View Full Version : WWYD - Should I get this horse?
Dec. 4, 2009, 01:49 PM
A friend of mine has this horse that he is trying to sell, but he is taking a job over seas and is running out of time. I cannot afford the horse, but he said if I wanted to keep the horse for myself, and when sold him I will give him his portion of the money, which wouldnt be much. The horse has a lot of things going for him, but is off the track and has an old bow. He is 100% sound now and shouldnt be any problems in the future.
So what would you do? would you get this horse to turn around and sell?
Is the old bow going to scare off a lot of people?
Not to mention he is a solid black horse, with a perfect heart on his forehead... If I ever showed him I'd name him Valentino :)
Dec. 4, 2009, 01:55 PM
if you took the horse and turned him into a profitable show horse, then sold him, you make a nice proft...if the horse market comes up. but make sure you have the resources to take the horse up.
Dec. 4, 2009, 02:01 PM
I cannot afford the horse
I think you have answered your own question right here.
Dec. 4, 2009, 02:01 PM
OTTB's are plentiful, and in this market I'd be hard pressed to take on a project, even a free one, that has an old injury - even if the horse stayed completely sound on it.
Unless he's a SUPER fancy mover with a 10 jump, I'd pass. And even at that, he'd need to be big, flashy, and super quiet.
Dec. 4, 2009, 02:02 PM
If you can't afford the horse, can you afford the upkeep, training & showing to market him until he sells?
Is he going to sell for enough $$ that makes it worthwhile for you to take this risk?
Can you afford to lose money on this horse? By the time horse sells & owner gets his cut, there may not be any profit for you.
Do you have the resources or ability to sell him?
What if 6-12-18 months go by & horse still isn't sold? Will owner take him back then? Do you have to pay owner?
Personally, I would pass. The old bow will scare off some buyers. Others might not care, but it will make him a harder re-sell.
Dec. 4, 2009, 02:32 PM
Let me rephrase this... I can not afford to purchase the horse. The actually costs of keeping a horse is not an issue as my mother owns a boarding facility.
He horse is super nice looking and dead quiet. He told me he didnt care how long it took to sell him, 2 months, 2 years, as long as he gets his cut in the end.
The main issue Im tackling here is if the old bow is going to kill his ability to be sold? If he is really nice to ride, quiet, jumps good and moves good, for a horse under 10k, is it going to hurt him that badly?
Wondering if someone has had experience with selling a horse with an old bow?
Dec. 4, 2009, 02:53 PM
i peronally have bought 2 horses with old bows. One was a retired GP jumper that had an old bow. The other is my current event horse that has an old bow from racing.
do you know what the old bow is from, also how bad is the bow?
both of mine have minor bows. someone inexperienced wouldnt be able to tell they have them. in fact i didnt even know about my jumpers bow until he reinjured it (again minor) about 2 years later during heavy show season. I was chatting with someone that used to know him and she said "oh so he reinjured that tendon?" he had about 60 million other injuries or bumps so i wasnt suprised. Had i known about the bow i still would have bought him.
my new mares bow the owner didnt tell me about either but she accidentally let it slip that her first owner after the track rehabbed her on the beach. She also has a scar from wrapping on her leg with the bow, and the tendon is oh so slightly thicker than the other. So with all that i figured she had a bow. My vet didnt even say anything about it until i did. And knowing she had it i bought her anyways. And she is my prelim event horse.
so it depends on the buyer, how bad the injury was, and how nice he is.
If the owner doesnt care how long it takes, you like the horse. As in if you had the money you would buy him, then i say go for it. It doesnt look like you have much to lose if you want to ride this horse.
Dec. 4, 2009, 03:24 PM
Sorry but the answer is not enough information.
If the horse is currently in a regular program doing what the buyer wants him to do-like flatting 3 days a week and jumping up to 3', 40 fences or so a week-which would equal the average 2 lessons a week program? Probably no problem at all.
But of he does not know how to do these things yet, is not being regularly worked or has been sitting around? It might bother me because I have no idea how he will hold up.
Would want to know what caused the bow as well.
There are alot of examples of horses with old bows that are fine. There are just as many that had another problem that caused the bow, like conformation, and will never hold up on it.
No idea what camp this one falls into.
If he has not done much, I wouldn't take him on. Even non bows are hard to sell without specific skills.
Dec. 4, 2009, 03:34 PM
Only thing to add:
Agree on the owner's cut up front, and make that a fixed amount. If you have no idea how long it might take to sell him, you could be putting in more that the selling price.
You also need to discuss a contingency plan with the distant owner should things change for you and you need to give the horse back. He probably doesn't want to get that phone call while he's out of the country. If you find yourself needing to get out from under him in, say, 90 days, what does the owner want?
I think anything can be negotiated, so long as both sides at least talk about all possible scenarios up front and address these in their written agreement.
Dec. 4, 2009, 05:53 PM
I'd get an ultrasound and vet's opinion on the bow. . . but have seen lots of TBS with them off the track and most stayed sound. . . it will depend, as Find8 said
Dec. 4, 2009, 06:23 PM
If he stays sound on it, I don't think it's a huge deal. My current horse was purchased with an old bow that'd he'd been sound on for a couple years. As long as the horse is going fine on it (and is everything you described to boot), I wouldn't think you'd have trouble selling him.
A quick bit of unsolicited advice on buying a horse to sell it for a profit: my bottom line with "re-sale horses" is that it must be a horse I enjoy personally. If you don't like the horse for yourself in the meantime, imagine how you'd feel taking care of him if he were hurt again. But if it's a horse you actually really like, you won't hate paying that vet bill so much. So take him on because you like him and because he also happens to have good resale potential, not because he's an investment only. Hope for the investment, but don't count on it. If you're really realistic like that, you'll be fine. If you take the horse because it's a fancy horse you can afford but not something you would otherwise look at (whether because of personality or size or whatever), pass.
Dec. 4, 2009, 06:26 PM
Are you an ammy? If so, are you willing to give that up? Since you would be acting as the agent for, and potentially profiting from, the sale of a horse you do not own I believe this would be considered professional activity.
As far as the old bow, I agree with findeight in that it depends. I have a fabulous horse with two old bows. I consulted with my vet regarding them prior to purchase.
Dec. 4, 2009, 07:17 PM
Is this horse something you want to keep.... if the market does not improve? If not, I would pass.
The stars and the moon must align for an ex-racer with a set bow... to be worth a ton, even with all of your hard work. Horses are like yachts... they are much easier to buy, then to sell!
Dec. 4, 2009, 08:24 PM
In this market, no. What if you can't sell him? What if he comes up lame --who foots the bill?
If you do take him on, have a WRITTEN agreement covering all the WHAT-IFS.
I would not even look at a horse with an old bow, but thats just me.There are plenty of others out there on todays market shelf that are without an injury history.
Dec. 4, 2009, 08:37 PM
No, I wouldn't. Not unless he was a proven jumper, with great talent upper level talent would I take him on. Even then I probably wouldn't. And yes old bows scare a lot of potential buyers off, they just do, I wont look at a horse with an old injury like that, because as they get older or whatever they can easily re-injure themselves.
Dec. 4, 2009, 08:52 PM
Anyone who knows horses well will not be scared off by an old bow depending on location, severity and how it has healed. An ultrasound will tell you what you need to know beneath the skin, a look at the horse, the way of going, the temperament will tell you all else. If you can afford to care for the horse and you like him, why not? You can always lower the price and sell early, or keep him, etc.
In any case, I once was trying to sell a grey TB gelding, clean legged, not a pimple on him and very attractive. The people wanted a potential whip's horse. he was a little too looky for a hunt horse nevermind a whip's horse who needed to be sound to gunfire! They would not take him of course and told me they had a horse they were trying in the trailer. I walk to the trailer and see a horse with not one but two bows, matching fronts, pretty much the length of his cannon bones and a bit over at the knee. To say I was a little taken aback is putting it mildly. They assured me they were likely going to buy him for somewhere in the neighborhood of $5,000because he was bomb proof and was currently hunting as a whip's horse and had been for some time. So there you have it. My horse went back to owner because he was too spooky for me to deal with, he then went to New York and went into training for hunter equitation horse or some such.
Many factors to be considered but mainly, as the other poster said, do you like him and can you take care of him without creating a crisis? If so, go for it. He needs somebody to give him a shot.
Dec. 4, 2009, 10:00 PM
my horse has an old bow. I have only had him since July and have not done much with him (yet)though. But I felt someome needed to take a chance on him, He is a great boy, well worth the risk. I think IF you can afford him go for it! But be prepared for him not to sell. This market sucks, and you could have him for a long time!