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View Full Version : Compare these OTTBs for best eventing potential!



xcPayge
Oct. 30, 2009, 07:16 AM
I am interested in which horse you prefer out of these four solely based on conformation for eventing prospects. I know that there is only so much you can see from conformation but i'm interested in what people look for before inquiring about a horse. Let me know which one and why. Btw, they are all 4-5 and 16.2. Thanks everyone!

#1 http://i36.tinypic.com/34g63vd.jpg

#2 http://i36.tinypic.com/2j154r4.jpg

#3 http://i34.tinypic.com/28b66pi.jpg

#4 http://i33.tinypic.com/2sb4src.jpg

FairWeather
Oct. 30, 2009, 08:08 AM
(are you taking these off of other sites? thats a no-no, you should be linking, if not, sorry!)

That said, i like #1 best, but conformation of course only gets you so far.

jn4jenny
Oct. 30, 2009, 08:20 AM
For a resale project, I wouldn't buy anything with a plain bay wrapper or a homely head. That disqualifies 2 and 4.

Although chrome is useful for resale, I can only assume that when you say "take up the levels" that you mean to take a horse up to perhaps Novice/Training/Prelim and then sell to an adult amateur or teenager home. And for that, personality and attitude matter more than anything. For that market, quiet, easy, and willing trumps "cute" or "well conformed" any day of the week. At least it does if you're trying to produce a profit (which in this economy is kind of laughable, no offense but it's true).

GleeRider
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:21 AM
(are you taking these off of other sites? thats a no-no, you should be linking, if not, sorry!)

That said, i like #1 best, but conformation of course only gets you so far.

Since when was posting pictures on an informal forum thread a no no..? Not to be rude, but im curious?

caffeinated
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:30 AM
I actually like #4 the best (and think his head is lovely, hehe). I like his back end more than the others (loin looks smooth and well connected, hip and SI line up, low stifles).

That said if you put some different muscling on the first horse, he'd look an awful lot like many of the top eventers look - if I were to look at my pictures from the rolex jog, I'd see tons of similarities.

But I'm hardly an eventing expert, just have certain things I like in a pony. :)

xcPayge
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:34 AM
For a resale project, I wouldn't buy anything with a plain bay wrapper or a homely head. That disqualifies 2 and 4.

Although chrome is useful for resale, I can only assume that when you say "take up the levels" that you mean to take a horse up to perhaps Novice/Training/Prelim and then sell to an adult amateur or teenager home. And for that, personality and attitude matter more than anything. For that market, quiet, easy, and willing trumps "cute" or "well conformed" any day of the week. At least it does if you're trying to produce a profit (which in this economy is kind of laughable, no offense but it's true).

I was just looking for advice on soley conformation. I'm not talking about buying a horse and selling it in the next 2 months. Mostly just experience for me. I was not born yesterday, i do understand the economy is awful to sell a horse right now. I'm just playing around with the idea of a prospect. I'm sorry if that has offended you in anyway.

xcPayge
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:39 AM
I actually like #4 the best (and think his head is lovely, hehe). I like his back end more than the others (loin looks smooth and well connected, hip and SI line up, low stifles).

That said if you put some different muscling on the first horse, he'd look an awful lot like many of the top eventers look - if I were to look at my pictures from the rolex jog, I'd see tons of similarities.

But I'm hardly an eventing expert, just have certain things I like in a pony. :)


Thank you for your kind response Caffeinated. I definitely have to agree with you. I too am no expert on eventing! That is exactly why i started this thread :) I think #1 is my favorite. He reminds me of Will Coleman's ride Twizzle*. And as far as #4 goes. I agree that his head is quiet lovely. I wouldnt call him homely at all. But hey, everyone has a right to their own opinion right ;]

LudgerFan
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:39 AM
For me, it's a toss-up between #3 and #4. Since we can't see the front legs of #4, I'd want to be sure that the legs are good and straight underneath and tendons look good. Horses #1 and #2 are lower-set in the neck department. Front legs not as good, particularly #2 who is a bit too sloping in the pastern for my liking, and slightly back at the knee. #1 might be a bit tied-in behind the knee, hard to tell from the photo. There is definitely something I like about the first horse, though. He has a certain presence.

#4 probably has the best neck placement, with the best development at the tie-in to the wither. Looks to have a bit more bone, too. There is a bit of overdevelopment in the underneck, but not bad, really. Hard to see the neck on #3, but the base looks to come out of the shoulder pretty high. Both #3 and #4 are very well-balanced overall. I'd take either or both, but I guess for you it would come down to seeing them move. Another thing to consider is the strength of the loin in #4. Good in terms of durability, but likely bad in terms of tending towards tightness and stiffness.

RacetrackReject
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:49 AM
I agree that #1 will probably be very athletic and look quite nice with some muscling. I like the body shape of #3 but something in the front end looks odd, maybe just the way he's standing. With that said though, I would pick #4 without a doubt as my favorite. I am not a big chesnut fan, but I think that horse is lovely and he has the shoulder and hip that I tend to like.

xitmom
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:57 AM
I like #3 and #4 best too. #1 has something weird going on with his right front... and does he have a hoof? ha ha #2 has too much slope in the front pasterns for me. You would need to check out what is under the wraps on #4 to confirm no issues. I happen to find the looks of #3 most pleasing but would want to see how he moves... his shoulder looks somewhat upright in the picture.

FairWeather
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:58 AM
Since when was posting pictures on an informal forum thread a no no..? Not to be rude, but im curious?

Hi Glee--
posting pictures is fine, but yanking the pics from rehoming groups and put up as your own is bad form. Sorry to detract from the thread--just a pet peeve :)
(and I have no idea if these were yanked)

Hilary
Oct. 30, 2009, 10:06 AM
Looking ONLY at the photos: I'm not sure I'm in love with any of them. #1's neck is too low for my taste although the rest of him is quite nice. #2's front pasterns are too slopey for me. I like #3 except the fact that his tongue is out. If it's out while he's having his photo taken can he keep it in while he's working? Maybe that's the only time he's ever put it out, but he looks a little wired.

#4 is well put together all over with none of the particular body part flaws I see in the others, but he's wrapped and poulticed up to his eyeballs so I need to actually see his legs before I say I like him.

xcPayge
Oct. 30, 2009, 10:17 AM
Hi Glee--
posting pictures is fine, but yanking the pics from rehoming groups and put up as your own is bad form.

Fair Weather, I just saved pictures of TB's that i was interested in and liked their conformation and uploaded them here in picture links. I wasnt yanking pictures up and putting my name on them. Just for conformation purposes. I'm sorry if i upset you by doing so. I'm still not sure there is any harm in it. But again sorry if you disagree. :/

FairWeather
Oct. 30, 2009, 10:33 AM
I understand, but it's really frowned upon. you should *link* to the horses you like if it's a re-homing group.
If they are pictures that someone sent you that is different :0) (not upset, but it is a pet peeve)

xcPayge
Oct. 30, 2009, 10:44 AM
I didn't really look at it from a standpoint of hinding the links from people. Just a convenient way to post the links because they dont each have their own individual page. I guess i could have posted the site and hold you how far to scroll down on the page...:confused:

beninni3
Oct. 30, 2009, 01:16 PM
I'd have to say #4 is the best conformationally put together, has the most even body length proportionally. Most of the others aren't in correct proportion. 1&2 are both long in the back with a very short slopped hind end. #3 is nice but has a very high withers which presents saddling issues, the way he is standing almost looks a little over at the knee as well. #4, I agree with what others have said, it's hard to tell what his legs look like all bandaged up, although they do appear to be basically straight with good pastern angle. I wouldn't worry about the underneck development, that is most likely due to being on the track (assume these are TB's based on conformation and picture presentations). Some retraining would likely take care of that!

cindylouwho
Oct. 30, 2009, 01:40 PM
Is there anyway you could take all 4, ride them for 6 months and then put them for sale with all the same selling price... and report back to us as how they sold? :)

OK, I was never one for reason, but it does sound like a good idea.

I like #3. I just love the face:)

FancyJumper82
Oct. 30, 2009, 02:01 PM
They're all very cute and somewhat put together well. I was very drawn to #1. He has a very unique presence to him. I did notice, however, that he has quite a long back and runs downhill a touch. The other horses I liked were #3 and #4. #3 has a nice short back, and a great hip angle. #4 has to be my favorite. He has a nice big neck, straight long shoulder, and great hip angle. He looks like he would be gorgeous once you put some muscle and weight on him.

Good luck with your project!!

LKF
Oct. 30, 2009, 02:14 PM
#4 is the winner

ThirdCharm
Oct. 30, 2009, 02:29 PM
#4. Nice smooth deep hindquarter, good angles, uphill overall build, nice eye, strong loin... if the legs match the rest of the horse, he's very nice.

#1 would be second, I like him quite a bit. But not as smoothly put together in the loin esp and the RF looks a little over. Could be the way he's standing. Bit long in the back.

#3 would be up there except his front legs look funkier than #1s. Shoulder a little straight.

#2 has a weak-looking rear, long weak pasterns, rough/weak loin coupling, and looks a little pigeon-breasted if I'm thinking of the right term. Neck might improve with work but is not appealing. Shoulder looks straight and not a lot of depth in the rear or front compared tot he long middle.

Jennifer

Guyot
Oct. 30, 2009, 03:00 PM
#4 has my vote, for all the reasons mentioned above. I'll add that the tighter coupled are easier to jump and easier to balance and gallop then the longer body type. Therefore, for resale, it may not move as loosely or well, but will be easier to jump for the vast majority of people.

judybigredpony
Oct. 30, 2009, 03:33 PM
#1 looks to be over @ the knee right front unless he is moving.

# 2 has a really flat left front w/ weak looking pastern opposing foot doesn't match and may no be a fixable thing.

#3 lovely,has head turned so I can't tell proportions although somewhat upright

#4 maybe tad straight in shoulder is short coupled but if I had to buy one soley off a photo he's the winner hands down.

Unless the head is totally out of proportion, I heard a judge coming out of a BIG "AA" show ring after judging green conformation class muter "They Don't Walk On Their Heads" he had pinned a gorgeous proprtioned horse with lovely gaits but a very plain head border line hammer head not 1 hair of chrome but poetry to walk n trot and just so symetrical and balasnced.
And I buy n sell OTTB's for a living w/ plenty sold solid performing horses as provinance.

AppJumpr08
Oct. 30, 2009, 04:30 PM
#1 is Dwight (http://www.canterne.org/images-salehorses/Dwight.jpg)
TRAINER-OWNED GELDING
Bay, 16.2 hands, 4 years old

“Dwight” is a big, handsome boy with lots of heart and the potential to be a wonderful equine partner away from the track. He's by the Breeder's Cup winner Volponi--and while he inherited some of dad's good looks, sadly he didn't seem to get the turn of foot.

Asking $3,500, Call Mark at 617-469-5324


#2 is SkippingAndADancing (http://www.canterne.org/images-salehorses/Skip&ADancin.jpg)
TRAINER-OWNED GELDING
Bay, 16.2 hands, 5 years old

“Skipandadancin” is by the multi-million Skip Trial, who actually won the Mass Cap in his day! Trainer says that this horse is striking, good natured and has the makings of a wonderful show horse.

Price: $1,500 Call Rupert at 813-679-6926


#3 is Bullish Force (http://www.canterne.org/images-salehorses/BullishForce.jpg)
TRAINER-OWNED STALLION
Dark Bay, 15.2 hands, 4 years old

"Bullish Force" is a very cute and dappled colt is excellent to work with as per his trainer. Reports that he is sound, but he just doesn’t want to winter him and would rather find him a good home. Has been on the farm and turned out, should transition nicely to farm life.

Price: $500 Call Tim Kirby at 617-640-8893


#4 is War Morning (http://www.canterne.org/images-salehorses/WarMorning.jpg)
TRAINER-OWNED FILLY
Chestnut, 16.1 hands, 3 years old

“War Morning” is young, big and nice looking, as you can see from the photo. She has great potential as a show horse away from racing; owners says that she just doesn't have the speed to compete at the track where her trainer is going over the winter. She is by a son of Storm Cat named Roar of the Tiger who is a full brother to Giant's Causeway (whose stud fee is $125,000!). Very athletic, nice-looking family! This filly has a definite elegance about her; we can definitely see her in the hunter ring with her height and scope!

Price: $1800
Call Steve at 617-538-7539


Just in case anyone was wondering ;) They are all still available, as far as I know, and are all looking for good homes!
The last day of racing at Suffolk is November 7th - right around the corner!

jn4jenny
Oct. 30, 2009, 05:37 PM
I was just looking for advice on soley conformation. I'm not talking about buying a horse and selling it in the next 2 months. Mostly just experience for me. I was not born yesterday, i do understand the economy is awful to sell a horse right now. I'm just playing around with the idea of a prospect. I'm sorry if that has offended you in anyway.

Didn't offend me at all, but it obviously offends you. Sorry you took it the wrong way.

If you didn't care to have resale included as an element of the evaluation, why did you mention it at all? It would have been more pertinent to say "Please evaluate for conformation, am looking for something off the track to take up to X level of eventing." Sorry if I took your lead to mean that you wanted the conformation evaluated in terms of resale down the line.

I agree that #4 is the best built. She looks an awful lot like my gelding, and there's nothing better than a catty little jumper. And apparently you do not care for commentary on the other super-anti-resale features of her profile, namely that she's a chestnut mare (very unpopular on hunter market, so woe betide you if she ends up hating XC) and has Storm Cat lines (notorious for difficult, sometimes dangerous foals).

Toadie's mom
Oct. 30, 2009, 09:09 PM
I like #4 also, but I'd have to see those legs without wraps. My biggest concern about the other 3 is that they all seem to have really long pasterns. #4 looks very balanced and athletic, but from 1st hand experience those short backed horses sure can buck :winkgrin:

Renascence
Oct. 31, 2009, 10:23 PM
I like #4 the best. I think that conformation is easier to ride than the others. Still any one of these looks more than capable for at least lower level eventing, if not more, and the important thing is to see them in person to know more. No one but an idiot is going to turn a horse down on color if its a good horse.

lstevenson
Nov. 1, 2009, 01:22 AM
#3 is going to be the best athlete....by far.

judybigredpony
Nov. 1, 2009, 08:05 AM
Didn't offend me at all, but it obviously offends you. Sorry you took it the wrong way.

If you didn't care to have resale included as an element of the evaluation, why did you mention it at all? It would have been more pertinent to say "Please evaluate for conformation, am looking for something off the track to take up to X level of eventing." Sorry if I took your lead to mean that you wanted the conformation evaluated in terms of resale down the line.

I agree that #4 is the best built. She looks an awful lot like my gelding, and there's nothing better than a catty little jumper. And apparently you do not care for commentary on the other super-anti-resale features of her profile, namely that she's a chestnut mare (very unpopular on hunter market, so woe betide you if she ends up hating XC) and has Storm Cat lines (notorious for difficult, sometimes dangerous foals).


Oh I would look to take back the Chestnut mare remark....
Having seen and sold some amazing Chesntut TB fillys....that one could bite you:yes:

ss3777
Nov. 1, 2009, 08:09 AM
I like #4 also, but I'd have to see those legs without wraps. My biggest concern about the other 3 is that they all seem to have really long pasterns. #4 looks very balanced and athletic, but from 1st hand experience those short backed horses sure can buck :winkgrin:


I love # 4 and noticed her on another thread. I keep giving myself the financial ruin talk ;)

Amen to the short backed horses sure can buck, OH MY GOD can my wee man, short backed guy buck!! He can morph into a marine mammal (think dolphin in the waves) when he gets the wind up his arse.

jn4jenny
Nov. 1, 2009, 08:22 AM
Oh I would look to take back the Chestnut mare remark....
Having seen and sold some amazing Chesntut TB fillys....that one could bite you:yes:

I am not talking about my personal opinions here. I am talking about what is effective for resale. If she's "amazing" and has the show record to prove it, then she'll resell even if she's purple with green spots. But have you ever tried to sell one of the chestnut fillies that's NOT amazing? There is too much unfair prejudice against chestnut mares to easily get rid of an "eventing school dropout" who also happens to be a chestnut mare. That's the reality whether us fans of chestnut mares like it or not.

Seriously though, I am done replying to this thread. The OP is looking for confo critiques, and I have already supplied mine, so it would be rude to keep intervening. ;)

Chall
Nov. 1, 2009, 09:23 AM
I like #1. Shorter cannon bones in the front. Nice healthy size hind hooves. Overall his hooves seem solid and substantial and look like they bear the weight above them. And I love the somewhat tight lip, and his eye. He's aware of the photographer and not sure what's going to happen next and whether he will like it - seems like a horse who will bond with a trust worthy owner (i.e. he has his feelings and lets you know them, politely. Easy to read how he feels about something). That said I think they are all lovely and each have their strengths. But I am not a professional and just like horses.

mortebella
Nov. 1, 2009, 09:52 AM
For my money, #3 is your horse. There are a couple of things about this picture where I can't see so good (I can't see his throatlatch/windpipe, for instance) and it's too dark to get as good a look at his legs as I'd like. But aside from the fact that a couple of the others had standout things that really broke it for me, (e.g. long, floppy pasterns on #2, I liked #1 except for the kinda upside down neck) this horse just seems put together right - balanced, symmetrical, stands evenly under himself - to do well in a number of disciplines, and I think that's about as good a predictor as you can get, confo wise, for eventing success. I would look for strong and agile, and flexible. You can't tell the last from a picture, but he looks the first two, to me. I liked the big deep chest - always suggests endurance capability and stamina to me. I don't know near enough about angles in the back end - to me, his look good, but I'd like to hear from somebody who's really got a grip on all that triangulation of point of hip to stifle etc, what they think of this guy.

And FWIW, I thought his head was handsome! :lol:

ryansgirl
Nov. 1, 2009, 03:06 PM
#1 is Dwight (http://www.canterne.org/images-salehorses/Dwight.jpg)
TRAINER-OWNED GELDING
Bay, 16.2 hands, 4 years old

“Dwight” is a big, handsome boy with lots of heart and the potential to be a wonderful equine partner away from the track. He's by the Breeder's Cup winner Volponi--and while he inherited some of dad's good looks, sadly he didn't seem to get the turn of foot.

Asking $3,500, Call Mark at 617-469-5324


#2 is SkippingAndADancing (http://www.canterne.org/images-salehorses/Skip&ADancin.jpg)
TRAINER-OWNED GELDING
Bay, 16.2 hands, 5 years old

“Skipandadancin” is by the multi-million Skip Trial, who actually won the Mass Cap in his day! Trainer says that this horse is striking, good natured and has the makings of a wonderful show horse.

Price: $1,500 Call Rupert at 813-679-6926


#3 is Bullish Force (http://www.canterne.org/images-salehorses/BullishForce.jpg)
TRAINER-OWNED STALLION
Dark Bay, 15.2 hands, 4 years old

"Bullish Force" is a very cute and dappled colt is excellent to work with as per his trainer. Reports that he is sound, but he just doesn’t want to winter him and would rather find him a good home. Has been on the farm and turned out, should transition nicely to farm life.

Price: $500 Call Tim Kirby at 617-640-8893


#4 is War Morning (http://www.canterne.org/images-salehorses/WarMorning.jpg)
TRAINER-OWNED FILLY
Chestnut, 16.1 hands, 3 years old

“War Morning” is young, big and nice looking, as you can see from the photo. She has great potential as a show horse away from racing; owners says that she just doesn't have the speed to compete at the track where her trainer is going over the winter. She is by a son of Storm Cat named Roar of the Tiger who is a full brother to Giant's Causeway (whose stud fee is $125,000!). Very athletic, nice-looking family! This filly has a definite elegance about her; we can definitely see her in the hunter ring with her height and scope!

Price: $1800
Call Steve at 617-538-7539


Just in case anyone was wondering ;) They are all still available, as far as I know, and are all looking for good homes!
The last day of racing at Suffolk is November 7th - right around the corner!

Just to update:

Dwight is no longer available - they want to keep running him.

Skippinganddancin was being picked up today to go to a new home :yes:.

Bullish Force sold today and was picked up :yes:.

War Morning I think is still available (though I'm not sure as horses are moving fast!). And yes those are CANTER NE photos :).

So three our of four sold which we love to hear! But there are plenty more nice ones that needs homes asap so if you are interested please call the trainer asap!!

:)

AppJumpr08
Nov. 1, 2009, 03:13 PM
Just to update:

Dwight is no longer available - they want to keep running him.

Skippinganddancin was being picked up today to go to a new home :yes:.

Bullish Force sold today and was picked up :yes:.

War Morning I think is still available (though I'm not sure as horses are moving fast!). And yes those are CANTER NE photos :).

So three our of four sold which we love to hear! But there are plenty more nice ones that needs homes asap so if you are interested please call the trainer asap!!

:)


Yay! Excellent update :D

ryansgirl
Nov. 1, 2009, 03:37 PM
Yay! Excellent update :D

Yes lots found homes this weekend and there are so many more nice ones that need homes :):yes:. We'll be back there both days this weekend and hopefully by then lots more will have sold!! Fingers crossed!!