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View Full Version : The next "Super-Stud"; who will it be?



Mara
Nov. 29, 2009, 05:11 PM
In the past it's been Northern Dancer, Danzig, Mr. Prospector, Storm Cat. . .all were marquee names at the select sales, and when a top stakes mare retired it seemed a sure bet that one of these horses would be at least considered as a prospective mate (unless the mare was a daughter/granddaughter of, or closely related to). For example, I was sure when Darley purchased Ashado that she'd be going to Storm Cat (and I was right).

Just for fun, who might be the next in line to assume the mantle? Or are these days over with?

harvestmoon
Nov. 29, 2009, 06:50 PM
Medaglia d'Oro, Street Cry, Tiznow...

A.P. Indy and Dynaformer are still chugging along, too. For how much longer, I don't know.

I'm hoping Bernardini's foals end up being nice runners.

I'm pretty sure there will always be top stallions, no?

Mara
Nov. 29, 2009, 06:59 PM
Top stallions, yes, of course. You generally see the same names in the top 20 or so on the year-end rankings.
I'm talking about the ones who end up with legendary status (or close to).

AppJumpr08
Nov. 29, 2009, 07:13 PM
I'm curious to see if Birdstone continues to have the success he had this year...

LaurieB
Nov. 29, 2009, 07:16 PM
My guess is Medaglia D'Oro.

Rubyfree
Nov. 29, 2009, 07:50 PM
Medaglia D'Oro & Street Cry are looking good for that status right now- we'll have to see some of their boys hit the shed to get a better idea though.

Candy Ride was looking hot for a while there but it seems like his runners peter out of top form quicker than some.... maybe that's just my perception.

I would LOVE to see Hard Spun get the glory in the shed that he seemed to always be thisclose to having on the track. I love him.

shawneeAcres
Nov. 29, 2009, 08:41 PM
Giants Causeway seems like a heck of a sire and pretty big name fellow

keepthelegend
Nov. 29, 2009, 09:39 PM
I love Tapit

Mara
Nov. 29, 2009, 09:41 PM
One I've never felt has been given his due is Smart Strike, except for the Curlin years. He's been one solid sire, IMO.

Linny
Nov. 29, 2009, 09:57 PM
One I've never felt has been given his due is Smart Strike, except for the Curlin years. He's been one solid sire, IMO.

AP Indy, Distorted Humor, Smart Strike.


As for younger unproven sires, it's hard to tell. Medaglia d'Oro needs to sire a top class colt before he will be considered "elite" though he got better mares after his first foals hit the ground and were very good looking.
Tapit also needs a top colt. His fillies have carried the day for him for two years now.
Tiznow, by merit of his own modest breeding may always be the victim of some prejudice, though WinStar has supported him and had great success.

Meredith Clark
Nov. 30, 2009, 01:47 AM
I have no business commenting on this thread but I LOVE this horse

http://www.lanesend.com/stallions/stallions/rock_hard_ten/

Mara
Nov. 30, 2009, 09:47 AM
I have no business commenting on this thread but I LOVE this horse

http://www.lanesend.com/stallions/stallions/rock_hard_ten/


Rocky is one gorgeous dude, but he's got his sire's history against him. Kris S.'s kids haven't done so well in the shed.

KentuckyTBs
Nov. 30, 2009, 02:56 PM
Kris S. has sired some nice broodmares though. The farm I work at has two LOVELY Kris S. mares who both throw LOVELY foals (big, good bone, good looking) Though the one mares oldest is a 2 yr old of this yr who hasn't broke his maiden yet, though he's close! The other mares first foal is a yearling, so it is hard to tell if either mares will throw winners on the track... but boy as a hunter rider, I'd kill to have ANY of the offspring out of these two mares.... they're just lovely!

But I'm still learning about TB pedigrees, so my words don't count as much! ;-)

harvestmoon
Nov. 30, 2009, 04:11 PM
Rock Hard Ten got another stakes winner this weekend. :) Hopefully he keeps it up!

Drvmb1ggl3, I was thinking of Galileo. It's amazing to me what Urban Sea has done. Not only is she producing amazing racehorses, but she's producing producers, too. I hope Sea The Stars does well.

Prado Power
Nov. 30, 2009, 11:38 PM
I agree about Hard Spun. With Danzig you get the speed/miler, but he also has stamina lines through his dam, a Turkoman mare. And if he can pass that big heart along, look out!

A few more that have had some success early on,
Speightstown
Kitten's Joy
Tapit

Any of them could have that big breakout colt/filly in the next couple years.

Polydor
Dec. 1, 2009, 01:44 AM
Redoute's Choice (highes stud fee in australia) and More then Ready are fairly popular in australia. I know we have 5-7 mares being bred to Bernadini this coming year.

P.

vineyridge
Dec. 1, 2009, 12:28 PM
Is Cape Cross still alive? I love the Ahonoora in his pedigree.

I think Monsun is already at super status.

Mara
Dec. 1, 2009, 12:56 PM
Is Cape Cross still alive? I love the Ahonoora in his pedigree.

I think Monsun is already at super status.

I love Monsun. We'd do well (several pedigree experts are in agreement on this point) to start getting some of that blood into the US stock.

VirginiaBred
Dec. 1, 2009, 01:24 PM
I love Tapit

:yes: Me too.

ivy62
Dec. 1, 2009, 02:46 PM
I too would like to see some new blood in the US stock, that is why I am a fan of Leroidesanumaux and can't wait to see what Invasor does.....

Flypony
Dec. 2, 2009, 01:50 AM
Rock Hard Ten got another stakes winner this weekend. :) Hopefully he keeps it.
Quite a choice of words:lol::lol::winkgrin:

harvestmoon
Dec. 2, 2009, 06:06 PM
Rock Hard Ten got another stakes winner this weekend. :) Hopefully he keeps it.
Quite a choice of words:lol::lol::winkgrin:

:lol: Oy, I didn't even notice my wording till you pointed it out.

Now I'm amused with myself for being so unintentionally clever. ;) :winkgrin:

harvestmoon
Dec. 5, 2009, 08:27 PM
Hey, guess what? Rock Hard Ten is keeping it up. :D

He got another stakes winner today.

Forego
Dec. 6, 2009, 11:47 AM
Another vote for Hard Spun!

haligator
Dec. 7, 2009, 10:06 PM
Hi,
Of recent racing graduates and judging by the looks of offspring, I have to say Rockport Harbor immediately comes to mind. In general, add Malibu Moon, A.P. Indy, Smart Strike, and Hard Spun. I agree with whomever said that it would be wonderful if Hard Spun attained the top glory he was so often denied at the track.

I also believe the Birdstone's are due to take over all racetracks! I'd like to think Invasor and Empire Maker will hit big.

I'll also throw in Northern Afleet, Distorted Humor, Offlee Wild, and Sky Mesa as longshots in the stallion 'race,' as they've already produced some amazing horses.

Hallie
Hallie I. McEvoy
Racing Dreams, LLC

"Don't take your organs to heaven - heaven knows we need them here!"

Foxtrot's
Dec. 7, 2009, 11:06 PM
...I hope you are right about Malibu Moon ..:) :)

Mara
Dec. 8, 2009, 12:13 AM
I remember reading a post (not sure if it was here) from someone who did a little statistical research on unsoundness in Unbridled's Song offspring. If I recall, the numbers show that his kids are no more or no less sound than the average stallion's. He's just had the unfortunate luck to have some high-profile breakdowns and early retirements among his get.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

I'd love to see Rockport Harbor do well as a sire, and remove the bad hoodoo from the line!

ivy62
Dec. 8, 2009, 05:59 AM
I would really like to see some new blood. Either from Europe or Australia or South America.That is why I like Leroidesanimaux or Invasor. Our Tbs are too closely bred...

vineyridge
Dec. 8, 2009, 11:28 AM
With American stud fees what they are and people breeding for the sales barns, the same big name studs will be used over and over and over and over again.

I noticed that Shirocco's starting stud fee was about half of what it would have been in North America. The Brits don't seem to have the mindset of very high stud fees at first, then down that we do.

I just read a 2006 article speculating that Sadler's Wells was at 400,000 pounds at that time and that Galileo, who had just gone private, would be somewhere between 250,000 and 500,000 pounds.

(OT, but can someone please tell me how to get the pound sign (UK money) on my keyboard?)

Mara
Dec. 8, 2009, 01:06 PM
With American stud fees what they are and people breeding for the sales barns, the same big name studs will be used over and over and over and over again.

I noticed that Shirocco's starting stud fee was about half of what it would have been in North America. The Brits don't seem to have the mindset of very high stud fees at first, then down that we do.

I just read a 2006 article speculating that Sadler's Wells was at 400,000 pounds at that time and that Galileo, who had just gone private, would be somewhere between 250,000 and 500,000 pounds.

(OT, but can someone please tell me how to get the pound sign (UK money) on my keyboard?)

There may be an easier way than this, but click the "start" menu, then "Run". When the "run" window opens, type in charmap.exe, then click "OK". You'll get a window FULL of cool symbols. The sign for pounds sterling is fifth row down, third from the end.£££££

Other fun ones are ♫, ♣, ♀,♥, ☺, ♂, and☻. There are hundreds.

haligator
Dec. 9, 2009, 12:46 PM
Hey Mara,
Did you see the Rockport Harbor's at any of the sales? Maybe I'm crazy but I thought they looked good - really good - other than just a few who seemed a little light-boned. I'd be interested to know what you think if you saw them, albeit knowing about the genetic history.

And that brings up the point - would I breed or buy one? I just don't know if I'm the type to wade in and prove the bloodlines wrong. But, they sure looked nice :)

And, may say again MALIBU MOON? As far as I am concerned he is the 'it' stud.

Best,
Hallie
Hallie I. McEvoy
Racing Dreams, LLC

"Don't take your organs to heaven - heaven knows we need them here"

LaurieB
Dec. 9, 2009, 01:29 PM
I'm surprised that people are guessing that the next "super stud" might be horses who have yet to prove themselves as any kind of stallion at all. Don't get me wrong; I love Hard Spun (have a mare in foal to him in fact) and I've seen some great looking Rockport Harbors. But as of yet those two (plus Invasor and Leroideanimaux) have yet to show that they can even sire good runners much less become the kind of stallion that can shape the breed.

ivy62
Dec. 9, 2009, 03:00 PM
I like both of those horses for a few reasons...At least they both had successful careers in their own rite. They bring new blood into lines we have over used here..Some people I know have some Leroy babies and are very pleased with what they see so far and I hope Invasor proves to be a good stud...
Time shall only tell.....

littlebaypony
Jul. 6, 2016, 08:11 PM
Found this older post and, as a racing spectator who enjoys hearing from those in the know, wondered what each of you thought of the stallions you chose back in 2009. Who do you think are the new legends and the new up and coming prolific studs?

Can'tFindMyWhip
Jul. 6, 2016, 08:35 PM
I was reading through this thread, without looking at the dates and thinking, "Why aren't many people talking about Malibu Moon?" Funny.

I think this topic is pretty interesting too.

snaffle1987
Jul. 7, 2016, 08:20 AM
I think Uncle Mo will continue to gain popularity and success, much like Tapit did. I think we haven't seen the best of Tapit yet and that he is by far the most consistent sire out there right now with a very neat pedigree!

I am interested in seeing the first AP's hit the track. While triple crown winners are rarely replicated, AP's pedigree strikes me as very interesting and an interesting cross on a lot of mares. He has had a great first book of mares and I think he will be very fun to watch over the next few years.

Draftmare
Jul. 7, 2016, 08:51 AM
I love Tapit

Surprised nobody else has mentioned him in this thread. He is the first one I think of when I think of studs reaching legendary status.

Shammy Davis
Jul. 7, 2016, 10:41 AM
This has been a really interesting and unique year for the high end 2016 North American stallion list. Specifically, as it relates to the sires of Triple Crown stakes racing colts. Uncle Mo sired 3 that started in the KY Derby and 4 in the Preakness. Tapit sired 3 colts in the Derby. Giant’s Causeway sired 2 entered in the derby. Research from another website’s thread that I follow reveals that in the last 20 years of North American Thoroughbred racing history only Gone West sired three starters in the KY Derby in 2002. Further, going back to 1957, according to this individual’s research, it occurred in 1984 with sire Cox’s Ridge, 1974 with Damascus, and in 1959 with Royal Charger. As a disclaimer, I didn’t do a fact check, but the source is extremely reliable and knowledgeable.
What is even more interesting is the fact that currently in the industry fewer mares are being bred with a significant cut in progeny. The top three sires, in the thinking of my generation, were Northern Dancer, Mr. Prospector, and Bold Ruler. Bold Ruler sired around four hundred and fifty foals in his life time while Mr. Prospector sired about 1000. Northern Dancer, with about 650, was probably more significant in European racing, but his progeny have had international legs since his death in 1990. In contrast, this year’s derby crop was certainly an exception. Uncle Mo had 167 live foals from 211 mares covered which was an incredible first year. Tapit had 109 live foals from 134 covers. Giant's Causeway had 128 live foals from 166 mares covered. I know there are some who disagree with me when I say that top class sires reside at the head of list because it’s a numbers game and the odds are in their favor, but it is very hard not to take number of mares bred into account when data shows that less mares are being bred nationally. The industry conversation for decades since the 70’s has always been based on the big three stallion line progeny. I am wondering if the definition of the great sire is changed. Do we need to frame our discussion for a new baseline and what recent sires are the new base line? Does it matter?

Andrew
Jul. 7, 2016, 11:14 AM
Unbridled Song :-)...

Laurierace
Jul. 7, 2016, 02:26 PM
Unbridled Song :-)...

Hard to be the next anything when you are dead. Maybe broodmare sire.

ASB Stars
Jul. 7, 2016, 05:53 PM
Hard to be the next anything when you are dead. Maybe broodmare sire.

I didn't have the heart to tell him.

littlebaypony
Jul. 8, 2016, 12:15 AM
Wouldn't his last crop of foals just be hitting their stride on the track this year and next? Not that they will make him a "Super Stud" but perhaps there's something spectacular still to come?

Palm Beach
Jul. 9, 2016, 10:46 AM
The decrease in number of mares being bred is a reflection of fewer mares and
the economy.