PDA

View Full Version : Dover Saddlery



twhs
Mar. 22, 2011, 12:15 PM
What's going on? Tuesday morning & I can't log on!

comingback
Mar. 22, 2011, 12:32 PM
They must have seen that other thread complaining about the shipping prices and shut down out of embarrassment :D

I havent been able to get in either...

jay0087
Mar. 22, 2011, 12:33 PM
hmmm I just tried too and no luck! But was on it alot last night looking at fly sheets

twhs
Mar. 22, 2011, 12:50 PM
Comingback, I thought the same thing!

AliO
Mar. 22, 2011, 03:13 PM
I thought the exact same thing about the COTH thread! lol

Janet Nittmann
Mar. 22, 2011, 04:58 PM
We apologize for the fact that the Dover Saddlery website is currently down and for the inconvenience that this has caused. This situation will be rectified as soon as possible. However, you can shop on our mobile site at m.doversaddlery.com or by mail order by calling 1-800-989-1500.

KingoftheRoad
Mar. 22, 2011, 05:48 PM
Whoops, there they are - anything that might impact sales, they'll jump right on. Customer complaints and direct questions, ignore and hope they'll go away.

Funny they still haven't answered the questions about their shipping policy and prices on the other thread. I thought maybe they just hadn't seen the forums in a few days....silly me.

Janet Nittmann
Mar. 22, 2011, 08:25 PM
Thank you to all of you who have posted about our shipping and pricing policies. We do read all your postings and appreciate your feedback. Below I will explain how to get the best shipping rate and best prices when shopping from Dover Saddlery.
The best shipping rate possible is a $4.95 flat rate - on all items. This rate is available through the Dover Saddlery Visa card. In addition when you use the Dover Visa card you will receive savings of 4% on all Dover purchases (through rewards points) This loyalty program is very popular because of the shipping rate and savings offered.
Regarding prices, we aim to offer extremely competitive prices on all our items. Nearly every catalog has coupons where special offers can be found. The sale catalog is your source for a large number of items on sale, gift with purchases, special buys etc. – you can get the same price as in the sale catalog on our website by entering the item number in the “Order from Catalog “ box. To search and browse the best offers on the Dover website please use the ON SALE and /or the CLOSEOUTS tab at the top of the homepage. For our retail customers - If you take the sale catalog into any of our retail stores you will receive the same pricing as in the catalog- even outside of the store sale period. All of our retail stores regularly have store sales which are widely advertised and most of our stores have a tent sale at least once a year. If you have further questions our customer service supervisors would be happy to assist and can be reached toll-free on 1-800-989-1500.

jay0087
Mar. 22, 2011, 08:44 PM
I would like to know why you have to have the catalog to get the sales prices. One catalog said to bring it with you and the other one said nothing. Brought the sales catalog in with me since nothing is marked on being on sale and wanting to know prices as I shop had the catalog sitting on the counter as I checked out. When I got to my car I realized I was not charged the sales price. I feel this is a very shaddy way to conduct business.

Janet Nittmann
Mar. 23, 2011, 06:51 PM
We apologize for this – you did the right thing and you should have received the sale prices when you took the sale catalog into our store. I will send you a private message so I can get the details and make this right. Our sale catalogs are valid much longer than the retail store sale period and this is the reason why you need to take the sale catalog to the store to get the pricing that is in the catalog. This is rather like in many cases you need to take your card to your supermarket to get better prices.

KingoftheRoad
Mar. 23, 2011, 09:55 PM
Janet,

I appreciate you taking the time to write some responses here. I think everyone has customer service stories, both good and bad, about any company. I think what I'm really trying to get at are some policy issues that have continued for several years, and continue to negatively impact your company's image and reputation.

A couple of things: it's hard to sign up for the "rewards" credit card, only to have the rewards program discontinued with the original bank two months later, and be stuck with a card that doesn't do any good, and get dinged on a credit score for opening and closing an account so soon. So for me, at least, I'm really burned by that. I never open new accounts, so to take a leap, open a new credit card, and then have it be useless in a few months, is very difficult to accept, much less having to apply for yet another card.

Secondly, even with the reduced price on the shipping, the Fedex Smartpost simply isn't working well for a lot of us. With other companies, we get shipments that can be tracked door-to-door. With Smartpost, we get a shipment that eventually gets dumped into a black hole, and we have to wait and see when it might show up. This is incredibly frustrating, and often unworkable, especially when ordering items for a specific event.

Finally, since some of us aren't willing or able to sign up for the rewards card, the tiered shipping rates make no sense whatsoever. As has been mentioned numerous times on these threads, charging $20+ to ship a pair of $300 Pikeur breeches bears no relation to the actual cost to ship these items. This exorbitant shipping costs often leads customers to purchase the same items elsewhere, sometimes at a slightly higher unit cost, to achieve a lower total purchase price. This doesn't serve your company any good, since you lose the sales, and frustrates your customers to no end, because it feels like we are being taken advantage of by being grossly overcharged for shipping.

These complaints are not new - if you have looked on this board before, you will see the same concerns coming up over and over again. As far as the 100% customer guarantee, while there is a benefit to that, I don't think most of us want to essentially pay "satisfaction insurance" in the form of higher shipping costs on all of our items, to protect your company from the few people that are making ridiculous returns for normal wear and tear.

I sincerely hope that you and others in your company will listen to these complaints, and finally do something about them. Thank you again for responding to some of the concerns.

SAcres
Mar. 23, 2011, 10:04 PM
I don't buy from dover anymore because of how expensive shipping is. I usually get free shipping from smartpak, either using their free shipping codes or the newer free shipping on smartpaks over $40. Although I will say that Dover has great customer service too, at least IME. :)

RugBug
Mar. 23, 2011, 10:07 PM
As far as the 100% customer guarantee, while there is a benefit to that, I don't think most of us want to essentially pay "satisfaction insurance" in the form of higher shipping costs on all of our items, to protect your company from the few people that are making ridiculous returns for normal wear and tear.

Please have to courtesy and the deceny to speak only for yourself.

I LOVE the 100% satisfaction guarantee coupled with the low prices. In fact, I was just lamenting about the Pessoa turnout I purchased last year that is losing all it's hardware. If I had bought it from Dover, I could have a new blanket....LAST year when the first buckle broke after limited use. Since I didn't buy it from Dover, I've had to just deal with it. The blanket has been used about 45 days total in 2 years and I'm having to use baling twine to keep in on? Not good.

Atlas Shrugged
Mar. 23, 2011, 10:08 PM
Great exchange of comments, above. I would like to add that I went to the RI store a few times and was so put off by the sales help that I actually complained to Dover and was assured this info would be forwarded to the store. Haven't been back since. Not much of an inventory to boot. Smartpack store was so much better... nice, helpful, and much more to choose from- and deep discounts with the monthly coupon (15% - 20%). And I agree that the Dover shipping costs are a real turn-off. I tried to order clipper blades a few days ago and decided to shop elsewhere - got them for 2/3 the price and no shipping cost just by googling it. Just sayin'

KingoftheRoad
Mar. 24, 2011, 08:31 AM
Please have to courtesy and the deceny to speak only for yourself.



I'm not sure I understand the decency remark, but let me clarify - there are stories going around about people returning blankets after four or five years of hard use, saying it didn't meet their expectations. Or turning in badly abused paddock boots after two years, and expecting a new pair in return. I can't imagine anybody wanting to pay substantially higher prices across the board so that Dover can protect themselves financially from these kind of nutty returns.

I will freely admit that when I'm buying items that have a questionable reputation (such as Ariat paddocks or half chaps), I often consider Dover more than other companies, so that if they break too early, I have some recourse (since Ariat sucks at addressing their own problems - but that's another thread entirely). But, as an example, I have a Peter Wylde bridle that I've used for three years five times a week on my jumper. The stitching is pulling out of the noseband. According to this guarantee, I could return it and get an exchange or credit, because it "didn't meet my expectations".

While most of us, including me, have too much integrity to do such a thing (and I had included most of the people on this board when making my previous comments), I don't want to pay substantially higher prices for shipping on things that don't break or have problems often, to subsidize those outlier people who would take advantage of such an offer.

I hope this helps to explain further.

cxt
Mar. 24, 2011, 11:47 AM
Janet,

Any thoughts for your canadian customers? The Dover Visa is not going to help me. The last time I placed an order I was told the only shipping option would be FedEx Air, which was going to cost over $100 - I don't remember exactly how much. With my own detective skills, I figured out that FedEx ground to the same location would likely cost around $20 but I was told that wasn't an option, and that the price difference was mainly brokerage, which was included in Air but not ground. When my package arrived, Lo and behold, a $35 brokerage charge was waiting for me.

Is there any chance that your shipping policies might be altered to allow ground shipping? I realize it isn't as fast, but when I wait months for your sale catalogue, another 2 weeks really won't kill me :)

The most common explanation I've gotten is that you have had too much trouble with usps (which i have used for many other stores shipping from the us and have never had an issue myself...) but if that is a problem, wouldn't FedEx still be reliable with their much more affordable ground shipping?

Trixie
Mar. 24, 2011, 11:53 AM
Honestly, it's very sweet that you offer discounted shipping to those that have a Dover credit card, but I don't particularly want to sign up for a Dover credit card, particularly when people on this board have had reliability issues with them in the past.

What's your thought for those of us who would prefer not to use your line of credit?

Rio Blanco
Mar. 24, 2011, 12:06 PM
What they're not telling you is that those cards charge more in interest than you save..............am I the only one that has realized this??

I, personally, like Dover's products (like their version of Eskadrons and their schooling pads) but now that Smartpak is becoming larger and I get free shipping from them once a month with my Smartpaks, I don't care to bother with Dover and their embarassingly horrible customer service.
Example of EXCELLENT customer service: My boyfriend ordered me a bridle from Smartpak with a figure 8 from the same product line that they assured him would fit when he inquired about it because a customer review had said that it didn't. It was his Christmas present to me and I oiled the bridle/figure and tried to put it together that morning and low and behold, it didn't fit. I called Smartpak and not only did they apologize, they sent me their figure 8 bridle that happened to be the next line up from what my boyfriend had ordered for me AND let me keep the old bridle. Now THAT is customer service.
Example of PISS POOR customer service: I ordered a surcingle from Dover because I went to college and obviously couldn't take my trainer's surcingle with me that I used frequently on my mare with my Pessoa rig. Not only did they send it to the billing address instead of the shipping address, but when it arrived it was MOLDY inside the plastic. I called Dover and was rudely told that they recommend opening leather products as soon as they arrive so that this will not happen. Well gee, had you sent it to the right place, maybe I could have opened it sooner than 4 WEEKS after it was shipped to the WRONG address first. Didn't I provide you with a SHIPPING address for a reason? They also refused to replace it. So long, Dover...I spend so much money with Smartpak now and recommend them to everyone and make sure that I tell people to be very wary of your business.

trubandloki
Mar. 24, 2011, 12:15 PM
Wonderful post KingoftheRoad.

Let me add the frustration with the sale fliers and the inconsistency of the pricing.

It is totally absurd that you have to have the catalog item number in front of you to get the sale price on line or at the store. Oh but wait, you not only have to have that catalog but the other six catalogs that you have because each has different prices for different things so if you are ordering six different things you probably find the lowest price for each in a different catalog.

In the long run I am betting Dover would save money on programming and such if they simply had things on sale. One item code, one sale price. Not one item having many different codes and many different prices.

I used to shop at Dover regularly before I realized there was a better way to go. They have good products. I am just not willing to play their childish games when it comes to pricing.

Petstorejunkie
Mar. 24, 2011, 01:10 PM
The fact remains that consistently I can find the same products for within a dollar or two of Dover's prices, and get $7.99 or less flat rate shipping or even free. Most of the time I can find cheaper prices and free shipping on the exact same items they sell!

The industry has "raised the bar" on online equestrian supply orders. It's time for Dover to catch up.

GingerJumper
Mar. 24, 2011, 01:48 PM
I feel like I'm the only person going to say this, but oh well...

I LOVE Dover Saddlery and have always had a fantastic experience with their customer service and returns policy.

There. I am done now. You may all continue with your bickering and Dover hating :D

bananna
Mar. 24, 2011, 02:07 PM
I was perfectly happy with Dover, and had gotten LOTS of stuff there over the years until a little while ago. I had some bad customer service, where two customer service people told me my package was shipped before it even hit embroidery.

It was annoying to not get a straight answer, and it didn't really give me faith that they were their supporting me as a customer. It was a present for someone, and they didn't get it until later and it would have been fine, except I didn't find out that the product wasn't shipping until it was too late to grab them a small, here is a gift in the meantime gift. Just really frustrating all over.


I can get pretty much the same stuff for the same price or cheaper elsewhere, and those are places that have tried to help me with customer service. I will be shopping elsewhere from now on.

moodymaretoo
Mar. 24, 2011, 02:50 PM
I feel like I'm the only person going to say this, but oh well...

I LOVE Dover Saddlery and have always had a fantastic experience with their customer service and returns policy.

There. I am done now. You may all continue with your bickering and Dover hating :D

Me too Appy, me too.
Now when these Dover hating threads pop up, I just get my popcorn & read. Some valid points are made, but most of the worst stories I'm reading, don't involve requesting a supervisor.
I've had to do it, when I didn't feel I was being helped. I ask for a supervisor, I don't yell.. just a "Can you connect me to your supervisor please" Voila
Even when it's been my own stupid fault. (without my glasses, O/S does look like C/S)
NEVER had a problem getting something fixed or at least addressed. :D
ps Totally Love Dover and SmartPak and Tractor Supply, and Valley Vet.... I shop around, but if it's something I'm not sure I'll like, I ALWAYS get it from Dover. If it doesn't work out after a few weeks I can send it back. No so with boots I got from SmartPak.

Noodles
Mar. 24, 2011, 04:06 PM
Dover has always been great with me...just MHO

Prime Time Rider
Mar. 25, 2011, 01:09 AM
So, the "solution" that Dover for its high shipping costs is to get a Dover credit card? I don't consider that much of a solution!

2horseowner
Mar. 25, 2011, 01:53 AM
I have the card and found the "solution" ridiculous too. Surely after seeing all the gazillion shipping cost complaints, Dover could come up with a better response. Instead of talking around the complaints, how about giving a us a straight answer as to why they won't change? Are they legal issues or just plain apathy?

BeastieSlave
Mar. 25, 2011, 10:01 AM
Nope. I'm not interested in getting a credit card so I can save a few bucks on shipping.... I can save money elsewhere without having to do that!!

trubandloki
Mar. 25, 2011, 11:00 AM
. Some valid points are made, but most of the worst stories I'm reading, don't involve requesting a supervisor.
I've had to do it, when I didn't feel I was being helped. I ask for a supervisor, I don't yell.. just a "Can you connect me to your supervisor please" Voila

So, you think it is fair to give crappy service until a customer gets frustrated enough to ask for a supervisor?

wanderlust
Mar. 25, 2011, 11:18 AM
I think it would be great for Dover (or Smartpak) to do something like "Amazon Prime", where you pay a yearly "membership fee" and get discounted 3-day shipping and other goodies.

Of course, as my hubby frequently points out, the horse world is the only remaining industry where people write actual paper checks for everything, so I'd not be holding my breath.

Oldenburg99
Mar. 25, 2011, 11:41 AM
I think it would be great for Dover (or Smartpak) to do something like "Amazon Prime", where you pay a yearly "membership fee" and get discounted 3-day shipping and other goodies.

Of course, as my hubby frequently points out, the horse world is the only remaining industry where people write actual paper checks for everything, so I'd not be holding my breath.

As I reviewed the checks I have written recently, it was board, trainer - lessons & coaching fees, farrier, vet, repeat.

haha. you hubby is right.

tallygirl
Mar. 25, 2011, 11:56 AM
As I reviewed the checks I have written recently, it was board, trainer - lessons & coaching fees, farrier, vet, repeat.

haha. you hubby is right.

Same!! hahaha.:lol:

RugBug
Mar. 25, 2011, 02:33 PM
So, you think it is fair to give crappy service until a customer gets frustrated enough to ask for a supervisor?

I've never gotten crappy service from Dover. I have from SmartPak. YMMV.

Linny
Mar. 25, 2011, 05:07 PM
So, you think it is fair to give crappy service until a customer gets frustrated enough to ask for a supervisor?

It's not that it's acceptable, but sometime CSR's are just not at their best. I've had uniformly good service from Dover but if I met up with a crabby CSR, I doubt I'd let that one encounter end my relationship with Dover.
Just like any other big outfit (Macy's, Home Depot etc.) there are going to be bad apples who don't offer great service. Having worked in customer service in retail and banking I will attest that not everyone is cut out for waiting on customers, but not every customer is exactly a gem either. If you get poor service, alert a supervisor. If possible, follow up in writing. With luck, over time if a pattern develops the person will be let go. Part of the issue is that firing someone can be a nightmare and having written documentation helps.

Janet Nittmann
Mar. 25, 2011, 06:23 PM
Janet,

Any thoughts for your canadian customers? The Dover Visa is not going to help me. The last time I placed an order I was told the only shipping option would be FedEx Air, which was going to cost over $100 - I don't remember exactly how much. With my own detective skills, I figured out that FedEx ground to the same location would likely cost around $20 but I was told that wasn't an option, and that the price difference was mainly brokerage, which was included in Air but not ground. When my package arrived, Lo and behold, a $35 brokerage charge was waiting for me.

Is there any chance that your shipping policies might be altered to allow ground shipping? I realize it isn't as fast, but when I wait months for your sale catalogue, another 2 weeks really won't kill me :)

The most common explanation I've gotten is that you have had too much trouble with usps (which i have used for many other stores shipping from the us and have never had an issue myself...) but if that is a problem, wouldn't FedEx still be reliable with their much more affordable ground shipping?
We do not ship to Canada via the post office as unfortunately in the past too many packages were lost and a claim cannot be made for 180 days which led to a lot of frustration. We use FedEx Air for shipments to Canada as it has proven to offer the most reliable consistent service without any worries about when will the package arrive and what additional fees will be added (as is the case with ground) The fees you were charged were for tax and duty and unfortunately these have to paid regardless of shipping method.

Hawkeye_horses
Mar. 25, 2011, 06:58 PM
I love Dover, too...
I've had great service,
great experiences making returns or exchanges,
and helpful, friendly conversations with the CSR's.
I have the Dover credit card -- was a little bummed
when the first one was canceled and I had to reapply,
but to me it's worth the savings.
I don't have time to shop around much...
in fact, I'm surprised I'm taking time to chime in on this
discussion :)

Janet Nittmann
Mar. 26, 2011, 03:58 PM
I love Dover, too...
I've had great service,
great experiences making returns or exchanges,
and helpful, friendly conversations with the CSR's.
I have the Dover credit card -- was a little bummed
when the first one was canceled and I had to reapply,
but to me it's worth the savings.
I don't have time to shop around much...
in fact, I'm surprised I'm taking time to chime in on this
discussion :)
On behalf of the Dover CSR's thank you so much for this posting. We really appreciate you taking the time to say how pleased you are with the Dover Saddlery customer service and with the new Dover Visa card.

twotrudoc
Mar. 26, 2011, 09:54 PM
I have received great customer service from Dover for many years. I LOVE the sale catalogs, and, coming from a background in customer service, completely understand that the sale catalogs are "special" and not normal pricing.

Can't say as I have been bothered by the shipping prices either *shrug*

To each their own I suppose.

teal tea
Mar. 27, 2011, 04:55 PM
I for one am very happy w/ Dover. I have always been treated w/ courtesy. I would much rather pay their shipping and receive good customer service from them rather than go to my local English tack shop where I am met w/ substandard customer courtesy by a bunch of snobs who act like they could care less about you.

Just a week ago I went in to buy some Ariat boots and was asking about what they would do if my boots turned out defective. They said I would have to go through Ariat and probably pay a fee. Years ago I had a problem w/ a pair of Ariats. I called Dovers and they told me to send in the boots. I then promptly received a new pair. When I ordered my latest boots, Dovers reassured me if something was wrong w/ my boots, they would take care of it.

So is the shipping expensive? Yes, but they are nice and stand behind their product. I will pay extra and shop from them on the matter of principle and intelligence.

TheJenners
Mar. 27, 2011, 06:02 PM
For Canadians, get a friend on this side. I have a Canadian friend, he ships things to my house and then I kick it over the border. Costs me nickles to do that compared to what he'd have to pay. And I don't feel bad indicating "gift" on the customs form, because it's something he paid for, and as a gift, I'm saving his wallet the shipping.

I have had good service with most of the main tack places. I did get a little peeved that Adams took about three weeks to send me something small, and I have a Butet pad from Beval.com that STILL hasn't shown up, and I've called twice and been assured it would be here in a week. I ordered it in the middle of February, and won't be ordering from them again, sale or no sale :no:. I've never actually had to return anything to Dover, but have with Smartpak and it went off without a hitch. Ditto Horseloverz.

I pull up several tabs of the main sites I use (Smartpak, Dover, etc), get everything into the shopping carts, and before hitting submit, see which is less. That's the one I order from, that time.

moodymaretoo
Mar. 27, 2011, 09:02 PM
I've never gotten crappy service from Dover. I have from SmartPak. YMMV.

Me either RugBug


It's not that it's acceptable, but sometime CSR's are just not at their best. I've had uniformly good service from Dover but if I met up with a crabby CSR, I doubt I'd let that one encounter end my relationship with Dover.
Just like any other big outfit (Macy's, Home Depot etc.) there are going to be bad apples who don't offer great service. Having worked in customer service in retail and banking I will attest that not everyone is cut out for waiting on customers, but not every customer is exactly a gem either. If you get poor service, alert a supervisor. If possible, follow up in writing. With luck, over time if a pattern develops the person will be let go. Part of the issue is that firing someone can be a nightmare and having written documentation helps.

^ Thanks Linny.... that's exactly what was rattling around in the attic, but couldn't quite make it down the stairs.

kgro632
Mar. 27, 2011, 09:04 PM
I feel like I'm the only person going to say this, but oh well...

I LOVE Dover Saddlery and have always had a fantastic experience with their customer service and returns policy.

There. I am done now. You may all continue with your bickering and Dover hating :D

I too LOVE Dover and have allways had exceptional customer service there!!

I'm really sick of all of these Dover hating threads...

So just don't shop there!! End of story!

SnicklefritzG
Mar. 27, 2011, 09:15 PM
I shop at Dover's all the time because it is close to where I live and on the way to the barn. :) Furthermore, I think the customer service at the store is exceptional. When I walk in, I know there will always be a friendly and knowledgeable employee available to help. I can't say the same for certain other tack shops in NJ. There are some I refuse to shop at because the staff are either rude, disinterested or both. However, I have always had a good experience at Dovers. Plus if there is something I want but it's not in stock, they will have it shipped to the store at no additional cost to me.

BeastieSlave
Mar. 28, 2011, 10:07 AM
I think you guys are missing the point.

Many of us want to shop at Dover's!! I have never had a customer service problem or product problem. The problem for many of us involves THE SHIPPING. The cost and time involved is putting us off and complaints directly to the company seem to go nowhere. We vent here in hopes that someone 'out there' in a position do do something will make changes and we can go back to being Dover customers.....

KingoftheRoad
Mar. 28, 2011, 11:07 AM
I think you guys are missing the point.

Many of us want to shop at Dover's!! I have never had a customer service problem or product problem. The problem for many of us involves THE SHIPPING. The cost and time involved is putting us off and complaints directly to the company seem to go nowhere. We vent here in hopes that someone 'out there' in a position do do something will make changes and we can go back to being Dover customers.....

THIS! Exactly this! That's the whole point of this and the other thread. I know people keep talking about the "I hate Dover", but it's not that - I can even deal with the hunt for the lowest price in whichever catalog comes this week. But the shipping costs and transit time make me insane, and as you can see from my previous lengthy posts, Dover seems to deliberately choose to ignore those direct questions. For a company that promises 100% customer satisfaction, I'm at a loss as to why they refuse to even address this problem. Apparently the satisfaction is only after you buy from them, not when you're trying to express your dissatisfaction with their logistics.

Beastie, thank you so much for getting this back on track, I was about to give up.

OnePerfectRide
Mar. 28, 2011, 11:29 AM
How about Dover (or SmartPak) opening up a store in Lexington, KY? It is the horse capital of world after all and all we have is a few tiny shops with limited inventory. Just sayin...

Groro
Mar. 28, 2011, 11:45 AM
I have a Dover store nearby (Charlottesville, VA) and always shop there first. It seems that everything is on sale, so I end up spending less that expected everytime.

;-)

tyedyecommando
Mar. 28, 2011, 02:29 PM
I usually don't buy from Dover unless I cannot find it anywhere else. I would also prefer to spend a little more somewhere that offers discounted or free shipping than to pay premium shipping rates for FedEx Smart Post. I have never in my life seen a free shipping offer from Dover and I am not going to get the credit card to pay $4.99.

amastrike
Mar. 28, 2011, 02:42 PM
I think you guys are missing the point.

Many of us want to shop at Dover's!! I have never had a customer service problem or product problem. The problem for many of us involves THE SHIPPING. The cost and time involved is putting us off and complaints directly to the company seem to go nowhere. We vent here in hopes that someone 'out there' in a position do do something will make changes and we can go back to being Dover customers.....

Ding ding ding! We have a winner! I don't have a problem with Dover CS, and while I'm not a fan of slow shipping, I can deal with it. But I will not be raped on shipping charges.

Lucassb
Mar. 28, 2011, 03:02 PM
I think you guys are missing the point.

Many of us want to shop at Dover's!! I have never had a customer service problem or product problem. The problem for many of us involves THE SHIPPING. The cost and time involved is putting us off and complaints directly to the company seem to go nowhere. We vent here in hopes that someone 'out there' in a position do do something will make changes and we can go back to being Dover customers.....

Add me to this group, too.

I used to buy a lot from Dover, and generally I have had pretty good service from them. But between the exorbitant shipping costs and the hassle of having to dig through multiple catalogs to find the "sale" price on anything I might want to purchase - I just don't bother anymore, unless it is something that I simply can't find elsewhere. (And these days, frankly there aren't many things I can't find elsewhere, which means Dover has pretty much lost my business entirely.)

Smartpak, on the other hand... they get a big chunk of my business. Their service has been great, they have what I need/want, have free shipping and don't try to con me into a credit card every time I shop.

Bottom line: Smartpak makes it easy to do business with them; Dover makes it tough.

2horseowner
Mar. 28, 2011, 03:23 PM
Thank you BeastieSlave and LucassB for the above comments. I find it most interesting that Dover is only interested in addressing customers giving the "I Love Dover" posts. Dover still and always will never address the SHIPPING complaints ever. Even though I have the credit card, I still buy more from SmartPak, VTO, and others. I won't hold my breath on them ever offering up an explanation.

mg
Mar. 28, 2011, 03:43 PM
Thank you BeastieSlave and LucassB for the above comments. I find it most interesting that Dover is only interested in addressing customers giving the "I Love Dover" posts. Dover still and always will never address the SHIPPING complaints ever. Even though I have the credit card, I still buy more from SmartPak, VTO, and others. I won't hold my breath on them ever offering up an explanation.

To be fair, Janet from Dover Saddlery saw my posts about the credit card rewards and has been working with me via PMs to make sure I am getting my gift certificates from my earned points. As frustrating as the shipping charges are, those are corporate decisions which are made at the highest ranks within the company. Janet really doesn't have any influence over them and I'm sure her telling them a bunch of people complaining on the net won't change things immediately ;) I'm going to hazard a guess they are well aware of the feelings towards their shipping charges. However, it must not be hurting business *too* badly if they are continuing with their current practice.

On a separate note from the above: free shipping with a 100% satisfaction guarantee *CAN* be done! LLBean recently announced free shipping (non-promotional) to the US and Canada and they still hold the industry gold standard of the 100% guarantee :)

MintHillFarm
Mar. 28, 2011, 04:07 PM
"Secondly, even with the reduced price on the shipping, the Fedex Smartpost simply isn't working well for a lot of us. With other companies, we get shipments that can be tracked door-to-door. With Smartpost, we get a shipment that eventually gets dumped into a black hole, and we have to wait and see when it might show up. This is incredibly frustrating, and often unworkable, especially when ordering items for a specific event."

So true. I feel like I could get into that black hole but still never find my order...I always request not to use that method. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't...

MintHillFarm
Mar. 28, 2011, 04:10 PM
"As frustrating as the On a separate note from the above: free shipping with a 100% satisfaction guarantee *CAN* be done! LLBean recently announced free shipping (non-promotional) to the US and Canada and they still hold the industry gold standard of the 100% guarantee :)"

Yes, for sure!
LL Bean are masters of customer service.

kgro632
Mar. 28, 2011, 04:21 PM
I think you guys are missing the point.

Many of us want to shop at Dover's!! I have never had a customer service problem or product problem. The problem for many of us involves THE SHIPPING. The cost and time involved is putting us off and complaints directly to the company seem to go nowhere. We vent here in hopes that someone 'out there' in a position do do something will make changes and we can go back to being Dover customers.....

Well, if you consider you don't pay tax on online orders, often times the shipping is cheaper then the tax would be in store, so I save myself a trip to the store and buy online.

This may not be true in all states, but here in Texas sales tax is 8.25%

Just a thought....

BeastieSlave
Mar. 28, 2011, 04:40 PM
I have to pay the sales tax online too because there's a Dover store in GA, so no savings...

DMK
Mar. 28, 2011, 04:44 PM
Well, if you consider you don't pay tax on online orders, often times the shipping is cheaper then the tax would be in store, so I save myself a trip to the store and buy online.

This may not be true in all states, but here in Texas sales tax is 8.25%

Just a thought....

And purchasing from a different online vendor may save you tax and shipping. Don't worry, most of us penny pinchers have worked though the math. ;)

It's nothing against Dover, but I will shop at the online vendor that gives me the best price/shipping costs/service. There are certain items I buy from tack shops in person instead of online, but I do find that most times Dover isn't carrying what I need. For instance, ratcatcher and coat colors are more traditional, whereas if I go over to the Farm House setup at Conyers, there will be more variety. That's fine, I understand Dover's store inventory is geared to a different market than Farm House. I'm not willing to buy online when it comes to colors in coats/shirts or fit in helmets/boots/shoes and I'm happy to pay extra for that, but chances are that the variety I am after if I am buying show clothes/gear requires that I go to regular horse show vendor.

But Dover could have my business on the online stuff if it wasn't for the shipping costs. Since Jeffers, Schneiders and Smart Pak are all meeting my needs better than Dover, that's who gets my business. Acquiring and using a credit card simply is not a fair trade off for what I get elsewhere sans that problem. Signing up for bonus bucks at Schneiders is OK, a credit card is not.

But everyone has their business model and if this is what works for Dover, more power to them.

trubandloki
Mar. 28, 2011, 05:13 PM
As frustrating as the shipping charges are, those are corporate decisions which are made at the highest ranks within the company. Janet really doesn't have any influence over them and I'm sure her telling them a bunch of people complaining on the net won't change things immediately ;) I'm going to hazard a guess they are well aware of the feelings towards their shipping charges.
No one is asking that they change immediately.
But since threads like this have been going on for years now one would think that Dover would have shown they give two squats by now and done something to show their customer base that they understand the frustration.

Trixie
Mar. 28, 2011, 05:43 PM
To be fair, Janet from Dover Saddlery saw my posts about the credit card rewards and has been working with me via PMs to make sure I am getting my gift certificates from my earned points. As frustrating as the shipping charges are, those are corporate decisions which are made at the highest ranks within the company. Janet really doesn't have any influence over them and I'm sure her telling them a bunch of people complaining on the net won't change things immediately I'm going to hazard a guess they are well aware of the feelings towards their shipping charges. However, it must not be hurting business *too* badly if they are continuing with their current practice.

Maybe they aren't hurting too badly now - but if they want to stay competitive over the long haul, they do need to address it. I would deal with trying to look up their sales prices in 47 locations if the deal wasn't negated by the shipping. And they just. don't. address it. Even when asked point blank.


Acquiring and using a credit card simply is not a fair trade off for what I get elsewhere sans that problem. Signing up for bonus bucks at Schneiders is OK, a credit card is not.

This, also. I have a credit card or two. I don't need another one. I don't feel that I'm getting any great savings or deals having another credit card in order to come out with the exact same price I could get elsewhere, when there are folks having issues with these cards. I don't want to have to worry about my credit score.

mg
Mar. 28, 2011, 05:48 PM
Just want to say, I wasn't defending Dover's non-response to years of complaints about shipping! I just feel a little bad that some of the ill-feelings are getting directed towards Janet. After all, she doesn't make the policies. And, for all we know, she's not authorized to speak more to the shipping policies than she already has.

paintlady
Mar. 28, 2011, 05:56 PM
Smartpak, on the other hand... they get a big chunk of my business. Their service has been great, they have what I need/want, have free shipping and don't try to con me into a credit card every time I shop.

Bottom line: Smartpak makes it easy to do business with them; Dover makes it tough.

There was a thread recently that SmartPak is no longer offering free shipping. They do have free shipping if you get SmartPaks over $40, but I don't fall into that category.

Luckily, I have a Dover store 15 minutes from my house. If they don't have the items in stock, they'll ship it free to the store. Unfortunately, since I no longer need to do Dover mail order... they stopped sending me their sale catalogs! (I have a friend who works at the Dover store looking into that for me)

So, looks like SmartPak will be losing some of my business now.

paintlady
Mar. 28, 2011, 05:58 PM
Well, if you consider you don't pay tax on online orders, often times the shipping is cheaper then the tax would be in store, so I save myself a trip to the store and buy online.


Unless you live in a state where Dover has stores... like I do. I have to pay 5% tax on anything from Dover whether it's an online order or if I buy it in the store. I also have to pay sales tax on orders from VTO.

Calvincrowe
Mar. 28, 2011, 06:00 PM
Love Dover's products and selection--better than Smartpak's current product selection.

No issues with customer service.

Shipping? There's the rub! It takes forever to get items on the West Coast, the closest retail store is a 6 hour flight away, and the tiered shipping costs are out-dated. This is a company that does a tremendous amount of online-catalog sales. Why, in this day and age of multiple companies competing on line/catalog are they still using this silly system to calculate shipping?

I hate ordering from them, knowing that no matter how much it weighs, it is simply cost that will calculate my shipping. A saddle pad, some breeches and wham! I'm in the $20 shipping zone. Smartpak is the way to go.

Dover--study their model, and make the change to a flat rate!

And, no, I won't use your Visa to get $4.95 shipping. Bad on you for encouraging consumer debt to save a buck.

Peggy
Mar. 28, 2011, 06:04 PM
I had good service from Dover except for the order on the pair of breeches which somehow got lost (which they fixed by expedited shipping without charging me extra, so all good there) and the bridle tag that I added to a sale order because its cost wouldn't trigger any extra shipping (but the sale item was out, they didn't notify me, and I ended up paying an unseemly price for the bridle tag + its solo shipping).

I do love their shaped baby pads and the medium-weight pads and their version of the no-bows (and at least I can get the latter for less money, by ordering from Dover's Western cousin--now that's something I'd like explained*).

But, as others have noted, I figure out what something is going to cost me in $$ for item+shipping/handling+tax and factor in how soon I need it and the reliability of the merchant. Froogle is very useful for price comparisons, BTW. Dover often loses on the $$ for shipping and the timing, if it's an item that's available elsewhere. I can get stuff from SmartPak without paying for shipping if I time it to arrive with the SmartPaks themselves. I can patronize my local feed/tack store if I need or want it pronto.

* Don't believe me? Dover's no-bow wraps (http://www.doversaddlery.com/product.asp?pn=X1-26012&ids=1003281607), 10", $12.90. Smith Bros no-bow wraps (http://www.smithbrothers.com/product.asp?pn=X3-2635), 10", $10.99. Interesting that the list price is higher on Smith Bros. Not sure what sort of discipline-related psychology is going on there.

KingoftheRoad
Mar. 28, 2011, 06:07 PM
After all, she doesn't make the policies. And, for all we know, she's not authorized to speak more to the shipping policies than she already has.

You know what, it would be better if SHE would say that. Rather than making a show of coming on here and saying "On behalf of the Dover CSR's thank you so much for this posting", and then completely ignoring the complaints of everyone else on the post.

Even to say they have heard us, and are looking into trying to figure something out. Instead, by acknowledging the positive comments, and pretending the negative ones don't exist, it gives off the impression that Dover doesn't give a #$%^&* where you buy from.

It gets old feeling like this company that claims to be about customer service is just flipping everyone off.

BeastieSlave
Mar. 28, 2011, 07:30 PM
Even to say they have heard us, and are looking into trying to figure something out.

It would even be kind of nice if she had posted that they heard/read our complaints but can't do anything about them at this time.....
Instead, we're ignored - again :mad:

Janet Nittmann
Mar. 28, 2011, 10:17 PM
"Secondly, even with the reduced price on the shipping, the FedEx Smartpost simply isn't working well for a lot of us. With other companies, we get shipments that can be tracked door-to-door. With Smartpost, we get a shipment that eventually gets dumped into a black hole, and we have to wait and see when it might show up. This is incredibly frustrating, and often unworkable, especially when ordering items for a specific event."

So true. I feel like I could get into that black hole but still never find my order...I always request not to use that method. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't...

Regarding FedEx Smartpost – when your product is shipped we send an e-mail with a tracking number. This can be tracked through FedEx and through the Post Office, or you can call Dover Customer Service on (800) 989-1500 and a Customer Service Representative would be delighted to assist you with the tracking.

drawstraws
Mar. 28, 2011, 10:19 PM
Janet did contact me via PM as well, asking for more info on my Smith Brothers issue (they put $1200 worth of hold on my debit card for my $800 order, causing an overdraft from my bank and couldn't explain why), so it sounds like she's trying to address some of the "odd" issues that people have had. I still haven't had an explanation as to what happened, and there really isn't anything they can do to "fix" it after the fact, but hopefully it won't happen to someone else in the future.

horseshrink
Mar. 28, 2011, 10:52 PM
Is there an elephant in the room??

RugBug
Mar. 28, 2011, 11:13 PM
Shipping? There's the rub! It takes forever to get items on the West Coast,

My Dover orders do not take forever to get to me...and I live in a podunk town on the central coast of California. They take about the same time as any other mail order company.



And, no, I won't use your Visa to get $4.95 shipping. Bad on you for encouraging consumer debt to save a buck.

Please. You may not like or want the credit card, but they aren't encouraging consumer debt to save a buck. :rolleyes: If you're going to make an argument, at least make a valid one.

Possessing and/or using a credit card does not encourage debt. Using a credit card to purchase things you can't afford encourages debt. If you pay off the card each month there is no debt and no extra fees. Lack of self-control is not the credit card company's fault....

Calvincrowe
Mar. 28, 2011, 11:57 PM
Rugbug- perhaps encouraging consumer debt was a bit much, but if the only way to get the "cheap shipping" is to use their Visa, then it cuts out those of us who don't want or need another Visa--and more cards on our credit rating. I have a very low interest card and would love to buy more items from Dover, but I despise their archaic shipping rates.

And, items shipped with SP get here faster than those I get from Dover...and I live in a podunk town in SW WA...
Perhaps it is who does the delivering, in this case, rather than a specific company. Dover usually takes 7-10 business days, SP is always dead on 5-7.

I just think Dover needs to listen to the consumer, and they aren't. This isn't about customer service, it is about meeting the vast consumer voice, crying out for more reasonable shipping. You can't tell me that SP isn't taking away some of their sales..or a lot of their sales, as SP has grown so much in the last few years.

I love the Dover catalog, I pour over it. I even order on occasion, but I'd damn sure order more often if they had a flat rate of $7.95!

kgro632
Mar. 29, 2011, 12:35 AM
Unless you live in a state where Dover has stores... like I do. I have to pay 5% tax on anything from Dover whether it's an online order or if I buy it in the store. I also have to pay sales tax on orders from VTO.

I live in Texas, there is a store an hour from my house in Dallas, and I still don't pay tax on my online orders.

sansibar
Mar. 29, 2011, 01:42 AM
We do not ship to Canada via the post office as unfortunately in the past too many packages were lost and a claim cannot be made for 180 days which led to a lot of frustration. We use FedEx Air for shipments to Canada as it has proven to offer the most reliable consistent service without any worries about when will the package arrive and what additional fees will be added (as is the case with ground) The fees you were charged were for tax and duty and unfortunately these have to paid regardless of shipping method.

I am sorry but isnt that what trackable numbers are for or insurance? I have shipped many items USPS and UPS from the USA and they have all been received within a week. Each time I have been charged $8-20, to ship a saddle it cost $100. I am currently waiting on a package from the USPS. Also the Fedex air charging $100 is insane I shipped many items from england and was charged less than $20 to ship it airmail and it was received within 5 days. Explain how it is cheaper to ship from England than the USA?

Believe me if smartpak shipped to Canada they would have line ups of customers. And if dover shipped to Canada affordably they would see similar results.

Coreene
Mar. 29, 2011, 03:30 AM
LL Bean just launched a new ad campaign to introduce their free shipping, all the time, no minimum orders. They, like many other retailers, were discovering that the savvy shopper is turning away from online companies that rake people over the coals for shipping, and turning towards free shipping. Food for thought.

DMK
Mar. 29, 2011, 10:04 AM
If you're going to make an argument, at least make a valid one.

OK, I'll bite! Credit card transaction fees from the perspective of the business owner are a significant cost impact - greater than debit/cash/check transactions (and probably paypal), so every time you use a credit card (even if you responsibly pay it off without you incurring finance charges) you are increasing the business overhead (which in turn leads to increased prices). Not that Dover the store is worried about Dover card transaction fees (although I am reasonably sure the card manager/bank has only negotiated reduced fees, not zero fees), but my guess is Dover is trying to make money on external transaction fees while promoting easier purchasing power.

Hey, nothing wrong with making a buck, but in looking at the entire picture, it would rub me wrong to use a credit card instead of a debit card to save me a few bucks in shipping if that will ultimately contribute to the rising cost of goods... especially if I could purchase the same thing with low/free shipping and use my debit card with another vendor.

But I'm kind of serious about not using my credit card and not taking on add'l cards with high interest rates, so my perspective may not reflect the average population.

paintlady
Mar. 29, 2011, 10:06 AM
I live in Texas, there is a store an hour from my house in Dallas, and I still don't pay tax on my online orders.

Interesting. Consider yourself lucky then. I've always been charged sales tax on online orders from Dover and any other retailer that has a store in VA. When I used to work in DC, I had online orders shipped to my work address to avoid the sales tax. My office is now in VA, so I can't get away with that anymore. :(

mg
Mar. 29, 2011, 12:01 PM
Land's End just launched a new ad campaign to introduce their free shipping, all the time, no minimum orders. They, like many other retailers, were discovering that the savvy shopper is turning away from online companies that rake people over the coals for shipping, and turning towards free shipping. Food for thought.

Not to hijack, but really? I just looked this up and couldn't find anything. I know LLBean announced permanent free shipping with no minimum order value just this past Friday. No doubting, just wondering if I'm looking in the wrong place! :)

Janet Nittmann
Mar. 29, 2011, 02:58 PM
Interesting. Consider yourself lucky then. I've always been charged sales tax on online orders from Dover and any other retailer that has a store in VA. When I used to work in DC, I had online orders shipped to my work address to avoid the sales tax. My office is now in VA, so I can't get away with that anymore. :(

For clarification - Dover Saddlery customers who shop direct (online or through our catalogs) do not pay sales taxes, except for those with shipping addresses in -Massachusetts.- we do have to charge sales tax for shipments to addresses within our home state. (Dover Saddlery is based in Littleton, Massachusetts). Please send me a private message if you have a particular issue or situation that I should look into - many thanks

paintlady
Mar. 29, 2011, 03:27 PM
For clarification - Dover Saddlery customers who shop direct (online or through our catalogs) do not pay sales taxes, except for those with shipping addresses in -Massachusetts.- we do have to charge sales tax for shipments to addresses within our home state. (Dover Saddlery is based in Littleton, Massachusetts). Please send me a private message if you have a particular issue or situation that I should look into - many thanks

Thanks Janet. That is interesting since it's not the case for other retailers. For example, I get charged sales tax on online orders through LL Bean even though their "home" store is in Maine.

Now that I have a Dover store 15 minutes away (Chantilly, VA), the only orders I've placed have been through the store to save on the high online/catalog shipping costs. I do get charged sales tax on those orders. It's been years since I've actually had a Dover order shipped to my home address.

I do wish you'd send me your sales catalogs though. Apparently, I got "dropped" from your mail list - perhpas since I no longer place online/catalog orders. I still want the catalog though so I can browse and get the sale price through the store. I have a friend who works at the Chantilly store that said she'd check on this for me.

RugBug
Mar. 29, 2011, 04:04 PM
OK, I'll bite! Credit card transaction fees from the perspective of the business owner are a significant cost impact - greater than debit/cash/check transactions (and probably paypal), so every time you use a credit card (even if you responsibly pay it off without you incurring finance charges) you are increasing the business overhead (which in turn leads to increased prices). Not that Dover the store is worried about Dover card transaction fees (although I am reasonably sure the card manager/bank has only negotiated reduced fees, not zero fees), but my guess is Dover is trying to make money on external transaction fees while promoting easier purchasing power.

Well, at least is a valid argument, although a thin one. ;)




Hey, nothing wrong with making a buck, but in looking at the entire picture, it would rub me wrong to use a credit card instead of a debit card

In my experience, the safety of using a credit card for online purchases far outweighs any reason to use a debit card. Credit card number stolen? Not so big a deal (as long as you have that protection, which most cards do these days). Debit card number stolen? World of hurt as they have access to any accounts and you don't necessarily have the protection that the credit cards do. If your account has the protection, well, it's not an issue.



Thanks Janet. That is interesting since it's not the case for other retailers. For example, I get charged sales tax on online orders through LL Bean even though their "home" store is in Maine..

The part your missing is that Maine has sales tax, Massachusetts does not. THAT is why you don't pay sales tax for Dover purchases. NOT because you placed them online.

trubandloki
Mar. 29, 2011, 04:07 PM
The part your missing is that Maine has sales tax, Massachusetts does not. THAT is why you don't pay sales tax for Dover purchases. NOT because you placed them online.

I have only had to pay sales tax when buying from LL Bean since they opened a store in my state. I pay NY sales tax rate, not Maine's.

DMK
Mar. 29, 2011, 04:21 PM
well to be fair, I'm not sure I would use a debit card without adequate protection at my local gas station, never mind online. Identity thefts occur everywhere, not just when you click on a link.

as for the bit about credit card transaction fees being a thin (albeit valid ;) ) argument, let's just say I know a tack show owner who would be howling in disagreement. It's a significant hit to the bottom line that already shows up in the pricing. It's also likely to be your typical small business owner (aka most tack stores) that is in no position to negotiate on these fees, or even let a consumer know how much it is costing them (supposedly even WalMart was hard pressed to reach a favorable negotiation point in this area - and WalMart is its own viable economy). And then on top of visa/MC's interchange fees, the bank may (will) have it's own processing fee on top. It's a "not thin" enough of an issue to other countries that the EU reached a settlement agreement with MC after the threat of antitrust suit, and a host of non EU countries with, one presumes, less negotiating power than the EU or WalMart have picked up the anti-trust gauntlet. So I don't know if I can think of it as a thin argument, but maybe one that 'Merkans aren't really hip to just yet. ;)

MintHillFarm
Mar. 29, 2011, 04:33 PM
UPS seems the most reliable. LL Bean items seem to arrive to NY in a day or so.

kgro632
Mar. 29, 2011, 04:40 PM
For clarification - Dover Saddlery customers who shop direct (online or through our catalogs) do not pay sales taxes, except for those with shipping addresses in -Massachusetts.- we do have to charge sales tax for shipments to addresses within our home state. (Dover Saddlery is based in Littleton, Massachusetts). Please send me a private message if you have a particular issue or situation that I should look into - many thanks

Ah ha!

See, sales tax and shipping at lease in TX are about equal!! I save the gas money and buy online!

Janet Nittmann
Mar. 29, 2011, 05:16 PM
Thanks Janet. That is interesting since it's not the case for other retailers. For example, I get charged sales tax on online orders through LL Bean even though their "home" store is in Maine.

Now that I have a Dover store 15 minutes away (Chantilly, VA), the only orders I've placed have been through the store to save on the high online/catalog shipping costs. I do get charged sales tax on those orders. It's been years since I've actually had a Dover order shipped to my home address.

I do wish you'd send me your sales catalogs though. Apparently, I got "dropped" from your mail list - perhpas since I no longer place online/catalog orders. I still want the catalog though so I can browse and get the sale price through the store. I have a friend who works at the Chantilly store that said she'd check on this for me.


You can request a Dover Saddlery catalog at our website, DoverSaddlery.com or please send an email with your name and address to customerservice@doversaddlery.com and it would be our pleasure to mail you the latest catalog.

Coreene
Mar. 29, 2011, 05:29 PM
Not to hijack, but really? I just looked this up and couldn't find anything. I know LLBean announced permanent free shipping with no minimum order value just this past Friday. No doubting, just wondering if I'm looking in the wrong place! :)Blonde moment. Got my L's mixed up, I meant Bean.

wanderlust
Mar. 29, 2011, 09:29 PM
The part your missing is that Maine has sales tax, Massachusetts does not. THAT is why you don't pay sales tax for Dover purchases. NOT because you placed them online. Huh? Massachusetts most certainly has sales tax. Exceptions are if you "eat it or wear it", it is tax free. There are, of course, exceptions to those exceptions.

Generally, if there is a brick and mortar store in the state to which you are shipping an online order (or if it is strictly an e-tailer, where the headquarters are located), you pay that state's sales tax on the order. Not sure how Dover gets around that, but it is how almost all online retailers handle sales tax.

Starhouse
Mar. 29, 2011, 09:42 PM
Huh? Massachusetts most certainly has sales tax. Exceptions are if you "eat it or wear it", it is tax free. There are, of course, exceptions to those exceptions.

Agreed, it's called Taxachusetts for a reason! :)

RugBug
Mar. 29, 2011, 10:39 PM
as for the bit about credit card transaction fees being a thin (albeit valid ;) ) argument, let's just say I know a tack show owner who would be howling in disagreement. It's a significant hit to the bottom line that already shows up in the pricing. It's also likely to be your typical small business owner (aka most tack stores) that is in no position to negotiate on these fees,

Oh, I agree that it's not a thin argument for the small business owner. But Dover's not really a small business.


Huh? Massachusetts most certainly has sales tax. Exceptions are if you "eat it or wear it", it is tax free. There are, of course, exceptions to those exceptions.

Generally, if there is a brick and mortar store in the state to which you are shipping an online order (or if it is strictly an e-tailer, where the headquarters are located), you pay that state's sales tax on the order. Not sure how Dover gets around that, but it is how almost all online retailers handle sales tax.

color me confused and (partially) educated. Coulda sworn I did some searching years ago on the topic and that was the answer I found. Musta been from Wikipedia. :lol:

Wonder why it is that I pay sales tax through some online retailers (without stores in my state) and others I don't.

wanderlust
Mar. 29, 2011, 11:27 PM
color me confused and (partially) educated. Coulda sworn I did some searching years ago on the topic and that was the answer I found. Musta been from Wikipedia. :lol:

Wonder why it is that I pay sales tax through some online retailers (without stores in my state) and others I don't. My understanding is that the online sales tax payment issue is somewhat legally ambiguous, and the current system most use is based on their best interpretation of the law. So, some online retailers take a "scorched earth" approach to the sales tax issue- they basically charge everyone so they and their customers are covered in case a state tax board decides they are going to challenge the status quo and go after a company for non-payment of sales tax. Which seems more and more likely given then current revenue problem state governments find themselves in.

trubandloki
Mar. 30, 2011, 09:11 AM
I am trying to find where I posted what you quoted as being said by me about sales tax, and I do not see this anywhere. I have no idea which states do and do not have sales tax, and I do not recall posting this.
Sorry. Not sure how that happened. I did not edit it. I must have deleted a quote and messed up the top line. I have edited it now to be accurate.

The Crone of Cottonmouth County
Mar. 30, 2011, 12:43 PM
The thing that people sometimes overlook when going for free shipping is that it isn't, in the strictest sense, "free." Somebody's gotta pay FedEx, and I reveal no secrets when I say that it's ultimately the consumer who foots the bill, in some way or another. Especially now that fuel prices are enbiggening so much. There's no such thing as a free lunch, as Pop used to say.

That said, I recently spent 20 minutes back-and-forthing between the Dover and SmartPak websites, trying to figure out the best deal on a pair of those bizarro new tennis-shoe-lookin' Ariat tall boots (http://www.smartpakequine.com/productclass.aspx?productclassid=9405&) (who can resist a boot with "intake vents"?). The retail price was the same at both stores, but SmartPak's shipping was $7.95, while Dover wanted a whopping $25.95. Yipes! On items where all other variables are equal, I'll enjoy the cheap SmartPak shipping while it lasts.

On a purely aesthetic note: compared to the SmartPak website, Dover is slow, unattractive, and outdated.

mg
Mar. 30, 2011, 12:47 PM
On a purely aesthetic note: compared to the SmartPak website, Dover is slow, unattractive, and outdated.

I will definitely give you that one! I HATE shopping the Dover site. It's clunky, unattractive, and difficult to shop. My job is working on web content for a retailer with an award-winning website, so I'm not website stupid either. SmartPak, on the other hand, is a great website. I'm such a web-retail geek now that I get really excited/jealous when they launch new web features!

horsepoor
Mar. 30, 2011, 01:50 PM
On a purely aesthetic note: compared to the SmartPak website, Dover is slow, unattractive, and outdated.

Agreed. It is such a little thing, but what drives me crazy is not being able to open stuff up in multiple tabs and compare. I use Firefox, and I like to right click, open in new tab on different items and some vendor sites allow you to do this but Dover does not and it drives me crazy.

amastrike
Mar. 30, 2011, 02:00 PM
Agreed. It is such a little thing, but what drives me crazy is not being able to open stuff up in multiple tabs and compare. I use Firefox, and I like to right click, open in new tab on different items and some vendor sites allow you to do this but Dover does not and it drives me crazy.

I don't think it's a little thing at all. You can open stuff in different tabs on Dover, but it's a pain... You have to click on the link, hold it down, and drag it to the tab bar. It'll open up a new tab when you do that. I find Dover's site very hard to navigate.

horsegal301
Mar. 30, 2011, 02:26 PM
Dover may have more expensive shipping, but they have a 100% guarantee of customer service. My mom bought a sheet for my pony and it had rips in it after 3-4 days of wear, despite my mom having the sheet for a couple weeks ahead of time, I posted the picture on dover's facebook, they told me to call customer service so the sheet could be refunded or exchanged. They do this A LOT and they make sure their customers are happy.

Consider that someone has to pay for shipping and the boxes they're shipped in.

I will also chime in that I love how they do Tuesday Trivias and Fun Fact Fridays and actually get in touch with their customer base and make sure people are happy and respond directly to a lot of the posts. I did just get a pair of Free Royal Rider stirrups because of one of the contests, and after not getting an email from the person I was supposed to contact after a day or two, I posted on their facebook and they said they'd make sure she received the email - I heard an hour later back from her that she was sending the stirrups out.

The shipping is eh, but they are completely reliable with their customer service, if you're not happy with a product, let them know and they'll do their best to fix it.

Fashion Police
Mar. 30, 2011, 02:42 PM
I recently spent 20 minutes back-and-forthing between the Dover and SmartPak websites, trying to figure out the best deal on a pair of those bizarro new tennis-shoe-lookin' Ariat tall boots (who can resist a boot with "intake vents"?). The retail price was the same at both stores, but SmartPak's shipping was $7.95, while Dover wanted a whopping $25.95. Yipes! On items where all other variables are equal, I'll enjoy the cheap SmartPak shipping while it lasts.

On a purely aesthetic note: compared to the SmartPak website, Dover is slow, unattractive, and outdated.

Good luck with the Ariats, I love them, but their zipper reputation isn't exactly unblemished. If you buy them from Dover, you can call them up and have them send you a new pair of boots and a free return shipping label - rush, if you need it. Good luck getting that kind of service from Smartpak. I'm not sure I'd be willing to pay that much more for most items, but zippered boots or horse blankets (which are usually less expensive at Dove anyway) top my "only buy at Dover" list.
Agree with you completely about their website.

amastrike
Mar. 30, 2011, 02:52 PM
Dover may have more expensive shipping, but they have a 100% guarantee of customer service. My mom bought a sheet for my pony and it had rips in it after 3-4 days of wear, despite my mom having the sheet for a couple weeks ahead of time, I posted the picture on dover's facebook, they told me to call customer service so the sheet could be refunded or exchanged. They do this A LOT and they make sure their customers are happy.

SmartPak has them beat. I posted on SP's wall about a problem, and they called me to fix the problem.

mg
Mar. 30, 2011, 02:57 PM
Dover may have more expensive shipping, but they have a 100% guarantee of customer service.

So does SmartPak ;) And with $7.95 flat rate shipping (no additional ship charges either on large items like tack trunks or saddles!) or free shipping if you have >$40 of Smartpaks.

Fashion Police
Mar. 30, 2011, 03:06 PM
SmartPak has them beat. I posted on SP's wall about a problem, and they called me to fix the problem.

Well they aren't very responsive when your two month old turnout's lining falls apart at the seams.
Or they forget - for three months straight - that you're supposed to be paying "barn buddies" shipping rates.
But you may have hit on the answer to getting great customer service - post a complaint on their wall!! Great idea, and maybe worth trying with Dover about their shipping prices!

Sonoma City
Mar. 30, 2011, 03:19 PM
I can't help myself anymore, after following this thread, I think Mick Jagger says it best: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxkdmL3iMCY :D

RugBug
Mar. 30, 2011, 10:05 PM
Dover may have more expensive shipping, but they have a 100% guarantee of customer service.
So does SmartPak ;) And with $7.95 flat rate shipping (no additional ship charges either on large items like tack trunks or saddles!) or free shipping if you have >$40 of Smartpaks.

SmartPak does not have 100% satisfaction guarantee. They basically told me "too bad." Very similar situation with Dover and they replaced the item at no cost to me.

My experiences with Dover make me want to continue using them. My experiences with SmartPak make me want to only use them when necessary.

trubandloki
Mar. 31, 2011, 10:12 AM
SmartPak does not have 100% satisfaction guarantee.

They do now.

http://www.smartpakequine.com/custcare_returns.aspx

wanderlust
Mar. 31, 2011, 01:14 PM
They do now.

http://www.smartpakequine.com/custcare_returns.aspx Nice! And a price match guarantee!

Renn/aissance
Mar. 31, 2011, 02:33 PM
For what it's worth: I do not order online from Dover because of the shipping prices. Despite several catalogue requests I do not receive them at my address; I also have called on several occasions and specifically asked to receive the Elite catalogue and do not. I do have a nearby store but they are often out of the item I want in the size I need- this is nothing against the store- and it takes a week to get items shipped in- again, I can see this happening, so no fault to the store here, the people there are great.

If I want a specific item in a relatively short period of time I go to another local saddlery or order from another of the myriad online retailers that don't require my firstborn child for shipping.

Lately this has been happening more often than not. I used to be a frequent Dover customer. Not so much anymore.

Edited to add: ditto ditto ditto on the unwieldiness and unattractiveness of the website.

pds
Mar. 31, 2011, 04:01 PM
Nice! And a price match guarantee!

I loves Smartpak!

KBC
Mar. 31, 2011, 04:28 PM
I am sorry but isnt that what trackable numbers are for or insurance? I have shipped many items USPS and UPS from the USA and they have all been received within a week. Each time I have been charged $8-20, to ship a saddle it cost $100. I am currently waiting on a package from the USPS. Also the Fedex air charging $100 is insane I shipped many items from england and was charged less than $20 to ship it airmail and it was received within 5 days. Explain how it is cheaper to ship from England than the USA?

Believe me if smartpak shipped to Canada they would have line ups of customers. And if dover shipped to Canada affordably they would see similar results.

Another Canadian who has had no issues with USPS.

I also second the thought that introducing affordable shipping to Canada would be beneficial to mail order companies, as well as us Canadian customers.

The Crone of Cottonmouth County
Mar. 31, 2011, 04:42 PM
Well they aren't very responsive when your two month old turnout's lining falls apart at the seams.
Or they forget - for three months straight - that you're supposed to be paying "barn buddies" shipping rates.
But you may have hit on the answer to getting great customer service - post a complaint on their wall!! Great idea, and maybe worth trying with Dover about their shipping prices!

I unintentionally got SmartPak's attention by reviewing -- at their request -- a pair of breeches I'd bought. Ordinarily I don't provide free content for corporate websites, but the breeches had an odd fit, so I panned them. Months later I got an unsolicited email from customer service saying how sorry they were that the pants didn't work out and here's a $5 credit. Well, that's nice. We'll see if the credit actually does get applied on my next purchase.

pompeiii
Mar. 31, 2011, 05:35 PM
I unintentionally got SmartPak's attention by reviewing -- at their request -- a pair of breeches I'd bought. Ordinarily I don't provide free content for corporate websites, but the breeches had an odd fit, so I panned them. Months later I got an unsolicited email from customer service saying how sorry they were that the pants didn't work out and here's a $5 credit. Well, that's nice. We'll see if the credit actually does get applied on my next purchase.

This happened to me with SmartPak as well when I left a negative review for a blanket liner that ripped at the buckle after 36 hours of use... I had contacted their customer service rep prior with no resolution (but, the item was on clearence (discontinued color) and as a result about 90% off when purchased and no longer available), but I was pleased to get the email about my credit following the negative review (I did managed to repair the item and it works nicely now). Credit was applied to my next purchase.

ShaSamour
Apr. 1, 2011, 11:27 AM
I have to say, SmartPak has been great as I've been going thru my search for new boots.
- Ordered a pair of DeNiro's, size 38/x-slim calf/regular height: calf perfect but foot way too big, despite the fact that I know a 38 is my European size. Exchanged them, even tho they were special order, no question for
- DeNiro's, size 37/slim calf/regular height: foot slightly too small, calf perfect but slightly too short. Exchanged no question for
- TredStep DaVinci's, due to receive next week.

Dover, on the other hand, made it clear that if I ordered a pair of Sergio Grassos that they WERE NOT returnable because they were a custom item. And that was at the store. If they had them on-hand in another store in my size, I could try them on at the store, no obligation. But if they had to be ordered, I had to take them. I was not going to spend $900 and potentially end up with boots that didn't fit and couldn't be returned.

pds
Apr. 1, 2011, 05:24 PM
Dover Saddlery Inc. Reports Operating Results



Highlight of Business Operations:

Excellent Customer Service: The company-wide focus on exceptional customer service is integral to our success. We promote a culture of prompt, knowledgeable and courteous service and strive for a consistent customer experience across both order channels. Over 90% of our customer service and sales representatives are horse enthusiasts. Additionally, our representatives receive ongoing product training from merchandise suppliers and internal product specialists. We also have a policy of offering customers a 100% satisfaction guarantee. We believe that our well-trained, knowledgeable staff and our historical ability to fill approximately 95% of the items ordered within an average of 1.6 business days in 2010 from our in-stock inventory are some of the reasons why we have had historically low return rates and high repeat customer rates.


According to American Sports Data, over 5.6% of the U.S. population, or 16.8 million people, ride horses with an average of 21.7 participating days per year, which exceeds participation in other popular outdoor sports, such as downhill skiing at 4.6% and 6.3 days and mountain biking at 2% and 18.1 days. There are many indicators that point to the continued growth of the equestrian products industry. A study by NFO Research indicated that 10% of U.S. households are involved in riding, an additional 5% were involved at one time and 18% would like to become involved. There has also been an increase in nationally televised programming of equestrian sports. NBC now broadcasts the International 3-day event from Lexington, KY (called Rolex) each year and in 2010, showed over 16 hours of events from the World Equestrian Games. The World Equestrian Games were held for the first time in the United States in September 2010.


Based on research of other similar multi-channel concepts, we believe that, when mature, the natural channel balance of a multi-channel retailer tends to stabilize with 60% to 80% of the sales coming from the retail market channel. This retail purchasing preference on the part of consumers is even more pronounced in the equestrian industry. Research by Frank N. Magid Associates, Inc. indicates that 80% of tack customers shop at retail stores. Since we currently have just under 33.3% of our total revenues coming from retail stores, we believe that there is significant opportunity to develop our multi-channel strategy and pursue our targeted retail store expansion. See “Retail Store Operations and Expansion”


Read the The complete Report (http://www.gurufocus.com/StockLink.php?type=sec&symbol=DOVR&date=2011-03-31&report=10-K)

Janet Nittmann
Apr. 1, 2011, 08:51 PM
I have to say, SmartPak has been great as I've been going thru my search for new boots.
- Ordered a pair of DeNiro's, size 38/x-slim calf/regular height: calf perfect but foot way too big, despite the fact that I know a 38 is my European size. Exchanged them, even tho they were special order, no question for
- DeNiro's, size 37/slim calf/regular height: foot slightly too small, calf perfect but slightly too short. Exchanged no question for
- TredStep DaVinci's, due to receive next week.

Dover, on the other hand, made it clear that if I ordered a pair of Sergio Grassos that they WERE NOT returnable because they were a custom item. And that was at the store. If they had them on-hand in another store in my size, I could try them on at the store, no obligation. But if they had to be ordered, I had to take them. I was not going to spend $900 and potentially end up with boots that didn't fit and couldn't be returned.

We apologize if you were misinformed, however you can now return ALL custom items to Dover Saddlery. On our website and in our catalog you will see 100% satisfaction guaranteed, money back any time, any reason. This applies to all items offered by Dover Saddlery. (At one time in the past we did not take back custom items, however this policy was changed some time ago)

Coreene
Apr. 1, 2011, 09:11 PM
Funny how Janet keeps ignoring the shipping question, except when she pimped the Dover credit card.

Peggy
Apr. 1, 2011, 09:30 PM
Funny how Janet keeps ignoring the shipping question, except when she pimped the Dover credit card.Nor has the pricing disparity b/w Dover and Smith been addressed.

Janet Nittmann
Apr. 1, 2011, 10:56 PM
Funny how Janet keeps ignoring the shipping question, except when she pimped the Dover credit card.

Please do not think I am ignoring your comments. We are very aware of the comments about shipping on this forum and we respect all opinions expressed here. Please however be respectful in return -when we provide factual information about how you can get the best shipping rates when shopping at Dover. Many thanks in advance

amastrike
Apr. 1, 2011, 11:09 PM
Janet, how hard is it to actually address the complaints? If you just said "we understand that there is dissatisfaction with our shipping rates; however, we are unable to make changes to the prices at this point in time", that would be great. Telling people to get the credit card is just side-stepping the issue. We're not stupid, we see what you're doing. We're happy to be respectful if you treat us like we're not dumb as rocks.

Janet Nittmann
Apr. 1, 2011, 11:13 PM
Nor has the pricing disparity b/w Dover and Smith been addressed.

Pricing in the English equestrian market tends to be higher than the Western equestrian market - all of you who are in business and all who shop in different stores, different regions and different countries will be aware that different markets command different prices.

amastrike
Apr. 1, 2011, 11:20 PM
O. M. G.

So, has anyone else changed their Dover policy from "I only buy there if it's an incredible deal even with ridiculous shipping or if I can't find the item I need anywhere else" to "they don't deserve my business" because of this thread and the Official Dover Responses?

Because I sure have.


I'm amazed at the difference between Dover and SmartPak with these things. Dover skirts the issue and basically says "screw you" when there's a complaint. SmartPak bends over backwards to fix it and will often offer a (partial) refund. If I didn't know that SmartPak was too classy for it, I'd think they'd hired Janet to pose as a Dover employee to make them look better.

BoysNightOut
Apr. 1, 2011, 11:55 PM
Wow.

No, I don't want a credit card just to get a low shipping rate.

Yes, I want a sales catalog with 1 sales price for an item, not 2 or 3 prices where I hope I found the lowest one.

Yes, I want a sales catalog with actual sale prices. Putting the price you normally charge in your regular catalog in red, making it look like a sale, is annoying.

Not going to lie, after reading the Dover rep's responses, I dislike Dover even more. So glad to have places like SmartPak, Schneider's, Adam's Horse Supply, and VTO around.....always have had fabulous customer service & good pricing from them.

Janet Nittmann
Apr. 1, 2011, 11:59 PM
O. M. G.

So, has anyone else changed their Dover policy from "I only buy there if it's an incredible deal even with ridiculous shipping or if I can't find the item I need anywhere else" to "they don't deserve my business" because of this thread and the Official Dover Responses?

Because I sure have.


I'm amazed at the difference between Dover and SmartPak with these things. Dover skirts the issue and basically says "screw you" when there's a complaint. SmartPak bends over backwards to fix it and will often offer a (partial) refund. If I didn't know that SmartPak was too classy for it, I'd think they'd hired Janet to pose as a Dover employee to make them look better.

I am very sorry if we have disappointed you in anyway. I have just sent you a private message so we can assist you further through a direct dialogue.

RugBug
Apr. 2, 2011, 01:45 AM
O. M. G.

So, has anyone else changed their Dover policy from "I only buy there if it's an incredible deal even with ridiculous shipping or if I can't find the item I need anywhere else" to "they don't deserve my business" because of this thread and the Official Dover Responses?

Because I sure have.

Nope. But I sure am surprised that a lot of people on this thread can't figure out the answers without someone directly telling them so.

I have to laugh because other people who end up answering for a company have seen that they often do more harm than good. Who wants to end up in that boat? Poor JanetNittman is trying to answer you in a way that gives you the requisite information without getting into policies and procedures. Can't you see that?

Let me translate for you:

If you want better shipping rates, get the credit card. If you don't want the card, you will pay on the scale we use right now.

End.Of.Story.

It's not Janet's job to justify their shipping policies and procedures to us. If you don't like them, go elsewhere. Dover will get the picture if it's a big enough issue.



I'm amazed at the difference between Dover and SmartPak with these things. Dover skirts the issue and basically says "screw you" when there's a complaint. SmartPak bends over backwards to fix it and will often offer a (partial) refund. If I didn't know that SmartPak was too classy for it, I'd think they'd hired Janet to pose as a Dover employee to make them look better.

I've never had Dover say "screw you" on something. SmartPak has. YMMV.

tallygirl
Apr. 2, 2011, 02:44 AM
Nope. But I sure am surprised that a lot of people on this thread can't figure out the answers without someone directly telling them so.

I have to laugh because other people who end up answering for a company have seen that they often do more harm than good. Who wants to end up in that boat? Poor JanetNittman is trying to answer you in a way that gives you the requisite information without getting into policies and procedures. Can't you see that?

Let me translate for you:

If you want better shipping rates, get the credit card. If you don't want the card, you will pay on the scale we use right now.

End.Of.Story.

It's not Janet's job to justify their shipping policies and procedures to us. If you don't like them, go elsewhere. Dover will get the picture if it's a big enough issue.



I've never had Dover say "screw you" on something. SmartPak has. YMMV.


AMEN. Has anyone ever worked for a corporation? I am almost 100 percent positive that Miss Janet over there is not the CEO of dover. She can't just change the shipping rates just like that. I think she has handled herself very professionally and courteous. I don't necessarily LOVE Dovers shipping prices but they DO offer some great deals in their sale catalog.. I have gotten 3 very nice pairs of Ariat breeches for 40 bucks. I don't think this needs to be another tear a poor employee apart thread. She has not said anything negative or disrespectful. If you dont like Dovers shipping prices, simply dont shop there. No need for Coth'rs to be rude. She isnt forcing you to shop there. :winkgrin:

kgro632
Apr. 2, 2011, 03:27 AM
I'm just going to say it!

THIS THREAD IS RIDICULOUS!

Ok, you hate Dover because of the shipping, you won't ever shop there again, ok..

Done and Done. So don't!!

But continuing to complain on here isn't going to do you any good....Unless of course you are fishing for something..... To get all the wrongs righted by them......

I don't know?

Do you haggle the post office on price of shipping? Or Fed Ex or UPS ?




Good grief!

KingoftheRoad
Apr. 2, 2011, 09:59 AM
I'm just going to say it!

THIS THREAD IS RIDICULOUS!

Ok, you hate Dover because of the shipping, you won't ever shop there again, ok..

Done and Done. So don't!!

But continuing to complain on here isn't going to do you any good....Unless of course you are fishing for something..... To get all the wrongs righted by them......

I don't know?

Do you haggle the post office on price of shipping? Or Fed Ex or UPS ?
Good grief!

But then, I shouldn't be surprised. I'd already pretty much given up. The point of this thread and the other one has ALWAYS been that we WANT to shop at Dover, that we think they have a good selection, and the customer service thing is a wash wherever you go, but that the SHIPPING prices, make it impossible to purchase from them.

Very simple comparison here, I want to buy a pair of Ariat Covington half chaps.

Dover's price: 169.95 + $19.95 shipping = $189.90

VR Tack's price: 143.95 + free shipping = $143.95.

Victory Canter's price: $159.95 + free shipping = $159.95

Now, would I be willing to swallow the extra $10 or $20 difference in the retail price to get Dover's guarantee? Well, since these are Ariat chaps, which are notorious for having problems, maybe. But am I really willing to pay a $45 premium for it on a pair of half chaps? Not really. Somehow, a $140 item doesn't seem worth a 30% premium in case they break.

Remember, nobody is losing money on these items, so if someone else is selling it for less, they must still be making a profit. So Dover sets their profit margin higher. And again, the problem with that overpriced shipping is that it takes FOREVER to arrive, and CANNOT be tracked once it gets to the post office.

So the WHOLE POINT HERE, is that while I really WANT to buy from Dover, as they have good selection, usually good prices (if you look hard enough), and the customer service guarantee, I simply cannot justify the premium price in return for what you get.

And as far as complaining here, there are very few places where customers have the ability to draw enough attention to have a prayer of getting a company to change their practices. This happens to be one of those places. I'm not trying to get any wrong righted, since I haven't purchased anything from Dover in the last year. But I would really like to purchase from them, but can't see past these backwards policies that they seem to hold to like glue. Or maybe you would prefer I go bombard their Facebook page?

In case you haven't heard, sometimes the squeaky wheel gets the grease - in this case, I'm trying to squeak as much as I can about Dover's insane shipping policies - NOTHING ELSE - in hopes that someone over there might clue in and start applying grease! Sorry if that bothers you, go read another thread.

jay0087
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:30 AM
Wow I thought this post would be dead already!!

But anyways after this thread I went and applied for the credit card. Thinking ok better shipping rate (that cost the same as driving to the store) Plus I was about to make huge purchase and thought ok I can get the points. But since I am just out of college and dont have the big income, I was denied. I was not getting the card to say hey I can now buy more because its going on a card, it would have only been for things I can pay off right away that I would have otherwise driven to the store to get.

O well!! : )

kgro632
Apr. 2, 2011, 10:33 AM
=And as far as complaining here, there are very few places where customers have the ability to draw enough attention to have a prayer of getting a company to change their practices. This happens to be one of those places. I'm not trying to get any wrong righted, since I haven't purchased anything from Dover in the last year. But I would really like to purchase from them, but can't see past these backwards policies that they seem to hold to like glue. Or maybe you would prefer I go bombard their Facebook page?

In case you haven't heard, sometimes the squeaky wheel gets the grease - in this case, I'm trying to squeak as much as I can about Dover's insane shipping policies - NOTHING ELSE - in hopes that someone over there might clue in and start applying grease! Sorry if that bothers you, go read another thread.

I suggest writting a letter, go through the proper channels, email the higher ups, people that CAN actually make changes.

I was under the impression that this forum was to gain useful information from others, not to try to change a companies shipping rates.....

To each their own.

amastrike
Apr. 2, 2011, 11:38 AM
I feel bad for Janet, because she's obviously in a nasty spot here. She's trying to help her company, but she's restricted in what she can say. Unfortunately, the end result is that half-answers are just annoying people further. It would be better to have stayed out of it altogether.

tallygirl
Apr. 2, 2011, 12:09 PM
I feel bad for Janet, because she's obviously in a nasty spot here. She's trying to help her company, but she's restricted in what she can say. Unfortunately, the end result is that half-answers are just annoying people further. It would be better to have stayed out of it altogether.

I am sure people would still be dissatisfied even if she stayed out of it. It's the nature of the beast. I doubt poor Janet can change all over Dovers shipping policy. And I doubt a few small voices really mean much in the big scheme of Dover sales. I still shop there even if their shipping is high, I don't like paying more in shipping but oh well, its business. Their customer service is great.

I bought one of their coolers from the sale catalog and they emailed me telling me it wouldn't be in stock until May, this was in January. They asked me If I would like a different color instead (which is what I really wanted but It wasn't on sale). So I ended up getting the cooler I wanted in the right color, I was more than please. :yes:

I am sure they lose customers when the item is the same price somewhere else but competitor has free shipping. I am sure they are aware of all this and dont need a thread on COTH about it every month from a bunch of angry folks. If you don't like the shipping policies, don't shop there. :D

trubandloki
Apr. 4, 2011, 12:13 PM
Great post Kingoftheroad.


I am very sorry if we have disappointed you in anyway. I have just sent you a private message so we can assist you further through a direct dialogue.
I am confused. Why have the conversation via PM?
All of us have the same problem with the shipping rates and funky 'sale' prices.

For the record, I find nothing wrong with Smith Bros having different pricing than Dover. It is a different catalog just happens to be owned by the same company. Different market so different prices.

Rel6
Apr. 4, 2011, 01:07 PM
I had a terrible Dover experience. I ordered Crowne Pros, they sent me pull-up instead of zip-up. THEN MADE ME PAY THE SHIPPING ON THE RIGHT ONES. I had to overnight them too since I had a horse show coming up (standard would have been fine (*if they hadn't sent me the wrong boot the first time!*)

Thanks for nothing Dover.

DMK
Apr. 4, 2011, 01:45 PM
I suggest writting a letter, go through the proper channels, email the higher ups, people that CAN actually make changes.

I was under the impression that this forum was to gain useful information from others, not to try to change a companies shipping rates.....

To each their own.

Nothing stays the same forever. Your proposed methods, while perfectly suitable for the 90's have been updated. Welcome to the social network digital media. And if you don't think corporations have embraced the new reality, you haven't paid attention to all the facebook pages/campaigns started by large corporations (Dover included). That has become a perfectly acceptable - and perhaps more effective - method of promoting change in a corporation. And if it isn't against the rules of the forum, then more power to people (politely) trying to inspire change.

That said, the PR person is just the PR person. Never kill the messenger.

adm1220
Apr. 4, 2011, 02:03 PM
I used to have the Dover credit card and had to re-apply for the new one when they switched banks. I was denied, as was my boyfriend! Kind of silly, since my credit is better now than it was during my college years when I originally had the card.

Pretty frustrating, considering we both we going to purchase new saddles. The card would have considerably cut down on shipping costs.

InWhyCee Redux
Apr. 5, 2011, 03:56 PM
We apologize if you were misinformed, however you can now return ALL custom items to Dover Saddlery. On our website and in our catalog you will see 100% satisfaction guaranteed, money back any time, any reason. This applies to all items offered by Dover Saddlery. (At one time in the past we did not take back custom items, however this policy was changed some time ago)

So, if the red saddle pad I bought three years ago clashes with my new chestnut horse, I can return it for a full refund?

Janet Nittmann
Apr. 5, 2011, 04:07 PM
Many thanks for the comments on this forum and in particular thank you for the understanding that I am posting to explain our current policies and how you can best shop at Dover Saddlery. Please be assured we do read all of your comments and your views are discussed internally. I send a private message to assist with a particular issue regarding an order or a credit card application. If you do have a particular issue you can also send an email to customerservice@doversaddlery.com or call Customer Service on 1-800-989-1500 until 11PM ET. We strive to address all issues in a timely manner and work with our customers to meet with their satisfaction.

Janet Nittmann
Apr. 5, 2011, 04:34 PM
So, if the red saddle pad I bought three years ago clashes with my new chestnut horse, I can return it for a full refund?

My colleague says that the red saddle pad might look great on your chestnut! Anything goes these days! The 100% satisfaction guarantee refers to satisfaction with the products we sell, if you are not satisfied with any of the products you have purchased at Dover Saddlery then they can be returned for a refund or exchange at any time.

paintlady
Apr. 5, 2011, 04:56 PM
So, if the red saddle pad I bought three years ago clashes with my new chestnut horse, I can return it for a full refund?

It's silly returns like this that results in rising costs. My friend who works at one of the Dover stores said they deal with a handful of customers who seem to get joy out of returning things just because they can. IMO, those people are abusing the "100% satisfaction guarantee" policy.

InWhyCee Redux
Apr. 5, 2011, 05:03 PM
It's silly returns like this that results in rising costs. My friend who works at one of the Dover stores said they deal with a handful of customers who seem to get joy out of returning things just because they can. IMO, those people are abusing the "100% satisfaction guarantee" policy.

Believe me, I would NOT make a silly return like that, even if Dover's says I'm well within my rights and sanity to do so. Hell, why don't they just GIVE us the goods until we ready for something new?

Seriously, not even Macy's allows no-questions-asked returns after six months.

paintlady
Apr. 5, 2011, 06:19 PM
Believe me, I would NOT make a silly return like that, even if Dover's says I'm well within my rights and sanity to do so. Hell, why don't they just GIVE us the goods until we ready for something new?

Seriously, not even Macy's allows no-questions-asked returns after six months.

I got that you were only joking. However, there are plenty of people out there that do abuse Dover's "100% Satisfaction Guaranteed" policy. My friend at Dover is constantly amazed at the stuff people bring in for returns.

InWhyCee Redux
Apr. 5, 2011, 06:21 PM
I got that you were only joking. However, my friend at Dover is constantly amazed at the stuff people bring in claiming they were not satisfied. Unfortunately, there are people that abuse Dover's return policy which only hurts the rest of us in the long run.

Maybe they should consider a reasonable return policy. A year would be plenty of time to know if something didn't fit or was defective, no?

pds
Apr. 5, 2011, 06:24 PM
Lands End had a similar policy years ago, maybe they still do. My wife worked at a Lands End store while in college and she would tell me stories of wealthy, or people that appeared to be wealthy pull up in their fancy cars and return stuff that was years old, had obviously been mistreated, etc. I guess some people have no shame.

sansibar
Apr. 5, 2011, 07:19 PM
Another Canadian who has had no issues with USPS.

I also second the thought that introducing affordable shipping to Canada would be beneficial to mail order companies, as well as us Canadian customers.

Yup my package I was waiting on arrived yesterday a week later, with no duty charges. And I paid $7.95 to ship the box from New Jersey.....