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scaredtosaythetruth
Nov. 16, 2010, 08:34 AM
Hi, I'm an alter. I need some advice about my trainer. I'm scared to face reality but I know the wonderful COTHers can me help decide what to do.

I think my trainer is selling drugs. I have witnessed a few things around the barn that make me think she's doing drugs and selling them. What should I do? I'm scared to report her but I think illegal things are going on both at the horse shows and at home. :(

SillyHorse
Nov. 16, 2010, 08:40 AM
There's probably an anonymous TIP (Turn In a Pusher) line where you are. Call and leave an anonymous tip. They will investigate. If it's true, she needs to be stopped.

2bayboys
Nov. 16, 2010, 08:52 AM
Is this a trick question? Why would you be afraid to do what you know is the right thing to do? Do you want your horse to remain in the care of someone whose judgment may be impaired?

mrsbradbury
Nov. 16, 2010, 08:54 AM
If you even guess this is the case, and your horse lives on property she owns/ leases; and she gets busted... Your animal/ tack etc. can get tangled into an awful mess. If nothing else. RUN

purplnurpl
Nov. 16, 2010, 09:41 AM
Yup. just quietly leave.

scaredtosaythetruth
Nov. 16, 2010, 09:47 AM
I've thought about doing an intervention instead of turning her in to the police. Has anyone ever done something like that? But what if I'm wrong? How embarrassing would that be?

JB
Nov. 16, 2010, 09:48 AM
Yup. just quietly leave.
And THEN call.

shawneeAcres
Nov. 16, 2010, 09:54 AM
I would not get into the middle of it with an "intervention". I would 1) find a new barn 2) leave and just come up with a "good excuse" and 3) send in an anonymous tip.

STA
Nov. 16, 2010, 09:54 AM
If you are correct - you should leave
If you feel (as you state) strange things are happening - you should leave

Leave and report your suspicions - that is what the Police are paid to do.

findeight
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:07 AM
Real interventions are not like on TV-people can, and do, get shot walking uninvited into somebody else's house particularly if they are involved in illegal activities-no Dr Drew either.

Lets get real on that one. And it sounds like there is no hard proof. That TIP line is the best way to notify authorities of suspicious activity-and it is anonymous to protect you from retribution whether you are right or wrong...and the cops DO persue these leads.

If there is anything making you uncomfortable in any barn-just leave.
And you need to do just that.

Whoever mentioned trouble if there is a bust? Dead on, everything on the property is siezed and everybody...as in EVERYBODY...is under suspicion until cleared.

Oh, let me add it sounds like you are fond of this trainer? Well...if she is trafficking she is using you and your horse as a front for her illegal activity and probably her business as a laundry for drug profits. She is taking advantage of your feelings and loyalty...she ain't going to miss you if you go.

KristieBee
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:13 AM
agreed with find eight. additionally, interventions are used by people close to the addict to let them know they know there is a problem - and more importantly, to inform them that if they don't address it, to let them know there will be dire consequences to their closest relationships.

the real power of an intervention is the stakes involved - the addict realizes they are going to lose the people closest to them if they refuse to get help. that's what provides the incentive for them to try to change (though the success rate with interventions is quite low - an addict has to be ready on their own terms to get well.) at any rate, it doesn't sound like you are in that place at all with your trainer - additionally if you're not even sure this is going on there's just no place in this for you to intercede. even though you're probably right - (if it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, etc.)

i say just move your horse and go. this is a big deal, and not something to get tangled up in.

2bayboys
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:21 AM
OP, by contemplating an intervention (not to be taken lightly), are you trying to save your trainer? Or are you trying to save your own boarding/training situation which you see as threatened by her suspected drug use and dealing?

Walk away. Whether or not you report her suspected illegal activity is another question entirely.

SmartAlex
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:30 AM
No intervention. Leave quietly. Tip anonymously.

rugbygirl
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:36 AM
That kind of thing is not unheard of in a lot of sport organizations...you don't want your name anywhere NEAR hers when she falls. Get out, now. Trust the COTHers...it doesn't really matter WHAT it is that makes you uncomfortable at a barn, but this is your (very expensive) hobby. You deserve to have confidence in your trainer and the barn.


Even if you are like me 500km from any actual boarding facility...there are ALWAYS other options for you and your horse. Better options.

Leave on good terms, and DO NOT dig in to the issue. If you truly suspect illegal activity, make a good faith report after you are well free from association with the person/place.

scaredtosaythetruth
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:38 AM
You all know how it is... it is never uncomplicated. I am not in a position to just walk away or leave quietly. I have one horse leased to another customer there and another horse is part of a partnership. I've made a lot of investments both financially and emotionally.

What if it was just pot? It seems like something is going on because grooms from other barns have been driving in lately, she comes out of the office and talks with them for a minute and they leave and there is this weird little hand tap on the car door and then she puts her hand back in her pocket.... maybe it's the other way around? Maybe she's buying pot or something from THEM?

There is definitely something not right going on I just can't quite put my finger on it.

findeight
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:41 AM
Oh, Interventions are when family and friends, under the guidence of a paid professional, act to get addicts to realize they are killing themselves. Usually the addict is removed and commited to in house rehab and intensive therapy...not free of charge either, sometimes requires court involvement.

If the trainer is dealing, providing the means for other addicts to kill themselves-that is not an intervention, that would be an arrest.

rugbygirl
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:43 AM
What if it was just pot?

Pretty sure that if you live in the US, there's no such thing as "just pot."

Seriously, life sucks sometimes. As a responsible adult however, you are sort of duty-bound to do something if you know this is going on. The law will see you as culpable if/when she gets caught. Decide how much the partnership and lease are worth, I suppose. Also, if YOU'VE noticed, OTHER people have...and how long do you think this will go unreported? Trust me, if there are kids at this barn and she really is dealing...bloody hell, you do NOT want your name near that...and if someone's parent knows you KNEW ABOUT IT AND DIDN'T SAY ANYTHING?

Now, if your relationship with this trainer is decent, you could ask her what is going on. In a non-threatening, non-public environment. If you are satisfied with the answer, there you go.

barnbum81
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:48 AM
I was going to say your trainer must be our old trainer, but she was a pill popper, I wish it had been "just pot" . We walked away (resisting the urge to run) from that trainer.

I would try to get out, especially if it is a "dealing" type situation as opposed to using. That's pretty scary stuff!

Pussy Cat
Nov. 16, 2010, 10:58 AM
Maybe they just have bad backs and are picking up some muscle relaxants from the nice lady.... ;)

You said that one horse is part of a partnership, is the trainer your partner? That could complicate things.

What is your relationship with the person who leases your horse? What does your contract say about moving barns?

I think you should just ask the trainer. Phrase it jokingly if you are too nervous to confront her directly. Hopefully she will answer honestly and you will have your answer and can act accordingly.

findeight
Nov. 16, 2010, 11:04 AM
Thing is, with a training barn, there are younger kids around so it would not be "just" anything if and when the law steps in. If you are noticing this activity, others are too and if it's increasing? Only a matter of time before somebody blabs or she sells to a narc. Most of these types branch out from "just pot" pretty quick, they make more money on crack, coke and oxy etc.

And, far as not being in a position to leave? You may have to do so involuntarily so get a plan B in place quickly.

One other thing, having personal experience with addicts, they lie and steal. Alot. Ethics and morals are destroyed.

My best friend in high school and college, beautiful girl, good family, died at age 50 of liver and kidney failure, a heroin addict and ward of the state. Last time I saw her she was about 30, out in the back of the show barns handing off a baggie of white powder to a groom and stuffing a wad of bills in her pocket. I was later question by police who came to my home. That'll wake you up. I distanced myself from her pretty quick-and never heard of or from her again after being friends fo 15 years. Nice.

So I do feel strongly about where this leads and how you can get sucked into guilt by association.

scaredtosaythetruth
Nov. 16, 2010, 11:05 AM
[QUOTE=rugbygirl;5226370]Pretty sure that if you live in the US, there's no such thing as "just pot."[/QUOT

without being too specific, i'm out west. so ya, there can be an attitude of "just pot" even in the US.

Aliascml
Nov. 16, 2010, 11:06 AM
As others have said- Leave and call TIP.

rugbygirl
Nov. 16, 2010, 11:09 AM
so ya, there can be an attitude of "just pot" even in the US.

I'm in Western Canada, so I get where that attitude comes from...:lol:

But friend, believe me here, if there are kids at this place and she is selling...it's not "just pot" anymore. She's in an authority role around kids, and the law/media does NOT take it easy in situations like this (even if she never sold to a minor.) You should be worried about yourself here. I would be.

2bayboys
Nov. 16, 2010, 11:18 AM
How do you know it's "just pot"? If you don't know what is changing hands, there's plenty of fun things that are possibilities. Ecstasy is making a huge comeback right now.

Regardless, even if it is "just pot", distribution is still a felony. That would surely complicate things even more.

An intervention is not about confronting her with suspected dealing. What do you think she'll say when you tell her about your suspicions? "Oops! My bad! I'll stop selling drugs RIGHT NOW! Thanks pal!"

JackieBlue
Nov. 16, 2010, 11:35 AM
If I thought my trainer/barn owner were dealing and using drugs of any sort I would not need to poll an internet bulletin board to know what to do. Is there more to this story than we've been told?

BAC
Nov. 16, 2010, 11:39 AM
One other thing, having personal experience with addicts, they lie and steal. Alot. Ethics and morals are destroyed.

Yup, I have personal experience with that also. Once the addiction takes hold they are no longer the person they were, their entire world revolves around their next fix and they will do anything to get it, even if it means stealing from their best friend, etc. I had a trainer with a heroin addiction. Shortly after I realized what her problem was she was fired by the barn, she had been stealing to support her habit.

Definitely avail yourself of the tip line and try to move out if you are able.

findeight
Nov. 16, 2010, 11:46 AM
without being too specific, i'm out west. so ya, there can be an attitude of "just pot" even in the US.

I'm in the conservative midwest but, even here, I do understand the "just pot". But I was living in good old So Cal when questioned by the cops about my BFFs dealing-apparently she was mixed up in an extensive interstate operation fronted by show barns.

But there is no such thing as "just" when a teacher or youth coach is involved. Also the "just pot" part is pretty available so the grooms and barn help from other barns wouldn't need to make special, sneaky trips to your barn, should be able to get it closer.

Rest assured her supplier handles the more lucrative things as well and that she will enjoy that extra money and branch out to them. Her own addiction needs to be fueled as well. that also makes her more likely to lie, cook books and take advantage of the trust of others. Like you.

Make sure your ownership or partnerships are well defined as far as who owns the horse...you may need to prove it.

JumpingBug
Nov. 16, 2010, 12:08 PM
"SmartAlex
Advanced

Join Date: Jul. 5, 2007
Location: On the Buckle
Posts: 2,336

No intervention. Leave quietly. Tip anonymously."


AGEE but not to soon after you leave or the "trainer" will know where the tip came from. But by the way if you leave what do you care? I mean to say what good will be gained from this? I think I would just leave and move on to a situation that was better for me!

sa11yb
Nov. 16, 2010, 12:11 PM
If I thought my trainer/barn owner were dealing and using drugs of any sort I would not need to poll an internet bulletin board to know what to do. Is there more to this story than we've been told?

Totally agree, I would use my alter to find more appropriate barns in my area.

findeight
Nov. 16, 2010, 12:17 PM
AGEE but not to soon after you leave or the "trainer" will know where the tip came from. But by the way if you leave what do you care? I mean to say what good will be gained from this? I think I would just leave and move on to a situation that was better for me!


Getting a bit OT here but NO she will not automatically know who tipped the cops. That is not fair to the system of anonymous tips to police operating under several names in various states. These hot lines do a good job protecting the identity of tipsters and there is no requirement to testify in court if you use a tip line. Her operation is hardly a secret.

I would bet the cops are already aware, just she is probably small potatoes at the moment and will walk within hours of being booked anyway. She keeps on getting bigger and more careless, she will get busted and it will stick.

That is another reason you should not maintain any association with this type thing, you are under survelliance as much as she may be.

hollyhorse2000
Nov. 16, 2010, 01:17 PM
This sounds like a difficult situation, and I sympathize. Often it's not just a simple take your horse and leave decision. I assume if it were that simple, the OP would not be posting here.

So without offering advice, let me point out a few things to ponder:

1. Just because she's selling doesn't automatically make her an addict. She may not even be using. She may just be picking up extra money. So issues of intervention; addicts steal/lie etc., may not apply. (Please underscore may.)

2. On the other hand, someone being relatively brazen with such trafficking may be in deeper trouble than you realize, and there may soon be an issue with care, credibility, maintenance, etc. at the barn as the bigger issues get overwhelming.

3. Have you talked about your suspicions to anyone else? Is this "common knowledge"? Has this been going on for a long time and you're just now aware or a new issue? The answers might also provide insight into why this is occuring i.e. is this part of a larger issue such as deep in debt?

4. I do understand the "just pot" aspect, but any drugs, even pot, draw a "bad crowd" and I personally wouldn't want to draw that crowd to the place where my horse lives.

5. What happens to the barn if the trainer is actually arrested and jailed? What does this impact in terms of barn care/maintenance? If the barn will fall apart without her, that's something to consider. Leaving sooner rather than later might be important here.

6. Doing the right thing with a clear conscience is important. If you are certain, you may really have a moral responsibility to report. But depending on where you live, a small time person dealing pot to some barn workers may not be important enough for the police to follow-up on. Or they may not have enough to go on just with one tip. So even if you report, it's possible no action will be taken.

good luck

Moesha
Nov. 16, 2010, 01:22 PM
This makes no senese..."what if it is pot?" "Grooms from other barns?"

"hand taps on window and reaching into her back pocket?"

Seriously....

Trixie
Nov. 16, 2010, 01:27 PM
I'm w/Moesha... I would just quietly terminate my business arrangement and be done with it, if you're so bothered.

Unless you are close personal friends - and I mean family - an intervention based on a vague assumption is a sort of idiotic idea. Given that these are your suspicions and ONLY suspicions, it doesn't sound like you actually know anything about the situation. Thus, you can't help.

Moesha
Nov. 16, 2010, 01:33 PM
Trixie, I agree it sounds like the OP has no idea what is going on if anything....none of the suspicious activity makes sense, if the trainer was walking around bare naked covered in manure with pupils the size of Nebraska and muttering to herself and had track marks up and down her arms and the stalls had not been cleaned in a week and there were naked grooms from other barns passed out in the aisle while making secret hand tappings, of course ...well ok there might have a problem....

This thread reminds me of the "H/J barns drugging their horses thread....again the parent could not leave even though her daughter was riding a drugged horse,and how awful it is that H/J barns drug their horses..."

Next post will be that this trainer has unprepared 12" riders going to A shows...probably because she is drugging all of them...."

HRF Second Chance
Nov. 16, 2010, 01:36 PM
This is a pretty serious accusation. Even to accuse her of it and have the police investigate her would be a crushing and probably career ending (or at least significantly damaging) event. Not to discount your worries and/or fears but I'd sure be much more certain that there was something in fact going on.

I would keep my ear open around the barn and see if anyone else considers it suspicious. Or confront her, but she's not going to be honest and say "Sure, Sally I'm selling pot. Want a dime bag?"

If it truly concerns you this much you should leave, for your own sanity and safety of your investments. As mentioned if it does all go south you're going to lose your investment to legal issues anyway.

scaredtosaythetruth
Nov. 16, 2010, 03:26 PM
Thanks for the advice everyone. I went today and gave my notice. I'm taking both my horses and moving out. I just can't take it anymore. They can sue me. Whateve. In my mind they have broken the lease and partnership anyways. Might get ugly but I'm over it.

I'm calling the TIP line too as soon as I'm packed up and gone!

findeight
Nov. 16, 2010, 03:36 PM
Excellent. Even if you are not correct, anytime you start feeling uncomfortable at a barn? Probably best to leave. Giving notice and paying up, of course.

Usually, hunches or feeelings you get about things/people you are very familiar with that suddenly start to give you the creeps are not without cause.

Summit Springs Farm
Nov. 16, 2010, 03:51 PM
Thanks for the advice everyone. I went today and gave my notice. I'm taking both my horses and moving out. I just can't take it anymore. They can sue me. Whateve. In my mind they have broken the lease and partnership anyways. Might get ugly but I'm over it.

I'm calling the TIP line too as soon as I'm packed up and gone!

Good for you and Good Luck!!

Spud&Saf
Nov. 16, 2010, 04:07 PM
Usually, hunches or feeelings you get about things/people you are very familiar with that suddenly start to give you the creeps are not without cause.

F8...of all the wise things you have posted, I really needed to hear this today. You are my Yoda :lol:.

Spud&Saf
Nov. 16, 2010, 04:29 PM
PS - OP maybe you should ask her to cut you in. Horses are expensive and drugs are fun, seems like a win-win to me. :yes:

CosMonster
Nov. 16, 2010, 04:51 PM
Trixie, I agree it sounds like the OP has no idea what is going on if anything....none of the suspicious activity makes sense, if the trainer was walking around bare naked covered in manure with pupils the size of Nebraska and muttering to herself and had track marks up and down her arms and the stalls had not been cleaned in a week and there were naked grooms from other barns passed out in the aisle while making secret hand tappings, of course ...well ok there might have a problem....

This thread reminds me of the "H/J barns drugging their horses thread....again the parent could not leave even though her daughter was riding a drugged horse,and how awful it is that H/J barns drug their horses..."

Next post will be that this trainer has unprepared 12" riders going to A shows...probably because she is drugging all of them...."

I thought it was a bit odd, too. Let's just say I'm not as naive as I'd like to be, ;) and I was reading the description of the strange behavior wondering what the heck was going on... I didn't think of drugs until the OP said it. I don't know, it just seems really blatant and kind of spy vs. spy. :lol:

Regardless, though, I agree with findeight that if a rider is thinking this is likely, whether it is true or not, it's probably a good sign that they should leave and find a barn whose staff they trust. Good luck OP, I hope it all goes smoothly for you.

hntrjmprpro45
Nov. 16, 2010, 05:02 PM
On the subject of drug use, for those who wonder what the signs may be... we had a local trainer in our area who was heavy into pain meds. She would frequently miss lessons (sometimes up to 50% of her scheduled lessons), have incoherent speech at times, behave/react inappropriately (like laughing when nothing funny was said or get raving mad over nothing) and would get extremely forgetful. Those are the type of things that would REALLY indicate drug use. I am not saying that the person in the case of the OP isn't on drugs, just saying this is what I have seen from my own experience.

Either way, its good that the OP got out of there and I hope there are no major repercussions involving the partnership/lease.

gottagrey
Nov. 16, 2010, 05:18 PM
Thanks for the advice everyone. I went today and gave my notice. I'm taking both my horses and moving out. I just can't take it anymore. They can sue me. Whateve. In my mind they have broken the lease and partnership anyways. Might get ugly but I'm over it.

I'm calling the TIP line too as soon as I'm packed up and gone!

It's good you are getting out of a situation you are uncomfortable with but really calling a tip line to report that Miss Susie is talking w/ grooms from other barns, taps the car and then puts her hand in her pockets does not exactly make a drug cartel or a substance abuser...

and now I'm not saying your suspicions are not valid, I'm just saying that before you blow the whistle you might need more clear cut evidence..

REH
Nov. 16, 2010, 05:25 PM
Y'all have been watching too many cops shows. What in the world do you think is going to happen if she turns in the trainer and the trainer isn't engaged in illegal behavior? Nada. Some SWAT team is not going to attack the farm and call her into ill-repute in front of the eyes of the local community. Posting on a bulletin board about suspicions and having someone guess who the trainer might be is going to do more to ruin her reputation than calling the police who get many unfounded "tips" from tinfoil-hat-wearing folk that never end up harming anyone's reputation. They'll take it, consider it, and do something with it or not, but even if they do something with it, it's not going to end up in some chase scene with guns drawn...it's going to be something none of us would ever be the wiser about.

Trixie
Nov. 16, 2010, 05:48 PM
It's good you are getting out of a situation you are uncomfortable with but really calling a tip line to report that Miss Susie is talking w/ grooms from other barns, taps the car and then puts her hand in her pockets does not exactly make a drug cartel or a substance abuser...


This. Really, if you're unhappy, get out, but it sounds like you have a vague suspicion and no proof. It seems awfully peculiar to turn her in for talking to some grooms and making a few abnormal gestures. Unless, as Moesha said, you have any sort of other proof and there is a clear danger - otherwise, it sort of looks like an overreaction to just about any bystander.

HRF Second Chance
Nov. 16, 2010, 05:51 PM
Good point, look at how many people here just went along with that she must be selling drugs simply because this person said she was. No proof, and not really many questions asked about what roused those suspicions until half way through the first page. And not much evidence really.

Maybe I'm just blind.... But I'd have to see myself. Like the house on the corner from where I board has junky cars in and out in 5 minutes, and a steady stream down a dirt road. Now THAT'S supicious! Especially when it's the same 20-30 ratty ass cars EVERY DAY for 5 minutes.

REH
Nov. 16, 2010, 06:19 PM
Good point, look at how many people here just went along with that she must be selling drugs simply because this person said she was. No proof, and not really many questions asked about what roused those suspicions until half way through the first page. And not much evidence really.

Maybe I'm just blind.... But I'd have to see myself. Like the house on the corner from where I board has junky cars in and out in 5 minutes, and a steady stream down a dirt road. Now THAT'S supicious! Especially when it's the same 20-30 ratty ass cars EVERY DAY for 5 minutes.

I'm going to have to disagree with my beloved Moesha and Trixie on this one.

Being a serial barnhopper, I've been to a lot of barns and seen a lot of "visiting grooms". They come and visit the other grooms and "hang out" for a bit, or they come looking for work, which is pretty apparent to anyone observing it. Having numerous grooms pull up to the farm, never get out of the car, does seem suspicious and not just odd. And, the grooms do tend to be involved in the horseworld drug culture. If the vibe feels off, I'd go with my gut on it.

shawneeAcres
Nov. 16, 2010, 06:40 PM
Look I used to live with someone that dealt drugs. What the OP is describing IS very suspicious. It does not mean for sure that the trainer is dealing, BUT it sounds pretty accurate! I left and never looked back. TO my knowledge he was never "caught" but honestly it was very obvious what was going on (and trust me it was!!!!). I am glad the OP left and is going to tip off the authorities, I didn't have the guts to tip the authorities on the guy I lived with, mostly because he had LOTS of connections and I was pretty afraid of the ramifications. Was best to leave and move far far away!!!

FYI this was NOT happneing at anytime when I was running a barn, during that time I was had gone amateur for a few years and had my horses at home and was not teaching or training so noone that I had contacts with in the hrose world had anything to do with it. I also did not allow myself to get caught up in the drug thing, but I realized (thank goodness) that if he ever WAS caught I would be smack dab in the middle of it!

2bayboys
Nov. 16, 2010, 06:40 PM
This. Really, if you're unhappy, get out, but it sounds like you have a vague suspicion and no proof. It seems awfully peculiar to turn her in for talking to some grooms and making a few abnormal gestures. Unless, as Moesha said, you have any sort of other proof and there is a clear danger - otherwise, it sort of looks like an overreaction to just about any bystander.

Repeated visits and the visitors never get out of the car? But instead conduct some sort of...conversation?...transaction?...in the driveway? I'm sorry my friends, but I've been involved in law enforcement for 20 years, and I hate to bog this conversation down with professional jargon, but THAT is what they call a CLUE. :winkgrin: And in all seriousness, that is exactly the sort of information that led to the investigation and arrest of 15 college students in my little town recently.

OP, I'm glad you've decided to leave, if for no other reason than your own peace of mind.

findeight
Nov. 16, 2010, 07:11 PM
Well, numerous visitors who never leave the car and such was exactly what I watched around my BFF for years and was too dumb to realize what it was. Likewise my ex hubby's oldest boy had many "driveway visitors" and one barn I boarded at and left with a bad feeling had a stream of them.

All were busted for trafficking. Maybe this situation is innocent. Looks like the proverbial duck though.

doublesstable
Nov. 16, 2010, 07:37 PM
Since you are already leaving - do that and don't look back. Since you are not really sure drugs are involved; I wouldn't turn anyone in.

What comes around goes around.... if in fact they are, the behavior will catch up to them. And since you will be out of the situation it doesn't affect you anymore anyway.

If there is an owner of the property; they should deal with it if it in fact is an issue.

islndgirl
Nov. 16, 2010, 07:56 PM
Hmm... I would think it would be better to call the tip line and have her investigated. If it is true then she will have to face the consequences, and if there are legal issues with the OP taking her horses out of the barn, then the OP will have documented proof as to why she was leaving the barn/situation and taking her horses with her. JMHO!

I hope things work out for the best for the OP now that she has made the decision to go.

Flashy Gray VA
Nov. 16, 2010, 08:22 PM
Giving the OP benefit of the doubt, she did the right thing in just leaving. Gut instincts are, in general, a good thing to listen to - I'll assume it was a messy situation and she wasn't able to post too many details here.

Now that you're out of there, I don't think there's anything else to be done - as Mo and Trixie said, you don't have a ton of hard evidence (just those CLUES :lol: ).

Bottom line is reputation is everything, and if you think there's drug dealing on the property, you can bet that you are not the only person who has suspicions. Better to get out and keep your reputation intact.

I should mention that recently I watched "Cocaine Diaries" on the BBC and it totally blew me away:

http://www.bbcamerica.com/content/292/cocaine-diaries-alex-james-in-columbia.jsp

Alex James, formerly of the UK band Blur, once arrogantly boasted of the millions of dollars he spent doing coke. The President of Colombia saw this interview and then invited James to come on down to get an eyeful of what the cocaine trade is all about - the havoc wreaked on an entire society.

I grew up in the 80s and got my fill of "Just Say NO" programming, but this documentary was one of the few on the subject that has ever really gotten my attention. Really sobering stuff.

I think about it every single time someone says something along the lines of "it's just pot."

Moesha
Nov. 17, 2010, 10:19 AM
REH, I understand what you are saying, but you are going under the premise this is a real situation, I am not believing it. It just has all the earmarks of a made up situation. The OP is observant enough to notice this transactions down to hand tappings and pocket reaching yet has no other evidence...? And after my post and Trixie's posts that questioned her, she is suddenly is moving her horses out...one is leased out and the other she only half owns but she is taking them out immediately yet an hour before she was torn on what to do, didn't want to leave even wanted to have an intervention....ummm if the trainer was drud dealing what makes the OP think she hersefl is an addict??? .I find it hard to imagine, not impossible and of course and yes plausible, that this trainer would be so reckless...there are 24 hours in a day...to make drug deal transactions in in front of your boarders?....we are not talking about a street corner, this is a farm...I just am finding it hard to beleive and the sudden clarity because she posted here?? Come on!

We never know when we could find ourselves in this posters shoes, "There but for the grace of God go I" But I personaly l would not be posting this on a BB if my insticts told me this was going on I would get out.

Moesha
Nov. 17, 2010, 10:23 AM
Giving the OP benefit of the doubt, she did the right thing in just leaving. Gut instincts are, in general, a good thing to listen to - I'll assume it was a messy situation and she wasn't able to post too many details here.

Now that you're out of there, I don't think there's anything else to be done - as Mo and Trixie said, you don't have a ton of hard evidence (just those CLUES :lol: ).

Bottom line is reputation is everything, and if you think there's drug dealing on the property, you can bet that you are not the only person who has suspicions. Better to get out and keep your reputation intact.

I should mention that recently I watched "Cocaine Diaries" on the BBC and it totally blew me away:

http://www.bbcamerica.com/content/292/cocaine-diaries-alex-james-in-columbia.jsp

Alex James, formerly of the UK band Blur, once arrogantly boasted of the millions of dollars he spent doing coke. The President of Colombia saw this interview and then invited James to come on down to get an eyeful of what the cocaine trade is all about - the havoc wreaked on an entire society.

I grew up in the 80s and got my fill of "Just Say NO" programming, but this documentary was one of the few on the subject that has ever really gotten my attention. Really sobering stuff.

I think about it every single time someone says something along the lines of "it's just pot."

Flashy Alex James Documetnary on that was amazing.....sad and terrible but really fascinating, I think we can apply that to so many "legal" things in our lives even things we do on a daily basis, the clothes we wear, the energy we use, the organizations we support, etc, etc,

Alternative Route
Nov. 17, 2010, 10:32 AM
OP - you say that you have (had?) horses here that were owned in partnership, and that you've been noticing this for a while now, no? Dare I say, but I think I may know where you are talking about. I know that I was showing recently, and heard some scuttlebutt about this going on both at home and at shows. I'm not saying it is, but if it is the same barn - run like hell.

I talked about what I was told with a friend of mine who is in law enforcement in that state - at the state level - and it sounds as though there is a whole lot more to the story, and that there may be some major blow up soon. I hope you are out of there by that point. I don't think it will be good for anyone. Because this is a trainer who frequents many shows in different states, it isn't just going to be a simple possession with intent to sell case.

REH
Nov. 17, 2010, 10:35 AM
When I was a kid, I kept my horses at the barn of a woman who was basically running a bordello and selling (and using) drugs. I didn't know this from the get go, otherwise I would never have boarded there. I had an uncofmortable feeling but could never really put my finger on exactly what was going on--only way I found out (first about the drug use, the rest I learned later on) was an emergency in the barn and I pounded on the office door, she opened it and went flying out and I went around to the back side of her desk to call the vet only to see the coke on the shelve-style drawers of her desk. She suddenly realized a 12-year-old child was in her office with all the coke and she came back in, grabbed me from across the desk by my hair and pulled me across the top of the desk. I wish I had left when I first got the uncomfortable feeling that something wasn't right and not waited until the first hard proof. It made it much more difficult once it was clear that I knew what she was doing. We ended up taking my horses out for a "trail ride" and then never came back, my mother showing up later to get my belongings.

findeight
Nov. 17, 2010, 10:41 AM
Unike the TIP lines, this BB is not uber confidential and identities can be deduced.

Best not to speculate about identity. One way or the other it could get back. Don't think we want that.

Oh...the horse show circuit has long been a perfect venue for interstate marketing and moving merchandise in creative ways. Nothing new and if this trainer is involved (which we don't know for sure), certainly not the first, last or only one.

Moesha
Nov. 17, 2010, 11:08 AM
When I was a kid, I kept my horses at the barn of a woman who was basically running a bordello and selling (and using) drugs. I didn't know this from the get go, otherwise I would never have boarded there. I had an uncofmortable feeling but could never really put my finger on exactly what was going on--only way I found out (first about the drug use, the rest I learned later on) was an emergency in the barn and I pounded on the office door, she opened it and went flying out and I went around to the back side of her desk to call the vet only to see the coke on the shelve-style drawers of her desk. She suddenly realized a 12-year-old child was in her office with all the coke and she came back in, grabbed me from across the desk by my hair and pulled me across the top of the desk. I wish I had left when I first got the uncomfortable feeling that something wasn't right and not waited until the first hard proof. It made it much more difficult once it was clear that I knew what she was doing. We ended up taking my horses out for a "trail ride" and then never came back, my mother showing up later to get my belongings.


Wow that is crazy!!! Maybe I am mean for not believing this thread....I just have found 9/10 times the feeling I get when reading one of these turns out to be right, but I completely understand and beleive and know that crazy things like this have happened time and time again...and the best thing is to follow your instincts and get yourself and your horses out to safety.

Trixie
Nov. 17, 2010, 11:43 AM
I completely agree - if you're uncomfortable, of course you should leave - there's NO reason to leave your horse with anyone who makes you uncomfortable for any reason.

There's also a pretty long road from a vague tip on a drug tipline and an actual arrest and conviction. If it's not a matter of public record, would that help you in a lawsuit?

The OP might do better to document the ways that the trainer has actually violated their contract.

Hunter Mom
Nov. 17, 2010, 11:47 AM
I guess I would ask myself this - if it is true and you didn't do anything, would you regret that decision? If it isn't true and you did, would you regret that? Always make the decisions you can live with. If there are kids at this barn, that makes the stakes higher, too.

Christa P
Nov. 17, 2010, 01:20 PM
Unike the TIP lines, this BB is not uber confidential and identities can be deduced.

Best not to speculate about identity. One way or the other it could get back. Don't think we want that.

Oh...the horse show circuit has long been a perfect venue for interstate marketing and moving merchandise in creative ways. Nothing new and if this trainer is involved (which we don't know for sure), certainly not the first, last or only one.

Not just horse shows, but the entire industry. A few years ago they caught somebody with drugs at an international crossing here in the Buffalo area - they were moving racehorses, along with the drugs, across the border.

Christa

Eye in the Sky
Nov. 17, 2010, 05:57 PM
I thought it was a bit odd, too. Let's just say I'm not as naive as I'd like to be, ;) and I was reading the description of the strange behavior wondering what the heck was going on... I didn't think of drugs until the OP said it. I don't know, it just seems really blatant and kind of spy vs. spy. :lol:

Regardless, though, I agree with findeight that if a rider is thinking this is likely, whether it is true or not, it's probably a good sign that they should leave and find a barn whose staff they trust. Good luck OP, I hope it all goes smoothly for you.

Actually, it sounds just like some of the gangs I've worked with - which is why it sounded very hilarious to me! I was imagining her trainer trying to "color out" but not being able to wear the barn colors and the catastrophe that would eventually cause LOL! I mean, I'm not saying that what the OP was witnessing was not weird and was not potentially illegal, but honestly, the trainer could have been off her meds for turret's and the tapping could have been part of that - or OCD or Schizophrenia (that last one would have me concerned).

I mean, I AM struggling with the idea that your trainer is growing and/or dealing and the drug ring happens to involve area grooms - it's just too sing-song for me. And hilarious. It's as if Lifetime had an affair with the WB and had this disaster of an after-school special. :lol:

Eye in the Sky
Nov. 17, 2010, 05:58 PM
Not just horse shows, but the entire industry. A few years ago they caught somebody with drugs at an international crossing here in the Buffalo area - they were moving racehorses, along with the drugs, across the border.

Christa

VR for $1000, Alex.

Moesha
Nov. 18, 2010, 09:37 AM
Actually, it sounds just like some of the gangs I've worked with - which is why it sounded very hilarious to me! I was imagining her trainer trying to "color out" but not being able to wear the barn colors and the catastrophe that would eventually cause LOL! I mean, I'm not saying that what the OP was witnessing was not weird and was not potentially illegal, but honestly, the trainer could have been off her meds for turret's and the tapping could have been part of that - or OCD or Schizophrenia (that last one would have me concerned).

I mean, I AM struggling with the idea that your trainer is growing and/or dealing and the drug ring happens to involve area grooms - it's just too sing-song for me. And hilarious. It's as if Lifetime had an affair with the WB and had this disaster of an after-school special. :lol:

Maybe it could be Tori Spelllings comeback!!

"Mother May I ride with Danger"

Long Spot
Nov. 18, 2010, 09:41 AM
Ha!

In the movie her horse would be named Mary Jane. Of course.

LearnToFly
Nov. 18, 2010, 10:45 AM
It is great fortune that they allow me to new city for special trainings in freedom fighting and I sneak to internets cafe to see this about illegal things happen in American horse places. And this illegals make this alter person takes it horse away.

I worry about this illegals in America. My uncle is illegal from PNG and works very hard for Americans horses peoples. Do illegals workers at American horses places make people take their horses away? This would be very bad. My uncle send us money for our freedom cause.

Do you think Mr. Pat Parelli can come train our warponies for freedoms fightings in PNG? We have our people in high places to get him visa so he can work for our horses people legally.

I must go back to training and type very fast. I very sorry for mistakes.

Sincerely,
Guerilla,
PNG

You should start a thread. I want to hear all about your life sneaking into internet cafes to read COTH while freedom fighting in Papua New Guinea with your warponies

Moesha
Nov. 18, 2010, 12:12 PM
Ha!

In the movie her horse would be named Mary Jane. Of course.

and she would be going for the 10" Speed championships at the World Equestrian Games, but her evil trainer only wants to do drugs and have affairs with married men and beat and abuse her Central American Staff...who are of course also involved in the drug trade, and then Tori realizes that she should have learned to tack up her own horse because she is being chased by The Warmblood mafia and hides out in her barn but can't figure out how to put the saddle on or the bridle and has no idea what the martingale is because she always had Chez tack her horses up for her....but the spirit of Seaweed comes to her and she is able to figure it all out and just in time for a perfect lead change....and she escapes... but her evil no qualifications trainer has drugged all the horses throughout the country and they are disqualified from WEG :( and the German team is all on maternity leave :0 ....so Papua New Guinea wins the gold!!

tidy rabbit
Nov. 18, 2010, 01:14 PM
B.R.A.V.O. Mo! bravo!

I think you have the next best seller there!

Eye in the Sky
Nov. 18, 2010, 04:10 PM
and she would be going for the 10" Speed championships at the World Equestrian Games, but her evil trainer only wants to do drugs and have affairs with married men and beat and abuse her Central American Staff...who are of course also involved in the drug trade, and then Tori realizes that she should have learned to tack up her own horse because she is being chased by The Warmblood mafia and hides out in her barn but can't figure out how to put the saddle on or the bridle and has no idea what the martingale is because she always had Chez tack her horses up for her....but the spirit of Seaweed comes to her and she is able to figure it all out and just in time for a perfect lead change....and she escapes... but her evil no qualifications trainer has drugged all the horses throughout the country and they are disqualified from WEG :( and the German team is all on maternity leave :0 ....so Papua New Guinea wins the gold!!

OMG!! Yes! The spirit of Seaweed - wonderful addition to the plot! Tori will have to learn also how to tighten her own girth or else (sub-plot) she will be in danger of sliding sideways during the power and speed selections of the 11.5" (is her horse an Arabian names Russian Roulette, by chance?) Championship! This is where the plot thickens, because it is in the padding of the girth that the JRT sniffs out the elusive drugs and people begin to take notice that "something is wrong". :eek:

This brings back memories of that other story we were working on many years ago - something "pines" I think - anyone recall the name?