keeping a stock tank from freezing?

[Lmabernathy]

no access to electricity


I have heard of adding:

white wine:D-that sounds expensive

salt-probably would have to add so much water wouldn't be platable

Any other ideas :confused:

[Mali]

This is on my honey-do list:
http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/WaterHeating/SteveTank/SteveTank.htm

[oldpony66]

I have heard of adding:

white wine:D-that sounds expensive



:lol::lol::lol: I'm chuckling just imagining your drunken horses if you ever added enough wine to actually lower the freezing point of your trough :lol::lol::lol:

[RLF]

I used to have a farm that had no access to electricity in the back pastures as well. I built a 4 walled cover for the stock tank out of plywood and 2x4's. I then glued pink foam insulation on the inside. The top of the tank cover had a hinging lid that opened only over half of the tank, and that hinging part was also insulated. I put handles on each end for easier carrying and lifting. Once it was over the tank I would stuff additional insulation material down in the sides to fill as much of the gaps as possible (this was a pain in the butt).

At night I would flip the lid closed to keep out any weather that we might get.

it worked ok. The downside was that certain horses were wary of it. I ended up keeping in the pasture right by the tank for a month before I used it. At first they wouldn't go near it. Also- it can get hard for shorter ponies to reach in when the water level got low, and flipping the tank and washing it out became a big project.

But all in all, I would do it again if I needed to. It definitely helped.

[buck22]

insulating your tank... and keeping it out of the wind and in the sun helps too. I self care board and have no electricity, I insulated my tank with R30 (wrapped safely of course) and stuck it in a windbreak, and so far so good, no ice whatsoever and its in the 20's and howling.

[Lord Helpus]

I have spent several hours today researching this issue.

The *best* thing I cme up with are heaters which run off battery current. Batteries as in car-type batteries which must be recharged each day.


This was one of the sites that had them:

http://www.hydrogenappliances.com/hotwater.html

the site talks about having 2 batteries for each heater, but it only takes 1 - 2 hours to recharge a battery, so one battery would do for each heater.

Time consuming, but not outrageous.

However, when I saw this thread here, I opened it immediately to see if there was a better way.

For this week, my solution is to move all the horses into the paddocks near the barn and run electrical heaters to those troughs.

[Peggy]

Assuming my calculations are correct and assuming some stuff that probably shouldn't be strictly assumed, a 10% NaCl solution would have a freezing point of about -7°C. Probably not a large enough ∆T to be all that helpful and not too palatable either. Same deal likely for the ethanol solution. I think wine will freeze in the freezer. Vodka won't, IIRC, but that's a pretty high concentration of ethanol for horses to be drinking. Not to mention the cost. Antifreeze is poisonous. (you could say the same thing about ethanol…)

Isn't there something about floating a log or a ball in the water? Keep in mind that I'm from a part of California where things rarely freeze.

[sar2008]

Solar heated troughs. (http://solarheatedwatertrough.com) Weeeeeeeeeeell worth the investment.

[Eventer55]

You can build a wall about 1 ft wide all around the tank and pack it with fresh manure. If done correctly it heats up enough to keep the tank from freezing solid. Leave the drain, so you can get to it when you need to clean it out.

You know how even in the Winter you dig into a manure pile and steam rises? Well, this is the same theory. If done correctly it can work. You need to keep adding as it breaks down.

I've seen it work:)

[Hinderella]

I've been dealing with this problem too (separate post) because while our barn does have tank heaters, they are not used as early or as often as we really need to keep the tanks clear of ice.

Two years ago I built what I called the "red neck tank insulator". I took large cardboard boxes and cut pieces to the height of the tank (100 gallon Rubbermaid). Between two pieces of cardboard I sandwiched several layers of bubble wrap. I slid the entire thing into heavy weight contractor bags, and wrapped each section tightly with duct tape. I then was able to wrap the entire plastic coated mess around the tank and hold it in place with more duct tape.

I did this because the people who help with the feeding & watering at our barn said they would not be able to empty and clean the tank if it's boxed into a plywood enclosure like RLF used.

It did keep the water warmer, and when the other tanks were frozen over, mine was still clear. This year I'm making it with foam instead of bubble wrap and I'm thinking of adding a partial cover for more insulation.

My situation may be different, because we do have the use of heaters some of the time, but it's a relatively inexpensive experiment. You could probably use old beat up horse blankets for insulation, too.

[ChocoMare]

I'm in the same "no electric" bucket at a self-care farm myself.

For this year, I got two 40-gallon plastic drums and cut the tops off. I have an older 100-gallon Rubbermaid tub that has a big honkin' hole in the bottom.

I'm going to put a layer of styrofoam insulation, cut to fit, on the bottom of the big tub. Then insert the two 40-gallon drums (side by side) and then will fill in around the drums with extra pieces of styrofoam and fill the gaps with spray-in/expanding insulation.

That should do it!

[Southernboy]

I used a battery powered fish aerator which creates enough bubbles to keep a hole in one end from freezing. I wouldn't trust it long term or in single digit weather but it will keep a hole open for a while. (And no I don't have any goldfish in the tank.)

[goeslikestink]

no access to electricity


I have heard of adding:

white wine:D-that sounds expensive

salt-probably would have to add so much water wouldn't be platable

Any other ideas :confused:

if its self filling they put your stable muck around it about 2ft out and thick so its just below the water line

this is what i do and my tank keeps running taps might not work hose pipe might not work but the tank always does

horses dont tend to eat dirty bedding- but dirty bedding and muck generate heat

[Eventer55]

if its self filling they put your stable muck around it about 2ft out and thick so its just below the water line

this is what i do and my tank keeps running taps might not work hose pipe might not work but the tank always does

horses dont tend to eat dirty bedding- but dirty bedding and muck generate heat

I don't think anyone's listening to us, as I already posted this (see above post) It does actually work:) Not making it up.

[Trixie]

White wine definitely freezes in the freezer. Ask me how I know :no:

[KristiKGC]

Does anyone have any ideas that still allow for regular cleaning? The trough pictured in the solar heater link looks filthy and my guys like to rinse their mouths out in the water.

[Mali]

If/when I build the solar trough, I would hinge the top and hinge one of the sides to allow for me to tilt the trough and dump it for cleaning. All you would need is 4 hinges and some sort of clasp/hook to secure it so the horses can't open it. I would HAVE to have some way to clean it.

[ReSomething]

County at one time had described how his tanks were heated geothermally. I searched geothermal heat and was unable to find the post but did find a few threads from last winter with other ideas.

For something quick I might sacrifice seven or eight bales of hay to make an insulated surround, there are passive solar techniques such as painting one side of the tank black and orienting the tank long side to the sun or putting the tank inside a run in with a plexiglass wall on the south side.

We have an old scuba tank, if you are in the right area to refill it you could use somethng like that for a bubbler, and the compost idea has real merit, the hay bales aren't much different.

ETA check out Holly Jeane"s "I wish they would invent" thread, http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?p=5276448#post5276448 which asks the same question and has links to propane fired heaters and other ideas.

[Coyoteco]

County at one time had described how his tanks were heated geothermally. I searched geothermal heat and was unable to find the post but did find a few threads from last winter with other ideas.

For something quick I might sacrifice seven or eight bales of hay to make an insulated surround, there are passive solar techniques such as painting one side of the tank black and orienting the tank long side to the sun or putting the tank inside a run in with a plexiglass wall on the south side.

We have an old scuba tank, if you are in the right area to refill it you could use somethng like that for a bubbler, and the compost idea has real merit, the hay bales aren't much different.

ETA check out Holly Jeane"s "I wish they would invent" thread, http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?p=5276448#post5276448 which asks the same question and has links to propane fired heaters and other ideas.

County's geothemal method was excellent but difficult. It required a two-foot diameter hole dug to the depth of 20 feet. A two-foot culvert was then placed in the hole upright. The water trough was set on top of that. Very interesting, effective, but difficult.

[Bit O Groby]

I'm in the same "no electric" bucket at a self-care farm myself.

For this year, I got two 40-gallon plastic drums and cut the tops off. I have an older 100-gallon Rubbermaid tub that has a big honkin' hole in the bottom.

I'm going to put a layer of styrofoam insulation, cut to fit, on the bottom of the big tub. Then insert the two 40-gallon drums (side by side) and then will fill in around the drums with extra pieces of styrofoam and fill the gaps with spray-in/expanding insulation.

That should do it!

ChocoMare ; what a good idea! I have a similar:yes: "opportunity" to use an old water tank (it's metal, rusted on the bottom) I live in same area as you, so while we are in the so-called "south", we do have more freezing water than many would think.

[RLF]

Quote:
Originally Posted by goeslikestink
if its self filling they put your stable muck around it about 2ft out and thick so its just below the water line

this is what i do and my tank keeps running taps might not work hose pipe might not work but the tank always does

horses dont tend to eat dirty bedding- but dirty bedding and muck generate heat

I don't think anyone's listening to us, as I already posted this (see above post) It does actually work:) Not making it up.

LOL- these poor horses went from white wine to poo!

:lol:

[MoonWitch]

DH built lids for ours that we put on at night. It's been in the single digits here with artic winds blowing and we have had minimal ice in the morning - like 1/2' thick. We left off two of them last night & the result was me hacking away with an axe this morning through 3' while the others you could just break with the heel of your boot.

It's worth a try!

[ACP]

There is a thread like this in another section, I posted there, but will put this here too. It is an old idea, i can't remember where I first read about it.

You can rent a large power auger and dig an overgrown posthole and bury a 8 foot (or longer) length of 18 to 24 diameter galvanized culvert pipe in the hole, with just 5 or 6 inches of the pipe showing above ground. Then attach some brackets to the top of the pipe (by welding or nuts and bolts to hold a small stock tank (90 gallons or less), so that the bottom of the stock tank completely covers the open end of the pipe. (The stock tank will appear to be mounted on a low pedestal.) The vertical pipe acts as a conduit for the warmer ambient ground temperature from the soil below the frost line. The beauty of this design is that it is essentially passive and there is no significant maintenance, once installed.

[farmgirl598]

My water source for the barn is a typical outdoor spigot, but it is enclosed in a wooden box, with all pipes, etc, inside the box. What you end up with is a spigot sticking out of a wooden box. (hard to describe)...anyhoo, I took the "POO" advice here, and took the lid off of the box last weekend, and packed it with dirty bedding and manure. Did not know if it would do much good, but knew it couldn't hurt. This morning I figured I would at least TRY to turn on the water to see what would happen. I poured a bit of hot water over the spigot handle, as it was frozen in place. Once the handle thawed enough to open the tap, I HAD WATER!!!!! AND it got down to the mid teens here last night, with a killer wind chill. The "manure for insulation" idea really works! My only question is, how often do I need to add new manure? I am tickled pink with this idea!~ I do not want to depend on a trough heater, as the electricity in my barn was only meant for lights and an electric fence. I am away from the barn so much, I am afraid of fire, electrical shock, etc. This "natural" idea is just perfect!!!!

[farmgirl598]

Anybody know how often the manure needs to be replaced when it is being used for "insulation"?