fenbendazole(power pack) help?

[Shiaway]

I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm sorry for starting another thread about this. But I am just really dense apparently. *sigh* I want to give my 3 horses a double dose of fenbendazole for 5 days (i.e. panecur power pack) but I want to buy the cheaper fenbendazole instead of going with the paste. And I have a few questions

1) where do I find fenbendazole?

2) how do I calculate how much to give for a double dose?

3) My two older horses need their teeth done (they have an appointment in march) and especially my old standardbred has always been a real slob, just spewing his grain everywhere when he eats--even after the dentist *sigh*. So should I worry about the liquid getting into them? And what if they don't like the liquid and turn their noses up at the grain?

Thankfully the horse who really needs it is my lusitano and he is a PIG about his food so I'm certain he'll eat it (he'll eat straight bute out of your hand if you just put it in a handful of grain).

Thanks!

[jn4jenny]

All the answers you're looking for:
http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?t=238053

[Shiaway]

Thanks my search function isn't working.

[Tegan]

another quick question that wasn't ever answered in the other thread...

For those that have used the cattle dose, does about 1 tube for horse for the entire 5-day power pack sound about right? I have done the math and the cattle tube is cheaper than the goat liquid for 2 horses, but just want to check that I have my dosing right for grams instead of mL.

[Grataan]

It depends on which cattle dose you are going by.

A horse needs 10mg/kg or 4.6 mg/lb.

1000lb horse x 4.6 mg = 4600mg (1000lb /2.2 = 454.5kg x 10=4545mg)

So you need 4.6 grams per 1000lb horse per day.

The smaller cattle tube has 92 grams of paste at 10% (9.2 g fenbendazole)-you will need 2 and a half of these tubes per horse.

The larger cattle tube ( the one you need the dosing gun for) has 290 grams of paste at 10% (29 grams fenbendazole) one of these will do 6 treatments (or 5.8 if you round up to 5grams per dose)

I've included the math here as a guide. One should obviously have an accurate weight on their horse and sub that in for the 1000lb mythical horse I have used in order to keep the math simple in my post.

[jn4jenny]

The 10.2 oz cattle tube is 290 grams, but the dosing gun forces you to round to the nearest 5 grams. 290 grams divided by 5 = 58 grams per day, but if you consider the dosing gun, the closest/most you can get consistently is 55 grams per day.

55 grams divided by 4.6 mg per 100 lbs = 1195 pounds maximum horse size for a PowerPac from the cattle tube.

Throw in one regular Safe-Guard 25-gram tube with the cattle tube, and now you can dose up to 1369 pounds. You can be as precise with the little tubes as you need to be, so suddenly it becomes possible to dose 63 grams for a 1369-pound horse (60g from the cattle tube and 3g from the little tube).

Fenbendazole has been proven safe for horses at over 11 times the regular dose. So if you have any doubt about your horse's weight, or if you're rounding for the sake of the cattle tube, it's okay to round up.

[Grataan]

Jen's right on, I somehow omitted that part of my personal horse routine where I make up the difference in weight with liquids (I round up but I've got a few who are over 1000lbs and love jen's method for the fatties)

Good catch Jen!

[naters]

Jen - what do you mean "throw in" a regular tube of safeguard?

[JB]

naters - 1 of the cattle tubes only doses up to 1195lb of horse. If your horse weighs more, you need more stuff. It's cheaper to do that with a tube of Safeguard (at what, a couple of $$ often?) then to buy another tube of cattle paste, or even a tube of Panacur.

[Shiaway]

Thanks for everyone's help. I ordered 1000ml of cattle/goat fenbendazole from Jeffers. I think I'll mix it up with some oatmeal since my horses like that and hopefully it will be sticky enough to stay in their mouths.

This will certainly make de-worming Shiaway a lot easier. He is horrible!! He is so fast with his head de-worming him is always a chore. I can't imagine 5 days straight of it.

[naters]

gotcha.. I had envisioned trying to put the paste from the big tube into the small one... lol. it wasn't working in my head :)

[jn4jenny]

gotcha.. I had envisioned trying to put the paste from the big tube into the small one... lol. it wasn't working in my head :)

I suppose you could do that. :lol: I just buy Luer Slip syringes and dose into those. I wish my horse would eat it out of his food--every year I try that with the "spare" paste in my tube (I dose for 1195 pounds so I've got 15 extra grams to play with every year), and every year it's a fail no matter what I mix it with. This year I'm going to try and mix it with molassed beet pulp, but I'm not holding my breath. And of course, he's just big enough that buying the liquid fen isn't very cost effective. :rolleyes:

[Shiaway]

Just wanted to let you guys know--those of you who bought panacur power pack and not the liquid, aren't suckers. I just finished giving my guys the fenbendazole liquid and it was NOT fun. A paste would have been worth the money!

They wouldn't touch it even mixed up with some oatmeal and syrup. So i put it in a big syringe and gave it to them that way. Most of it dripped down the syringe. And one of my horses is HORRIBLE about being de-wormed. It took two people and tomorrow it will be worse.

[cyndi]

Mine are easier for the liquid than paste. I just use a large syringe made for oral dosing (the kind my husband uses to dose his endurance horses with electrolytes.)

easy peasy. Another friend even just puts it in their feed and they eat it.

Liquid is also cheaper.

[Equibrit]

You can make a tasty paste with confectioners sugar and oil of peppermint.

[Shiaway]

I did use an oral syringe but it's so liquidy most of it went all over my hand. And of course it's cheaper, no one said it wasn't cheaper. I'm just saying I'd rather be syringing a paste instead of a liquid. At least they'd get all of it.

Equibrit,
Those are great ideas! I will try that tomorrow.

[JB]

No, you don't want to syringe the liquid, as you've discovered ;)

There are tons of ways to make food tastey - my favorite is puree a carrot in a cup or two of water and add that to the food :)

But I totally understand there are some *really* picky eaters - don't like any change in taste OR texture - and that makes the paste worth it :)

[Shiaway]

The powered sugar was a great idea! Shiaway actually ate his out of a bucket! I think Jeff might have as well because he didn't seem unhappy when I was syringing him.

I don't think Sol will though. He's been known to not like even some treats--i don't think he was spoiled enough when he was young. He didn't even know how to eat an apple when I got him.

But still I also mixed in the probiotic and it helped to not all drip out. Sol is pretty easy to de-worm. It's shiaway that is the problem. So thanks for the great idea!

[cyndi]

We've had good luck mixing yucky stuff with either yogurt or applesauce - both can still be administered with the oral dosing syringe.

[Always Tardy]

Hi,
I am thinking about doing the power pak but my guy was just wormed with strongid, how long should I wait before doing the power pak? I was thinking about 3 weeks? TIA!

[Grataan]

Two to three weeks should be fine.

[JB]

4 weeks, actually.

[Always Tardy]

Thanks! I'll probably do 3-4 week to be safe as he is known to be reactive! And thanks for all the info about the liquid. That will help a lot!
Helen