PDA

View Full Version : I am All Confused about WB's



AnnabelleQF
Apr. 16, 2003, 08:46 AM
Hey-
I was just wondering...what is the difference between all the different breeds of Warmbloods?
I have heard that some of them are pretty much the same except they come from different regions. Anyone care to clarify? And does anyone know anything (or have one) about Brandenburgs?? Thanks!

AnnabelleQF
Apr. 16, 2003, 08:46 AM
Hey-
I was just wondering...what is the difference between all the different breeds of Warmbloods?
I have heard that some of them are pretty much the same except they come from different regions. Anyone care to clarify? And does anyone know anything (or have one) about Brandenburgs?? Thanks!

slp
Apr. 16, 2003, 09:01 AM
As far as the German warmbloods go, it depends on what region of the country they are from. Hannoverians are from the Hannover region, Holsteiners are from the Schleswig-Holstein region, Rheinlanders are from the Rheinland-Pfalz region.....Lots of criss-crossing between them. We have a Holsteiner and he has lots of Sele-Francais and TB in his bloodlines. Each region has their own state stud, or verband, and depending on which verband the sire and dam are registered with determines what "breed" the foal is.
Susan

ScubySnak82
Apr. 16, 2003, 10:05 AM
Not that this helps but the Warmblood breed thing is really confusing! I have a branded Belgian Warmblood....and his parents are a Westfalian and a Dutch warmblood...lol. I have come to the conclusion that if you aren't breeding your horse then breed doesn't matter as much as ability, looks, and conformation. Brandenburgs are a nice breed. I have a friend with one and it's a really cute hunter. Good luck!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://community.webshots.com/user/scubysnak7

"It is dangerous if you are right when the government is wrong." -Voltaire

~*~ DROP BUSH, NOT BOMBS! ~*~

"73% of serial killers vote republican" - The Life of David Gale

hoopoe
Apr. 16, 2003, 10:18 AM
In a nutshell they are not Breeds ( except for one or two and I cannot remember which that is).

Each Verband has a standard they would like to see, type, performance etc. The horses are inspected and if they meet the current criteria they are accepted into the breeding registry.

Some registries will accept the horse based on it's parents approvals others want to see the horse for it to be registered or branded.

And the standards can change if they find they want to move the type ( such as from heavy old style to one with more refinement or fire)

This question has been asked before and I am sure the people on the Breeding forum can give you a more complete response.

_\\]
-- * > hoopoe
The ancient Greeks did not write obituaries. They only wanted to know if you had a passion.

Portia
Apr. 16, 2003, 11:23 AM
Trakehners are a breed, with an essentially closed studbook. The other German and European warmbloods have open studbooks and are more types than breeds. They are essentially mutts -- very, very well bred, highly pedigreed, selectively devised, very successful mutts. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

A stallion of the desired type with an appropriate pedigree and with appropriately high qualifications (pedigree, conformation, gaits, athleticism, temperment, demonstrated through stallion testing or high level performance in competition) can be approved for breeding by numerous verbands (breeding societies), though he will only be registered with one (whoever issued his foal papers). The same with mares, though the standards are not as stringent as with stallions because an individual mare can have less impact on the breeding population than can an individual stallion. Just because a horse is registered with a certain verband does not mean it will be approved for breeding; something in the range of about 1% of the colts that are born are ever approved for breeding.

The offspring of a stallion and a mare approved for breeding by a particular verband, regardless of their registration, can be registered with the approving verband. Thus, the offspring of a Hannoverian registered stallion who is approved by the Holsteiner verband and of an Oldenburg mare who is also approved by the Holsteiner verband can be registered as a Holsteiner. The offspring of an unapproved sire or dam cannot be registered with the verband, regardless of their registration.

Historically the verbands went by geographic region, but now they go more by marketing plans. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Lea
Apr. 16, 2003, 11:27 AM
How and from what did the warmbloods start? Is it true that they started from draft-crosses?

Normal is the setting on a dryer!

Portia
Apr. 16, 2003, 11:37 AM
Warmblood breeding began in Europe, fueled by competition between the regional principalities and duchies to produce the best horses, and by the needs of their armies. Each region needed to produce horses that could be versatile, that a calvalry officer could ride on the parade ground one day and charge into battle on the next, or that could be hooked up to a supply wagon if necessary. Then, after the war du jour was over, the horse had to be something that the local farmers could use for riding and for work. Since the age of mechanism ended the need for warhorses and calvalry mounts, they have been intentionally bred to be athletes and have become lighter and more refined through the infusion of select Arab, TB, and Anglo-Arab blood.

Warmbloods are not draft crosses. There is very little true draft horse blood in warmbloods, and none at all for a hundred years or so. They have been derived by selective breeding over a few hundred years, using a mix of TB, Arab, and (going back aways) Andalusian/Lusitano horses with light carriage horse breeds such as Cleveland Bays and Hackneys, orignally mixed with the local farm mares (but not drafts).

The term warmblood is a confusing misnomer -- they are not a cross between hot-blooded TBs and Arabs and cold-blooded draft breeds. They are instead warmbloods in the sense that in temperment, build, and purpose, they fall somewhere in between the two extremes.

PaintedWhisper
Apr. 16, 2003, 03:41 PM
So what about German Riding ponies??

My German riding pony was imported from germany, and has a brand? (MozartXSina)

Just a mini-warmblood??

-Emily-
When they discover the center of the universe, a lot of people will be disappointed to discover they are not it.hhhh
^Whispering Hill^
^You've Got Mail^

Dragoon
Apr. 16, 2003, 03:53 PM
Excellent post, Portia! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"They say there's a place where dreams have all gone,
They never said where, but I think I know.
It's miles through the night, just over the dawn,
On the road that will take me home."
("Going Home" from Gods and Generals)

Alagirl
Apr. 16, 2003, 04:26 PM
I just like to add that Rheinlaender is not the same as RPS or Zweibruecker.

They are closer related to Westphalian, just on the left bank....

Brandenburg has re-established their autonomy since the fall of the wall, as all breeds were collectively called *Noble Warmblood of the GDR*, together with the Mecklenburger and then some. Since then they had an infusion of Han&Hol ...There are just now really getting in the swing of things, before, in Communist times, riding was frowned upon and horses were just a means to make a quick buck (not that playmoney they had, but good hard cash, like Mark (west)and $$$, good quality horses for a fair price....

AllWeatherGal
Apr. 16, 2003, 05:22 PM
Also, fwiw ... there are some 20 JC-registered American TBs currently standing stud at various Verbands throughout Germany, including the "national" Trakehner facility.

In addition, if you're a breeder and you THINK you might want to register a baby, do it RIGHT away. One of my friends waited to register her Galoubet x Premium Hanoverian mare baby and because Galoubet isn't approved by the Hanoverian Society and the Selle Francais require presentation by the third year for "foreign" horses, she's OOL.

Portia
Apr. 24, 2003, 04:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PaintedWhisper:
So what about German Riding ponies??

My German riding pony was imported from germany, and has a brand? (MozartXSina)

Just a mini-warmblood??

-Emily-<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Sorry, Emily, just saw this as I'm still catching up after having been away from the computer at the World Cup. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Yep, a German riding pony is a kind of mini-warmblood. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif They are generally bred under the same breeding rules and standards as are in place for most of the verbands, except being crossed with pony breeds, and they are in separate pony studbooks. (Most of the verbands have minimum height requirements for breeding approval for their horse studbooks.)

Oh, and thanks Dragoon. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif