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dp1092
Mar. 25, 2011, 09:36 PM
Does anyone know if the USEFNetwork will be broadcasting the USHJA derby next week? Thanks! :)

findlymine
Mar. 25, 2011, 11:08 PM
yes it will be!!!!

AliCat
Mar. 25, 2011, 11:26 PM
Is it bad that I am upset that I will be doing fabulous things in NYC, and am a bit bummed that I will miss this?

Tha Ridge
Mar. 25, 2011, 11:54 PM
Is it bad that I am upset that I will be doing fabulous things in NYC, and am a bit bummed that I will miss this?

You can come to my apartment and watch it. :D :lol:

AliCat
Mar. 25, 2011, 11:59 PM
You can come to my apartment and watch it. :D :lol:

:lol:

I would love to, but I don't know that my friend I am tour guiding would enjoy that so much.

Perhaps if we ordered Chinese takeout he could be swayed....

dp1092
Mar. 26, 2011, 12:48 AM
I had to work the night of the Nation's Cup...I was so upset. But I'm so happy they are having live feed of the derby! Definitely my favorite class of WEF :)

CThorse
Mar. 29, 2011, 06:50 PM
does anyone know what time it is scheduled to start?

Lucassb
Mar. 29, 2011, 06:58 PM
The email I got states it will be shown on the USEFnetwork on Saturday, with the first horse at 7:30 pm... http://www.usefnetwork.com/WEFDerby2011/

clearound
Mar. 30, 2011, 12:24 AM
They are only showing the second round of the Derby. The first round is Friday afternoon. I am not sure how many they bring back for the second round.

MHM
Mar. 30, 2011, 03:48 AM
They are only showing the second round of the Derby. The first round is Friday afternoon. I am not sure how many they bring back for the second round.

I believe the top 25 come back on Saturday night.

Plumcreek
Apr. 2, 2011, 01:44 AM
This better be good. Finally decided to invite small group of internet-challenged hunter riders over tomorrow to watch the Hunter Derby on the big screen TV feed from my computer. Bought super party food. I reconnected the cable that I had disconected to check another problem weeks ago, and now no TV feed. Disconecting has negated the set-up somehow, way above my capabilities to fix, so now Mr. Expensive Computer Man is coming in the morning. Murphys Law strikes.

MHM
Apr. 2, 2011, 06:53 AM
Ugh, Plumcreek, that stinks.

There were some lovely horses and great trips in the first round, so hopefully the class tonight will be worth the trouble for you. :)

bizbachfan
Apr. 2, 2011, 07:31 AM
was planning on going to this but life got in the way and I will be watching the feed instead

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 11:32 AM
According to Shownet, these are the top 25 from yesterday (in order). I'm wondering where Castle Rock is?? He wasn't even in the first round.
EMPIRE SCOTT STEWART
JERSEY BOY JENNIFER ALFANO
INCLUSIVE VICTORIA COLVIN
DEDICATION SCOTT STEWART
PRAISE KELLEY FARMER
ROCK STAR LOUISE SERIO
MISS LUCY JENNIFER ALFANO
SIENNA PATRICIA GRIFFITH
SAILOR'S VALENTINE HOLLY ORLANDO
BASES LOADED KELLEY FARMER
DELOREAN PATRICIA GRIFFITH
SUMMER PLACE MAGGIE JAYNE
THE SPECIALIST KRISTY MCCORMACK
MONTAGUE GARY YOUNG
GOGOL LYMAN WHITEHEAD
CARLOS BOY SCOTT STEWART
FRANCESCA MAGGIE JAYNE
SUNDANCE KIM MC CORMACK
COOPER SCOTT STEWART
GENEROUS DAVID OLIYNYK
COASTING LAENA ROMOND
ELON AF OSTRA HULT MELISSA BARK
LUXOR NIKKI CARR
DECLARATION SCOTT STEWART
ENSO LILLIE KEENAN

Sundown
Apr. 2, 2011, 02:48 PM
Did Lone Star do this class yesterday? Or is it since he won he can't compete again?

MHM
Apr. 2, 2011, 03:32 PM
Lone Star did not do it yesterday. No idea of the reason.

I'd be surprised if there was any kind of restriction on past winners.

supershorty628
Apr. 2, 2011, 07:37 PM
If it's not too much trouble, can someone post how Cooper (with Scott Stewart up) goes? He was in Kip's barn for a long time and I absolutely adore him - was very sad when he was sold.

This is what he looks like: http://chronofhorse.com/sites/default/files/WEF12Cooper.jpg

Thanks!!

MHM
Apr. 2, 2011, 07:55 PM
Supershorty, he was good yesterday. I'll keep an eye out for him.

I'll be interested to see what the course looks like. They sure had a lot of stuff in the ring this afternoon!

MoonLadyIsis
Apr. 2, 2011, 07:56 PM
wasn't Lonestar retired?? I thought I remembered reading about or hearing it, but I can't remember

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:24 PM
I read on Horseshowdiva he was lame...not sure how much truth to that there is. Such a nice horse.

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:43 PM
Bad boy Declaration!

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:43 PM
Declaration was giving Scott a tough time about the bank! Kudos to him for getting over it.

War Admiral
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:46 PM
Hmmm, I'm thinking my baby greenie needs to go school some event courses and learn tables at some point in the next couple years!

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:50 PM
Have these horses never schooled banks before this?

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:51 PM
I tuned in late... is there some kind of leaderboard online somewhere? I love that they go up the bank and leave the ring a little bit.

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:52 PM
Looks like judges 2 and 3 saw the last horse break but the score from team 1 didn't seem to take into consideration...thoughts?

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:53 PM
Have these horses never schooled banks before this?

If their riders are smart they have ;) I'm sure Declaration has. Must have been an off night.

Roxy SM
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:54 PM
Wow the second to last horse was given a 76 from the first judge and a 55 (I more agree with this score) from the other two!

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:54 PM
Yes, I noticed the trotting as well. I've seen two trot so far.

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:54 PM
Probably a blocked view, which is why the teams are separate.

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:57 PM
Poor Generous saw a monster in the corner... shame. I'm a sucker for a goodlooking chestnut.

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:57 PM
Generous had a moment there.

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 08:58 PM
Lots of trouble tonight! It's a shame hunters don't get to practice under the lights as much as jumpers do.

MHM
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:02 PM
Cooper was very good. Certainly more cooperative than Scott's first mount!

Unfortunately jumped a bit high and had the back rail down at the last jump. :(

PolymerChem
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:02 PM
Love the feed! Unfortunately, it seems like a rough night - I think everyone so far has a knockdown, refusal, or trot break.

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:02 PM
If it's not too much trouble, can someone post how Cooper (with Scott Stewart up) goes? He was in Kip's barn for a long time and I absolutely adore him - was very sad when he was sold.

This is what he looks like: http://chronofhorse.com/sites/default/files/WEF12Cooper.jpg

Thanks!!

Love his face! He's like a giant pony.
He had a great round until the last fence, where he took a rail :(
but got raw scores of 54, 48, and 50. total score of 174.

klmck63
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:03 PM
If it's not too much trouble, can someone post how Cooper (with Scott Stewart up) goes? He was in Kip's barn for a long time and I absolutely adore him - was very sad when he was sold.

This is what he looks like: http://chronofhorse.com/sites/default/files/WEF12Cooper.jpg

Thanks!!

Cute horse! Had a really nice round but a rail at the last fence :(.

Scores of 54, 48 and 50, got some points for the high options and some bonus points for handiness, total of 174 for round two, 339 for both rounds.

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:05 PM
Awesome round for Sundance!!

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:05 PM
Damn!! Kimmy was after it, wasn't she??

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:05 PM
Very nice bold round from Kim and Sun Dance. Lots of flare and good off the bank to the wall

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:05 PM
Big whoop and whistle for Sundance!

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:06 PM
Wow.. Sundance looks like Jersey Boy!
88, 90, and 85! Guess he's not scared of the bank after everything he saw as an eq horse.

2tempe
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:08 PM
Sundance - so nice to see him going around sans martingale...
And I love the course; if I could have done something like these courses in my adult ammie days, instead of the line/diagonal thing; I might have stayed w/ hunters!

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:09 PM
I thought Francesca's scores were high...

supershorty628
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:13 PM
Thanks for the Cooper updates... bummer about the last fence. :( :( I love him and his baby face so much, haha.

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:13 PM
I thought Francesca's scores were high...

Did she have an error? My feed was skipping. All I saw was that it was a bit of a scurry-around. What did I miss?

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:13 PM
Ditto on Francesca. She made it around with pace, but I didn't like her cornering and a couple of her distances. It went from Pace to quickness.

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:14 PM
I thought Francesca's scores were high...

I agree. She looked frazzled.

lep
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:17 PM
She cross-cantered on the bank, too.

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:18 PM
And she cross cantered on the up and down bank.

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:21 PM
Really wish they had a commercial break so I could run to the kitchen to get a drink!

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:22 PM
Ahhh. That explains it.

Love Gogol lopping his ears around the course!

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:25 PM
The way too big flapping martingale was very distracting on Montague! Anyone else see that??

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:26 PM
the judging quite confusing

oh well

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:26 PM
Very confused on the judging, montague was quick.

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:28 PM
Very confused on the judging, montague was quick.

He also swapped at least once, I think twice.

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:31 PM
Bummer about the swap on The Specialist- three friends and I are watching this together via AIM, and independently of each other we all said "I like that one!" as he came in.

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:32 PM
Shame on Jayne's steering error there. Nice going horse. Thought he went better the Francesca.

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:32 PM
The judging will even itself out. The best ones are still at the top, the worst at the bottom, and lots of room to fill in the middle.

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:33 PM
Shame on Jayne's steering error there. Nice going horse.

Good horse to basically trot that fence!

JinxyPoo
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:34 PM
Aww that's a shame. Summer Place is so cute.

lep
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:34 PM
It is confusing.... Bases Loaded blew a lead and cross-cantered. One of the recent ones (forget which, but a bay) had swaps before a few fences.

wanderlust
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:35 PM
Shame on Jayne's steering error there. Nice going horse. Funny, I was just thinking (again) how much I dislike her herky-jerky steering and style, and then she totally missed the pass-through. That lovely horse deserves a better ride than that.

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:36 PM
Apparently someone really likes Phil Collins

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:37 PM
Patrica's horse looks super green.. I laughed when her stock tie came loose!

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:38 PM
He likes the Beatles better.

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:40 PM
I think the horses need to compare notes at the in gate. A lot of "canter, canter, up the bank, canter, canter canter, I'm a good pony, I'm a good WHAT THE HECK IS THAT?! okay I'm over it canter down the bank I'm a good pony..."

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:41 PM
thought Sailor's Valentine quite nice!

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:42 PM
Note to riders: you are riding hunters, motoring around your corner through the walkways is not attractive.

kateh
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:42 PM
^^ He seemed really into it!

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:42 PM
they thought so too ':yes:

what a beautiful horse - anyone know it's breeding?

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:45 PM
She imported him, but he's got a very TB look.

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:45 PM
Scott S having a time!

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:45 PM
She imported him, but he's got a very TB look.

I agree - that very non warmblood neck!!!!!!!

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:45 PM
Poor Scott... not a great night for him.

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:45 PM
Poor scott, his luck at the banks and that last fence is not so good.

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:46 PM
Poor Scott! It's just not his night! Kudos to the way he's handled himself though!

Peggy
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:47 PM
SAILOR'S VALENTINE (5114799)
Foal Date: 4/18/2002
Breed: KWPN
Color: Chestnut Sex: G
Sire: VDL ORAME (http://www.paardenfokken.nl/pedigree.php?horseid=2257)
Dam: REMY-GO (http://www.paardenfokken.nl/pedigree.php?horseid=244937)
Membership Type: Life
Breed Registry Information:
VALENTINE GO (02.10420) - KWPN

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:48 PM
thanks Peggy!!!

wanderlust
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:49 PM
Go Jen! Beautifully and smartly ridden. Very odd scoring, though. Team 2 a 66?

Sorry to see Scott have those problems, his horse is stunning.

JinxyPoo
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:51 PM
What was the deal with that 66??

joiedevie99
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:54 PM
The scoring at the bank seems super inconsistent. Some panels don't seem to be faulting the lead swapping/cross-cantering issues anywhere near as drastically as others.

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:54 PM
They must have really whacked her for the awkward bank. Nicest horse so far.

wanderlust
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:55 PM
Ok, it's official. Team 2 is smoking crack. An 89 with 10 bonus points? It was just not that good.

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:55 PM
couple chips for serio and a little lost once, not sure about the 2nd place

JinxyPoo
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:55 PM
Scores all over the place for Rock Star too

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:58 PM
That Praise is a good-looking horse. Shame.

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:01 PM
odd canter on sienna and some trotting

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:01 PM
I wish they hadn't changed the name - that is Vallado - that "Praise" - a wonderful stallion just starting out in hunters

IMHO - keep the name !!! - and "Praise" is

IMHO

an awful name

A lot for a recent starter in all this to deal with!

A very nice horse!

Peggy
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:02 PM
That Praise is a good-looking horse. Shame.Adorable horse. The announcer said something about him being new to the hunter ring, but didn't mention which ring he came from.

MHM
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:02 PM
All I can say is I have a pretty good vantage point with a good view right by the table bank, and it's still hard to see everything. So that might explain the range of scores.

I don't think any of the judges are actually situated at the mid-point of the ring.

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:06 PM
I saw Inclusive last weekend.. wow he jumps so well!
Too bad about those tight distances, but a nice ride from Tori.

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:06 PM
inclusive was nice, except for the one wall which made people gasp

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:06 PM
so how will the judge the overchecks by Victoria Colvin???

let's see

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:09 PM
Jersey Boy pretty fine

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:09 PM
Nice round from jersey boy, little long to one and some playing on the backside. nice last hand gallop

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:10 PM
a raw 97 for Jersey Boy??!?!? Wow.

Peggy
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:10 PM
Seemed to me that Inclusive made an un-hunterly bid at a few fences.

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:13 PM
so how will the judge the overchecks by Victoria Colvin???

let's see

iEquitate
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:13 PM
winning round for Empire.

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:13 PM
they will give it to Scott even though I didn't love the round

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:13 PM
Oh, yeah...

enjoytheride
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:13 PM
Agreed on empire.

Natalie A
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:14 PM
Or not! Love watching Jersey Boy go.

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:14 PM
winning round for Empire.

I agree. He really should have won. He had the best bank jump of the night too!

joiedevie99
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:15 PM
I too thought Empire had a nicer round than Jersey Boy.

Peggy
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:15 PM
Loved Empire's jump but he just didn't seem as smooth and broke b/w the fences as Jersey Boy.

mcohen416@ufl.edu
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:15 PM
Empire is without a doubt my new fav hunter stallion

Midge
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:16 PM
At the end of the night, Miss Lucie is the one I want to take home...

Renn/aissance
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:21 PM
I liked Empire better than Jersey Boy, but judged purely on the second rounds, I liked Sundance best of all.

War Admiral
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:22 PM
I too thought Empire had a nicer round than Jersey Boy.

I thought so too.

Tell you who I *really* thought was best over the bank though was Lillie Keenan! It's a shame she had to go first, I wonder if they might have scored her higher if she'd gone later.

Tap2Tango
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:28 PM
I liked Empire better than Jersey Boy, but judged purely on the second rounds, I liked Sundance best of all.

I also thought Sundance had the best round.

3Dogs
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:34 PM
Umm - I didn't think so - Empire had a few subtle checks and gappy mouth moments

JMHO

And Victoria also had some bobbles though I LOVE that horse!

MHM
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:40 PM
I agree. He really should have won. He had the best bank jump of the night too!

Empire only took three strides on the table bank, compared to Jersey Boy's six strides on that bank. To me, that shows a lot of handiness! But the chestnut did jump well.

Oh, well, that's what makes it interesting! ;)

wanderlust
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:44 PM
Umm - I didn't think so - Empire had a few subtle checks and gappy mouth moments

JMHO I agree, and I wouldn't call it subtle. Scott had a good firm feel of his mouth the whole way around... some times firmer than others. ;)

Beenthere
Apr. 2, 2011, 11:01 PM
Who are the judges with Team 1, 2 and 3?

MHM
Apr. 2, 2011, 11:23 PM
Who are the judges with Team 1, 2 and 3?

I believe it was announced as:

1. Kitty Barker/Danny Robertshaw
2. Paddy Downing/Johnny Barker
3. Scott Fitton/Jim Clapperton

Prime Time Rider
Apr. 3, 2011, 12:27 AM
I missed the live feed, Does anyone know if they're going to replay it?

Plumcreek
Apr. 3, 2011, 04:58 AM
I missed the live feed, Does anyone know if they're going to replay it?


Check back in a day or so, and something will be archived.

MHM
Apr. 3, 2011, 09:01 AM
I thought Sundance looked great last night! I know he won the equitation finals a few years ago. Does anyone know what he's been doing lately?

usedtobeaweffer
Apr. 3, 2011, 12:51 PM
I too agree that Empire went great… however… Jersey Boy went much "quieter" on a looser more easy going rein whereas Empire just seemed like he was "ridden" the whole way… I mean obviously I am simply trying to find something wrong with the ride because it was still amazing… I just think that the more "huntery" one was Jersey Boy.. although I really don't like him as much as some do…

Gnrock25
Apr. 3, 2011, 02:13 PM
Did anyone read the article in the Chronicle? Specifically Scott Stewarts comment: "I was a little disappointed in the course,” said Stewart, who focuses on the traditional divisions but started contending occasional derbies last year. “Not taking anything away from Jen, she rode great and the horse went great, but I thought it wasn't a true hunter course. First year horses maybe shouldn’t have gone in the class. I was this close to not going with my first horse. I was a little disappointed with the designer and what he put forward to us with the table and all that. I didn't think it was really a fair test for most hunters.”"

It was a HANDY! That means its NOT traditional! Its supposed to be different! This just made me angry that he complained about it. Just because he has great hunters doesnt mean that they will automatically win all of the derbies. Did this comment annoy anyone else? or was it just me?

MHM
Apr. 3, 2011, 02:21 PM
^ I think it's just you.

He's entitled to his opinion, whether or not you happen to agree with it.

In fact, I would say he's more entitled to an opinion than most, since he's out there doing it at the top level week after week, and he qualified five in the top 25 in this class.

dp1092
Apr. 3, 2011, 02:35 PM
Did anyone read the article in the Chronicle? Specifically Scott Stewarts comment: "I was a little disappointed in the course,” said Stewart, who focuses on the traditional divisions but started contending occasional derbies last year. “Not taking anything away from Jen, she rode great and the horse went great, but I thought it wasn't a true hunter course. First year horses maybe shouldn’t have gone in the class. I was this close to not going with my first horse. I was a little disappointed with the designer and what he put forward to us with the table and all that. I didn't think it was really a fair test for most hunters.”"

It was a HANDY! That means its NOT traditional! Its supposed to be different! This just made me angry that he complained about it. Just because he has great hunters doesnt mean that they will automatically win all of the derbies. Did this comment annoy anyone else? or was it just me?

I don't think it's just you, I agree with you. Scott did qualify five in the top 25, however the course was a more experienced course for more experienced horses. Scott's horses that qualified were first years, and this course showed that the first year horses need improvement, which is why they are first years. Jersey Boy has been in the sport with Jen for a while and is always very successful in derbies. Scott's horses are VERY talented and always put a good in a good course, but Jersey Boy, a more experienced horse, put in an EXCELLENT ride last night over a more experienced course.

I realy hope this didn't offend anyone :(

dp1092
Apr. 3, 2011, 02:39 PM
On a better note,
http://www.chronofhorse.com/sites/default/files/WEF12BethMcCormackKissingSundance.jpg
Does anyone else think this is the cutest picture ever? Kisses for an amazing horse proving he isn't just a Maclay finals winner.

kateh
Apr. 3, 2011, 03:11 PM
dp, I particularly liked this one:
http://www.chronofhorse.com/sites/default/files/WEF12MontagueandGaryYoung.jpg
Not just a pat, a full on hug!

Ruby G. Weber
Apr. 3, 2011, 04:40 PM
I thought the course won.

By George!
Apr. 3, 2011, 04:57 PM
I don't think it's just you, I agree with you. Scott did qualify five in the top 25, however the course was a more experienced course for more experienced horses. Scott's horses that qualified were first years, and this course showed that the first year horses need improvement, which is why they are first years. Jersey Boy has been in the sport with Jen for a while and is always very successful in derbies. Scott's horses are VERY talented and always put a good in a good course, but Jersey Boy, a more experienced horse, put in an EXCELLENT ride last night over a more experienced course.

I realy hope this didn't offend anyone :(

You certainly didn't offend me, since I agree with you. Scott's comments to the Chronicle reporter smack of sour grapes and poor sportsmanship. I watched the class in person, and I've seen all of the WEF hunter derbies (I think this one was the third?) in person. Scott has had multiple rides in each of them. So far, the handy rounds have all been in the International ring, under the lights, and each handy has used the table and the bank as part of the handy course. There's no way he or
his horses should have been surprised by the table.

And the horse that stopped out at the table was Declaration, who is most certainly not a first year horse. Last but not least, all the horses had 30 minutes to hand walk all around all the elements of the course before the class started. (yes, I know it's different once the horse goes back in -alone- to actually jump.)

My $.02.

By George!
Apr. 3, 2011, 05:02 PM
On the topic of first year horses, Tori Colvin rode Inclusive, a first year horse Scott owns. She didn't have any trouble with the table or the bank.

usedtobeaweffer
Apr. 3, 2011, 05:29 PM
I agree Scott was all sour grapes…. to bad as he is one the top if not the top hunter trainer/rider….

dp1092
Apr. 3, 2011, 06:09 PM
You certainly didn't offend me, since I agree with you. Scott's comments to the Chronicle reporter smack of sour grapes and poor sportsmanship. I watched the class in person, and I've seen all of the WEF hunter derbies (I think this one was the third?) in person. Scott has had multiple rides in each of them. So far, the handy rounds have all been in the International ring, under the lights, and each handy has used the table and the bank as part of the handy course. There's no way he or
his horses should have been surprised by the table.

And the horse that stopped out at the table was Declaration, who is most certainly not a first year horse. Last but not least, all the horses had 30 minutes to hand walk all around all the elements of the course before the class started. (yes, I know it's different once the horse goes back in -alone- to actually jump.)

My $.02.


Jersey Boy "looked" at the pond but Jen didn't think twice about it and kept riding to what she wanted out of her horse, and she had an excellent round. Scott, when Decleration stopped on the table, you could see him kind of alarmed by the stopped and didn't fully regroup before attempting to jump down the table. Instead he rushed the horse and rushed himself without getting organized. All-in-all Kim McCormick's round on Sundance was my favorite round all night. Good rider and good horse, amazing what an equitation winner can do in a hunter derby :)

3Dogs
Apr. 3, 2011, 10:05 PM
You certainly didn't offend me, since I agree with you. Scott's comments to the Chronicle reporter smack of sour grapes and poor sportsmanship. I watched the class in person, and I've seen all of the WEF hunter derbies (I think this one was the third?) in person. Scott has had multiple rides in each of them. So far, the handy rounds have all been in the International ring, under the lights, and each handy has used the table and the bank as part of the handy course. There's no way he or
his horses should have been surprised by the table.

And the horse that stopped out at the table was Declaration, who is most certainly not a first year horse. Last but not least, all the horses had 30 minutes to hand walk all around all the elements of the course before the class started. (yes, I know it's different once the horse goes back in -alone- to actually jump.)

My $.02.

right on

any one pay attention to the fact that Scott's horses are prepped to the nines by the worker bees and he hops on for one or two jumps and into the ring he goes? Not taking away from his talent but perhaps he could get to know his horses a bit better (and work on those banks ;) )

my $.02

War Admiral
Apr. 3, 2011, 10:51 PM
Sour grapes. He got outridden by a 13 y/o and a 14 y/o. Fact.

I respect him, but nobody is invincible, and apparently he needs to be reminded of the simple fact that success is 99% preparation.

Get thee to an eventing course, Mr. Stewart!


(Footnote: my barn has already scheduled its baby greenies for exactly that, in September.)

showjumpers66
Apr. 4, 2011, 02:41 AM
Thanks! He is my favorite horse ever. We imported Vallado (aka Praise) as a 3 year old as a hunter prospect, but moved him to the jumper ring to meet his stallion licensing requirements. Wendy Peralta has been showing him in the jumpers for us, although she had been prepping him for a move to the High Peformance hunters / derbies. Kelley Farmer has only had the ride for less than two weeks since Larry Glefke purchased him and they just need a bit more time to get each other figured out. It was a really tough course to get to know each other with. :yes: I personally thought it was a great course.


Adorable horse. The announcer said something about him being new to the hunter ring, but didn't mention which ring he came from.

supershorty628
Apr. 4, 2011, 10:00 AM
right on

any one pay attention to the fact that Scott's horses are prepped to the nines by the worker bees and he hops on for one or two jumps and into the ring he goes? Not taking away from his talent but perhaps he could get to know his horses a bit better (and work on those banks ;) )

my $.02

I don't think that's really a fair assumption. You don't know how much work Scott does with those horses in the morning or at home (I don't either). There is a huge time crunch to get horses prepped for a class like that, and with the number of horses that he had in there - 5? 6? - the ring would have been held up more than once if someone didn't have the horse pretty much ready to go so he could get off one and get on the next.

Just my 2 cents as well.

GreenMachine
Apr. 4, 2011, 10:19 AM
I don't think that's really a fair assumption. You don't know how much work Scott does with those horses in the morning or at home (I don't either). There is a huge time crunch to get horses prepped for a class like that, and with the number of horses that he had in there - 5? 6? - the ring would have been held up more than once if someone didn't have the horse pretty much ready to go so he could get off one and get on the next.

Just my 2 cents as well.

Indeed. Clearly, he knows his horses well enough to have had five qualified for the second round. That's certainly better than most, with or without worker bees.

meupatdoes
Apr. 4, 2011, 10:20 AM
right on

any one pay attention to the fact that Scott's horses are prepped to the nines by the worker bees and he hops on for one or two jumps and into the ring he goes? Not taking away from his talent but perhaps he could get to know his horses a bit better (and work on those banks ;) )

my $.02

3Dogs, you must be pretty slick if you can tack, prep, wipe down, hop back on, ride, put away, and bring out the next for 5 or 6 horses, which, in a class of 40 would give you 8 or fewer trips per horse.

Good thing the class was at night too because that's a whole lot of braiding for you for one day. :lol::lol::lol:

MHM
Apr. 4, 2011, 02:28 PM
3Dogs, you must be pretty slick if you can tack, prep, wipe down, hop back on, ride, put away, and bring out the next for 5 or 6 horses, which, in a class of 40 would give you 8 or fewer trips per horse.

Good thing the class was at night too because that's a whole lot of braiding for you for one day. :lol::lol::lol:

Scott actually had six out of the 25 in the night class when you count the one he owns and trains that was ridden by a junior.

So as you say, the ring would have been empty quite a bit if he did everything himself. ;)

mroades
Apr. 4, 2011, 02:32 PM
just watched the rounds of the top three....based on that small piece of info, it looks like they got it right imho

STA
Apr. 4, 2011, 02:43 PM
I did not see the Derby, and I did not hear Scott's comments, but you (collectively) have taken unfair CHEAP shots at a professional with an opinion.
Reading comments in a magazine can have an entirely different connotation than the spoken word.
I was standing directly in front of the fence at Old Salem last year when Scott fell off after his horse was spooked by something on the rail. No sour grapes, no bad sportsmanship and he may have had cause in this situation.
His opinion - a different course may have been better suited is just that his opinion and I for one, would like to know how one of the best hunter trainers and riders, looks at these issues.
By the way, I have personally seen him (really) gallop fences in hunter classes, work hard in the mornings, and ride in Grand Prix jumper classes - I don't believe he has to try three-day horses. And he would not know me from the parking lot attendant - these are just observations from afar.

By George!
Apr. 4, 2011, 04:12 PM
STA - I respectfully disagree. You can read Scott's quote in the write-up on the COTH website here: http://www.chronofhorse.com/article/jersey-boy-banks-another-derby-win-wellington?page=2. He said he didn't think the course was a fair test for most hunters, and specifically mentions the inclusion of the table. I can understand why he said that, since he and his horses had a lot of trouble there. If I remember correctly, his rides were the only ones who really had a tough time there. Almost all of the other horse/rider combos negotiated it just fine, including Inclusive (owned by Scott, ridden byTori Colvin).

I saw the spook/spin that unseated Scott at OSF last year as well. Totally different situation than Declaration refusing to hop down off the table. But to me that Derby course was a huge disappointment - too similar to the courses we all see week in and week out because all the rain forced it off the field and into the sand ring.

MHM
Apr. 4, 2011, 05:17 PM
Scott is entitled to have an opinion about the course, regardless of whether everyone here agrees with him. I would say his opinion after he rode it five times is at least as valid as the opinion of someone who didn't ride it at all. Or even see it in person. The live feeds are great, but you don't see as much detail.

His opinion is also supported by the fact that probably a third or more of the horses in the handy round had a pretty major error that resulted in at least one score below 70.

I don't have the scores in front of me, but quite a few horses had a stop, a rail, a spook, or a break in gait, and this was a pretty nice group of horses who had all gotten good scores in the first round to qualify for the night class.

STA
Apr. 4, 2011, 05:51 PM
STA - I respectfully disagree. You can read Scott's quote in the write-up on the COTH website here: http://www.chronofhorse.com/article/jersey-boy-banks-another-derby-win-wellington?page=2. He said he didn't think the course was a fair test for most hunters, and specifically mentions the inclusion of the table. I can understand why he said that, since he and his horses had a lot of trouble there. If I remember correctly, his rides were the only ones who really had a tough time there. Almost all of the other horse/rider combos negotiated it just fine, including Inclusive (owned by Scott, ridden byTori Colvin).

I saw the spook/spin that unseated Scott at OSF last year as well. Totally different situation than Declaration refusing to hop down off the table. But to me that Derby course was a huge disappointment - too similar to the courses we all see week in and week out because all the rain forced it off the field and into the sand ring.

By George - truly not arguing with you, but I respectfully disagree. When was the last time any show hunter showed over those type of fences? Why didn't the course designer include a liverpool to simulate a stream or a ditch? I heard plenty of discussion about the Grand Prix with 16 clear and the next day 1.50 meter class with a handful clear - how the courses were not appropriate. Were those riders all poor sports and displaying sour grapes attitude?
My point is just because a person with the knowledge and experience is asked his opinion and it is critical does not automatically equate to being a bad sport or sullen attitude.

enjoytheride
Apr. 4, 2011, 05:56 PM
My opinion having watched it, is that it was the best hunter derby course I've seen yet and a difficult one that really tested what the whole hunter derby thing is about.

A course of big fences with some extra bushes a couple more turns and maybe a trot fence isn't much different then a regular course.

This course had banks up and down, gates, walls, narrow paths to turn through, big galloping sections, percision sections. It was difficult to ride. Gun around like a jumper and motorbike your turns, or crawl around and break into a trot doing the smaller circles or fail to show a hand gallop. To top that off it was in a different ring, under lights, at night.

It was challenging not because of the difficulty which any jumper can do, but because it really tested which horses looked like a pleasure to ride despite the turns which weren't supposed to be sharp and which riders really really thought about it.

This really seperated the riders into groups.

1. jumper rider riding a jumper style horse. quick does not equal forward, and you could really tell on the turns.

2. crawling around on a horse that is slow slow slow, trotting in places

3. a rider on a green horse

4. a rider who thought about when to go easy, when to gallop, how to make those tight turns through the walkways look smooth, where to change leads, how to softly ride the wall after the bank down, and the horse that made it look like he was just doing another inside outside diagonal course.

MHM
Apr. 4, 2011, 06:12 PM
I heard plenty of discussion about the Grand Prix with 16 clear and the next day 1.50 meter class with a handful clear - how the courses were not appropriate. Were those riders all poor sports and displaying sour grapes attitude?
My point is just because a person with the knowledge and experience is asked his opinion and it is critical does not automatically equate to being a bad sport or sullen attitude.

Exactly. Well said.

Horseshowaddict
Apr. 4, 2011, 10:11 PM
The bank and ramp have been used at all 3 WEF hunter derbies from what I can recall. There is no reason to be unprepared for them. However, showing in the big ring, under the lights, with an audience is something that only experience can help with. These horses do not get that much of a chance to do it, and there is always a bit of an "unknown" factor during these types of classes. Derbies themselves are still relatively young, and are sort of "creating" a type of horse that will excel at them. Give it time, and there will be plenty of big guns out there.

dp1092
Apr. 4, 2011, 11:28 PM
"The bank and ramp have been used at all 3 WEF hunter derbies from what I can recall. There is no reason to be unprepared for them."

Banks are scary for horses cause they can't see the jump down without looking. However, since the banks are in the ring and have been used the past three years at WEF, riders should have assumed the banks would be incorporated in this years course. I agree with you Horseshowaddict that there was no reason to be unprepared for the banks. However, I watched the derby again yesterday and it seemed Scott, on his first mount, was the only one to have difficulties with it.
I loved the course personally, it really seperated the experienced horses from the greenies and the rightfully deserved winner, Jersey Boy, won and I am very happy with his victory. He had an awesome attitude going around the course; ears pricked, appeared to be having fun, and jumping beautifully. He deserved the win :)

Let me add: Sundance deserved higher than fifth place, in my opinion. His round was spectacular and he looked so happy going around the course with his ears pricked the whole round and nothing phasing him in the ring. Personally, his round was my favorite. Him and Kim make an awesome pair :)