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jazzrider
Nov. 17, 2009, 12:17 PM
My horsey identity (and my COTH signature) has officially changed. I put my beautiful dressage saddle on Ebay today -- finally facing the fact that Jazz is never going to come back enough from his injury for us to continue on with our dressage aspirations (low as they were).

Not sure how I feel about it. DH has been super -- actually discouraging me from selling it because he knows what it means to me. But here we are, three years past that fateful summer, and it feels right now. I took the first step by getting Luke, my TWH, two years ago (wow, time just flies!). Then riding Jazz lightly on the property, he's let me know his preferences are first to be bareback, second for my Circle Y western saddle, and third for the dressage saddle (I think he associates it with work!). That soft, new saddle in it's pretty custom cover has just been sitting in my tack room making me feel bad for both Jazz and I. So today I'm officially hanging up my backyard DQ identity, and when folks ask me what type of horsewoman I am, my answer will be "just a trailrider." But really, it's not a just. It's a good thing. Time to move along.

Anyone else go through something similar?

ChocoMare
Nov. 17, 2009, 12:41 PM
I left behind jumpers 20 years ago and never looked back.

Soooo nice having no pressure to "perform" or be totally correct in position, etc. It's just you and your horse, enjoying God's creation and having fun.

Once you start trailering out to ride the countryside, you'll ask yourself "What took me so long?!" :lol:

Can't wait to see pictures of you out and about! :cool:

Bank of Dad
Nov. 17, 2009, 01:33 PM
Next go the britches and boots. No one cares what you wear on the trail. Hell, your horse doesn't even need to be all that clean!

texang73
Nov. 17, 2009, 01:38 PM
Soooo nice having no pressure to "perform" or be totally correct in position, etc. It's just you and your horse, enjoying God's creation and having fun.



While I still love to jump cross country, but don't really like to nor can afford to compete, just school over fences... lately we have been doing lots and lots of trail rides to some great state and national parks, mostly for the reasons stated above by Chocomare! I love it! :D

saddleup
Nov. 17, 2009, 01:57 PM
And just because you are a trail rider doesn't mean you can't jump the occasional log or stream. Being comfortable at speed, or knowing how to jump, can save you in a tricky situation...like the time the skies opened with hail, horizontal rain, and lightning and we had to get off the mountain fast. Our horses all were ex-show horses, and they got us safely back to the trailers in record time.

IMO, there's no such thing as "just" a trail horse or rider.

But you know that already!

jazzrider
Nov. 17, 2009, 02:01 PM
Next go the britches and boots. No one cares what you wear on the trail. Hell, your horse doesn't even need to be all that clean!

Ugh, I have so many pairs of britches, and now I only ride in my favorite two or three. I may have to gift them to someone!

Chocomare -- I'm always the one with the camera, so there's never pics of me. This one is about it -- DH took it this summer.

ChocoMare
Nov. 17, 2009, 02:03 PM
Gawjus dahling! :yes:

ChocoMare
Nov. 17, 2009, 02:04 PM
And just because you are a trail rider doesn't mean you can't jump the occasional log or stream.

Ditto! :yes: Got to do just that this past Saturday (jumped two downed trees and a ditch :D)

tkhawk
Nov. 17, 2009, 06:59 PM
I love trail riding and camping. It is so relaxing and just being in nature alone or with your friends is great.

Also for dressage, I wonder how much does today's stuff actually represent what it was intended for? In the old days it was mostly to train war horses-hmmm I wonder if that is why they called it high school-you graduated and then went off to war?? But now there is no "graduation" per se. Skill of the rider and horse is not field tested , where you have people trying to kill you coming at you from all directions and death and injury and still have the horse listen to you, instead it is just ring tested with really no threat or distraction. Today you can use it generally in any type of riding-but not in war!

Trail riding isn't as easy as it seems-especially if you have a hot horse.:winkgrin: You just encounter so much stuff and it takes time to build trust in each other and I love it. I think you can use dressage while riding the trails-not the strict ride every step kinda thing, but the principles.

But to me just to able to ride your partner out there and have a blast is great. Plus I go camping a lot and you just meet so many fascinating people of all kinds and get to ride in some pristine country. I love it and so does my horse!!

rmh_rider
Nov. 18, 2009, 08:02 AM
Hi Jazzrider

Hello, my name is rmh_rider, I am a trail rider now too. (you all say: hello rmh_rider)

After many many years of riding and training for endurance, I have come to the fact and conclusion I can't ride those hard miles any more. Health issues. May sound easy, and a no brainer, but hard for me.

To work up before admitting I can't handle the hard long miles any more, I bought a 1.5 yr old rocky filly. Then I broke her. Then I certified her. Now we are enjoying the miles at a more comfortable pace. Relaxed, nice. She is now 3.5 yrs now. I have always been a trotter, now I ride gaited. I am happy to be riding at all. She has made it so I can!

I *didn't* sell any of my tack. As a matter of fact, my saddle (a Solstice) fits her perfectly, and it has a new life as a trail horse rider saddle only. I have all my other stuff I used for endurance. I still have my endurance horse. He still loves trail and is still quiet. He isn't all go go go iow. He doesn't mind a slower pace, or not being ridden as much these days.

Hard to admit to having to go to a different lifestyle with horses. But at least you still have horses, and still enjoy them, and CAN still enjoy them. Look how much knowledge you have now as a trail rider. !!! You can apply all you have learned to the trail. I do/did. My dressage riding (yes did that) helps alot.

I am enjoying NOT having to race out at the crack of dawn or earlier to train. It was hard to meet folks at 10am, and not 5am (to beat the heat).

Enjoy trail riding. Life is more beautiful from atop a horse. You get to see landscape nobody else gets to!

jazzrider
Nov. 18, 2009, 10:38 AM
Hello rmh_rider! :winkgrin: Thanks for your post.

I've been out riding the trails for a long time now, but as many of you know your horsey-identity is often wrapped up in what eventing or competing you've done -- and for me that was dressage. But now I've unwrapped myself, no more explanations of what I used to do before my horse got injured. Now I'm a trailrider. And I'm hoping this proclamation will take away the guilt of not doing enough ring work, not using my expensive dressage saddle (crossing my fingers Ebay will do it's thing!), and not training and just let me embrace trail riding for what it is. Dressage, for me, was my base training and it's a part of the rider I am. So I use those skills every time I ride -- out there on the trails. Now jumping, saddleup, if I tried that I'm pretty sure my TWH would fall on his cute little face. But who knows? ;)

ponygrl25
Nov. 18, 2009, 10:59 AM
Don't be too sure that you TWH can't jump. Both of mine are capable of jumping any log or ditch that gets in their way. The 4 year old will even hop over the electric fence if it isn't built to her ''high'';) standards.

Anyway, have fun out on the trail and maybe we'll see you out there! Wear what's comfy, ride the horse that enjoys his job, and see the sights (and post what you see and where you have been).

cloudy18
Nov. 18, 2009, 11:05 AM
It's all I have ever done. I probably can't afford to show, don't have the time, nor the desire to ride around in a circle that much. I would like to try endurance or competetive trail or maybe the extreme cowboy competitions, but not enough time for that either. Stupid work!

You can probably get rid of those extra britches on Ebay too! I like being able to wear whatever, use whatever tack. Also, friends of ours have kids in 4H and when she complains about getting up super early to bathe horses and she still doesn't even get to ride, I think how glad I am that we don't do that. My horses don't know what a bath is.

Welcome to trail riding, full time!

jazzrider
Nov. 18, 2009, 11:06 AM
ponygrl25, your sig made me laugh out loud. :lol:

My boy Luke is special. He seems to get his feet tangled up if he's doing anything but his flat walk or running walk. He's a marcher, and I can't even throw the reins away on the way home because he starts swirling his head around in confusion and bangs it on a tree. :lol: But you never know. We have yet to impulsively give it a try. I used to jump out on trail all the time with my OTTB, but Luke shows no aptitude or inclination for it. He just high steps it over things. :D

Where are you in VA? We're up north.

Eddy's Mom
Nov. 18, 2009, 11:46 AM
Yay! Welcome :D I showed hunters for years and years before hanging up my show helmet and field boots for trail. Pretty soon was I pretty heavy into endurance. I absolutely adore it. Funny though, I recently started missing "formal" riding and took up dressage. PM me the link to your saddle, I'm looking :eek: I am not planning on being a full-time DQ but so far I am really enjoying it. Plus the benefits of dressage on the trail are far too many to name. You are lucky, many "just trail riders" have horrid equitation and no control of their horses. Congratulations!! And you can always buy another dressage saddle and more show breeches if you decide to get back into it after a few years!

ChocoMare
Nov. 18, 2009, 11:54 AM
ponygrl25, your sig made me laugh out loud. :lol:

Ditto! :yes: I like Billy Graham's similar version:

Going to church doesn't make you a Christian. Just like me living in a garage doesn't make me a car.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

jazzrider
Nov. 18, 2009, 12:17 PM
Yay! Welcome :D I showed hunters for years and years before hanging up my show helmet and field boots for trail. Pretty soon was I pretty heavy into endurance. I absolutely adore it.

I'm intrigued by endurance riding but just don't think I have the time to commit to it. Every year I think I'm going to go to a intro clinic about it (someone usually posts it here) but then I don't. For now trail riding will hopefully be enough!

Sent you a PM on the saddle link. :)

BigHorseLittleHorse
Nov. 18, 2009, 12:39 PM
Same situation for me happened 15 (gasp!) years ago. My 11-year-old warmblood cross, who I had bought to be an eventer, suffered a career-ending injury. After 18 months of rehab, we had 13 years of slow, rambling trail rides, until I had to put him down this past April.

He was my only horse for a long time, until I finally adopted a rescue 3 years ago. I had no particular plans for the new guy, but he made it clear that he wanted to be an endurance horse. I was actually really happy about it, because after so long on the trail, somehow I couldn't contemplate returning to the arena...

monstrpony
Nov. 18, 2009, 12:48 PM
I was able to get back to trail riding this past summer, just bobbing along, watching nature go by, with the occasional long trot or bit of gallop thrown in. Nothing structured, nothing formal.

But I'm having a hard time motivating myself to do much else!

jazzrider
Nov. 18, 2009, 01:01 PM
BigHorseLittleHorse, are you aware that your post level right now is 666? :eek: Quick, post again!

:winkgrin:

And on returning to the arena -- yeah, I'm not sure I'm going to miss it too much either. Jazz and I shared a mediocre work ethic, must to the frustration of our trainer.

Austin Rider
Nov. 18, 2009, 01:55 PM
I love to trailride. I know you'll have lotsa fun.

For me, it's not an "either/or" choice. It's "all of the above." I started as a trailrider, then began dressage lessons when i realized that I needed some education. A foundation in dressage has made me a better overall rider. I still trailride and camp a lot, but also take weekly dressage lessons and recently enjoyed an informal schooling show for the heck of it. Next stop is learning to jump. It's all good and lotsa fun. Oh, and I trailride in my dressage saddle, but also have a western saddle that I use on occasion. As long as the saddle fits, the horse sure doesn't care.

I can see that it's different for folks who started out with lessons & showing and did enough to get the been-there-done-that medal. By the time you shift to trailriding, you already have a strong riding foundation to rely on. I'm dyslexic and did it backwards! :)

Have fun!

pj
Nov. 18, 2009, 03:50 PM
[QUOTE=ponygrl25;4504887]Don't be too sure that you TWH can't jump. Both of mine are capable of jumping any log or ditch that gets in their way. The 4 year old will even hop over the electric fence if it isn't built to her ''high'';) standards.

QUOTE]

Don't sell those walkers short in the jump dept.
I fox hunted one for a couple of years. He jumped many a 3-1/2 ft chicken coop, rails, etc. etc. and did it well.
I expect it's like any breed in that some will have more talent than others.

twhs
Nov. 18, 2009, 10:35 PM
Jazzrider --

What's the ebay link or id # for your dressage saddle?
BTW, I rode babycakes Chloe today for the first time -- and in a dressage saddle!!!

For the rest of you, Chloe, is my TWH who was born in my brand new barn on my birthday 4 years ago. I'm a senior so I've had other people working with her in the saddle while I played with her on the ground. Today was quite a thrill. Only ten minutes --mainly because the dressage saddle was killing me (LIke Jazzrider, I'm accustomed to a cushy Tucker) but tomorrow will be longer.

AlfalfaGirl
Nov. 18, 2009, 11:27 PM
glad to have another trailrider. I am enjoying the trails myself and constantly looking for trails to ride.

I was hurt on a horse a year ago and am working on my confidence and riding the trails is helping. I wish I had had training on jumping! My gelding jumped a ditch the other day - I don't which one of us looked worse...he stumbled when he landed and I nearly pitched off on the left - ended up with a bruise on my leg from slamming into my western pommel!!!:lol: Your former training will certainly make you look more graceful going over a ditch or jumping a tree.

Ponygirl - your sig line is funny...I am from Texas so I thought that was a scream.

winkybear
Nov. 19, 2009, 12:06 AM
Hi!

I started in Dressage early, was riding upper level horses at age 11. It was way cool. :D

My riding life has always been Dressage, Dressage, Dressage. I did very little competing due to ongoing health issues, but I never gave up!

Then I became permanently disabled from my health issues. I stopped riding for several years while I recovered as best I could. But my life was empty without at least one horse. :no:

Now, at age 53, I am privileged to own a rescued paint with a jaw-dropping extended trot and such fluidity with his at-liberty 'roll backs' it makes me cry. :eek:

But he also has some intermittent lameness issues, and I don't have anywhere near the strength of core and legs required to ride all those fancy moves any more. My right calf muscle is so atrophied that I use a spur on my right foot.

But ya know what we both enjoy? Hitting the trails! We can walk until the cows come home!

I sold my Dressage saddle and now ride in an Aussie, for safety on the trail. My Ice is very calm and well-behaved but I feel very secure in the Aussie -- I ain't coming outta that saddle unless I want to :winkgrin:.

I ride in a synthetic Western barrel saddle (lightweight for him) for our arena work.

Yes! There is life after Dressage!! :lol:

jazzrider
Nov. 19, 2009, 09:42 AM
Jazzrider --

What's the ebay link or id # for your dressage saddle?
BTW, I rode babycakes Chloe today for the first time -- and in a dressage saddle!!!

For the rest of you, Chloe, is my TWH who was born in my brand new barn on my birthday 4 years ago. I'm a senior so I've had other people working with her in the saddle while I played with her on the ground. Today was quite a thrill. Only ten minutes --mainly because the dressage saddle was killing me (LIke Jazzrider, I'm accustomed to a cushy Tucker) but tomorrow will be longer.

Fabulous that you rode Chloe! Was she good for you? I need to come over and play in the ring with you. Are you going on Saturday's ride at the Arboritum?

It's so great to hear that everyone has loved the transition from competing/showing/training to trail riding and been ok with the change in horse-world-identity. :yes:

BigHorseLittleHorse
Nov. 19, 2009, 01:00 PM
BigHorseLittleHorse, are you aware that your post level right now is 666? :eek: Quick, post again!

:winkgrin:

And on returning to the arena -- yeah, I'm not sure I'm going to miss it too much either. Jazz and I shared a mediocre work ethic, must to the frustration of our trainer.

oh no! Thanks for pointing that out... luckily nothing bad has happened in the last 24 hours, other than boring corporate meetings :)

baylady7
Nov. 19, 2009, 01:12 PM
Hi Jazz

My boy retired from the ring last fall and now is exclusively a trail dude. Now he does from time to time have to do some dressage work when we are hacking- keeps him supple, fit and responsive. But he also gets a ton of long and low time too. It is nice though when he willingly rounds up when cantering across a field- that comes from years of training and building his body up. Enjoy your rides!!!

matryoshka
Nov. 23, 2009, 12:06 PM
Another rider facing physical issues that make riding tough. I now have a good endurance/CTR prospect but am not sure I've got the ability to do all the riding necessary for conditioning or to handle the day of competition. It sucks.

Accepting limitations is never fun. For me there is usually a period of depression until I can figure out some alternatives to salvage my self-esteem. Usually requires setting new goals that are within reach.

I'm not quite ready to give up my goals of competing at distance, so we'll see.

I agree that "just trail" isn't very descriptive of the skills, soundness, and sanity that riders and horses must have to negotiate trails safely and well. Sure, a horse may be unsuited to the show ring or other event and he can learn to do trails well. But he has to be trained and be able to negotiate varied terrain, sometimes in the face of serious distractions and outside stressors.

Trail horses are cool and deserve respect, whether they are distance horses or used for pleasure riding. I've got an OTTB that can only manage about 10 miles at a time due to a racing injury. He's the best trail horse I've ever ridden. He stays cool under pressure and has the remarkable ability to calm other horses down. When I lead a trail ride on him, the horses who start out nervous calm down and seek him out. He could care less who he is near on the trail, but if I look around, I'll find that all the formerly-nervous horses are trying to get as close as they can to him. I call him "Papa Frank" when he is leading a ride.

I wish I knew his secret. That's a knack I'd like to have! There are a few "papa" horses out there. They are extra special, in my book.

wanabdriver
Nov. 24, 2009, 02:14 PM
Welcome to trial riding!! IMO the best thing to do on horseback and the horses favorite thing!! Mine anyway. To me trial riding even become a lot of work. I was always schooling on the trial. Making sure I did a perfect circle and figure eights, correct leads and basically working up a good sweat for me and the horse!!

A week ago I decided I had had enough of all of this! I am strictly going to go from point a to b and enjoy the scenery. I won't let me horse get away with anything but I am just going to relax from now on. I was actually burnt out. I also have a pony that I drive and ride and also have to work him and my QH plus work, kids, house and bills!! Well I have made the decision that they will go out twice per week and that's it!!

Since that decision I have been more relaxed and so have they. If I ride I ride, if not oh well. Makes you appreciate the time you do have out there and enjoy it even more.

Have fun, Heather

Rackonteur
Nov. 24, 2009, 04:28 PM
Hello, rmh_rider! :)

Jazzrider,

I don't think "just" goes with "a trail rider." :) I have known plenty of DQs who were terrified of taking their horses outside the arena and onto the trails, so to me there is nothing "just" about being a trail rider. I wish I were brave enough to go trail riding. I used to love it when I was young, and would go from the ring to the trails and back and forth without even thinking about it. These days I find my western saddle far more comfortable than a dressage saddle (although I find breeches more comfortable than jeans).

I admire you for getting out on the trails and I hope I will get brave enough to get back out on some too.

cloudy18
Nov. 24, 2009, 08:16 PM
That's the beauty of trail riding, you can wear breeches in a Western saddle if you want! Or jeans in an English saddle. Or no saddle at all, but please wear pants of some sort.

rmh_rider
Dec. 22, 2009, 10:04 AM
Hey Rackontuer

So are you riding a gaited horse? What breed?

Me, of course I am riding a Rocky. What a nice breed! Talk about an easy easy horse. She is a tough cookie on the trail, she is a natural iow. Sweet temperment too.

She is one of those horses other horses who are nervous gravitate to. But then, my arab is one also. Maybe it is me?

Hey those x-show horses are fabulous on trails too. I have ridden with many and they usually are the best! They do like to break up the work in the arena and ride trails. I have found it helps their minds. And yes, you can do dressage work ON THE TRAILS.

Come over to the fun side, let's trail ride.

And if you haven't ridden horses in the snow, you HAVE TO. It is a blast! Trails sure beat the arena.

matryoshka
Dec. 22, 2009, 10:16 AM
That's the beauty of trail riding, you can wear breeches in a Western saddle if you want! Or jeans in an English saddle. Or no saddle at all, but please wear pants of some sort.:lol::lol::lol:

I found a lady who is willing to ride my little Arab mare in distance competition this year. I've had trouble with days of pain after riding and don't think I can manage the training schedule to compete her myself. This rider is more patient than I and a lovely rider. I don't want my limitations to negatively affect the horse's future. I feel very fortunate to have found a good arrangement.

I'm trying to find a saddle that lets me ride without hurting myself. If I can't find one, I think I'll have to give up riding altogether. That's a tough prospect to face. I haven't tried side-saddle yet, but that's another stop on my way to figuring out how I can stay on the trails.

I also have a young pony that turns three this year. I plan to get her going under saddle and have her broke to drive. Driving is an option, buy ai yai yai--you need to haul the horse and the cart to go out on the trail! Logistics nightmare!! Possible, though.

JollyBadger
Dec. 22, 2009, 01:23 PM
IMO, there is no such thing as "just" a trail rider, and no such thing as "just" a trail horse.;)

While we may not have show-winning equitation, we have the balance and "feel" to ride our horses in a variety of terrain, elevation, footing, distance and weather that a lot of "arena-only riders" would never even attempt.

Not to say that there is anything wrong with arena work - all of my "formal" riding education took place in an arena, and I still do arena work with my TWH to brush up on things. I just prefer the freedom that I have out on trail, and enjoy the constantly-changing scenery.

Heart's Journey
Dec. 22, 2009, 01:55 PM
I showed as a young girl and a little bit as an adult and I find trail riding much more challenging. I camp 2x a month from Oct - April and cover a lot of ground out in the woods.

Camped mid Dec with friends and on one 3 hr trail ride we rode past an 8' gator (about 15' away from us in a ditch), saw 10 wild pigs, about 12 deer, crossed a deep stream (water was halfway up my leg on my 15 hand horse), sloggged through about 2 miles of water along the trail, flushed tons of birds along the ride, and not a single one of us had any issues with our wonderful solid trail horses. As others have mentioned trail riding can be chock full of scary stuff that horses in a ring never encounter. It takes a brave rider to handle this stuff and while our horses aren't necessarily as highly trained for show events though do have to be able to perform a lot of functions for enjoyable rides.

Sunday we were out riding and crossed a narrow scary bridge twice, rode up & down an embankment that has cross ties to hold the sand in, crossed a very busy 6 lane road that the crossing light is very short (trot across), etc

I too feel that trail horses and trail riders are often short changed in the minds of many people, but we know that good trail horses are a treasure worth keeping.

rmh_rider
Dec. 22, 2009, 02:12 PM
Hey Heart's,

So what rig do you camp in? I have rig feva.

And where ya going to ride on such FABulous trails? Just in So Flow?

I won't go back to showing ever, never. Way too much landscape to see, and to me, and arena is not landscape!

Only way to see the land, the real land, is from the back of a horse.

Heart's Journey
Dec. 22, 2009, 03:43 PM
I have a Dodge 2500HD Diesel crew cab and pull a 2H GN LQ and have covered alot of miles, mostly in Fla, though I have traveled to Ga, TN, KY, and IL.

You would be surprised how many places we have to ride and camp - State Parks, Water Management Areas, State Forests, private lands, etc I'm a bit of a research nut and have found tons of places and have 6 thick notebooks full of maps, info, etc. The internet is a wonderful thing! Plus when traveling to a camping location, I will often stop and day ride somewhere so I can see what those trails are like and take pictures of the trail heads, etc.

I'm heading to my mom's for Christmas with my SSH horse, Rico in tow - will be there for 3 days (good friend has horse property) then head to the west coast to Alafia River State Park, stopping at SUMICA and Walk in the Water to day ride. After camping 3 nights at Alafia, will stop for one night at Little Manatee River State Park to ride those trails, then day ride at Deep Creek on the way home....

We don't have the type of scenery that many of you have (I've done week long rides in Wyoming (8), Utah, Missouri, and Indiana) but we make up for it in quantity. We do have alot of lakes, streams, deer, eagles, wild hogs, and gators to make it interesting.

Maybe someday our paths will cross

Thinkinghorses
Dec. 23, 2009, 03:57 AM
My horse and I enjoy trial riding the best. We work at improving ourselves in the arena at times, but the real relaxation and fun is going out to just see what there is to see. It can be the same trail but each time offer something different.
I feel trail riding is the most difficult ride from the perspective of the unknown. What is in those bushes or just around the corner? We dont know til we get there. :) It can be hard work to build up the confidence of horse and rider so that one can go anywhere or encounter anything and yet feel secure. But very well worth the effort.
Continue to enjoy the journey.

JackandMo
Dec. 23, 2009, 01:22 PM
At the ripe old age of 35, I have decided that the trails is where I belong.

I have leased out my ASB to be shown in 2010 in the HCP division, but when he's not in training or at shows, he and I hit the trails. I've started getting a little bit more adventerous and starting to get braver about rougher terrain, hills, embankments, etc.

I feel more secure and at ease on the trails. I love it!

siseley
Dec. 23, 2009, 04:01 PM
If any folks are planning to come to the left coast, look us up and lets ride. We have an extra stall, and a 80x100 turnout area for the horses, and a partial hookup for your rig. ( no septic tank back there next to the barn and turnout) You can ride for the next 20 miles across the open flats, or cross the buttes and be in some great hills and even deep sand if that is what you like, All this from the house.
Orrrr... lets hitchup the trailer and go ride the Red Rock of the El Paso mtns where they still mine gold,silver,tungsten, and lead. See some "Ghost Towns", and scenery that gives meaning to "blue sky and red sandstone". Just don't ride Red Rock in the summer....way too hot!
( but we've done it in competition ):rolleyes: