Pony breeder, sorry me again with ?'s feeding and signs

[SSFLandon]

With the Welsh X TB cross's how do you feed? My prego large pony (due about 5/10) looks great. Should I worry about her being to heavy, ie. founder, etc...she is fed a bit of Safechoice, senior and rice bran/empower mix all equal parts (at total of a 2qt scoop 2x per day) and free hay/salt block while inside. This is the same amount she ate while showing. She is out on mostly dead short grass for about 7 hours and hay is put in the pasture too. I just put a grazing muzzle on her because of our fescue and will close up the whole so she will not be able to eat outside but, will spend time in and out to help her eat throughout the day. Can't find a dry lot as stated in fescue thread.

also, what signs are normal at 60 days and until closer. She is a littly puffy in front of her udder and her teats have puffiness around them now too. She is maiden and so am I, Thanks!!

[Windswept Stable]

With the Welsh X TB cross's how do you feed? My prego large pony (due about 5/10) looks great. Should I worry about her being to heavy, ie. founder, etc...she is fed a bit of Safechoice, senior and rice bran/empower mix all equal parts (at total of a 2qt scoop 2x per day) and free hay/salt block while inside. This is the same amount she ate while showing. She is out on mostly dead short grass for about 7 hours and hay is put in the pasture too. I just put a grazing muzzle on her because of our fescue and will close up the whole so she will not be able to eat outside but, will spend time in and out to help her eat throughout the day. Can't find a dry lot as stated in fescue thread.

also, what signs are normal at 60 days and until closer. She is a littly puffy in front of her udder and her teats have puffiness around them now too. She is maiden and so am I, Thanks!!

First advice is to not worry so much. Sounds like you are doing the right things. You will get as many different answers here about what to feed--as posters. Do your research. Google and make a plan with your vet.

Hopefully you will find a dry lot situation. The muzzle with the hole covered will not allow her to eat hay.
Can you hotwire--a small paddock for her to be in so she can graze a little and still have her hay?

Next, I do not feed such a mixture to my ponies. If you are worried she is too fat -- nix the rice bran. Of all my pregnant mares, I seldom have one that needs rice bran.
What is empower?
Personally, I would switch to a mare/foal selection and away with all that mixing. I use Triple Crown Growth actually and top dress with Equi-Min. That being said, if I have obese mares, they stick with Triple Crown Lite. It really depends on how hard of a keeper your mare is. The mares generally do well eating the same as they ate before pregnant. Last couple months, the protein requirements do go up. I have only once after many babies had a mare come out of pregnancy looking too thin --and she was a very tough one--who had prior founders and had some insulin resistant issues. Thus, I was holding back too much and really had to struggle post foaling to equal it out with the demands of lactation. As far as being too fat, keep a vigilant eye on her--just as you would any pony. How is her neck? Is it cresty? tight with ruffles? if so-- you need to get ahold of the situation.
Last week, I discovered one of my mares--due in 30 days -- with a very cresy, tight neck ( I call it the pre-founder bump) - lord knows how-- we have had the winter from he--, she is not on grass, and gets a mere Quart per day of grain. Orchard grass with slight sprinkle of alfalfa for hay. Anyway, I switched her grain to the Triple Crown Lite -handful twice a day and top dress with EQui-Min. She's going to foal before the 30 days, so I am not worried -- and her babies always drag her down (which in this case is a good thing).

Good luck. Relax. Have fun.

[goodpony]

We switched all of our ponies to progressive ultimate which is a highly concentrated ration balancer/vitamin/mineral supplement and is super for my easy keeping Pony broodmares. I really think they look better and feel they are getting the nutrients they require for production/lactation while avoiding unnecessary weight gain. Im also not seeing the fat deposits we try so hard to avoid. With some of the other products I've used I would have to half the label ration to maintain a proper body weight and then worry they were being short changed on a balanced diet. One thing about ponies---its much easier to add a little weight than it is to get it off, especially with spring just around the corner.

[SSFLandon]

thanks for your info so far! I know ponies are different then horses. She has had times when she has needed more food and other times less. That must be the TB side of her. I'll nix the rb and Emopower (we mix the 2 and it's a fat supp from Nutrena). She was on it because her coat was dry but, she seems better now. The TC senior has more fiber/fat then the Nutrena Safechoice so that is why I mix those too. I like the SC because it's lower starch. Overall, I'll cut her back and bit by taking her off the supp because she is chubby enough but, not looking cresty at all. She has a thick neck per her build but, I do know what cresty is like and none of that thankfully. I have to keep the muzzle on which does make it impossible for her to eat while outside otherwise she will be exposed to the fescue however, I bring her in here and there during the day to graze on hay in her stall which she is fine with then she comes in about 3PM-8AM...I'll try not to worry too much!

[Summerwood]

I would agree that you should get rid of the Empower and the Rice Bran, which is I believe what Empower is mostly made of anyways. I have TB's and Welsh ponies, so I am familiar with what you are going through. I have a half-welsh colt that is a harder keeper than my welsh ponies too (he's on Purina JR). I am a firm believer that every animal is an individual and that they do not all fit into a particular feeding model. Not every product works for every animal, and I have had to do a lot of research over the years to keep weight on the wide variety of metabolisms I have had to feed. It is not unusual for me to have several different kinds of feed in my barn, but I usually don't mix different feeds (only exception would be beet pulp, which everyone gets). I think you are just making a headache for yourself mixing everything together. I used to feed SafeChoice to my mares, I took them off of it because my severely obese (long story) mare was not losing weight, she was gaining it. She is now on Triple Crown Lite and doing better on that. It is also significantly cheaper than what I was paying for SafeChoice, and the bottom line is important if you are selling foals. I add beet pulp to the feed for fiber in addition to their hay. A half-welsh (depending on her metabolism) may not do as well on the lite, in which case I would consider just keeping her on the TC Senior. It is high in fiber and has 10% fat, along with 14% protein. Senior is made to be a more complete and easily digestible feed for animals that are getting limited forage because of their age, teeth, whatever. You can add more fat in the form of corn oil if you need to, but I suspect you probably won't. Since you are limiting your mare's pasture and providing her with hay instead, you will want to make sure she has enough fiber. If I were you I would just feed her the Senior and some beet pulp if you are willing to. Good quality hay is the most important thing in their diet IMO. I find my harder keeping mare is fine in her pregnancy, it is when she is nursing the foal after about a month that she starts to lose the weight. I slowly add more alfalfa when that time comes, and up her grain/bp ration (she won't eat corn oil or fat supplements). Just keep on top of her body condition, and you will be fine. Good luck with her and be sure to post photos of that foal when it arrives!!

[SSFLandon]

thanks Summerwood...

I do have BP. I have a bunch of horses here that I feed and we have the TC senior for them along with a regular pellet. I started using it because of the high fiber however I did not want to use too much because of the high fat and also have been slowly changing the amounts and did plan to go off the RB. She has been on a senior pellet mix for awhile now and early on in her pregnancy as well. I found she was quieter to ride oddly and her weight was much better (she was eating more and not as fat as I wanted her to be showing in the green ponies) with less food while fed this way. I moved but, wanted to keep her feed the same so this is why she gets a little of both. The TC has alot of BP in it so I don't think I need to give her much more fiber right now and don't want to decrease her feed (lack of vitamins, etc) but, after her foal comes and if she needs weight I will add it in instead of uping her food along with more hay. She gets tim hay mostly and a little alf hay now.

how are you finding TC lite to be cheaper then Safe Choice? must be location. I was in MI and it's 11.99 per bag. Here in NC is 13.00 TC is always 16+ a bag wherever I've seen it. I shoud also add I have a mare allergic to molassas so the safe choice works for her and I'd like to not have to buy many more feeds!! It's not my favorite but, they like it and it works. I've had some turn down the TC lite too.

Overall it sounds like I have a good plan for her based on what i'm hearing, thanks

[Windswept Stable]

thanks Summerwood...

I do have BP. I have a bunch of horses here that I feed and we have the TC senior for them along with a regular pellet. I started using it because of the high fiber however I did not want to use too much because of the high fat and also have been slowly changing the amounts and did plan to go off the RB. She has been on a senior pellet mix for awhile now and early on in her pregnancy as well. I found she was quieter to ride oddly and her weight was much better (she was eating more and not as fat as I wanted her to be showing in the green ponies) with less food while fed this way. I moved but, wanted to keep her feed the same so this is why she gets a little of both. The TC has alot of BP in it so I don't think I need to give her much more fiber right now and don't want to decrease her feed (lack of vitamins, etc) but, after her foal comes and if she needs weight I will add it in instead of uping her food along with more hay. She gets tim hay mostly and a little alf hay now.

how are you finding TC lite to be cheaper then Safe Choice? must be location. I was in MI and it's 11.99 per bag. Here in NC is 13.00 TC is always 16+ a bag wherever I've seen it. I shoud also add I have a mare allergic to molassas so the safe choice works for her and I'd like to not have to buy many more feeds!! It's not my favorite but, they like it and it works. I've had some turn down the TC lite too.

Overall it sounds like I have a good plan for her based on what i'm hearing, thanks

I think your plan is fine. Definitely get rid of the double fat and stick with your TC Senior. I have not had any of my mares turn down TC Lite, but it does not sound like your mare is a candidate. I actually have a Welsh/TB mare that is such a porker--that's all she gets--even during winter lactation.(of course she gets hay too) Triple Crown products are $16 and some change here too.
Personally, I gave up beet pulp 2 winters ago. It was such a pain in the behind. The Triple Crown Products seemed to meet the needs of mine without all the hassle of beet pulp.

Best wishes

[Summerwood]

I may be confusing the price with a different feed but I am pretty sure I was paying $26/bag for SafeChoice and the TC Lite is about 16-17. I could be wrong on the SC price or it could be that the price came down. Actually now that I think about it I think I saw it at TSC recently for way less. I am in FL in the winter so it is hard to keep prices in each state straight. That was over a year ago that I fed it.
I find when in a routine of feeding beet pulp it is slightly more work but not much for me. It doesn't work for everyone in every situation, like if they are pasture-fed, etc. Everyone has their own way that works for them. Lots of boarding facilities won't bother with it either.
I think you have a good plan in mind. FWIW I have read in the past that RB does make a horse hotter. I have no idea if that is a fact, I have only ever fed it to one horse that I took care of of someone else's, and he had one foot in the grave. I don't think anything would have made him hot. I would be interested to hear if anyone has had that experience. As for her being quieter on the Senior, you can ask a TC dealer but I am almost positive they are pretty low in starch for ease of digestion in older horses or hard keepers. It is heavily bp-based like you said. The TC Lite I have is like chalk so I don't know how much molasses is in it. I personally wouldn't eat it :winkgrin: but the fatties who are on it eat it because they have to or they get no grain! I hear you on the not wanting to buy any more kinds of feed!

PS-Windswept, if I had to live in your climate in the winter I would not own so many horses so I understand why you don't want to bother with bp in the winter!

[SSFLandon]

I am from Mi so I know all about the weather and keeping feed from freezing!! my horses are probably so happy to be here in NC, well except my mare who has to wear a muzzle now...oh well, just 2 months and she'll be out of it! and she gets special attention now so hopefully she won't hate me too much

I've been using SC since it came out and it was always about 10-11 per bag in MI and a bit more here in NC so Idk how it was 26. the supplement they make is about that though....

I think you are right about Rice Bran making them hot. I put a few on it because there coats were dull with winter and they are spunky, gunna stop it for those that are fine now...not wearing blankets and the sun has improved their coats now...thanks again





I may be confusing the price with a different feed but I am pretty sure I was paying $26/bag for SafeChoice and the TC Lite is about 16-17. I could be wrong on the SC price or it could be that the price came down. Actually now that I think about it I think I saw it at TSC recently for way less. I am in FL in the winter so it is hard to keep prices in each state straight. That was over a year ago that I fed it.
I find when in a routine of feeding beet pulp it is slightly more work but not much for me. It doesn't work for everyone in every situation, like if they are pasture-fed, etc. Everyone has their own way that works for them. Lots of boarding facilities won't bother with it either.
I think you have a good plan in mind. FWIW I have read in the past that RB does make a horse hotter. I have no idea if that is a fact, I have only ever fed it to one horse that I took care of of someone else's, and he had one foot in the grave. I don't think anything would have made him hot. I would be interested to hear if anyone has had that experience. As for her being quieter on the Senior, you can ask a TC dealer but I am almost positive they are pretty low in starch for ease of digestion in older horses or hard keepers. It is heavily bp-based like you said. The TC Lite I have is like chalk so I don't know how much molasses is in it. I personally wouldn't eat it :winkgrin: but the fatties who are on it eat it because they have to or they get no grain! I hear you on the not wanting to buy any more kinds of feed!

PS-Windswept, if I had to live in your climate in the winter I would not own so many horses so I understand why you don't want to bother with bp in the winter!

[Windswept Stable]

Summerwood--- true story, 3 years ago --we had a bad winter and at the time was the worst winter in a while ( UNTIL THIS WINTER)...but at the time--we were having lots of ICE.
Gate latches iced, the ground in front of the gates would freeze solid at night & one would have to take a pick ax to the ground open gates. One would have to carry a lighter to open gate latches and to unfreeze wall bucket clips. The ground in front of my dutch door stalls would freeze and could not open the horse doors in the am.. Some mornings, the hay building door would be frozen shut...
and just in general-- awful conditions for keeping horses. At the time, I was feeding beet pulp at least once a day, sometimes if it was really cold--I would take them out some "hot lunch" beet pulp as well. Anyway, no hot water in my barn, so I would bring beet pulp bags in house and 2 big 5 gallon water buckets --and each feeding have 2 full 5 gallon buckets soaking with hot water beet pulp. Me-- 5 feet tall-- it was quite difficult carrying 2 buckets full or even one for that matter- down the small hill to my barn. Well-- imagine with half inch of ice on the hill to the barn. Me lugging 2 heavy full buckets of the beet pulp down to barn.. It was inevitable-- I FELL and busted my butt and buckets flew up in air and beet pulp rained down on me. At that point, I sat in the yard and cried. And that was my last bag of beet pulp!

So yes Summerwood--I totally agree with you, I own too many horses. And after this past winter from he--, I have decided that I am too old to do this and am on a mission to downsize. I can not spend another winter like this. It's just too hard.
Maybe for 3 or 4 horses, but not for 17.

[Summerwood]

Windswept--OMG I would sit in the yard and cry too, except I probably wouldn't have made it that long!! I actually didn't mean YOU have too many horses, I mean I have too many horses to live in that climate!! I would be downsizing myself, and I don't blame you for doing so. My mother-in-law has almost 40 ponies and lives in MI, so you definately aren't out of control like she is! She is crazy if you ask me!! :lol:

[SSFLandon]

YIKES! both of you are crazy to me..ha!! and i'm in the crying group too from past experiences...I hate winter and the issues that come with it..I'm 5'2 so carrying heavy anything is a pain. Good luck and I hope the weather stays mild now!


Windswept--OMG I would sit in the yard and cry too, except I probably wouldn't have made it that long!! I actually didn't mean YOU have too many horses, I mean I have too many horses to live in that climate!! I would be downsizing myself, and I don't blame you for doing so. My mother-in-law has almost 40 ponies and lives in MI, so you definately aren't out of control like she is! She is crazy if you ask me!! :lol: