Ace For Rehab - Dosage?

[Montanas_Girl]

So, the vet cleared Montana today to start back under saddle lightly (six months earlier than we antcipicated)! :D But.....he is not supposed to be turned out until he's been under saddle and sound for a few weeks. :no: Longing is out as well. He has been on stall rest since early October, and it is freezing here (no indoor arena, either). This could get interesting!

The vet gave me a bottle of Ace (20 mg/ml) and suggested using that to keep all four legs on the ground while we're starting back. He said the dosage "depends" on how Montana responds. Montana tends to be a lightweight (when he has had his hocks or teeth done), and I don't want to end up with him so doped up he's not safe to ride. I also, however, don't want to find out mid-ride that I didn't give him enough! I've never had to sedate him for exercise or anything like that, so I'm not sure what a good starting dose would be.... does 2 cc IM 20-30 minutes pre-ride sound reasonable, or should I start with less?

I was just wondering what others have done. The only way to find out what "his" dose is will obviously be through trial and error, but I'd like to shorten that process as much as possible!

[aks710]

I am currently in the process of bringing my TB gelding back after a stress fracture. This is what we've done:

After a month of stall rest and hand-walking, we started tack-walking for 10-30 minutes (increased the time over about 1.5 weeks), and when we did that we gave him 7/10 (0.7) CC of Ace. He was very good with this dosage.. he had a few "what's that!!??" moments but since all we did was walk, he didn't have momentum to do anything really dumb.

Soon we started trotting for several minutes per session, and kept the dosage about the same: 6/10 to 8/10 (0.6 - 0.8) of a CC, depending on the weather/wind, time of day, etc.

Once we started doing more serious trotting (10+ minutes per session), we upped the Ace to 1 - 1.25 CCs, again depending on the riding environment and trigger factors.

Since his behavior has been consistently good, we've gradually lowered the dosage over the past 3 - 4 weeks as we've started working him harder. By the time we added cantering we were back down to 0.6 CC, and recently we started cantering and are almost entirely off of Ace since he's back at his normal exercise routine.

It's always a little scary riding a drugged-up horse for the first few times, but you'll soon realize what he pays attention to (or what he could care less about), and get a feel for how he's responding. My horse is always a little wobbly and uncoordinated when we first start trotting on Ace; it's important to keep them moving forward so they don't trip or stumble too hard and risk re-injury. Also, while on the Ace keep your horse away from other horses or ponies who might be fussy or wild... my horse plodded around the arena one day indifferent to screaming children, yappy dogs, and a variety of other distractions, but when a crazy horse right behind him spooked and bucked, HE took off as well!! So, tranquilizers don't necessarily mean they're non-reactive to everything and you should always pay attention even if they seem totally out of it. :) GOOD LUCK!!

[Hilltopfarmva]

It really depends on your horses tolerance level. I usually start with 1 1/2 im and since I have an enclosed shed row barn that helps minimize the spook level. We usually tack walk for 3 to 5 days and then add in the trot. But... since you are outside you are going to have to play it by ear as to how much and when to reduce the dosage.

[FineAlready]

I'll echo what the others said regarding the dosage depending on the horse. When I first started tack walking my horse, we had to give IV Ace because the IM just wouldn't hit him at all (even at 2 and 1/2 ccs). For now, we've settled on 2 ccs IM half an hour before I get on. He does not appear "drugged" at all and has a TON of pep in his step at the trot - no tripping, swaying, etc. I do think it keeps him from completely losing it, though. For normal horses, I'd probably try 2 ccs IM and then try to step it down from there.

[LDavis104]

When mine was on stall rest (and when he first came off stall rest), I gave him 1 cc IM. He's a ~1000 lb appendix. He is usually calm anyways, so it would probably be different for a normally-hot horse. I did have to increase to 2 cc at times when I could just tell he was going to be crazy, or if the situation we were hand-walking in was going to be crazy (i.e. if there were lots of horses in the indoor cantering around or if it was windy).

Ace became my BFF, espcially after lots of episodes, including a broken hand. I continued to Ace him every day until he was back on turnout.

[Montanas_Girl]

Thanks, guys! Those responses are about what I expected. I'll try 2 cc today, since it will probably only be about 31 degrees outside when I'm at the barn, and we'll see how it goes. Montana is older (15) and normally a good boy, but he is a sensitive, hot horse. He is also a very, very athletic little monster when he decides to spook or buck. Once he's back on turnout, he'll be fine, but until then....I think we're going to go through a lot of ace!

[FineAlready]

Good luck! I'll add that my horse is a four-year-old OTTB and that he was on stall rest with hand walks for oh, about 5 and a half to 6 months before we started tack walking him. So, that probably had some impact on how much Ace was required. Mine was a looney tune (rearing, spinning - all that fun stuff!) for the first 3-5 tack walks and then settled into a walking routine. He is now pretty much perfect for the walking portion of our rides. At this point, it is the trotting portion of the rides that is sometimes just VERY exciting and very on-the-verge-of-a-huge-buck feeling, lol.

My guess is that you will probably be able to tell if the Ace was the right dose before you get on. I can definitely tell right away if the Ace is working or not. You should also be able to tell if it was too much.

Also, another thing that helps - after you give the Ace, try to leave the horse alone in a quiet environment for about 20 minutes (eating hay in his stall, for example) and then tack him up about 10 minutes before you get on. Try to avoid anything exciting happening during the 30 minutes after you give the Ace, as this can cause them to sort of "blow through" the Ace. I've noticed that any kind of adreneline rush that occurs during the critical 30-minute window can create the effect of not having been Aced at all.

Again, good luck and enjoy getting your guy back in action again! Once you get past the somewhat sick feeling of sitting on a horse that's been on stall rest with no turnout, you really will feel great to be back on your horse! It is an amazing feeling!

[LuvMyTB]

My horse has been on stall rest for 6 weeks and JUST last week we were allowed to start handwalking. I have been giving 1 cc of Ace IM 20 mins before walking (this is on top of 4 ccs of fluphenazine given 10 days ago).

I can tell within those 20 minutes whether or not the 1 cc was enough. If it wasn't, I give another 1 cc and wait 10 minutes--don't be afraid to give more if you need to. Not worth the risk of injury.

When we start tack walking (2-3 weeks from now), I will use however much Ace I have to....and then I'll give myself some, too. :)

[FineAlready]

When we start tack walking (2-3 weeks from now), I will use however much Ace I have to....and then I'll give myself some, too. :)

Hahahaha! I can't tell you how many times I have stood next to my horse, Ace-filled syringe in hand, and wondered "what if?"

[LuvMyTB]

Hahahaha! I can't tell you how many times I have stood next to my horse, Ace-filled syringe in hand, and wondered "what if?"

ROFL! Scary how tempted you get, isn't it? When we first started handwalking last week, we tried it with no Ace b/c generally he is a good boy. We got 3/4 of the way around the arena and WHOA--he just exploded.

After that all I could think was Holy $hit, how am I going to ride him when the time comes?! I am thinking of doing an oral dosage of vodka, or rum, or......:lol:

[brightskyfarm]

standardly, start with 2cc... and see his response. Ace comes in (2-3)pills and paste (a knuckles worth)too..

[FineAlready]

ROFL! Scary how tempted you get, isn't it? When we first started handwalking last week, we tried it with no Ace b/c generally he is a good boy. We got 3/4 of the way around the arena and WHOA--he just exploded.

After that all I could think was Holy $hit, how am I going to ride him when the time comes?! I am thinking of doing an oral dosage of vodka, or rum, or......:lol:

Ha ha! You'll be okay. Mine was generally okay for hand walking except for the occasional "showing of the belly" (it's a cute belly, but I'd prefer that he not stand on his hind legs to show it to me). That more or less corrected itself when he accidentally bumped me with his knee on the way "up" one day. The look of horror on his face was absolutely priceless...and I have never seen a horse throw it in reverse faster than he did! The thing that made me panic was watching him partake in serious stall rodeo sessions almost every day. I mean, bronco bucking, rearing, leaping, double-barrelling the walls. I just kept thinking - how am I ever going to get on him? But for him, and I think lots of horses (particularly TBs), being tacked up means work. Work is what they want, and they behave better when in work mode. As I mentioned, mine was a nut for the first few rides, but then it was like his brain switched over and he was like, "Oh yeah, I'm a real live riding horse again and I'm supposed to be a good boy!"

Anyway, good luck to everyone rehabbing a horse right now. :)

[Montanas_Girl]

Well, 2cc may have been a bit excessive for Montana. :lol: He wasn't unsafe to ride, but he was pony-kick quiet, which is a little too quiet for my tastes. So we'll try 1.5 cc tomorrow and see how that goes. Apparently he's a cheap drunk! :D

I gave him the ace IM when I brought him in from turnout. By the time I had groomed him and wrapped his legs, he was good to go. So, the 20 minute time frame worked out nicely for us.

[FineAlready]

That's great, MontanasGirl! Hopefully, that means this rehab will be smooth sailing for you! :)

[SquishTheBunny]

Dont forget Ace comes in different concentrations. Generally, 10mg/ml, 20mg/ml and 25mg/ml but I HAVE seen it sell in 50mg/ml.

When aking for dosages, its in the best interest to ask for how many MILIGRAMS are required. 2cc's of the 50mg/ml concentration could kill your horse, while 2cc's of the 10mg/ml is generally considered riding-safe dosage.

I have never used more than 20mg, usually 10mg is enough if you are just looking to take the edge off.

Also, giving it IV usually gives you more sedation than orally.

[Montanas_Girl]

Thanks for the encouragement, FineAlready!

Squish, if you'd read my first post carefully, you'd have seen that the bottle of ace I bought was the 20 mg/ml formulations. I appreciate the information, but I already had that covered. So, my horse got 40 mg yesterday and will get 30 mg for the next ride.

[SquishTheBunny]

Thanks for the encouragement, FineAlready!

Squish, if you'd read my first post carefully, you'd have seen that the bottle of ace I bought was the 20 mg/ml formulations. I appreciate the information, but I already had that covered. So, my horse got 40 mg yesterday and will get 30 mg for the next ride.

I actually did read your post clearly... :) Just a reminder for those saying "yeah go ahead and give 2-3cc's" as they may have had experience with a different concentration.

I have been involved with an animal who died as a result of an ace overdose. Just want to make sure people remember that its not a drug to play around with too much and that if they are offering advice on how much to give, to tell you in mg dosage.