California to see our new manager, first hand, at work at one of the most prestigious shows in the country.

Just as an FYI, when we were faced with the task of finding a new manager for our CDI, we knew that the powers-that-be will only approve a handful of CDI managers. We chose Regina Antonioli based one her many years of experience of running a top-notch CDI. Janine Malone had BIG shoes to fill, and we didn't take that lightly!

So we selected Regina. She is very accustomed to running shows where the competitors have names like Steffen and Shannon Peters, Guenter Seidel, Sue Blinks, Jan Ebeling, Leslie Morse, etc, etc, etc. It was at Del Mar a few years ago that Regina rolled out the red carpet for Brentina to say good-bye to all her fans while she read the poem written by Debbie McDonald on behalf of the beloved red mare.

We figured she knew how to put on a good show.

So, as some of you have stated....it takes a little learning curve for a new manager to come and run a show for the first time out of an unfamiliar facility.

We did have an AWESOME group of volunteers and Olga Wagner did a fantastic job overseeing her duties as she assisted Regina.

I also hope that we can put on a CDI for years to come.

While our Grand Prix freestyle class was small on Saturday night, it was good quality. I'm happy we could bring the show back this year.

I am no longer on the NCDCTA board, but I happily serve on the CDI committee and would welcome any thoughts, opinions, criticisms you might have via email or Private Message. If you want to email me, feel free: JennMitchell61@triad.rr.com

Thanks!
Jennifer

ride it
Jun. 14, 2011, 09:59 AM
I was at the CDI (CDC) as a competitor and thought I would weigh in, as a long time lurker on these boards.

On Friday, I witnessed a woman totally get in the face of someone in the show management because they were not given the volunteer job they had done in the past and felt the job they were offered was beneath them (this is what I gathered from overhearing on the way into the show office).

On Saturday, I heard all kind of murmuring about how the show was just "not nearly as nice" as previous years. I'm sure the management and NCDCTA board have been hearing it too.

I had a fine experience, with the only negatives being things they could not control--heat, smaller show, tough judging. I completely enjoyed the entertainment Saturday night and the singers almost brought me to tears. The jousting part was good family oriented fun which my 8 year old son thought was a total hoot.

Also, I am not put off in the least by the comments from PonyFixer. For all I know that was who got the earful by the unhappy volunteer. While it might not all be in this thread, and none of us except the management are privy to all the details, I'm sure they're sick of all the "what went wrong", and sometimes helpful/constructive criticism seems harsh if you are still upset. It would appear that she is just frustrated and letting folks know that without support there might not be a repeat. I can't even imagine the amount of work something this big takes, especially a first time, and having been in similar situations myself, I can be very sympathetic to being sensitive to what seems like criticism.

I hope we get to continue this tradition, if you need more in the "plus" column to push you!

Maria
Jun. 14, 2011, 10:32 AM
Thank you ride it.

We ALWAYS need more in the "plus" column. :)

owagner2501
Jun. 14, 2011, 07:04 PM
EVENSTAR - I am really sorry I did not include you on the volunteer roster this year. I was starting from scratch and used email blasts to the ncdcta base to recruit volunteers. Please send me an email at olga.t.wagner@gmail.com and I will add you to my list of potential volunteers.

RIDE IT - Sorry for you having to witness the irate outburst.. I must say that was the first time in many years that I took a slamming like that...

We had one of the BEST volunteer groups that I had a privilege to work with in long while. Several competitors including CDI competitors remarked at how professional and friendly the stewards and awards people were...And, the judges had nothing but praise for the scribes.

THANK YOU to all who volunteered! We REALLY cold not run this show with out you...

Olga

eggbutt
Jun. 14, 2011, 09:54 PM
EVENSTAR - I am really sorry I did not include you on the volunteer roster this year. I was starting from scratch and used email blasts to the ncdcta base to recruit volunteers. Please send me an email at olga.t.wagner@gmail.com and I will add you to my list of potential volunteers.



Olga, I am so sorry you had to start from scratch with volunteers! I know Janine left all her records (including lists of volunteers - particularly main ring scribes) in the trailer when it was moved. The fact that you didn't have those lists answers why some scribes who have always been counted on to scribe main ring were never contacted this year. :no:

I know your smile and sense of calm was a delight for all competitors the entire weekend!!

Cotner
Jun. 14, 2011, 10:18 PM
I don't post here often but thought I would weigh in also.

I was showing in the open show and had a very good experience. I had a stall on the inside aisle and found that it was well ventilated and cool considering the heat. I was allowed to have a fan, as were the other competitors around me. The only issue with the stalls is that they have a red clay base which is very dusty if your horse tends to paw.

The open show was smaller than in the past but I don't believe any of the competitors had a "schooling show" mentality, nor did show management. There were some very nice horses and good competent riders in the open show. I actually welcomed the fact that it was a bit on the quiet side since the horse I was riding is very excitable.

As far as the CDI, yes it would have been nice to have more Freestyles but I thought the ones I saw were excellent. I didn't find the indoor overly warm or stuffy and the entertainment was enjoyable.

I can't imagine the amount of work that goes into this show and I thought it was run very well. Maybe I am just not critical enough or too easy to please. Regardless, I hope the Raleigh CDI continues and grows bigger and better.

eggbutt
Jul. 31, 2011, 12:12 PM
So, I heard over the weekend at the Raleigh Summer I & II that NCDCTA will not now nor in the near future run a CDI again (although the board has not officially met to discuss the issue the Hunt Horse Complex has been informed)! It seems the show this year lost a TON of money for a variety of reasons, although Janine left her entire playbook of how to organize the show down to the last detail including a large volunteer list.

Janine Malone begain this show and organized/managed it for many years, contributing tens of thousands of dollars to NCDCTA over the years in profits to be used for education and the advancement of Dressage in NC. Janine was able to work with NCDCTA Board of Directors for all these years until the current board determined her "quirks" and her desire for absolute accountability to the penny caused her to be too hard to work with. She resigned at the end of 2009 during the Christmas holidays exhausted from the demands of the board. I believe NCDCTA can now truly appreciate Janine's ability to run fantastic shows and raise money for the organization despite personality differences with members of the current board.

Now indeed this is a real loss for North Carolina dressage competitors to lose the CDI. Humble pie does have a bitter taste I'm sure that NCDCTA leaders will thoughfully chew on. I am hopeful that a future NCDCTA board will have the maturity to honor Janine in every way possible for all she has done for the organization (founding member, CDI show organizer, etc).

On a very personal note, I hope Janine will again organize and manage a CDI somewhere in the southeast. If this happens it will definitely be a banner day for competitors in the Mid-Atlantic Region!

Sandie Dennis
Past NCDCTA President (as in years ago!!)

PS....I want to revise this a bit to apologize for indicating the current NCDCTA board as a whole was responsible for Janine resigning from show management for NCDCTA. It was a very distinct few on the 2009 board who pushed the limits of reason and remain on the board today. Those folks were truly "clueless" about many things CDI and let personalities get in the way....of course all of this is my opinion only.

grayarabpony
Jul. 31, 2011, 08:45 PM
Thanks for posting this eggbutt, I wondered why Janine Malone was no longer running the show.

Rhiannonjk
Aug. 1, 2011, 08:31 AM
I was thinking about reviving this thread on another note - and now that Eggbutt has, I want to add on a completely different track that the Hunt Complex was showing some fabulous upgrades this past weekend. There were some MASSIVE downpours, and all of the outdoor arenas drained beautifully (Though I can't speak for the warmup - the one arena I didn't see much of)

They were in the process of paving the aisleways in the barns, and I hear that the floors of the stalls have been leveled. Unfortunately, they haven't figured out a way to change the weather.

eggbutt
Aug. 1, 2011, 09:03 AM
I was thinking about reviving this thread on another note - and now that Eggbutt has, I want to add on a completely different track that the Hunt Complex was showing some fabulous upgrades this past weekend. There were some MASSIVE downpours, and all of the outdoor arenas drained beautifully (Though I can't speak for the warmup - the one arena I didn't see much of)



You are so right!!! And once again this is an example of Janine's positive involvement. When the new rings were being designed behind Barn E, it was Janine who insisted they be built to spec to drain properly. She spent hours working with the complex (on her own free time) to be sure the drainage and footing was exactly right. If you recall the old "temp" rings "on the hill" if it even misted the rings were under water! LOL!

dalpal
Aug. 1, 2011, 09:16 AM
So, I heard over the weekend at the Raleigh Summer I & II that NCDCTA will not now nor in the near future run a CDI again (although the board has not officially met to discuss the issue the Hunt Horse Complex has been informed)! It seems the show this year lost a TON of money for a variety of reasons, although Janine left her entire playbook of how to organize the show down to the last detail including a large volunteer list.

Janine Malone begain this show and organized/managed it for many years, contributing tens of thousands of dollars to NCDCTA over the years in profits to be used for education and the advancement of Dressage in NC. Janine was able to work with NCDCTA Board of Directors for all these years until the current board determined her "quirks" and her desire for absolute accountability to the penny caused her to be too hard to work with. She resigned at the end of 2009 during the Christmas holidays exhausted from the demands of the board. I believe NCDCTA can now truly appreciate Janine's ability to run fantastic shows and raise money for the organization despite personality differences with members of the current board.

Now indeed this is a real loss for North Carolina dressage competitors to lose the CDI. Humble pie does have a bitter taste I'm sure that NCDCTA leaders will thoughfully chew on. I am hopeful that a future NCDCTA board will have the maturity to honor Janine in every way possible for all she has done for the organization (founding member, CDI show organizer, etc).

On a very personal note, I hope Janine will again organize and manage a CDI somewhere in the southeast. If this happens it will definitely be a banner day for competitors in the Mid-Atlantic Region!

Sandie Dennis
Past NCDCTA President (as in years ago!!)

PS....I want to revise this a bit to apologize for indicating the current NCDCTA board as a whole was responsible for Janine resigning from show management for NCDCTA. It was a very distinct few on the 2009 board who pushed the limits of reason and remain on the board today. Those folks were truly "clueless" about many things CDI and let personalities get in the way....of course all of this is my opinion only.

Couldn't agree more with you Sandie.

Maria
Aug. 1, 2011, 09:41 AM
This makes me very unhappy if true.

There have been people behind the scenes that have wanted this show to fail no matter what. From the very first year they have had nothing but negative things to say about the show, it's organizers, it's workers, etc.

This is fact, not conjecture, as some of these people have spoken to me over the years. No matter what I said, they had an arguement for it.

Well, CONGRATULATIONS, I guess now you have gotten your way.

It's North Carolina's loss.

While I understand the financial loss of the 2011 show, it's nothing that can't be overcome. If the show is done correctly.

I'll shut up now, so much to say, so little good it will do.

eggbutt
Aug. 1, 2011, 09:58 AM
Yes Maria, I couldn't agree with you more. I have remained relatively silent about what happened to cause Janine to resign to see if those in leadership could come to their senses and realize what they were doing to the organization and dressage in NC.

It has always come down to personalities and control. When I was president for so many years, and Bo Belton was president before me, we more or less gave Janine free reign to organize/manage the CDI as she saw fit, knowing she was accountable in every single way, and realizing the huge task of what amount of work a CDI takes. Keep in mind, Janine did the majority of this work for all the many years she did it for literally pennies an hour.

So many rumors were started last year about the previous shows and Janine herself that were blatantly untrue and it's time for honesty.

Yes, jealousy, bitterness, need for control, personality conflicts, ignorance, arrogance, pot stirring, personal agendas, etc are all reasons Janine was forces out and now after all this time, the end of an NCDCTA CDI.

Who knows, perhaps my now public statements will cause the board to reconsider many things at their upcoming board meeting and admit their mistakes along the way regarding the CDI and Janine's tremendous contributions to the organization and dressage across the nation.

OK...I will now try to become as quiet about this as I've been for the past 18 months. After all, Janine has moved on (very successfully I might add) and so should we. My problem is I truly care about NCDCTA and the great work it does with the profits from the shows with the CDI being the diamond in the crown. Thank goodness NCDCTA had the GAIG championships last year to offset the financial loss from the CDI this year.

clover
Aug. 1, 2011, 04:28 PM
This is really disappointing news. Definately a loss for the area and for NCDCTA.

JennNC
Aug. 1, 2011, 07:28 PM
Its amazing how quickly information can travel on the internet. And as we all know, if you read it on the internet...it must be true! lol

I'd like to share a couple of points regarding this latest newsflash here on the COTH regarding our CDI.

I finished my tenure as president of NCDCTA in 2009 and am happy to continue to serve on the NCDCTA Competition Committee and on the 2011 CDI committee as well. While it is true that there will be no CDI in 2012, there is always the consideration of bringing it back in the future.

I regret that the news broke on an internet bulletin board before the NCDCTA could officially publish the news with the facts intact, but it does seem that the COTH BB is where fast breaking news can best be found (which is why I surf regularly, of course)!

Just to clear up any potential confusion, I want to share the two reasons as to why we have decided not to hold a CDI next year:

First, and very importantly, we did sustain financial loss. The actual facts are that the CDI part of the show WAS successful. We had a full slate of CDI riders and the CDI was well received by the dressage community, etc. It was very unfortunate, however, that the national part of the show, the Capital Dressage Classic was so undersubscribed. A successful CDC is necessary to financially support the CDI. The costs of running a CDI are exorbitant. Sadly, the CDC just didn't make enough this year to support it. I'm sure there are various reasons...the economy is an obvious one. Also, we have a LOT more shows now. With more shows to choose from, the numbers go down on many of them.

If there were folks who actually wanted the show to fail..perhaps they might have even "boycotted" the show for all I know.

Thirdly, and I think this is important to note...there are competitors who clearly don't like to compete when there is a CDI going on because the scoring IS tougher. I heard this from several competitors. Some of them DID show up to volunteer, however.

Sponsorship was down as well.

Secondly, and equally as important - the 2012 Olympic trials at Gladstone will be held very close to the weekend of our CDI date next year. At one point, we thought that it might even fall on the SAME date as our show. Regardless, due to the Olympic trials at the Gladstone show which will include the small and large tour riders....the Raleigh CDI would NOT be a points-earner for the Young Riders, the PSG riders, the Intermediare riders, nor the Grand Prix riders. In other words....it would be a TINY CDI due to the date of the Gladstone show falling so closely to our show and due to the fact that riders could not use our show as a qualifier in 2012.

So, I'm sure that you can all understand that it would be very unwise to hold a CDI in 2012.

We DO look forward to having a fabulous Capital Dressage Classic next year and perhaps a CDI is still in our future. We had a great group of volunteers and no problem getting them, which was fantastic. Thanks again to ALL who volunteered! Regina Antonioli, who was our manager this year, was thrilled with the volunteer effort from NCDCTA and she commented several times how much she enjoyed working with our NC manager, Olga Wagner who assisted her.

And, Maria, we are still so very grateful to have had you and the others who volunteered these many years at past CDIs to have come back and given of yourselves to make this past year's CDI so much fun. (Maria put on an AWESOME competitor's party and we hope to see everyone who helped back again to help us in the future.)

Thanks again to those who supported this year's effort and I hope to see our usual "cast of competitors" back in full force next year for the 2012 Capital Dressage Classic!

Oh, and RhiannonJk..you are right, the new improvements at the Raleigh fairgrounds are fantastic!

Jennifer Mitchell

Pony Fixer
Aug. 2, 2011, 12:07 AM
(snip) While it is true that there will be no CDI in 2012, there is always the consideration of bringing it back in the future.

I regret that the news broke on an internet bulletin board before the NCDCTA could officially publish the news with the facts intact, but it does seem that the COTH BB is where fast breaking news can best be found (which is why I surf regularly, of course)!
(snip)

Thirdly, and I think this is important to note...there are competitors who clearly don't like to compete when there is a CDI going on because the scoring IS tougher. I heard this from several competitors. Some of them DID show up to volunteer, however.

Jennifer Mitchell

No kidding!

I sit on the board and we haven't even VOTED yet on whether to hold the CDI or not. I did hear this same "rumor" multiple times at Janine's show this weekend and kept trying to mention that there had not yet actually been a vote. So I *assume* (and you know where that gets one ;)) this means the competition committee is going to RECOMMEND to the board that we not have one. The actual vote is tomorrow.

I am also one of the competitors that volunteered all weekend in lieu of competing (which I discussed with Jennifer openly), knowing based on past experience with several of the CDC judges that scores would be low (and they were very much so). I'm not a judge "shopper"--evidenced by my showing this past weekend under some known tough judges--but there are a few out there who have given me consistently what I consider to be lower-than-deserved scores and it's far too expensive to show KNOWING I'm going to get low scores.

And Sandie, lawdy!, thanks for clarifying. I have been completely NEUTRAL to all past board members and their real and perceived strengths and weaknesses. Maybe I'm naive (probably so, I am so A-political), but I don't think anyone wanted Janine to be grilled on a spit, and have never heard anything but praise for all of her hard work over the years for the CDI, the NCDCTA and dressage in the USA in general. There are always 3 sides to every story--"yours", "mine" and the "truth".

Threads like this make me want to go "lalalalalallalalalallalala I can't hear you, I'm just here to throw a good party" :lol:

Nice seeing both of you at the show, btw!

Robyn Hahn

eggbutt
Aug. 2, 2011, 08:37 AM
I'll shut up now, so much to say, so little good it will do.


After the "clarification" from past pres Jennifer, all I can do is agree with Maria!:yes:

Rhiannonjk
Aug. 2, 2011, 09:15 AM
Thanks for clarifying Jennifer! I hope that we will have the CDI back in the future.