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View Full Version : Anyone else walk the Redland course?



asterix
Apr. 16, 2010, 06:58 PM
SO not in love with the trakhener after the water. I don't think that's a horse friendly question AT ALL and am really debating whether to run XC...
would welcome other inputs, as well as what track you are planning on taking if you are running Training....
:(

SparklePlenty
Apr. 16, 2010, 07:33 PM
yikes... i'm running novice. Did you look at that course at all by chance? :) And how was the footing around the water?

good luck with whatever you decide, go with your gut.

:yes:

Highflyer
Apr. 16, 2010, 07:57 PM
I went back and forth a lot and decided to do the Legacy starter instead. Sounds like a good thing. Can you raise your concern with the TD? Or the rider rep, if there is one? (I know a lot of the ULRs are at Fair Hill instead) But unless it's super early on the course, I'd still run, anyway, and if you don't feel comfortable doing it, skip it. At least that way you'll get to do some of the course, even if you do get a TE instead of a W.

asterix
Apr. 16, 2010, 08:16 PM
sparkle, I don't know how to tell you this, but it's on the novice course too...
footing at the water is great right now -- best footing on the course actually. HOping for some rain as the top part is hard, believe it or not.

I WILL talk to the TD about it in the AM.

Yes, I will probably run at least through the water. Unfortunately the trak is sort of in the fence line to get home. I think that if others are jumping it without issue I will too -- he doesn't have a trak problem...

but it is not very nice -- at the TOP of a steep hill, freshly dug.
:eek:

mythical84
Apr. 16, 2010, 08:41 PM
Alrighty, let me preface this by saying that I haven't walked the course. But I'm pretty familiar with Redland. So here's my opinion dear asterix. ;)

First, I doubt they put something on the course to be mean to competitors or try to create stops. That's just not what course designers are trying to do. Without seeing the jumps in person, here's what I would be thinking ...

Ok, the horses come through the water where the riders are going to be riding strongly. Then they're going to have to power up this hill. Where their power is going to carry them right over the trakhener.

Let's remember that your baby horse does NOT have a ditch issue. Smile and KICK.

mythical84
Apr. 16, 2010, 08:51 PM
Asterix: Please don't think I'm trying to downplay your concerns. By all means talk to the TD about it. Your post just got me thinking about me walking the training course (my first) at Seneca a few years ago.

I'm meandering along fences 1 - 3. Then BAM! hugest table that I've ever seen. Right hand turn down to a big 'ol half coffin. Continue on and come to a HUGE steeplechase jump. Left hand turn to the water. And it continued on like this. So after I collect myself, I stand there thinking about it. Wondering why the course designer put these huge fly-type fences before the hard questions. Well, duh! He wanted to get us riding forward and aggressively before being faced with the ditches, waters, etc. Genius after I realized what he was doing.

asterix
Apr. 16, 2010, 08:57 PM
mythical, if I ride it, and it rides well, I'll be the first to say so. But I've walked a zillion training courses, and this does not scream "clever course design" to me.
As you know, I love the TD dearly, and have nothing but positive feelings about the course designer...
but let's just say that everything I know about trakheners suggests they ride best when you can ride forward to them.
It's very hard to do that when it is either at the top of a steep hill or off a bending line up a hill, depending on how you ride it.

And if it's a good question for Training, trust me, it's a toughie for novice....

but if it goes well I'll be happy to eat crow on here tomorrow. The baby horse does NOT have a ditch problem and it IS pointing towards home, so hopefully it'll be fine.

If I pay attention to the PA I should know before I go out -- either it is causing problems or it is not.

tarheelmd07
Apr. 16, 2010, 09:00 PM
I just got home from walking the Training course...and I'm with asterix in not being such a fan of the trakhaner or it's location...and neither me nor my horse have a trakhaner issue...

it's an awkward place on the course for any fence...so why put a fence that would be a looky fence (it's new, it's airy, etc) in that spot...

for anyone interested, here's the fence in question - it's coming back up the hill from the frog pond towards the bank
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=45600907&l=8a3566c62c&id=2707231

also, did anyone look at stadium? It had all fallen over when i got there (as had the port-a-potties by XC...thanks to the wind...) but I'm not-so-excited about the downhill triple...

asterix
Apr. 16, 2010, 09:07 PM
thanks for the pic, tarheel! What you have to envision is that this is at the top of a VERY steep hill --- THAT'S the problem with it.

When I was there stadium was intact -- and the triple is quite downhill. However, triples do tend to back horses off because they are so visually busy when they come around the corner and get an eyeball on the whole line....so use that to your advantage....the "oh, wow, that's a lot of poles" moment is your moment to balance and sort of coffin canter to it......

Of course, if you have a super keen horse this will not work so well, but my guys definitely need to process when the line is that busy...

tarheelmd07
Apr. 16, 2010, 09:11 PM
When I was there stadium was intact -- and the triple is quite downhill. However, triples do tend to back horses off because they are so visually busy when they come around the corner and get an eyeball on the whole line....so use that to your advantage....the "oh, wow, that's a lot of poles" moment is your moment to balance and sort of coffin canter to it......

Of course, if you have a super keen horse this will not work so well, but my guys definitely need to process when the line is that busy...

super-keen does not even begin to describe the enthusiasm the horse I'm bringing is capable of demonstrating :lol: there aren't enough poles in that triple to make him bat an eye...so there will be a lot of half-halting going on before we get there!

asterix
Apr. 16, 2010, 09:32 PM
oh, well, good luck then!!! :lol::lol::lol:
I can pretty much COUNT on the big boys to go ....beat...wow, man...that's more poles than I have hooves....beat...

Sounds like we are getting some rain, which will be good for SJ and the top of XC.....

Tazzie
Apr. 17, 2010, 04:43 AM
Good luck to everybody competing today. I'll be there almost all day long as groom/photographer. First ride around 8, last ride almost 3, and you can see that I'm up now at 4:45am. :)

I'll keep an eye out for my COTH friends and take photos and cheer you on!

(Sorry, no opinions about Traks as I'm a weenie BN person myself.)

SparklePlenty
Apr. 17, 2010, 07:44 AM
well i'm hoping to make the move to training this fall - so this should be a good test for us anyway.. but i THINK i know the big hill especially if it's coming from the pond. Hopefully you guys will post how it rode today so that i'm ready for it tomorrow...

Yikes.. this should be fun!

Dr. Doolittle
Apr. 17, 2010, 10:07 AM
Please, everyone let us know how it went! (You certainly could NOT have more perfect weather for it :))

I will be especially interested in hearing how that Trak rode for asterix. (Was it latish on the course, at least?)

Good luck to all, and we await your reports...

pharmgirl
Apr. 17, 2010, 10:22 AM
Am I reading that pic correctly in that it is also on the BN course?! :eek: If so, I think I am very glad that my guy had to scratch...(this would have been his first recognized HT)

yellowbritches
Apr. 17, 2010, 10:51 AM
The boss is talking to me now, he was walking the novice, and he said that the water/trak thing is NO BIG DEAL. He watched half a dozen horses go through it and it rode great, and he never heard a stop there the whole time he was walking. His point, which I agree with, is that with the trak being on an uphill, you can't mess it up! I also feel like I'd much rather run up to a trak on an uphill approach on a green horse rather than on a downhill, where baby horse can spend the whole approach staring down into the ditch!

pharmgirl, I have a feeling the fence is built to remove the log, thus making it an open ditch for BN. Could be wrong.

SparklePlenty
Apr. 17, 2010, 11:09 AM
Thanks YB!! :)

yellowbritches
Apr. 17, 2010, 11:15 AM
He says its a nice course. He said the training was "soft" but I couldn't tell what he thought of the novice, other than it was "nice." He says sj isn't as flowing as usual, but should ride fine.

asterix
Apr. 17, 2010, 03:23 PM
Well, I'm here to eat crow. Yb's boss is right, it rides totally fine. I don't think anyone had a problem with it all day. My pony just powered up the hill and jumped it out of stride. I suspect most horses did the same.
I talked to the td in the am and she predicted it would ride just like that. They think it'll be fine for novice too.
It will just be a ditch for bn.

Course was a nice early season t. Hardest question were turning benches at 5. Those rode awkwardly for me (pony not a fan of waving potted trees used to make them skinnies for t). I talked to the jump judge and she said she'd had several runouts to the right and many awkward trips. This is on the novice course numbered separately and I would be very careful here if I were running novice.

Sj doesn't have a great flow but is ok.

I was pleased with the munchkin. No phase was perfect and we both felt a bit rusty but he finished on his dressage score at his second t so I'm pleased!

OneMoreForTheRoad
Apr. 17, 2010, 05:01 PM
I rode only the beginning of the course with my guy and I thought it rode well, I was also worried about the Trak but like asterix said it rode perfectly fine.
We retired at the drop bank because my horse seemed to think I'd lost my mind when I decided to ask him to do that but this was also his first training.

SparklePlenty
Apr. 18, 2010, 08:01 PM
Soooo... what did everyone think of the Novice course today??

Maybe i'm just a big chicken, but i felt like the question into the water was a pretty BIG test for an early season novice run. I mean it was the exact same question (A&B) of the Training course.

I'd like to hear what everyone else thought! :)

Meredith Clark
Apr. 18, 2010, 08:12 PM
I'd like to hear what everyone else thought! :)

I think you should come to Fair Hill on tuesday and school drops into water with me! :yes:

kcrubin
Apr. 18, 2010, 09:53 PM
Maybe i'm just a big chicken, but i felt like the question into the water was a pretty BIG test for an early season novice run. I mean it was the exact same question (A&B) of the Training course.

I'd like to hear what everyone else thought! :)[/QUOTE]


I had one friend have a stop there and another got eliminated there today so I would say we are not fans - oh and these folks have schooled and were prepared. I didn't see it myself.

asterix
Apr. 18, 2010, 10:27 PM
Technically, the water was not the same as Training -- we had a C element, the log out of the water as well. However, I agree with you; A/B was fairly stiff for an early season novice water. Generally folks don't have trouble jumping a simple log OUT of the water -- I might have removed the A element for Novice and left B (ramp into water) and C (log out) instead.

How did the benches ride for novice folks?

Elliot
Apr. 18, 2010, 11:05 PM
I rode the novice today, and....I'm hesitant to criticize a Pony Club event, because I know this is a fundraiser, and PC is near and dear to my heart.

However, I thought the novice cross-country was all over the map. It was small, but I thought the water was really a training question—it was a big log in, and although there was land on the other side before the water, the horses didn't know that until they were on top of it.

There were a ton of problems on course today all over the place. I think many had trouble at the half coffin—I suspect horses just didn't know the ditch was there. My guy got around fine, but his eyes were bugging out over a lot of the fences.

It just wasn't the confidence-inspiring run I'd hoped to have before moving up to training. I think half of it was my green horse being a baby in his first outing of the season, and the other half was a course that didn't encourage horses to gallop and jump.

However, I thought the event was well run, the officials were friendly, and the volunteers were great, so there was a lot to like too!

SparklePlenty
Apr. 19, 2010, 08:10 AM
Whew! i'm glad that everyone had the same thoughts/feelings that i did....

Asterix - i agree 100% i would have totally preferring to Ramp in and then jump out. Maybe next year they will revisit that question for Novice. the benches rode fine for me - real forward - but there was a similar question like that at Waredaca in the fall .

Elliot - this too was supposed to be a confidence builder for us as we headed to MCTA. Now i have to find a Xcountry schooling before hand , now if anything my confidence is busted to pieces.

Oh well - at least my dressage rocked. LOL

Catalina
Apr. 19, 2010, 10:24 AM
I thought it was a pretty tough Novice course for so early in the year. My guy is a XC machine who never looks at anything and I had to ride hard to the benches and the coffin. I am in the same boat as some others now in that we are moving up at DR, but I am going to need to take him schooling at Morven before.

Ishi
Apr. 19, 2010, 12:01 PM
Redlands was the first event I rode on this horse (he belongs to a client), I thought it all went really well and I was beyond thrilled with this young horse. Stadium I thought was very good, I didn't see a problem with the flow of the course, I liked it.

XC I thought the 5 and 6 combo for Novice was tough this early on, although it was numbered seperately, I think it would have been hard to jump 5 without presenting 6. It rode in a slow 4 but had a wicked bend to it, plus heading toward stadium and the trailers, it begged to have a run out to the right. I just had to ride harder to 6 then I would have liked on a young horse, but it wasn't a shocker, I knew that walking it.

The only minor issue with the water I had was that I was on a young very brave horse who did what a good event baby should do, he looked the question over, got it, and went. I had to pull him off of the Training C but was pleased he sized it up correctly~if we'd been going Training, not his fault he can't tell the difference between white and black numbers LOL. He jumped it great, the baby trakener rode perfectly, although when I walked the course in the AM, it was still just a ditch.

This horse has a fantastic jump, he's so much fun! His owner took these pictures of us yesterday:
Dressage:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v44/FlyACK/Verreaux/IMG_6228.jpg

Stadium~good thing I don't look down, I'd be jumped right off of him!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v44/FlyACK/Verreaux/IMG_6263.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v44/FlyACK/Verreaux/IMG_6264.jpg

the last fence on XC:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v44/FlyACK/Verreaux/IMG_6271.jpg

This was my first time at Redlands, I thought it was well run and everyone was super friendly! We had a super tough division, we finished on our dressage score of 33.9 which put us in 7th place. All in all a great way to spend a Sunday.

It was good seeing you Catalina, good luck next weekend!

Dr. Doolittle
Apr. 19, 2010, 08:44 PM
Redlands was the first event I rode on this horse (he belongs to a client), I thought it all went really well and I was beyond thrilled with this young horse. Stadium I thought was very good, I didn't see a problem with the flow of the course, I liked it.

XC I thought the 5 and 6 combo for Novice was tough this early on, although it was numbered seperately, I think it would have been hard to jump 5 without presenting 6. It rode in a slow 4 but had a wicked bend to it, plus heading toward stadium and the trailers, it begged to have a run out to the right. I just had to ride harder to 6 then I would have liked on a young horse, but it wasn't a shocker, I knew that walking it.

The only minor issue with the water I had was that I was on a young very brave horse who did what a good event baby should do, he looked the question over, got it, and went. I had to pull him off of the Training C but was pleased he sized it up correctly~if we'd been going Training, not his fault he can't tell the difference between white and black numbers LOL. He jumped it great, the baby trakener rode perfectly, although when I walked the course in the AM, it was still just a ditch.

This horse has a fantastic jump, he's so much fun! His owner took these pictures of us yesterday:
Dressage:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v44/FlyACK/Verreaux/IMG_6228.jpg

Stadium~good thing I don't look down, I'd be jumped right off of him!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v44/FlyACK/Verreaux/IMG_6263.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v44/FlyACK/Verreaux/IMG_6264.jpg

the last fence on XC:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v44/FlyACK/Verreaux/IMG_6271.jpg

This was my first time at Redlands, I thought it was well run and everyone was super friendly! We had a super tough division, we finished on our dressage score of 33.9 which put us in 7th place. All in all a great way to spend a Sunday.

It was good seeing you Catalina, good luck next weekend!

Ishi, you ROCK woman! :D And saw these pix on Facebook; this is a very talented and cool horse, good of his owner to take these pix (and thanks for posting them. :)) Catalina (and the rest of the folks who did the Novice course), this is a bit concerning to hear (re: the N course), but in past years (at least when I was there, walking it with students and coaching), Redlands has had some puzzlingly harder? questions interspersed with some easier ones; same for T! With luck, it wasn't enough of a confidence buster to have any long term negative effects on anyone's future performances--especially (in Catalina's case) at DRHT. You will be fine doing T there, and clearly--both you and your horse are well prepared ;)

And asterix, good on the "smaller of the Big Boys" for tackling that Trak with aplomb! ;) Not that I (for one) ever had any doubt...:winkgrin: