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View Full Version : Toto sold to the USA?!



snoopy
Sep. 29, 2010, 05:35 PM
According to the BBC and Pierre St Jaques...TOTA SOLD TO THE USA.

Dressage_Julie
Sep. 29, 2010, 05:49 PM
My jaw is on the ground!

stolensilver
Sep. 29, 2010, 06:05 PM
I'm stunned too although he has quietly been for sale for a while now. It was rumoured the Max-Theurers had bought him last year after their own GP horse Augustin had to have colic surgery. I wonder who has bought him now? And who they will get to ride him? Whoever it was has very deep pockets!

stolensilver
Sep. 29, 2010, 06:08 PM
I wonder if Edward Gal will now bring out Totilas's sister? She's a beautiful bright bay called Uusminka and has been working at GP for over a year. He calls her his "secret weapon".

fsf
Sep. 29, 2010, 06:38 PM
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/weg/dressage/article.php?id=302392

Sara Lieser
Sep. 30, 2010, 10:27 PM
Hi guys,

I talked to Pierre St. Jacques today, and he was quite confused as to how he'd become part of this rumor. While the announcer did suggest Totilas had been sold to the U.S., Pierre did NOT confirm it. And, of course, Edward Gal told all of us at the press conference that Totilas is NOT sold.

It's a fun rumor though! Steffen and Edward were pretty funny at the press conference when a reporter asked the question. Edward said, "Oh yes, Steffen tried him this morning." But they were very clearly joking!

ToN Farm
Sep. 30, 2010, 10:34 PM
Why would the announcer say such a thing? Has anyone talking to him about why??

Don Raphaelo Rollkurista
Sep. 30, 2010, 10:56 PM
A glass of Sonoma Cab please!

Fantastic
Oct. 1, 2010, 09:24 AM
ToN, I agree! Why on earth would he say anything, unless it was true? So odd! Who was the announcer anyway? Does anyone know him/her?

alicen
Oct. 1, 2010, 06:55 PM
The (Brit ?) announcer on Universal Sports, who makes no attempt at pronouncing names correctly, introduced himself as Bob Cazarra (sp?). I just rewatched the ending of the Grand Prix Special broadcast. Cazarra says, about a teary Gal , that he was being emotional because Totillas had been sold to someone in the US and would be staying here after the games. St. Jacques said that he had heard nothing about it.

dalpal
Oct. 2, 2010, 08:37 AM
Eh, Edward doesn't need to be sad....if Toto were to be sold to the US, we "might" consider letting Edward come along with him. :lol:

alicen
Oct. 2, 2010, 09:42 AM
Eh, Edward doesn't need to be sad....if Toto were to be sold to the US, we "might" consider letting Edward come along with him. :lol:

Could he become a U.S. citizen in time for the 2012 Olympics? For him not to ride that horse in the Olympics would be absurd.

dalpal
Oct. 2, 2010, 08:53 PM
Could he become a U.S. citizen in time for the 2012 Olympics? For him not to ride that horse in the Olympics would be absurd.

It was simply a tongue and cheek post......from what I've read the rumor is false....so everyone can relax. ;)

alicen
Oct. 3, 2010, 08:04 AM
It was simply a tongue and cheek post......from what I've read the rumor is false....so everyone can relax. ;)

Ditto.

Seriously though, I would expect the commentator, Philip Ghazala, to offer a retraction and/or apology.

snoopy
Oct. 3, 2010, 09:06 AM
My appologies....The bbc feed had Pierre as co presenter and I thought I heard some sort of comment from him that agreed with the other presenter. Sorry Pierre!!

Mardi
Oct. 10, 2010, 12:03 AM
I just rewatched the ending of the Grand Prix Special broadcast. Cazarra says, about a teary Gal , that he was being emotional because Totillas had been sold to someone in the US and would be staying here after the games.

I thought Gal looked sad right after his salute in the freestyle ride..the sadness was unmistakable, but it could have been that perhaps he does not know if he'll ever go that way again...3 golds at the WEG.

That said, the "sold" rumor was again alive at the Region 9 championships in Los Angeles this weekend. New owner named, and the 8 digit price tag. "They bought the gold" was the comment (referring to London 2012).

Maybe where there's smoke there is fire ?

But bottom line, the new owner would be buying a talented 10 year old GP horse who is at the top right now, with unknown years left. Also he is, so far, an unproven stallion.

No doubt someone, some where, is sorting out the risk vs the investment ! :)

Coreene
Oct. 10, 2010, 12:49 AM
The horse flew back to Harskamp last Saturday, arrived Sunday and is enjoying a break.

Liz
Oct. 10, 2010, 09:24 AM
Honestly, would a top rider want him? You would face nothing but comparisons. Would they want to risk not being able to match, much less better, the scores Edward has already earned on the stallion?

evenstar
Oct. 10, 2010, 10:26 AM
[/QUOTE]The horse flew back to Harskamp last Saturday, arrived Sunday and is enjoying a break.[/QUOTE]


And some people think men actually flew all the way to the moon and planted a flag! How do we know those pictures of Toto arriving back home weren't photoshopped! :D

It's been fun to speculate, but I think we'll be seeing Edward on Totilas in 2012. (OK, so I'm still speculating...)

ShannonLee
Oct. 10, 2010, 11:13 AM
I heard a rumour that Paul Schockemhole's stud bought him for 9 million euros. It's a 3rd hand rumour, so take it for what it is, but that seems more likely than any other top rider taking over the reins. Perhaps someone like Paul would be interested in Totilas and Edward together......

I can't imagine any rider wanting to take over the reins from Edward - talk about a hard act to follow! And for sure no guarantee of a Gold medal - it takes a team to win that medal, and I think many people forget that Edward is a huge part of this successful team!

mbm
Oct. 10, 2010, 12:52 PM
I thought Gal looked sad right after his salute in the freestyle ride..the sadness was unmistakable, but it could have been that perhaps he does not know if he'll ever go that way again...3 golds at the WEG.

i saw the same thing, and the team looked not happy either.

my guess was that the crowd reaction to Fuego really put a damper on things and it was pretty clear to most that the star of the show was not Totilas. That realization could be a big fat downer when you assume you are the star.

Donella
Oct. 10, 2010, 01:16 PM
I can't imagine any rider wanting to take over the reins from Edward - talk about a hard act to follow! And for sure no guarantee of a Gold medal - it takes a team to win that medal, and I think many people forget that Edward is a huge part of this successful team

Amen!

candico
Oct. 10, 2010, 04:18 PM
I think Edward looked sad because there were two big bobbles in his test. The GPS went much better, IMO, and I think they were hoping for a flawless freestyle. All of the Dutch team had their game face on and I don't think it is just about winning for them - it is about being better than the last time so that there is a progression.
That said, it is not Toto that the US needs from the Dutch. It is more of their formula for putting forth a top team. Let's put aside all the RK/LDR and look at how much emphasis they put on both mental and physical fitness of the entire team. They had two of their top horses out - Salinero and Parcival, and still we are more on par with their 4,5,6 and 7th top horses. Okay, Ravel has beat Salinero once I think, so maybe up to their third best. How are we going to medal at the Olympics with just Steffen carrying the team? Great Britain has certainly stepped it up and Spain is also coming on stronger. You can see Germany faultering a bit with a loss of team members such as Salzegaber who has much experience at the Olympic level. I think a successful team needs to have at least two riders who are confident at the Olympic level to get onto that podium...
I'm not faulting the other three combinations, rather the US process of selecting the team at such a late date and perhaps not having a coach capable of bringing out the best in our horse and rider teams. I did not see a significant improvement from the selection trial at Gladstone, and I'm not sure if it was "nerves" or what, but it just didn't seem that the three were "in the zone" as far as their performance at WEGs. To me, that is what a good coach does. Get the entire team "in the zone", game face on, whatever.
Maybe we need to select an "A" team and "B" team now and seriously start grooming them for international competition especially on a mental level. It it harder since the team members are not located close enough to each other to easily be monitered throughout the year, but it did seem to help Courtney when she was able to go and stay/train with Steffen prior to Beijing. The loss of her strength and of Guenter's has put a serious damper at the top, but what is being done to restrengthen our pool of riders. Would love to hear from Liz on this, because I still would love to see her on the "A" team especially with a US bred horse! I do think Guenter will make it back in time to be considered for the team, but can't D & J buy him an already somewhat seasoned horse that he can just bring a little more out of instead this green, hothead whom I do think is a fabulous horse, but just think GS deserves a nice sane super horse like Toto or Fuego. FWIW

siegi b.
Oct. 10, 2010, 06:30 PM
I agree with most of your post, candico, because it addresses some of the differences between the American and Dutch teams well. Where I'm not completely in agreement is with the coaching aspect.... You have to have "good material" to work with in order to go to the top. Looking at the US team, there were - in my opinion - several riders that should not have been on it but qualified because there weren't any other good rider combinations available. We do not have the depth of talent in the US that the European countries seem to have ad nauseum. I read about young rider programs and competitions and I wonder what happens to those young people. Where are they? Why are they not proceeding up the ladder?

Looking at the WEG I am tempted to wager that the likes of Liz Austin and Cassandra Barteau - given a little bit more advanced coaching and training - would have put in very good performances and maybe even better performances than some of the US riders on the team.

So maybe we need a better selection process early on and then intensive training/coaching to get where we need to be?

Just some thoughts.....

alicen
Oct. 10, 2010, 08:54 PM
i saw the same thing, and the team looked not happy either.

my guess was that the crowd reaction to Fuego really put a damper on things and it was pretty clear to most that the star of the show was not Totilas. That realization could be a big fat downer when you assume you are the star.

No doubt. Has crowd mentality ever been anything but depressing?

mbm
Oct. 11, 2010, 12:45 AM
i am not much of a go along with the crowd kind of person.... which is one reason why i think this whole Fuego thing is really interesting.

crowds can be good or bad, depending where you stand.

altho the recent "crowd reaction" on COTH has left a very bad taste in my mouth.

Truthiness
Oct. 11, 2010, 09:52 AM
my guess was that the crowd reaction to Fuego really put a damper on things and it was pretty clear to most that the star of the show was not Totilas. That realization could be a big fat downer when you assume you are the star.
mbm, I can always count on you for comic relief. The star of the show was undeniably Totilas. Fuego was quite fine but not in the same league.

ridgeback
Oct. 11, 2010, 10:22 AM
mbm, I can always count on you for comic relief. The star of the show was undeniably Totilas. Fuego was quite fine but not in the same league.

Umm the star of the show was not Totilas it was Fuego...Is Totilas a better dressage horse YES YES YES did he deserve to WIN YES YES YES:D but no arguing who stole the show..right or wrong. On a personal note Totilas and Laura's horse stole the show for me.

bort84
Oct. 11, 2010, 12:13 PM
i saw the same thing, and the team looked not happy either.

my guess was that the crowd reaction to Fuego really put a damper on things and it was pretty clear to most that the star of the show was not Totilas. That realization could be a big fat downer when you assume you are the star.

Wow, mbm, you found a way to insert Fuego into another thread. Creative.

Great horse, definitely stole the hearts of the crowd, but I highly doubt that's why EG looked sad if he was sad at all.

You know what makes up for the crowd not having the same frenzy during your ride? 3 gold medals...

mbm
Oct. 11, 2010, 12:16 PM
mbm, I can always count on you for comic relief. The star of the show was undeniably Totilas. Fuego was quite fine but not in the same league.

mmmmhmmmm.... that is why 25000 people leaped to their feat and cheered for Fuego and not Totilas?

and Bort, people were speculating why he looked not happy... he and his team looked plenty happy for the other rides.... so why not the freestyle?

probably because it wasn't a stellar test and Feugo stole the show.

or, that is my guess anyway - about as good as your or anyone elses :)

this is not a spitting contest, but none will remember Totilas' 3 gold medals and everyone will remember Fuego.

that is how people work :)

NOMIOMI1
Oct. 11, 2010, 12:27 PM
I wouldn't even know the horses name had it not been for Coth and the MBM fan club for the spanish horse.

OF COURSE people will remember Totilas at the WEG, and what he's done before and after (since he is making history) and is the MOST talked about dressage horse for quite some time (will continue to be).

The only one starting threads and carping on and on, pimping if you will, the spanish horse is you.

ridgeback
Oct. 11, 2010, 12:28 PM
mmmmhmmmm.... that is why 25000 people leaped to their feat and cheered for Fuego and not Totilas?

and Bort, people were speculating why he looked not happy... he and his team looked plenty happy for the other rides.... so why not the freestyle?

probably because it wasn't a stellar test and Feugo stole the show.

or, that is my guess anyway - about as good as your or anyone elses :)

this is not a spitting contest, but none will remember Totilas' 3 gold medals and everyone will remember Fuego.

that is how people work :)

Well I for one will remember the best test/horse/rider and that would be Totilas and Edward:D

bort84
Oct. 11, 2010, 12:48 PM
this is not a spitting contest, but none will remember Totilas' 3 gold medals and everyone will remember Fuego.

that is how people work :)

I strongly disagree. Anyone who knows a lick about dressage and is involved in it right now will remember Totilas and his 3 gold medals and his clear dominance over everything over the last year and however many more years he competes and continues his reign.

Fuego will have some lasting youtube-type popularity (think Blue Hors Matine and that Aachen freestyle), yes, because he had an awesome, energetic, and emotional freestyle. But I highly doubt he will have a legacy like Totilas or that most people who have any interest in dressage will remember his freestyle more than Totilas' sweep at the WEG.

Some may remember his one WEG freestyle more than Totilas' freestyle at this particular competition, but Totilas' body of work and collection of awards will not likely be forgotten by many or upstaged by Fuego's one very neat freestyle.

mbm
Oct. 11, 2010, 01:16 PM
<rolls eyes and walks away>

ridgeback
Oct. 11, 2010, 01:20 PM
<rolls eyes and walks away>

excellent idea:lol::lol:

bort84
Oct. 11, 2010, 04:15 PM
<rolls eyes and walks away>

Eh, I thought my post was pretty objective (as someone who enjoyed Fuego's performance very much), but it's okay. I did an eye roll when I read your first post too = )

My thought bubble was mostly: *eye roll* I can't believe she got Fuego talk in another thread! Sneaky genius for the cause? Perhaps...

Megaladon
Oct. 11, 2010, 05:08 PM
Okay, forgive me for sounding...dumb, but how is Totilas pronounced?

I thought I heard a commentator say "Totillas" like tortilla and this whole time I was thinking it was TotiLas (hard L)?

Anyway, he is quite a stunner and shows beautiful tests.

Coreene
Oct. 11, 2010, 05:43 PM
Okay, forgive me for sounding...dumb, but how is Totilas pronounced?

I thought I heard a commentator say "Totillas" like tortilla and this whole time I was thinking it was TotiLas (hard L)?

Anyway, he is quite a stunner and shows beautiful tests. You can listen to Gal saying it himself here: http://www.horse2rider.eu/Webnodes/en/Web/CMS/Nyheder/Interview+med+Edward+Gal

MelantheLLC
Oct. 11, 2010, 05:48 PM
The announcer pronounced it TOTE-ilas. Which personally I don't like, I call him Toe-TIL-as, sounds more like Attila or something. :lol:

As to Fuego and Toto, at the freestyle there wasn't any question which one stole the show for the audience. None. There was a noticeably subdued reaction to Toto, possibly because expectations had gotten so high that it would have taken a flying unicorn to meet them. (Reminds me of Close Encounters of the Third Kind...) Did this bother the dutch? Who knows, who cares? They had several bad breaks with their team earlier, maybe that was on their minds.

And I think Fuego will definitely be remembered as a very special horse--simply for making it into that company at this time--but equally his rider for showing so spectacularly that dressage is a performance art that can convey la Vida! with such heart and joy.

There are many many artistic performances, in ballet, opera, theatre, etc, that may not be absolutely perfect in execution, but which are so compelling that they set a standard of their own.

Totilas has given those, and doubtless will again. On Friday, Fuego did him one better. Personally, I just think dressage is in a wonderful renaissance with these two horses, so different in style and yet encompassing everything the sport can be.

What's to argue with about that?

Phaxxton
Oct. 11, 2010, 05:57 PM
You can listen to Gal saying it himself here: http://www.horse2rider.eu/Webnodes/en/Web/CMS/Nyheder/Interview+med+Edward+Gal

Can you tell me approximately where in the interview he says it? I must keep missing it. I watched the interview twice and didn't hear him say Totilas once.

I could have sworn in a clinic video I saw, he pronounced it TOTE-ilas, not To-TIL-as. Definitely not To-TI-yas.

meupatdoes
Oct. 11, 2010, 06:01 PM
Can you tell me approximately where in the interview he says it? I must keep missing it. I watched the interview twice and didn't hear him say Totilas once.

I could have sworn in a clinic video I saw, he pronounced it TOTE-ilas, not To-TIL-as. Definitely not To-TI-yas.

Gal pronounces it TOTE -il-as.

Phaxxton
Oct. 11, 2010, 06:09 PM
Gal pronounces it TOTE -il-as.

Yes, that's how I remember him pronouncing it. I just can't find the video where I heard it. :lol:

alicen
Oct. 11, 2010, 08:01 PM
this is not a spitting contest, but none will remember Totilas' 3 gold medals and everyone will remember Fuego.

that is how people work :)
The world according to mbm.

mbm
Oct. 12, 2010, 03:15 AM
i am willing to bet 5$ that in 5 years if you mentioned 2010 WEG what you will get in return is not "Totilas won 3 medals" you will get "Fuego!"

people remember emotional events more than numbers :) and i am willing to bet this freestyle will go down in history as one of the most memorable. i ust think it is so cool that we all got to see it and experience it! something most dressage people can agree with :) no arguing ... just enjoyment of a ride well done that most agree was quite emotional .

and Bort: my comment is not that people will forget Totilas and only remember Fuego - what i was trying to say is: for WEG 2010, what will be remembered for dressage will be Fuegos Freestyle.

i guess only time will tell.

btw, i am basing my comments on how people are reacting now... here on internetlandia and IRL.

i posted a collage of Totilas/Fuego on FB and it is going all over and the comments are really amazing! i just find it so interesting that this ride had such an effect on people.

ridgeback
Oct. 12, 2010, 04:59 AM
this is not a spitting contest, but none will remember Totilas' 3 gold medals and everyone will remember Fuego.

that is how people work :)

Actually mbm this is what you said...and some of us said that is all we will remember...Totilas freestyle and sweep.

Megaladon
Oct. 12, 2010, 08:42 AM
Thanks everyone!

netg
Oct. 12, 2010, 09:17 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if in 3 years we remember this year as "Oh, wasn't that when people seemed to really start noticing Laura and Alf?" Or if Tina and her guy keep improving and win a world championship "wasn't that their first championship?"

Unfortunately for Totilas and his place in this WEG, if he keeps winning this one won't be a major milestone for him, really - he was already beating world records, and at this point he's more competing against his own scores than other horses. I think if he continues on his current path to many these WEG will be the ones "rememeber the first time we got to see Totilas in person?"

And I think a lot of people will think of this year as "remember Fuego?" I think it's going to have a lot of meaning to different people. I just don't get why that has to be belittling to any of the horses...

bort84
Oct. 12, 2010, 11:35 AM
And I think a lot of people will think of this year as "remember Fuego?" I think it's going to have a lot of meaning to different people. I just don't get why that has to be belittling to any of the horses...

I agree with your whole post. It doesn't have to be belittling = ) The way you said it is the way it will likely be for many (and isn't belittling to any horse).

"Fuego had a freestyle that brought down the house, and/or I finally got to see Totilas. And man, Totilas swept! Wow. But that Fuego, so electric. And Laura on the big chestnut, neat!" Or whatever. Lots of things to remember about this WEG dressage competition.

Some have used a slightly different tone though = )

horse2rider
Oct. 14, 2010, 03:57 AM
http://www.horse2rider.eu/Webnodes/en/Web/CMS/Nyheder/Rygterne+svirrer+igen+om+et+muligt+salg+af+Totilas