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Brooke
Apr. 29, 2010, 03:58 PM
I saw a quick mention of the Storm Cat line on another thread and have a question. I picked up a gelding whose dam is by Illinois Storm, by Storm Cat. I have heard that the Storm Cat line can be hot. (The trainer did say "keep him focused. :eek:) But what else about them for the hunter/jumper rings? He seems very smart and athletic, but also seems to want to always push the limits. Any info on them?

Alterrain
Apr. 29, 2010, 05:41 PM
so your horse is a great grandson, on the mother side? I think that may be a little far back to be looking for genetic behavioral attributes.

BUT, they can buck! Ask me how I know this. :)

farmgirl88
Apr. 29, 2010, 06:10 PM
I saw a quick mention of the Storm Cat line on another thread and have a question. I picked up a gelding whose dam is by Illinois Storm, by Storm Cat. I have heard that the Storm Cat line can be hot. (The trainer did say "keep him focused. :eek:) But what else about them for the hunter/jumper rings? He seems very smart and athletic, but also seems to want to always push the limits. Any info on them?

i have a gelding by Gulch and out of a mare by Storm Bird. He's about as chilled out as they come. he's a total ham and hes pretty much dead quiet. he can randomly be "hot" but i think that every horse has that kind of moment lol. i wouldn't be too worried about it. Race horses are always hot for the first few weeks off the track for the most part. giving them adequate time off for them to become "horses" again is really key to getting their sane brains back.

I'm sure with time off, and a different work load, a lot of the StormCat's would be pretty decent, quiet horses.

mustangsal85
Apr. 29, 2010, 06:39 PM
Look at his offspring on the track, for the most part they seem to be fairly level headed as racehorses go.

Brooke
Apr. 29, 2010, 08:17 PM
Alterrain - I really didn't want to hear that! :eek: First time I lunged him he threw in a buck that I've only ever seen one other horse equal. Not only were his heels waaaay over his head, but he fired out so hard at the top of it that a hind boot went flying.
Oh my - I hope he saves it for the lunge line....

fleur de duc
Apr. 29, 2010, 08:23 PM
Yes I agree that it is less of a concern as a great grandson, depending of course on the type his sire throws. I have seen A LOT of storm cat offspring/grand-offspring have a major attitude! Of course every horse is different, and not ALL of them are like this, but a fair share get that attitude handed down. And yes. They can CERTAINLY buck.

Timex
Apr. 29, 2010, 08:46 PM
Storm Cats have a reputation of being inconsistant, can be nice and quiet one minute, totally nuts the next. In your guy, its kind of far back to really matter, but I've ridden some with the Storm Cat closer up that have been some of the more unpleasant rides. *shrug* but I've yet to see one that wasn't really athletic. For better or for worse. Lol

fleur de duc
Apr. 29, 2010, 09:05 PM
Storm Cats have a reputation of being inconsistant, can be nice and quiet one minute, totally nuts the next. In your guy, its kind of far back to really matter, but I've ridden some with the Storm Cat closer up that have been some of the more unpleasant rides. *shrug* but I've yet to see one that wasn't really athletic. For better or for worse. Lol

agreed . I forgot to add that they tend to be superb athletes. If you think about it, to buck like that, you kind of have to be athletic :lol: . I have a storm cat grandson as well, but his sire is also known to throw the same attitude, so it is pretty potent I guess in his genes. He is textbook storm cat line. They will try their heart out for you, but don't expect it to be without some antics and attitude.

I also agree about the inconsistency. You never know what you will get from day to day with some of them. And in my experience, they dont grow out of it with age.

DMK
Apr. 29, 2010, 09:25 PM
I'll be nicer than most (and it was my original comment that sparked the thread ;) ). I think they can be a horse with a lot of "Game ON" drive and desire to be mentally and/or physically challenged. Storm Cat's prepotency is part of the reason so many of his offspring are good at their jobs and that Game ON drive is part and parcel of the deal. That's a good trait in the jumper ring, but it can work against you in the hunter ring.

That said, first, second, third or fourth generation, every horse is an individual and may not have read the memo about their antecedents, so you have to judge them all as individuals. But everyone comes to the table with their biases, and it's a fact some horses will have to go the extra mile to prove they are your type of horse. Case in point, I like some Mr. P lines, but I find a lot of his sons/grandsons trend towards a downhill build. But conformation is not exactly a hidden asset/fault like personality. If the horse is at least 3, you should be able to figure that one out for yourself. ;)

I will say that another dominant trait in the storm cat line is a lovely uphill build found in so many of his offspring standing as sires. That's a good thing, so tricky temperament notwithstanding, there's a reason to focus on the line (uh, that and the fact it's hard to avoid).

Runinonjoy
Apr. 29, 2010, 09:32 PM
This is such an interesting thread! I also rode a grandson of Storm Cat for a while, and most of these descriptions of Storm Cat offspring fit him *perfectly.* Overall he was a great guy who was levelheaded, calm, and sweet as could be. That's why I fell in love with him, BUT he was at times unpredictable , and Oh. My. Goodness. He could buck! And when he did, it came out of nowhere… he went from being totally quiet to suddenly letting loose.

fleur de duc
Apr. 29, 2010, 09:40 PM
not to hijack or anything, but this is my stormcat grandson, to give you an idea of their bucking abilities

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=587136&id=1014840029
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=309769&id=1014840029

kbbarn
Apr. 29, 2010, 09:49 PM
I have a Storm Cat grandson. Has the Storm Cat look and from what I have learned, the traits as well. Definately a Game On horse, VERY athletic, Very smart but can loose focus quickly. Yes, can buck but that is usually do to something I have done. Does not buck to be a jerk, rather upset about my ride or lack of proper communication.
I agree with the amazing, wanting to work attitude one minute, then Yahoo and silly the next. Happens to us often but I love horses like this. Who wants the same ride every day? My guy keeps me focused and constantly learning. We teach each other. I adore him! If this is what all Storm cat babies and grandbabies are like, send them all my way!

Linny
Apr. 29, 2010, 10:00 PM
Fleur de Duc, is he by Tomorrow's Cat?
In many cases when you are looking at a grandson/daughter you have to look at the rest of the pedigree as well. Tomorrow's Cat stands in NY so I've seen plenty of his babies, and most seem pretty level headed (the above pics nothwithstanding!) OTOH, I have it on good authority that the Giant's Causeway's are stubborn, thick loons who will argue at any turn.

*JumpIt*
Apr. 29, 2010, 10:28 PM
I ride a Storm Cat grandbaby and he is one of the most laid back TB's I've ever met. Very sweet and trustworthy, will do anything you ask and can truly take a joke. He is by hennessy and out of Island Splendor.

His First Show -

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=4070008&l=81419b9c78&id=510596242

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQgs6f69vkU

fleur de duc
Apr. 29, 2010, 10:49 PM
Fleur de Duc, is he by Tomorrow's Cat?
In many cases when you are looking at a grandson/daughter you have to look at the rest of the pedigree as well. Tomorrow's Cat stands in NY so I've seen plenty of his babies, and most seem pretty level headed (the above pics nothwithstanding!) OTOH, I have it on good authority that the Giant's Causeway's are stubborn, thick loons who will argue at any turn.

Yes hes by Tomorrows Cat, and his mom was on the loopy side too. But I must say, even though he is a grandson, that attitude and mentality has been passed down 100%!
He has moments of what I could swear be levelheadedness .... but then leaf will blow by or a bird with fly above and all logical thinking goes poof:lol:

Jive
Apr. 29, 2010, 10:58 PM
I have a 10 yr old Storm Cat grandson on his sire's side (sire is Sir Cat, damsire line is Two Davids) and I bought him when he was 4. Mine has never thrown a buck under saddle while I have owned him just these silly little hoppy things that don't even qualify as a buck.

He was very spooky as a youngster but the right feed program and B1 vitamins helped a lot and he has grown out of it. Now he only spooks when he's bored. He's become a very mellow horse. We usually say he thinks life is a stroll in the park. He loves doing more difficult work, asking him to do lateral work while flatting really makes him pay attention and try, and over fences he loves doing more difficult turns.

He showed Hunters for 4 years and we decided to take him in some jumper schooling classes this winter. He had a blast and will be doing his first outdoor jumper show in a little over a week.

lindsay.anne
Apr. 29, 2010, 11:39 PM
Ahhhh, gotta love those Storm Cat babies!

My horse is a grandson of Storm Cat, he sire is Forest Wildcat (RIP :( ). BOY can my horse buck ! Alterrain, I feel your pain! His handstands would be ALL 10's by a gymnast judge ;) .

I've decided (after reading this month's PH) my horse is more of a "prankster" than hot. But he needs to stay focused and likes to see what he can get away with. He's the type of horse that makes me wish that sometimes soon a form of Ritalin will be made for horses :lol: .

I also agree with Timex though, they definitely have their good days and bad days. Sometimes he's as perfect as can be, and other times he's a nightmare.


Although he may have his quirks, he is the sweetest boy on the ground.. with the personality of a lap dog. And he's very athletic too (just sometimes he should exert his athleticism in the better ways ) But he's the type of horse that I wouldn't give him up for the world.

Mali
Apr. 29, 2010, 11:53 PM
My 4yo gelding is a great-grandson of Storm Cat and he is the most laid back, level headed horse I've seen. I was told that they were actually using him as a pony horse at the track before I got him - he was barely 3. He broke from the gate the 2nd time they ever put him in it, he just didn't want to run. In the year I've owned him, I've yet to see him buck or do anything stupid. He's quiet as an old dog. I would gladly take 10 of him any day.

MHM
Apr. 30, 2010, 12:48 AM
not to hijack or anything, but this is my stormcat grandson, to give you an idea of their bucking abilities

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=587136&id=1014840029
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=309769&id=1014840029

Those are great pictures! :lol:

Does he do that with somebody on his back?? :eek:

lindsay.anne
Apr. 30, 2010, 01:08 AM
not to hijack or anything, but this is my stormcat grandson, to give you an idea of their bucking abilities

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=587136&id=1014840029
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=309769&id=1014840029

Our boys sure are related ! I have to get a picture of my guy's handstands. They look identical. Hahah

Equilibrium
Apr. 30, 2010, 01:17 AM
Well I have to say I've probably been on more Storm Cat horses and more relatives than anyone. I was at the farm in California when the very first crop of Storm Cat's came through for breaking. Yes, the ones that are breeding are more of an uphill build but quite a few are of the downhill quarter horse build.

Yes, they are quirky and oh my goodness can they buck, but they are all triers. That's the one thing you like about them is that they all tried. The one who was most tricky was Tactical Cat. Have never seen moves from a horse like that and hope never to again. Went to the track with a pony and a groom leading on the outside. If you didn't have this set up, he would throw that shoulder down and then come up as fast as you like, spin, and knock the pony rider. But if you made it to the track, he was the easiest horse in the world to gallop so at least you could ride real long.

Good luck to everyone with their Storm Cat relatives, they will try for you and keep life interesting!

Terri

Beam Me Up
Apr. 30, 2010, 01:20 AM
I have a son of Stormy Atlantic by Storm Cat, about 6 mos off the track.

Mine is pretty sane, quite brave, though he does have an opportunistic streak (he knows when you're vulnerable, for example mounting). He does buck, has reared (and spends half the day in the field up on his hind legs, it appears) but is great to gallop and trail ride and most days is quite good.

1 in every 10 or so days is just inexplicably resistant, but he does seem to be improving in his work ethic. I've had a lot of OTTBs that took some time in that area.

I guess all of the horses on this thread have 3 other grandparents.

Void
Apr. 30, 2010, 01:52 AM
We've had 2 Illinois Storms in our barn and they are both super athletic jumpers, and boy can they buck!

ParisHillEC
Apr. 30, 2010, 04:10 AM
I must be lucky! I have had my ottb for a little over a year now. He is by exploit by storm cat. While he is super athletic over fences, he is one of the quietest horses I have ever ridden. Hack winning movement, never a buck out of him, and is more of a push than pull ride. Oh, and he's still a stud!
I'd take a million more like him in a heart beat!!

DMK
Apr. 30, 2010, 10:02 AM
Yes, the ones that are breeding are more of an uphill build but quite a few are of the downhill quarter horse build.

LOL, well of course, TBs are not famed for having a true breed type like a registry that selects for (and rewards) a specific conformation as a breeding attribute (instead of performance on the track). But scroll through any stallion register and check out the ratio of uphill vs. downhill build Mr. P sons and grandsons versus Storm Cat progeny. Then take out all the Unbridled descendants of Mr. P and see how many more level/downhill breeding stock is left out there on the Mr. P side. I'll give Gana Facil's french ancestors some of the "uphill" credit, I think even though I am a FL girl at heart and In Reality rocks. ;)

And don't get me wrong, I love my Lido Palace 3 year old, and any Fapp or Forty Niner bred horse (especially Peace Rules) is very high on my list of potential hunters... but there's really no getting away from the fact that a lot of Mr. P's in the breeding shed point downward like Mr. Greeley and Point Given. :lol:

And it's nice that Storm Cat is bringing some uphill into the mix, and as someone wisely pointed out, there are 3 other lines (or more) in most of these babies. Oh yeah, and there are a lot of jumps that can be jumped without being a hunter, so even if they come with that particular grandsire's drive, that's not a bad thing. Just maybe not a hunter thing.

au_panda
Apr. 30, 2010, 11:06 AM
I'm not sure, based on my personal experience with a specific WB bloodline, how quickly temperament and physical traits get diluted in a pedigree. I have 3 foals by the same stallion and mare. There are 2 others at my trainer's, one by the same stallion as mine and one by a different stallion from the same German stallion line where the common ancestor is 3 generations back. Another barn has 1 offspring of the same stallion as mine. The common temperament and behavior traits among all these horses is mind-boggling and would appear to rule out their occurrence simply by coincidence or common environmental factors. Based on my direct experience with this particular stallion line, I could provide some consistent descriptions of temperament and behavior.

From the many stories on this thread, it seems that the Storm Cat line produces some pretty consistent traits.

baldfaceboyz
Apr. 30, 2010, 11:27 AM
I have a SC grandson out of Storm Broker who stood for awhile at Country Life farm in MD. I bought him as a "lead thru" at New Holland to keep him out of the kill pen. Turns out to be "cold backed" and actually bucked off a saddle once by bucking so hard he busted the billets !!!!! I have since learned to manage this fun feature and on the stellar advice of FHOTD that he be given a "busy job" am now dabbling in endurance riding with him. We just completed our first 25 miler and he loved it. He also foxhunts and events a bit. He is the downhill QH looking build, is the least spooky horse I own, has a "go or get out of my way " mentality, very stoic, physically sound and tough. Much as I like him now, he has convinced me never to own another TB, though our Rinka Das son may change my mind ....

findeight
Apr. 30, 2010, 11:27 AM
For whoever asked "who wants the same ride every day"? Well, if you are showing the horse over fences in the Hunters, you better be in the ballpark every time you pay $$$ to go in the ring.

That is why I gave up after 2 years on my Mr.P grandson on top, Spectacular Bid grandson on the bottom after 2 years in a solid program. How much can you spend going to shows to end up in the dirt in the Adults or watch your (very) good Pro nearly turn into a lawn dart in front of their peers in the First Years. No thanks.

And, IME over alot of years, the traits they are bred for do not disappear when they come off the track. Oh, they may seem to. But when they are pushed a little, as you must at some points in training? They want to fight, or do it and then get even later, usually in dramatic fashion.

But you can't just point to an ancestor and say yea or nay and that is more true each generation back.

No accident you do find common ancestors in successful TB Hunters and alot of the Jumpers. In all honesty, SC is not one of them. Yet. As he works into the gene pool over a few more generations, who knows.

two sticks
Apr. 30, 2010, 01:29 PM
The one who was most tricky was Tactical Cat. Have never seen moves from a horse like that and hope never to again. Went to the track with a pony and a groom leading on the outside.
Terri

I had an OTTB mare by Tactical Cat. Most. Difficult. Horse. EVER! Had a heck of a spin 'n bolt move. Scared? Spin 'N Bolt. Don't wanna work? Spin n' bolt? Another horse in the arena? Spin 'n bolt. She also pulled this lovely move on the ground, spinning her shoulder into you and heading for the hills, even with stud chain, or a bridle, made no difference. Didn't lead, tie, or crossties. Couldn't hose her off... Couldn't shoe her without tranqs....

fleur de duc
Apr. 30, 2010, 04:45 PM
Those are great pictures! :lol:

Does he do that with somebody on his back?? :eek:

Unfortunately, yes. He has no problem getting his hind end up that high with little ole 110lb me on top:no: He has yet to get me off, but man, I have trouble sometimes. It is the twist that really gets me! The bucks I can sit, its when he throws his whole back end sideways in mid air, that is what gets me.

MHM
Apr. 30, 2010, 05:55 PM
Unfortunately, yes. He has no problem getting his hind end up that high with little ole 110lb me on top:no: He has yet to get me off, but man, I have trouble sometimes. It is the twist that really gets me! The bucks I can sit, its when he throws his whole back end sideways in mid air, that is what gets me.

If only horses would use their athletic powers for good instead of evil. :lol:

Void
Apr. 30, 2010, 06:15 PM
If only horses would use their athletic powers for good instead of evil. :lol:


I'm using that for my signature line :P

luckyduck
Apr. 30, 2010, 08:31 PM
I have a Storm Bird (sire of Storm Cat) Daughter....she is a bit flighty but has put nice quiet babies on the ground. (I wouldnt have used her as a show horse...not her line of work) I have had several Storm Cat grand children....and though they are sensitive, I found that once they trust you, they will do anything for you. ALL of mine have been dead heads and VERY nice hunters.

My one Storm Cat son...was very athletic and talented. He was not the BEST mover on the flat, but beautiful over fences.

I actually seek out this line for my hunters.

Coastal Storm, Three Wonders, Gulf Storm, and Stormy Atlantic....have all given me GREAT hunter show horses.

spaceagevalkyrie
Apr. 30, 2010, 08:58 PM
Yes, they are quirky and oh my goodness can they buck, but they are all triers. That's the one thing you like about them is that they all tried. The one who was most tricky was Tactical Cat. Have never seen moves from a horse like that and hope never to again. Went to the track with a pony and a groom leading on the outside. If you didn't have this set up, he would throw that shoulder down and then come up as fast as you like, spin, and knock the pony rider.

We have a tactical cat baby at the farm, getting ready for the track. Sounds just like her daddy :lol:.

MHM
Apr. 30, 2010, 11:08 PM
I'm using that for my signature line :P

Enjoy! :cool:

Equilibrium
May. 1, 2010, 12:54 AM
I had an OTTB mare by Tactical Cat. Most. Difficult. Horse. EVER! Had a heck of a spin 'n bolt move. Scared? Spin 'N Bolt. Don't wanna work? Spin n' bolt? Another horse in the arena? Spin 'n bolt. She also pulled this lovely move on the ground, spinning her shoulder into you and heading for the hills, even with stud chain, or a bridle, made no difference. Didn't lead, tie, or crossties. Couldn't hose her off... Couldn't shoe her without tranqs....

Oh my, he passed on his signature move to his children! I remember a few years ago there was a broodmare on offer by TC out of a good female family and my husband wanted to know if we should take a chance on her. No I don't think so! But it gets better as I use to ride his mother at the farm when I was first learing to gallop. She was a right wackadoo by Caro so the apple doesn't fall far from the tree!

Terri

Vesper Sparrow
May. 1, 2010, 09:42 AM
Have a great grandson (via Buddha). He's full of contradictions. Very athletic, but laid back and on the lazy side (he completely bombed out at the track and at polo). Almost no spook at all. Smart, learns quickly, eager to please and he's also one of those who will put on his 'game face' when he's at a show. Great on the ground for the most part--a real people horse--but can be a real pill with other horses (definely alpha). He's doing dressage and eventing but I think he could do hunters easily--he has the long stride and pretty jump.

He has a big buck but so far (knock on wood) he's only tried it out on my trainer.

Going Bananas
May. 2, 2010, 09:48 PM
Get him off of hot feed. DO NOT FEED ULTIUM! It'll turn him into a monster. use quiessence from smart-pak. when it comes to hunters and jumpers the bloodline of an ex-racehorse is the most insignificant thing to worry about. the jockey club papers aren't worth the paper they're printed on. Good Luck:)

Gry2Yng
May. 2, 2010, 10:02 PM
Get him off of hot feed. DO NOT FEED ULTIUM! It'll turn him into a monster. use quiessence from smart-pak. when it comes to hunters and jumpers the bloodline of an ex-racehorse is the most insignificant thing to worry about. the jockey club papers aren't worth the paper they're printed on. Good Luck:)

For real!?!?!

Jleegriffith
May. 3, 2010, 08:44 AM
I have had a few come through with the CANTER program.
We had Total Wildcat by Forest Wildcat and he was the quietest thing around and is actually now a western horse easily mistaken for a QH.

General Forrest by Forestry was initially a challenge simply because he was scared of the jumps but lord when he jumped nobody could beat him. Knees to his chin with a huge bascule.

Yellow Tavern by Exploit was a former steeplechase horse and a true upper level event prospect. No fence backed him off and he could seriously jump. Very athletic but not mean. Now eventing novice but I think he could go as far as they wanted to go. I know of another exploit horse who transitoned from track to riding horse with ease and they say he is an incredible jumper.

I like the Storm Cat bloodlines but the first two horses were somewhat downhill. Exploit seems to throw the more uphill bigger moving version.

hunterrider33
May. 5, 2010, 10:04 PM
I ride a mare that is out of Storm Day and she is the quietest, fanciest, best minded horse! She moves amazing, jumps great, she has a bit of a slight build, but is truly a great mare! She has the best attitude and is up for anything! Shes NEVER spooky, and is a bit on the lazy side. Shes also extremely sweet!

Slewdledo
May. 5, 2010, 10:19 PM
We are getting rave reviews on the 3YO greenbroke Delineator filly we just sent to California. (A big :eek: from everyone who raised her.) She has no spook in her :confused: stops, starts and steers from the martingale, and generally just ROCKS.

Color us confused, but SO pleased. :lol:

Samantha37
May. 6, 2010, 09:00 AM
I own a Storm Cat grandson- his sire is Stormin Fever. He is pretty laid back-very sweet and personable and anybody can handle him on the ground. He doesn't buck ever, so no comment on those abilities..

He is built like a brick sh*t house- uphill, big bodied, great angles. He is a fancy mover with a massive jump.

From his last event, at Novice:
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r222/ssilver3722/Vereaux/Horse%20Trials/Redlands/IMG_6264.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r222/ssilver3722/Vereaux/Horse%20Trials/Redlands/IMG_6263.jpg

That is Ishi riding him- he is at her place being trained/shown and eventually sold.