View Full Version : Corona Del Sol stepped up their game!

Nov. 16, 2009, 05:02 PM
I don't know about anyone else but I had a blast at Corona this weekend.
They really changed up the XC course! I took my new girl (Maddie) to her first novice. Had 2 refusals XC and 2 rails in stadium (that was my bad). They put the stadium in their small arena which was difficult but a good challenge. lots of tight twists and turns. ( kinda like their xc). My only complaint was there xc jump judges.. they were placed in interesting spots and i think there were a lot of mistakes on refusals and such but still .. overall.. a challenging and different course. Nothing like any other horse trial in area 5. Also... they gave really great prizes.. i mean they had hand made/panted plates and bowls in the shape of horses, this really cute rose made of metal and barbwire, and this saddle caddy thing! Something you don't see much at other area 5 shows. I think they are working really hard out there... so if you were on the fence about attending corona.. i recommend its worth taking a look!

Nov. 16, 2009, 07:19 PM
I enjoyed it, but I'm not sure either of my horses really loved the facility. I did think it was well-run, and the jumps were very nice on XC and in stadium. I was really shocked by the number of refusals. It seems like there were so many more than usual, and quite a few falls. Was it just because horses weren't used to the terrain and footing? (For my green pony, I know the terrain was the issue.) Or, since they had said in the omnibus "all courses easy for your first time at the level," did people step up a level and get caught by surprise? I had considered it, and I'm glad I didn't- A lot of the jumps seemed to be max height with some very interesting approaches. Sure, there were no banks (except in T) or ditches, but I found the XC to be quite difficult... especially when it came to remembering where I was going! I got lost twice on the Novice course, and once had to jump an extra BN jump to get back on my course!

One area of improvement might be putting out landmarks of some kind so people can remember which mesquite grove to gallop into- "turn right at the huge cactus" didn't narrow it down much for me! Another improvement on XC might be restricting course walkers. They really got in the way of a lot of rides. Because the terrain is not very open and it's not easy to see a horse coming at you, or a walker in your path, designated course walkign times might be wise.

I agree about the jump judges. I realize that they're volunteers and not very educated or experienced, but I listened in on part of their briefing, and their instructions may have been a bit confusing. I know many stops at fence 1 were overturned, because the jump judge was sitting in a truck way over by the final two jumps, and he couldn't possibly see clearly. My concern was at fence 2 on BN1. My super-green pony (umm, you probably all saw her, or at least heard her screaming whinnies all weekend!) was elminated on XC, which I knew was likely to happen, but I was shocked to see the score card and find out I had been charged with 2 stops at 2. My pony was really, really freaked out during her first little trip through cactus and mesquite, so she was looking at everything and stopped several times on the winding path to 2... but by the time we came around the final bend and actually got around to presenting to the jump, she took it like a champ. Clearly, the terrain was an issue, not the jump. I protested, and was denied on both counts. I have no clue what the jump judge saw. Maybe one refusal? But two? Oh well, she settled in after that jump and was a champ for the rest for the ride, and for stadium. And the rest of the jump judges seemed ok to me- even though we had some bobbles and freak outs, the rest of the judges made good calls on what was a refusal and what wasn't. :)

I really liked the stadium course. There were lots of turns, but all completely do-able. Jumps were very creative, but inviting at the same time. I liked the change in elevations- it added an interesting element.

The dressage judge, in my opinion, was way too nice. Spazzy Pony, who warmed up all nice then decided the dressage ring was a rodeo arena, got a 49 when I had predited roughly 64. (I had to shorten my reins on the free walk because she was doing a jig, and we got a 6!?) :) My other mare knocked 4 points off her normal score with a test that was very much on par with her usual. 8 points less than what the Greenwood judge gave us! Every test got a big smiley face and words of encouragement... like I do with my students at school who are slow learners... :)

Concessions were good, prizes were good, things ran fast even with Sunday's delays. The photographer (Terrie Hatcher) was great about making sure everyone got lots of photos, and it was great to have The Eventing Shop on site as well. I don't think many people had their best performances ever, but it was still fun. :)

Nov. 16, 2009, 11:41 PM
I did see your talkative pony.. very very cute pony btw.. she just needs therapy for her separation anxiety. hehe. i saw your dressage test with her. very comical. but eh. what can ya do.

i think it was the terrain as far as looky horses and refusals. most horses just aren't exposed to that type of environment. also i have been there every show since they opened... it was easy easy easy for the first few shows. i think they have had not really complaints but strong suggestions that jumps be more difficult. and i did notice it was a lot more refusals than usual. i think a lot of people went there and move up for the first time ( i know i did with the 2 i brought) and they were a bit surprised.

also i believe they have big plans for clearing out some of those mesquite and making footing and ground better. but there gonna have to if they are planning on having the BN and N championships there next year.

but yeah .. jump judges were a problem...we had girls who were marked for refusals when they really didnt but they honored it. the girl that was at jump 6 for the novice ( after a water when you go into the tree line and the sharp right hand turn) she was sitting on the ground.. indian style.. texting on her phone ... obviously not paying attention. hehe.. i had a refusal at that jump because my horse was more focused on the scary girl sitting on the ground than the jump. and she was in my path to go to that fence.. i tried to go as far wide left before turning so i would have more of a direct approach. when i did have a refusal i took a left hand turn.. and of course she was in my way.. so she decides to get up and starts JOGGING OUT OF THE WAY! my second refusal was the very next fence. and my mare was looking at the fake windmill.. ( which was fake yet mobile) she was freaking out at that instead of looking at the fence.. other than that, we got our head in the game and everything was great.

Nov. 17, 2009, 01:20 PM
Good to know!! I have been avoiding going there because of feedback about the facilities and organization of the show. It's always at a good time for me though, and if they are going to step it up, I am excited!!!

Nov. 17, 2009, 09:15 PM
My second refusal on my novice mare was at 7 too. My problem was the winding path- there was a sharp right bend, then you had to make a sharp left to the jump, and I came at it going too fast on the wrong lead because I was completely indecisive. :) Of course, that was after we had stopped at the water. We've never had a water issue, but I guess the mare didn't like the white water. She, by the way, needs therapy just as much as her kid sister!

I think the jump judge at 6 was still on the ground when I came through. The rider before me had fallen there, and the golf cart blindly cut me off trying to get to her (nobody told me to hold or anything). I was busy avoiding the golf cart and the horseless rider, and I blew past the turn and headed toward the training jump. The jump judge waved and started pointing to the novice jump. A big no-no! Of course, I would have figured it out and looped back around. I did almost plow her down when I turned back! Oh well... some poorly trained jump judges, but you can't be too picky way out in the middle of nowhere. :)

Were you, by any chance, stabled across from me? I wasn't exactly a model of patience this weekend! I think I may have lost my temper once or twice when the mares were screeching for eachother and climbing their stall walls. You just can't stop love. :)

Nov. 17, 2009, 10:42 PM
was there a big belgian cross across the way from you? i was in the second barn from the road facing the arenas and xc. i didnt notice any talkative mares across the way. but yeah i wasnt the model of patience either... i was riding that belgian cross.. he is 6 but mentally 2. he is huge and guy who has no personal space and has no idea how to stay out of my bubble. so i was the one shoving the 1400 belgian cross out of my way. hehe. without success.

the jump judge at 6 assisted my trainer as well. which is a big big no no! agreed! i guess you were the rider in front of me because as i was in the start box i heard on the radio "rider down" but they said 3, 2, 1 go! so no hold for me either.

and yeah i think on jump 7 i was on the wrong lead as well.. that didnt help at all.

yeah i brought that belgian guy for is second training but the first one was a while ago and he was in a lot better shape.. he was refusing jumps from 12 strides back .. so we obviously didnt finish.
but good weekend over all .. im just glad my welsh cob/tb mare finished her first novice. i was expecting some refusals.

Nov. 18, 2009, 07:05 PM
I heard the stalls were terrible... truth?

Nov. 18, 2009, 07:42 PM
Truth. :) Really, just the stall dividers. I loved the dutch doors, and the size was fine, but the dividers were just one big sheet of really thin plywood. I lived in fear that my two mares would knock it down to get to eachother. I much prefer for them to be able to see eachother, which they couldn't. It seemd like one careful kick would take down the wall.

Nov. 18, 2009, 07:46 PM
Yeah, I heard the stable conditions werent great from a few people. I'm thinking of going to their next event in March. I'm not one that expects my temp stall to be in a million dollar barn or anything, but I expect my horse to be reasonably safe and such.

Nov. 18, 2009, 08:39 PM
I agree they stepped up their game in a big way. I have competed there 3 times in a row, all at training. Each time they have changed the cross country course.
This time they changed it in a way that made the difficulty go way up. They used the same fences, but placed them in such a way to add a harder question to the fence.
I loved it, since it was the end of the season and if it had been the same course as the beginning of the season I would have felt like I ended on a novice run.
They continue to improve the footing, although it is not quite there yet. It has improved a lot since February, that is for sure!
The stalls are nice in my opinion. They are the old barns from Las Colinas. They are bigger than tent stalls and have dutch doors, which is cool for your horse to be able to hang their heads out. They have plenty of places to snap buckets to. I didn't notice the dividing walls to be in bad shape, so that may be a problem in only a few of the stalls. Hopefully the owners will fix that, I agree a safe stall is imperative!
This time they made the stadium a challenge. The June event the stadium was very small. This event it was max heights with max questions. The time was extremely tight also. It was a stadium course that shuffled the standings, which I like when stadium is before cross country, but not the day after. A few breather fences would be prefered, but hey, at least we had a challenging round to end the season.
I will send in my event evaluation again and suggest pea gravel in the wash rack again. (I suggested that after the June event) The deep sand that becomes mud and sucks off your boots and your horses hooves has got to go!
All in all it is a very fun show, and it keeps getting better. I will continue to support it. Its not perfect, but the more support, the better it will get!

Nov. 22, 2009, 09:56 PM
Anybody know what happened to the photos? They seem to have disappeared from Terrie Hatcher's site! I spent all week drooling and deciding which ones to buy. Now I can't have any. :(

Nov. 23, 2009, 02:41 PM
Wild. I just tried to view the pictures and I got a message that said I had to pay a fee to see them.......

Nov. 23, 2009, 07:12 PM
Wow, that is just really tacky. I understand that she's dealing with the facebook thing, but really... every photographer deals with that. It's not fair to her, but it's part of the job, and her reaction is tacky. There were several cute pictures of my pony, and I was waiting to buy until I had seen the pics my trainer's husband took. I really wanted to get pictures since it was Rocket's first show... but I don't think I want to play this game. Honestly, Terrie Hatcher is an amazing artist, but as far as horse show pics go, she's not the greatest out there. There were no good ones of my novice mare, just a few of the pony. The prices were already a bit high to begin with. To pay just to see her proofs (after she had posted HUGE signs ALL OVER THE PLACE at the show that proofs would be available online) is a little ridiculous. I would still love to buy some of the pictures of my pony, but not if I have to pay just to go in and choose. :(

blue horse 99
Nov. 24, 2009, 03:01 PM
This is our livelihood, not a hobby. It is long hard work, at the show and at the computer. Photographing horses is a skill and a talent, we love it, but we must
put food on the table. As a rider myself, Eventing is where I want to be. Eventing is expensive, the entry fees do not match the effort it takes to put on these courses. I am embarrassed for the Eventing community to have to deal publicly with the issue of stealing photographs. Most Eventers are extremely fair, honest, courageous and loyal.
Terrie Hatcher photography goes above and beyond to sort the images to name as a customer requested many years ago. We are notorious for correcting images no charge when purchased, we do not sell “on site” so that we can control the quality of our product. Our equipment is the best money can buy. We take pride in quality images and good customer service. It is my fond desire to be able to continue. Nobody in this business wants to keep clients from using their pictures, that would be self defeating. With the advent of the internet and the availability of printers and scanners rights usage
has become an issue for all photographic fields. The future of ALL photographers is in grave jeopardy - Free for all speculation shooting will probably become a thing of the past.. For years we have all watched people steal images to sell their horse with, or link directly to our sites to sell the horse, without out ever supporting the cost to us. Facebook is the latest theft, with no real way to detect or deal with the theft,
we are truly powerless to protect ourselves. The argument is, but what is the difference if we can send a postcard? The difference is that the image is directly under you name to promote you and for you and your “friends” to enjoy. Who needs a website? Yes, lets call it the real name - theft, shoplifting, stealing... since no one seems to respect the words copy RIGHT. but, “everyone is doing it” - would you also walk off the bridge with “everyone”? The Officer would not necessarily let you off the speeding ticket because you said you did not know there was a speeding limit and “everyone” is doing it. It is very hard for me to grasp that people think, -it’s on a picture, we are only going to use it to sell the horse. I cannot sit idly by and say or do nothing as we drown. This is a last attempt effort at trying to get everyones attention! So, I’m very happy to get your notice and to hear what you have to say. I welcome anyone to call me and talk to me 817-781-3643. My whole point is to be very certain that “everyone” is informed.
If you contact me and let me know you understand the situation and what your intention is, I will post your images -no charge. However let me point out its a valuable service we provide, movies aren’t free, pictures aren’t free, and if all you intend on doing is using without paying or entertaining yourself, then $12.00 is a extremely reasonable price to contribute for my time and equipment. Thank You, Terrie

Nov. 24, 2009, 03:45 PM
Wow, that is just really tacky. I understand that she's dealing with the facebook thing, but really... every photographer deals with that. It's not fair to her, but it's part of the job, and her reaction is tacky. There were several cute pictures of my pony, and I was waiting to buy until I had seen the pics my trainer's husband took. I really wanted to get pictures since it was Rocket's first show... but I don't think I want to play this game. Honestly, Terrie Hatcher is an amazing artist, but as far as horse show pics go, she's not the greatest out there. There were no good ones of my novice mare, just a few of the pony. The prices were already a bit high to begin with. To pay just to see her proofs (after she had posted HUGE signs ALL OVER THE PLACE at the show that proofs would be available online) is a little ridiculous. I would still love to buy some of the pictures of my pony, but not if I have to pay just to go in and choose. :(

this post is even more tacky. And the words in bold, even worse.

I believe that Terrie's phone number and email have always been listed on the Photoreflect website. Is it so much to give a quick phone call?

Nov. 24, 2009, 03:59 PM
I think it is just a bad marketing strategy..........I know that I wait until the end of the year and then order TONS of pics from Jim Stoner. If I had to pay and view at each show I went to (6x12=$72) I would be much more hesitant to buy.

I think that there are many industries that deal with electronic stealing, but passing the cost of some people's mistakes onto your are client base is counter intuitive and creates resentment. Without those clients to photograph you would have no business at all and the proofs of the clients OWN LIKENESS should be available to be previewed for free.

I wonder how many other horse show photographers do that.......

Nov. 24, 2009, 04:54 PM

photog spinoff

Nov. 24, 2009, 05:03 PM
I think that the economy today is changing the way a lot of things are going on.

First, I know and adore Terrie, but face it area 5, MANY of you steal pics from thier and put them on websites, facebook. I have seen it on many of our friends facebook.

I am expierancing a lot of problems that I think follow along with this. People want what we have for free. Thier general attitude seems to be, you stand out here and give me a lesson, or got o a show, or...name it...and it's not costing you anything, you are just standing here anyway. Wrong. It's my time, work, the place, the insurance. For Terry, it's the camera's. THe time, her bills at home....

Is it fair to ask someone to preview her website, it's the way it is going to be more and more if people keep helping themselves to the pictures the way that they currently do.

She is more than willing to let people look at thier pics free if she knows they aren't going to steal.

You say it's built into the cost of the pics the theft, guess what, neither Terrie or even myself, build theft into the price of what we charge. I am closing, period, because the last bunch of people we had in here stole us blind when they left. The horse that my daughter rode daily, sometimes twice a day, left and stole what they thought they were entitled to. Including prizes we won....how does one build that into the costs? Or the pain of it?

IF the pics I see all over the place from Terrie and Jim are any indication of how bad this problem is, Get ready to pay 100.00 per 5x7. Because that might start to cover it.

IF I built the cost of the thefts I have had over the past month in tack, shampoos, yada yada yada into my board, just to cover everything, I would have be charging 2 or 3 hundred more a month.

Along those lines, area5, stealing clients. I think everyone needs to start having some loyalty around here.I know of one trainer, other then me, who told me that in the past week, 3 clients moved to other barns. People she considered friends...HELLO? Yes, the argument is there that we want them to be happy? I think that marriage today is a good inidicator of some of the crap. We don't work to resolve conflicts or differing opinions, we just move on....I personally, WON'T take another trainer's student who lives in this town. I just don't. I will take someone who is at a place and thier horse is not being cared for, but they aren't working with someone....

Maybe that archaic, or old fashioned, but I want the trainers to be aware that I understand how that hurts me.

Anyway, Terrie you have great pics, and anyone who has ordered from you, and Jim know it.


Nov. 24, 2009, 07:13 PM
Gold 2012:

Wow!! I have not seen or heard of the amount of stealing, barn hopping, etc in the group of people I event with. We all ride at different barns and use different trainers. I choose these people because of their substance and the way they conduct themselves. We are a group of people that have evented together for years (14+ for some of us), grew up in PC together, serve on local eventing orgs, etc.....

Maybe it's unintentional, but I would review the people I call friends and they way my barn was marketed, to look at why this is happening to you. I am sure that you are a reputable trainer and that should show through in your clients.

Nov. 24, 2009, 07:32 PM
Terrie, I think you da bomb. I'm sorry it's come to this.

What about a password protected site that you can get to ONLY after you've agreed NOT to post pictures you haven't paid for?

I've watched Terrie put out blood sweat and tears for all of us, and I will do whatever it takes. I would hate to lose her!

Nov. 24, 2009, 09:32 PM
Forgive me for being computer illeriate, but I have posted Terri's pictures of me on my facebook. I thought I could because I bought a cd of the images.......Please tell me that is different than what we are talking about, because I am in no way a thief, I really thought I could post when I bought the cd of images...

Nov. 24, 2009, 09:36 PM
Are you serious? I have never been to a single photographer's website that isn't protected by simple basic software. Even smugmug for amature photographers uses it.

I can't imagine charging some to LOOK at photos.

Nov. 24, 2009, 10:02 PM
Wow, Gold, that was a bit of a bitter post. Why stay in Area 5 if you seem to lump as all together as thieves? :rolleyes: Maybe there's fewer meanies in another sandbox?

Terrie, the thing that got me was mostly just the way that proofs were there, then suddenly not there, then suddenly back for a charge, but no real message or explanation left on your website. I kept looking around, sure that I'd see some sort of note explaining the situation and the reason for the change. Yes, your reasoning should be intuitive, but when one changes their method of business drastically and suddenly, a little careful PR is usually needed. The note posted as the "proof" picture didn't really come across that way.

I'm fully aware of copyright issues and such, and it is a bit offensive to law-abiding potential customers when things are said like "no one seems to respect the words copy RIGHT." Some do. Don't alienate those customers. As far as what you said about posting links to your website on facebook... I've searched and read what I could, and as far as I can tell, there's no copyright issue there, as no "copy" of your work is actually made and the link brings up your site which you had (at the time) made publically available anyway. I did post a link to your site on my own facebook last week, mostly because some teens from my barn had managed to not pay attention to your huge signs and still didn't know where to go for proofs. If you're offended, I'll go ahead and take the link down- it doesn't work anymore anyway. :)

I guess it just sucks that you feel you have to take these measures because that many people are ripping you off. Please don't assume we all are. I was thinking last night about ways to protect yourself without making things more difficult for legitimiate customers. It seems like Photoreflect would offer more options to you, if any are available. My thought was a slide show that cycles quickly enough through images that one cannot accurately hit the "print screen" button to steal a particular image, but so that a viewer could still get a feel for what images are available... or an image that very quickly pulsates off and on the screen... or an image where at any given time only a portion of it is visible, but by watching long enough one can see all parts of it and know what they're buying (or have the option to buy)... these of course, are all just ideas and may be expensive to implement, but it would be nice if Photoreflect could offer such options to photographers.

Nov. 24, 2009, 10:04 PM
Forgive me for being computer illeriate, but I have posted Terri's pictures of me on my facebook. I thought I could because I bought a cd of the images.......Please tell me that is different than what we are talking about, because I am in no way a thief, I really thought I could post when I bought the cd of images...

I could be very wrong, but I think you're ok- the price for the CD option on her site says "with release." I have assumed that to mean your purchase gives you full rights to use of the picture.

Nov. 24, 2009, 11:15 PM
Why can't you disable the right click like every other website?

Nov. 25, 2009, 10:49 AM
Why can't you disable the right click like every other website?

ahhhh, the right click is disabled.
There are other ways young Jedis.

; )

I don't have much to say accept, thank you for your hard work, Terrie.
Terrie and Jim get 1/2 my pay check when it comes to HT photos. I'm even known to go back and buy prints from the year prior. lol.

I'm a photo junkie.

Nov. 25, 2009, 10:50 AM
2 of our local photog's do charge to view proofs. They I believe are a $20 & $25 dollar deposit. That is applied to any purchase you make though, so say you buy 3 photos and its $60 then you only pay the difference from the deposit. One of the photog's will refund if they don't get any really good shots you like, but they have to agree there is nothing worth purchasing. Not sure how that works. The other one will only give a refund if they literally do not get any photo's of you.

and a fantastic idea.

Nov. 25, 2009, 03:42 PM
I feel better now after realizing that the purchase of the cd releases the copyright....

I got to thinking though, a photographer could make money, I would think, if they offered a cd of all images at a reasonable price ($150 is normally not in anyones budget). Maybe an option where the rider could sign up for how many phases they wanted shot at different fees then pre-purchase the cd.

I would pay up to $75 at EVERY show, I would budget that, and just buy the cd every time. That might take some of the unknown out of it for the photographer, like they have already been paid ect...

I was in Florida the first show of this season and one of the photographers there had that set up. I signed up for all 3 phases and it cost me $70. Best money I spent all year.

I normally buy one or two photos from Terri or Jim from every show, but my budget wont allow me to spend the $150 for a cd every time, so I usually end up with one photo, my favorite shot, after staring at the proofs for several days trying to make a decision which one is my favorite.....

I don't know.......just some random thoughts....

Nov. 26, 2009, 06:47 PM
ooo, or what would be even better...
Terrie...hint hint.

would be a pre purchase set up for the entire season's worth of Area's shows for one fat price!!!

I'd dish out for that.