Ugh! Bad Hay?

[Trevelyan96]

In November, we picked up the first 110 bales of my 2nd cutting order of 250 bales. Looks great, very pretty grass hay.

2 weeks ago we picked up another 60.

Mistake #1 It is all supposed to be from the same cutting, so I wasn't overly concerned with doing a thorough inspection. I've been buying from this supplier for years and have never had a bad bale.

Mistake #2 Different helper. I pulled the first 110 myself because they were shorthanded at the barn, and this helper was pulling from a different section of the stack. The bales seemed heavier and dustier, but I though it was just general dust in the barn.

Since it was all supposed to be the same cutting, we just packed it in all in front of the first load, thinking it is basically the same hay.

The horses WILL NOT TOUCH IT! Its green, fine stemmed and smells fine to me, sort of a spicy fragrance to it, but where they were gobbling it up from the first load, they are turning their noses up at this load. Truly, I can't tell if its just dust, or mold. :confused: Being winter, I'm freaking out, as I'm terrified that I'm putting out hay that they can't or won't eat. Honestly, except for a few bales, I really can't see any difference between the 2 loads, but I've thrown hay to them in the morning or evening, only to find at the next feeding that they haven't touched it. :eek:

So now I have to go through every bale, try to identify what looks good and bad, and put it all back on the trailer to take it all back to my supplier. DH is ticked off at ME because of the wasted effort of picking up, loading, & unloading, and he wants me to push the supplier to pick it up or at least send someone to help us re-load on the trailer. They guarantee their hay and are not quiblling about taking it back since their hay is guaranteed. But I was there, and so I feel its my own fault. And of course, I have about 6 wasted bales because I opened them and tried to feed before I realized that they were just not going to eat this stuff.

So my question is... in this case, would you ask the supplier, who is local, to send someone to look at the hay and determine if they consider it bad enough to just dispose of it? Seems to be a wasted effort for me to load it and haul it all back if they can't sell it again, but I can understand why they'd want to verify that the hay is actually bad. It just seems to me that part of the reason I pay premium prices for the hay is that I'm also paying for their expertise on whether the hay is good or bad. If its perfectly good hay, that for some strange reason my horses won't eat, I'm more than happy to take it back to them, but if its bad, won't they have to trash it anyway?

[buck22]

I would call the dealer, and be perfectly frank. tell them the whole thing, first 110 were great, this 60 for some reason the horses won't touch. Hubby is mad at all of the wasted effort, I don't quite know what to do, can you guys help me out?

having said that, unless the hay is moldy or really dusty its probably not garbage, and even if it is moldy the dealer can still sell it as cow hay to someone, so don't feel bad for him. I don't know if he'd need to verify, most reputable dealers with return policies I've heard of take it back on the customer's word (but if they feel the customer is being overly picky, might be careful of doing business with them the next year).

this was only my second year putting up hay, and i got my education in mold/dust this year... from the bad baling weather, to freak flooding, I lost about 50 bales to mold this year. The mold presented as a sudden white poof when I opened bales. Though some of the bales I purchased were baled a little wet, my storage was compromised a bit too, so being it was a grey area of "fault" I didn't pursue a return and just ate the loss.

It was very tricky to monitor, often only half or as little as 2 flakes, of each bale would be affected. It would either smell musty, but look fine... or smell great but have white poofiness, or on the rare occasion both funky smelling and white poof. To make matters even worse - and to my utter shock and horror - my picky horses would eat the musty or poofy hay if I accidentally let them! I had a horrible summer/fall having to sift through all my hay, flake by flake, and trying to figure out how to dispose of it all. Fortunately my BO has dogs so much of my inedible hay went as bedding.

otoh, I put up some mature, but still very nice and clean and fragrant 1st cutting orchard that my horses nearly flat out refuse to eat. :mad: its clean and lovely, but I guess not tasty enough or cut at some odd stage of maturity that they find distasteful. :no:

like I said, I'd probably call and ask what to do. Hopefully you can get the remaining order filled from the original batch your horses liked, but be prepared that he might be sold out of that. Also, beginning of this summer I purchased some hay from a guy that stores hay for people all year... it didn't store so good, so the hay I bought off him in September was gorgeous, but the remainder I bought from the same exact batch the following June wasn't that nice. Live n learn

[Trevelyan96]

I talked to the supplier last week. Basically they just said to bring it back and they'll replce it or refund, whichever I choose. Its just that now I have to pull it out of the loft, load it on the trailer, and haul it back tha has DH really ticked. He's not real crazy about the horses as it is... this is just one more thing for him to complain about. :(

I did suggest that I can hire someone to help me get the hay back to the supplier, but he doesn't like that alternative either. Just no pleasing some men sometimes I guess.

[buck22]

trust me, I know what you're going through :( my SO just barely tolerates my horse habit as it is, if something goes wrong or I need to rush over to the stable or run around or get frantic, all heck breaks loose at home and I'm stuck apologizing for days :(

but you gotta do what you gotta do. I'd call the supplier and ask if he has any help available for you, or if the guys who are going to deliver the next load, can pick up this load and return it the same trip.

[Simbalism]

I've had that happen in the past. I got a load that looked alright although did seem a little heavier than previous hay. Horses would pick at it, but wasted most of it. I started really examining it and found it had a slightly funny smell. I think it was beginning to go moldy. Luckily, my hay guy came and picked it up.

[MistyBlue]

It can definitely be annoying to have to yank hay out of a loft and return it.
But thankfully it's only the 60 bale load and not the 110 bale load. And thankfully it's coming down from a loft instead of going up into one.
I wouldn't bother discussing with the spouse the issue since the supplier will take it back and swap it. Just park the truck or truck/trailer near the loft doors and toss the 60 bales down. Every 20 bales or so go down and stack them, then up to toss the next 20 down. Then return them and most likely the employees at the hay supplier will offload them for you and help you stack the new hay. 60 bales doesn't usually require 2 people to move around. Shouldn't take more than 30-45 minutes...an hour tops to toss 60 bales out of a loft and onto a truck.
I've found if the spouse doesn't have to deal with the various and sundry minutia things involved with horses and barns, they don't get overly annoyed about it. :)
Good luck!

[Painted Horse]

1st of all, You need to be able to look at the hay and see if it has mold. There is no reason for you to have wasted 6 bales. Don't expect your supplier to replace bales you broke open and could not return. If I pick up hay from a new supplier, I'll grab a random bale and break it open before I ever put any hay on the trailer. And I usually pay for the broken bale and throw it in the back of the truck. If the farmer has some cows nearby, they will often keep the broken bale and throw it over the fence to cows and not charge me for it. But I can't expect a feed store that doesn't have animals nearby to give me free bales to tear open.

Mold in a bale is not difficult to spot when you open the bale up. Most of the time the hay has turned more of tobacco color rather than a bright green, you next get the white powder from the mold and a sour smell. Hay that was put up wet, will be more heavy, You can feel the heavy bales. I just set heavy bales aside and tell the hay farmer that I don't want that bale. Because it almost always turns out when I cut the strings 2 months later that heavy bale has mold. If the hay looks the same as the 1st batch, it's probably not mold, but just a different mix of grasses. My horses love alfalfa or hay that has alfalfa mixed in. They gobble it up. If I throw a flake of straight grass hay in the manager, they eat the alfalfa and leave the grass hay until later when decide they hungry enough to eat it. If the new bales contain an older hay ( meaning it was more mature when cut) maybe they think it's stemmy or has a less sweet taste to it. Some parts of a field can have a higher mix of other grasses that the horses find more desireable. If you get 50% alfalfa on one end of the field and almost no alfalfa at the other end. Or maybe it's a higher mix of Timothy or Birdsmouth Trefoil etc.

Next. You bought the hay, you helped load it or at least oversaw the loading, you hauled it home and unloaded it into your barn. It's your responsibility to return it. Your hay dealer is being reasonable and fair to take it back. But it's not his responsiblity to help you return it. Now if he had delivered the hay and you had not seen it until it was stacked in your barn. It would be different. And you own the bales you broke open and tried to feed. Don't expect the farmer to replace those. You don't go into a grocery store and take a bit out of an apple and put it back on the shelf and say, jeez, it didn't taste as sweet as I though it should.


If it is moldy, Let the dealer decide if he wants it back or disposed off. Personally, I hate disposing of hay. You have to haul it to the dump, pay the dump fee, It cost money and takes my time. If it's moldy hay, and the dealer wants me to dispose of it, I would expect to be compensated for this effort. Take one of the broken bales back and show him the mold before you load it up. Let him decide what to do with it.


This all becomes much more difficult if you purchase the big bales. I personally buy my hay in midsized bales that usually weigh around 750lbs. You don't break one of those open, sift through the flakes and throw the loose hay in the pickup. And at $40 a bale, I don't want to break open a bale and leave it. Fortunately the farmers I buy from. All have animals they are feeding, So I can look at the bales they have open and are feeding from before I load any. If I don't like what I see, I drive home empty. And yes, I'm out the cost of my gas and time, but better that loss than the additional loss of spending time loading and unloading 6-7 ton of hay.

[JanWeber]

You may also want to ask if your hay supplier treats his hay with preservatives when they are to be stored. I bought some hay out of the field from a well-regarded local grower and it was fine. Bought more out of the barn and they wouldn't touch it - turns out it had been sprayed with a preservative...

[saddleup]

I feel for you...this winter hay is the bane of my existence. My supplier changed the way he bales it, and the huge bundles and hard to handle flakes made me nuts, so I have bought hay from three different suppliers in the last six weeks, hoping to find good hay.

The first one sold me ten small bales, which I tried and my horses really liked. So I ordered 50 more bales, and most of them were moldy when they were delivered. So, was it a bait and switch situation? Who knows? All I know if I've been loading and unloading, then loading hay again, for weeks, and I'm sick of it.

Just got 150 bales yesterday, and they come with a satisfaction guarantee, no questions asked. This guy may be a keeper, but I'll keep my fingers crossed for myself and any of you who fight the "good hay" fight.

[Trevelyan96]

I don't think the hay is moldy. It's mostly orchardgrass. Fine stemmed, very green and VERY dusty, but I'm not finding white poofy mold, and the smell is sort of spicy, not sour at all. Maybe its the smell that the horses don't like? I did notice that they are now eating the stuff off the ground that was snowed / rained on that they wouldn't eat a week ago. Some of the bales do have a lot of small foxtail type seed heads, and those are the ones I am putting aside to take back.

Truly, I'm at a loss as to why they won't eat this, because it looks like beautiful hay to me. Maybe I should dunk it first to get rid of the dust?

[MistyBlue]

Could be a fine weed in there. Sometimes my hay supplier has a few bales here and there that have that odd sweet/spicy smell. And my horses sometimes hoover it down and sometimes act like I'm trying to poison them. (and sometimes one horse eats it and the other ignores it, I swear they drive me nuts on purpose)
Do try dunking it or hosing it down a bit and see if that makes a difference. Not really soaking it, just rinse it off.
Maybe it's that it's just a new smell or taste they aren't used to?

[mkevent]

If some of my hay looks a bit dusty, I will wet it down thoroughly and the horses will eat it without problem. If they leave some behind, I figure maybe it has mold or something I can't see(or smell) so I toss that out. I thought I read somewhere that horses won't eat moldy hay unless they are desperate.

[slc2]

orchard grass isn't fine, and horses don't usually eat fine hay unless they are forced to.

[buck22]

I don't think the hay is moldy. It's mostly orchardgrass. Fine stemmed, very green and VERY dusty, but I'm not finding white poofy mold, and the smell is sort of spicy, not sour at all.
ooh! ooh! ooh! [raises hand] maybe its not dust, but pollen?? Unloading my last batch of hay from my new hay guy, a couple went 'poof' as they hit the ground off the truck (BUT they bounced :cool: ah ha! I've learned the difference between a nice sproingy bale and one that goes 'thud'). Anyhow, my eyes widened, and the hay man said, ah, thats not dust, thats pollen. And he's right. The white poofy hay made my COPD horse cough up a storm when he snatched a bite or two, the pollen hay he happily munches.

re fine hay, I've never seen hay finer than my teff, its so fine you could lay down on a bale and not get poked... and my horses hoover that, they love fine hay.

[sedaistable]

We have a local farmer that makes beautiful hay,except he sprays it with something BEFORE its baled so it wont mold in the barn.I think it prevents the normal "sweating period" that baled hay goes through,and makes it very dry before being baled.

It smells VERY sweet.Looks pretty.The horses hate it and will starve before they eat it.

My friend forced her horses to eat it and BAM---swollen legs til the hay was changed.

Might try asking your farmer if he sprays the hay after it is cut and before its baled.Thats okay for his own cows but not horses.

[Tamara in TN]

[QUOTE=sedaistable;4587435]We have a local farmer that makes beautiful hay,except he sprays it with something BEFORE its baled so it wont mold in the barn.I think it prevents the normal "sweating period" that baled hay goes through,and makes it very dry before being baled.

that is not the way proprionic acid works....and it cannot cause edema in horses in that way....certain weeds however can...

Tamara in TN

[Piatt Farms]

I feel your pain....a month ago I spent $80 on a BEAUTIFUL round bale of alfalfa. Green, leafy,beautiful once I pulled off the outer "shell". I pretty much continually threw the alfalfa to them to get them used to eating it (2 of the 3 are preggers and the vet said to feed them as much as they want) and the horses gobbled it up. So I order another round bale from the same person, same "stash", he brings it out, dumps it in the field so they can now free graze and when I unwrap it I find a huge chunk is soggy and moldy, there is white poofy mold throughout it, and WEEDS everywhere! AND IT'S STEMMY! Seriously. I found 3 scrawny leaves when I pulled a random handful out.
I just called him, explained that the first bale was great and this one was not acceptable, this would not work and I needed him to bring another out next week.
He acted as if it wasn't any big deal to free feed moldy hay to horses (!?!?!?!) but said he'd bring another out next week. This time, I will pull a section apart before he drops it. Of course, I will probably end up getting charged gas for making him take it back and bring me a new one if I don't like it.
Oh...and I'm doing all of this behind the DH back. He would be SOOO irritated by this. He doesn't understand why horses are so sensitive..."after all, didn't they live out on the range for years and years" and "ours get treated better than others".
*sigh* yes honey this is true, however these are TB, not mustangs, and we are responsible for feeding them, they can't eat dirt. And if you mean "treated better" then some of the other horses owned by people we know, then yes. But that bar is pretty low, I wouldn't set standard by that.

[buck22]

other horses owned by people we know, then yes. But that bar is pretty low
that made me lol!

anatolians? gorgeous dogs, my BO has a few, a beautiful fawn bitch that is just drop dead gorgeous. she told me about the anatolians to save the cheetah foundation? very cool.

[bbbkmc]

why certain hay that looks and smells the same to us is unacceptable to them. I've struggled with this mystery all winter, hay from same field and stored in same shed is either gobbled or rejected, and then I worry... But I watch them and they often will go back to the round bale and eat it. And sometimes if I switch the same bale to another field the others will eat it. Anyway, it stresses me out and I end up feeding more of the really yummy square bales in the barn.

One thought, we occasionally get hay with little prickly
weeds that get in my hands, can't imagine they like that.

I DO know the difference between "sproingy" bales and bales that go thud! We were picking up out of a field and the lower and closer we got to a stream the heavier and deader they felt. My husband was frustrated that I kept rejecting these big green bales, but there is nothing worse than doing all that work and paying money to get a rotten bale. I like to throw the bales off the truck (b/c it's easier than up! ) but also then I get to feel every bale. This year we stood the few questionable ones on their sides in the sun and then fed them first. I also feed the ? bales outside so they can pick through what they like and then poop on the rest, gotta love it!