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View Full Version : Carl Hester dominates Spanish Sunshine Tour



gladys
Mar. 16, 2010, 09:09 AM
I just read that Carl Hester is dominating the Spanish Sunshine Tour with Uthopia.

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/article.php?aid=295893

He is a rider I would love to watch and learn from. Has anyone ever had a clinicwith him?

caddym
Mar. 16, 2010, 10:25 AM
Have you seen his "Fantastic Elastic Masterclass" its GREAT you can find it on horse and country or theo's site

I agree, I would love to ride with him.

FabulousPixie
Mar. 16, 2010, 12:18 PM
Yep his masterclasses are great. There are two here:

http://horseandcountry.tv/episode/carl-hesters-fantastic-elastic-masterclass-crofton-manor-episode-1

http://horseandcountry.tv/episode/carl-hester-your-horse-live-episode-1

5WhiteSocks
Mar. 16, 2010, 07:48 PM
Video of Carl's GP ride of this weekend at the Sunshine Tour :

http://www.topdressage.tv/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=814

Sabine
Mar. 17, 2010, 12:46 AM
I have organized 2 clinics with him in SoCal. He was amazing. The spirit of his training technique is now more accepted and has become what many consider the 'best practice' method- but at the time (2-3 years ago) it was bleeding edge.

All that were there loved him, his style, his amazing communication skill and his empathy for the horse, whilst asking for reasonable improvement. As many on this board know- I am a huge fan of his and still often review my videos and the 'core' of what he taught- it is the foundation of any dressage horse's training, IMO.

I can only give him a huge 'thumbs up' and I can tell you that he is definitely very hard to get- for a clinic...;)

pluvinel
Mar. 17, 2010, 09:19 AM
I have organized 2 clinics with him in SoCal. He was amazing. The spirit of his training technique is now more accepted and has become what many consider the 'best practice' method- but at the time (2-3 years ago) it was bleeding edge.
........
Can you 'splain why it was not accepted???.....what was controversial???..what were the objections????

His style is lovely....very similar to how I was trained 40 years ago... why was it considered "bleeding edge"......????

Sabine
Mar. 17, 2010, 10:31 AM
Can you 'splain why it was not accepted???.....what was controversial???..what were the objections????

His style is lovely....very similar to how I was trained 40 years ago... why was it considered "bleeding edge"......????

He rides deep/low etc..

pluvinel
Mar. 17, 2010, 10:40 AM
Actually, the low/deep piece is a very small part of what I took away. My main take-away was that he starts with the basic abilities of the horse, what the horse naturally likes to do and builds from that.

Example, the flying changes....if the horse gives a change, he rewards that even when not asked for....he just commented the rider needed to be more careful.

The comment about collecting the trot as the beginnings of passage....he takes what the horse offers, doesn't dwell on it, rewards and moves on....but uses the horse's natural talent to build on it for the future.

I have had I-judges who has specifically (emphatically) said NO to encouraging what the horse offers accidentally (eg., piaffe, passage, flying changes....). That was the last time I took lessons with that person. My philosophy is to reward what the horse offers, even if premature, tell him he is a genius, then don't stress and just move on to what one wants.

So, I was wondering if that's what people objected to....the long, low, etc seems like a minor part of his approach.

claire
Mar. 17, 2010, 10:47 AM
He rides deep/low etc..

Deep/Low ala CH is controversial and cutting edge? :confused:
Is S.Peters controversial too?

I thought most BNR's do use Deep Low riding technique?

Deep/Low isn't exactly cutting edge, hasn't the technique been around for awhile?

edit to add: pluvinel this was also my take away from CH!

The comment about collecting the trot as the beginnings of passage....he takes what the horse offers, doesn't dwell on it, rewards and moves on....but uses the horse's natural talent to build on it for the future.

DownYonder
Mar. 17, 2010, 11:12 AM
I have organized 2 clinics with him in SoCal. He was amazing. The spirit of his training technique is now more accepted and has become what many consider the 'best practice' method- but at the time (2-3 years ago) it was bleeding edge.

Do you mean LEADING edge?

I really like what I have seen and heard about Hester, but I don't want anything or anyone considered BLEEDING EDGE around my horses! :winkgrin:

claire
Mar. 17, 2010, 11:18 AM
Bleeding Edge? Leading Edge? Cutting Edge?
Sorry, I was thinking Sabine meant "Cutting Edge"?

I agree, Bleeding Edge would be quite controversial!
I didn't know there was bleeding involved in C.Hester's version of deep/low! :lol:

Sabine
Mar. 17, 2010, 05:04 PM
Deep/Low ala CH is controversial and cutting edge? :confused:
Is S.Peters controversial too?

I thought most BNR's do use Deep Low riding technique?

Deep/Low isn't exactly cutting edge, hasn't the technique been around for awhile?

edit to add: pluvinel this was also my take away from CH!

3 years ago people felt differently...sadly .
bleeding edge is a term we use in technology- sorry to have confused- of course I meant cutting edge...

egontoast
Mar. 17, 2010, 05:26 PM
3 years ago people felt differently...sadly

Yes, it is true that even a few years ago the internet discussion board experts (especially at the UDDB) were insisting the nose must ALWAYS be in front of the vertical whether schooling, warming up or in competition and training deep, even mildly deep, was pretty much 'evil'. There were many threads about BTV. It was the biggest crime you could commit and there were many people that needed to go to jail.:lol:.

Nevermind if your horse was through or in balance or supple or on the bit, etc etc. The important thing which determined if the work was any good at all was the angle of the nose in relation to a line drawn at right angles to the ground. :)

Sabine
Mar. 17, 2010, 05:57 PM
Actually, the low/deep piece is a very small part of what I took away. My main take-away was that he starts with the basic abilities of the horse, what the horse naturally likes to do and builds from that.

Example, the flying changes....if the horse gives a change, he rewards that even when not asked for....he just commented the rider needed to be more careful.

The comment about collecting the trot as the beginnings of passage....he takes what the horse offers, doesn't dwell on it, rewards and moves on....but uses the horse's natural talent to build on it for the future.

I have had I-judges who has specifically (emphatically) said NO to encouraging what the horse offers accidentally (eg., piaffe, passage, flying changes....). That was the last time I took lessons with that person. My philosophy is to reward what the horse offers, even if premature, tell him he is a genius, then don't stress and just move on to what one wants.

So, I was wondering if that's what people objected to....the long, low, etc seems like a minor part of his approach.

I don't think folks actively objected- they were sceptical to two things.

1. riding deeper and for longer periods- not a deep and down and forward stretch but a deeper arch from the withers in a soft connection.
2. the horses all had to be super forward, like from a touch moving forward, and that was very scary and foreign to a lot of them. Nowadays it's generally more accepted although most amateurs find it somewhat scary....

claire
Mar. 17, 2010, 06:47 PM
Yes, it is true that even a few years ago the internet discussion board experts (especially at the UDDB) were insisting the nose must ALWAYS be in front of the vertical whether schooling, warming up or in competition and training deep, even mildly deep, was pretty much 'evil'. There were many threads about BTV. It was the biggest crime you could commit and there were many people that needed to go to jail.:lol:.

Nevermind if your horse was through or in balance or supple or on the bit, etc etc. The important thing which determined if the work was any good at all was the angle of the nose in relation to a line drawn at right angles to the ground. :)


Most of my trainers do use some Low/Deep (like S.Peters and
C. Hester))
I just figured it was not a very controversial tool.

(I'm not talking about the chin to the chest, spurring up and flexing version of deep, ie. RK/HF/LDR?)

I was always told that the thing with deep was, that, unless you were a more experieced rider you risked losing the rear end and ended up tooling about on the FH.
Thinking you were doing OK because the front was in a frame and the horse felt light.
All the while, the rear end was in Kansas! :lol:

pluvinel
Mar. 17, 2010, 09:31 PM
I don't think folks actively objected- they were sceptical to two things.

......
2. the horses all had to be super forward, like from a touch moving forward, and that was very scary and foreign to a lot of them. Nowadays it's generally more accepted although most amateurs find it somewhat scary....
That's been my philosophy.....also, CH's statement that if they won't go when asked, they're behind the leg and if they won't whoa or reduce speed when asked, they're not on the bit.

These things are paramount in my book. Stop. Go. Turn.

I formally qualify as an AA.....ammy or not, if you want to ride well, one better learn to...er.....ride. The reason CH's approach is "foreign" to a lot of AA's, or that they're scared, is that a lot of trainers dumb down the lessons. I really liked CH's approach especially to the young horses.

Bruce Davidson once said about AA's and AA dressage divisions....something along the fact of "why aspire to be the best of the worst"....

Don't hold me to that quote, but that's how I remember it in my aging brain. It stuck with me. There is a saying that if you want to improve your tennis game, you need to play with better players.....well, if I aspire to ride well, my benchmarks are not other AA's. The people to emulate are the best riders that I respect....those are my role models. This is the first time I've seen CH....from that brief video, he might make it to my book.

Don Raphaelo Rollkurista
Mar. 17, 2010, 11:01 PM
Bravo!!!!