Coyotes??

[buschkn]

I definitely have coyotes here. I haven't seen them, but some friends and the guys who work here have all seen several and they are reported to be BIG. Like the size of my German Shepherd Dogs, some of them. I never worried about it or paid attention, but two cats have disappeared and I think the fox is too small to get them.

I hear the coyotes most nights now, and it is creepy. There are a lot of them, and they sound close. I have big dogs, and they are fenced so I don't worry about that, but what kind of problems can they cause. Everyone here says I need to "get rid of them".

Thoughts, anecdotes, stories, suggestions?

[shakeytails]

We've had coyotes. There really isn't much need to "get rid of them". At our old place we did shoot a couple of times, but they were very bold and coming within about 50 ft of the barn. We had calves and/or foals at the time and I was concerned for their safety. One shot and they didn't come close again for about a year- DH used birdshot that wouldn't kill, but might sting a little from the distance he shot from. I have a Pyr now, and the coyotes generally stay clear. Still every now and then I'll see one cross the far back pasture or hayfield- the horses barely acknowledge their presence. I never have foals back there (crappy fence), so I just live and let live.

[2DogsFarm]

I don't think you have to worrry about your horses or dogs.

Even GSD-sized coyotes are not big enough to harm a horse - they are much lighter-boned than a domesticated dog.

We have coyotes here, I've heard & seen them on occasion.
I can always tell when they're in the fields behind my pastures as the horses go on Red Alert - all perked ears & heads up.

There must be plenty game for the coyotes here as nothing has even tried to get into my chicken coop {knock wood}

[tBHj]

A few days ago 2 coyotes attacked & killed a women a few hours away from my place. They are big, and not as shy as they were a few years ago.

[GoForAGallop]

A few days ago 2 coyotes attacked & killed a women a few hours away from my place. They are big, and not as shy as they were a few years ago.

This seems ridiculous...do you have a news article or something?


Coyotes are curious, but they're not going to be aggressive to you or the horses, so don't worry about "taking care of them" for those reasons. What you do need to watch out for are your cats/small dogs/sheep/goats/and any fowl you might have wandering around...but just use common sense about that. Lock the barn cats up at night/make sure they're indoor cats, make sure everyone is inside at dusk, etc. It's really not a big deal.

Coyotes are welcome on my property...they love catching the ground hogs that leave giant holes in my pasture. Their howling is eerie, but I've gotten used to it to the point where I can identify the different members.

[dalpal]

This seems ridiculous...do you have a news article or something?


Coyotes are curious, but they're not going to be aggressive to you or the horses, so don't worry about "taking care of them" for those reasons. What you do need to watch out for are your cats/small dogs/sheep/goats/and any fowl you might have wandering around...but just use common sense about that. Lock the barn cats up at night/make sure they're indoor cats, make sure everyone is inside at dusk, etc. It's really not a big deal.

Coyotes are welcome on my property...they love catching the ground hogs that leave giant holes in my pasture. Their howling is eerie, but I've gotten used to it to the point where I can identify the different members.

Uh no, she's not exaggerating, this was on our news website here in NC because the 19 year old woman who was killed was an up and coming Canadian singer. Name was Taylor Mitchell

http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/young-woman-hiker-killed-coyotes-canada

[GoForAGallop]

Uh no, she's not exaggerating, this was on our news website here in NC because the 19 year old woman who was killed was an up and coming Canadian singer. Name was Taylor Mitchell

http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/young-woman-hiker-killed-coyotes-canada

Okay, thank you, I was just disbelieving because that is not common coyote behavior...as is stated right in the article.

[SMF11]

Not because it is ridiculous, but I'd love a link to a news story as well. I've heard of coyotes attacking adults, but have never ever been able to find proof via a news story, so I'd love one here.

I second what everyone else says -- the horses will be fine. We also have big coyotes here -- German Shepherd size -- and have not had a problem at all with the horses or dogs, or my kids for that matter.

I had one watching me from the edge of the woods once (20 feet away) when I was walking on our farm. I was facing in the opposite direction, and as soon as I turned (& saw coyote) he took off like a flash. I roared and growled my fiercest growl . . . as the Dept. of Envir. Conservation here says, "don't act like prey". I'm not sure how this tone is coming off, so I want to be clear that I never for a second felt in any danger. But thought I'd speak the coyotes language and tell him it wasn't a good idea to be near me.

[Waterwitch]

We have lots of coyotes around - there is a den on my neighbors property. We hear them frequently, but rarely see them. No problems - and we have foals (and poultry).

[charlo]

It is true, Here are 2 links to two different news agencies of the account.

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20091028/coyote_attack_091028/20091028?hub=Canada

http://www.nationalpost.com/rss/story.html?id=2154123

[3Spots]

Coyotes are very common out here in SoCal, despite us not having a lot of acreage per person. They trot down the middle of a residential street, dart through the horses' pens at a boarding barn. We ride within 30 feet of them, hear them yipping at night. They've been in my backyard and I can walk to a Starbucks!

They DO take cats and small dogs -- quickly. I wouldn't trust them around 20lb animals, but otherwise keep to themselves, and take care of rats and moles and rabbits.

I saw the Canadian story yesterday and its the first I have ever heard of a human attack.

jan

[Bluey]

Before coyotes split in late spring, they roam in rather lager groups and they can bring foals, yearlings and sick and old horses down.

My neighbor several years ago was checking his calving cows one evening, that he had penned in a trap by the house and came to a circle of coyotes, laying around a cow having a calf, 11 or 12 of them.
He got two before the rest were too far away to shoot.
She was down in labor and they had already eaten on the calf, that was half out and now dead and on her back parts, so he had to shoot her.:cry:

That is rather common, that is why calving cows are kept close and checked often.

Coyotes are not aggressive to larger animals, they mostly live off insects, rodents, rabbits and such, but they are oportunists and will sure chase and bring down anything else.

One new neighbor got several dogs, before he decided to kept them penned, because one coyote would lure the dog to chase it and, once a ways from the house, several more jumped up and all killed the dog, even his two great pyrinees were killed like that.

We never leave a sick calf in a pen alone, we leave some for company, or coyotes will jump in the pen and eat on it and we find the calf dead next morning, or some times still alive.:(

Coyotes are the ultimate opportunist and will bring down anything that doesn't put a good fight, although they generally don't bother.

We can tell when coyotes become thick because the rabbits thin out.
Then the coyote population crashes and for a few years we are overrun with rabbits.

If you shoot a resident coyote, you alter the territory and others will try to come in to claim it, so it is better to leave an established small group there, better than having roaming coyotes around, that may want to test if horses or pets are easy prey and have not learned to leave your house, barn and pens alone.

We shoot at coyotes that come by the house, to keep them off, but generally, we leave them alone, unless we go thru a spell of too many of them.

We have been in a drought since 1991, we don't have that many rodents, rabbits and other, so even coyotes have not been as thrifty as they used to be.

[Woodland]

A few days ago 2 coyotes attacked & killed a women a few hours away from my place. They are big, and not as shy as they were a few years ago.

It must have been a mix - I own a coyote. They are shy and quiet never aggressive 19 years now. I found her as an injured pup on the road I did not know what she was until my vet told me. Pne of the best dogs I have ever known

From the article "Coyotes are usually fearful of humans and it is extremely rare for them to attack people. The eastern coyote which populates the Cape Bretton Park has interbred with wolves and is larger than its relatives native to western parts of America." Which makes more sense now.

[danceronice]

Coyotes will go for small kids, though I haven't heard of them bringing down an adult before. As bluey said, they're opportunists who'll take anything that's easy prey. That's why they're more successful than wolves. As a general rule, though, I wouldn't worry about horses unless you have any that are old or very young. Cats, chickens, toddlers, anything small like that.

Woodland, you cannot a) call a coyote a dog, it's not or b) compare the behavior of one reared from infancy by humans to those in the wild.

[JSwan]

Okay, thank you, I was just disbelieving because that is not common coyote behavior...as is stated right in the article.

In some areas coyote are interbreeding with wolves. I believe there is/was a study done in NY recently that confirmed that (DNA testing). I don't think the red wolf has interbred with coyote (yet) but the timber wolf has.

We've had coyote around here for years though they sometimes look as if they've got something else mixed in with 'em.

They do attack in packs here, usually to bring down large calves. Bounties don't seem to work - but hunting them with dogs or having Livestock Guardian Dogs does seem to discourage them from occupied areas (people, pets or livestock). Most folks don't bother shooting them unless they are caught stalking or preying on livestock or pets. (where I live) I enjoy listening to them at night and like having predators around as long as they keep to normal prey.

I'm very sorry about that young woman and my condolences to her family and friends.

[Saidapal]

We have them in my area. Used to hear them waaayyyy off in the distance but now they are in our back yard. Outdoor cats have been disappearing on a regular basis as are any loose chickens. Some people have brought donkeys in, especially those with goats and cows. My hay guy told me he lost quite a few calves to coyotes until he got the donkey. So far they haven't bothered any of the horses around here.

Knew they were around, but saw it for myself when one dashed across the road while I was driving to work at about 6a.m. Made my mouth drop.

[buschkn]

I am more of a live and let live kind of person, but it definitely bothers me if they are coming up to the house and barn. My dogs are all relatively big, but I am sure a pack of coyotes could take one pretty easily if they chose to.

[Mozart]

I've got to stop listening to the news....we have lots of coyotes, never had a problem with them. Then I hear about that poor young woman from Ontario. I wasn't too concerned about H1N1 either, then we hear about the healthy 13 yr old boy also in Ontario that died a day or two after contracting the virus....

sigh......

[equusus]

I roared and growled my fiercest growl . . . as the Dept. of Envir. Conservation here says, "don't act like prey". I'm not sure how this tone is coming off, so I want to be clear that I never for a second felt in any danger. But thought I'd speak the coyotes language and tell him it wasn't a good idea to be near me.

:lol:
I bet that sounded pretty funny!
I had some attack goats right near the house one night. I ran outside yelling at them and they took off. Evidently they understand English (with a little French mixed in!) too!

[Bluey]

:lol:
I bet that sounded pretty funny!
I had some attack goats right near the house one night. I ran outside yelling at them and they took off. Evidently they understand English (with a little French mixed in!) too!

I was reading ahead of your words and understood that you had some attack goats.:eek:
Well, we used to have some of those too, especially Billy the goat, that thought he was a guard dog and would rush people, head down, although was never brave enough to butt them.

In coyote territory, people with smaller livestock, goats and sheep, have herders, guard animals and/or confine them.
It just is not right to put your animals at risk, in harm's way, if it is a dog you leave to run "free", free to be run over in the highway, or a sheep unguarded at night.

[equusus]

Attack goats!:lol:

That was the only time we had any casualties from coyotes. We put up woven and no-climb wire fences and the coyotes seem to be too lazy to dig under...they go around.

Good fences make good neighbors!

[Equibrit]

Okay, thank you, I was just disbelieving because that is not common coyote behavior...as is stated right in the article.

Those don't appear to be common coyotes, but wolf/coyote hybrids.

[chai]

lol, I would love some attack goats to go with my attack mini-donkeys. Those little guys are like Rambo in a fur suit.
I saw the article about the coyote attack in Canada and I thought it seemed like bizarre behavior, too, but wildlife can be unpredictable. What a terrifying way for that poor young woman to go.

We have coyotes here and other than the disappearance of groundfowl like pheasants and a rash of missing cats, they seem more shy than aggressive.

[Timex]

i saw the story, and was really, really surprised, as that is not like any sort of coyote behavior i've ever seen or read about.

we have coyote around here, have had them trot right through our paddocks, but unless they seem sick, we don't worry about them.

[wendy]

there appear to be some strange hybrid canines moving in throughout the East coast that don't act like "normal" wild coyotes. They are very large, completely unafraid of humans, apear to form stable packs year-round, and are rather aggressive. One that was shot in our neighborhood after the pack had consumed most of the cats and smaller dogs looked suspiciously like a dog/wolf hybrid, not a coyote at all. We've seen large wild wolfish beasts trotting boldly across the barnyard during broad daylight with people all over the place.

[dalpal]

It must have been a mix - I own a coyote. They are shy and quiet never aggressive 19 years now. I found her as an injured pup on the road I did not know what she was until my vet told me. Pne of the best dogs I have ever known

From the article "Coyotes are usually fearful of humans and it is extremely rare for them to attack people. The eastern coyote which populates the Cape Bretton Park has interbred with wolves and is larger than its relatives native to western parts of America." Which makes more sense now.

Give me a break...they are WILD ANIMALS....you cannot say that they NEVER aggressive. Just because you own one (and I don't know why anyone would own a wild animal :confused: ) does not mean the news story is false.

[seeuatx]

We've got a pack down over the hollow about 1/2 a mile from my house. I heard them a while ago, and my JRT started going nuts, running into the house like Satan's henchmen were on his heels. Since then, several neighborhood cats (mostly strays but a few outdoor pets) have disappeared. No dogs yet, but I keep mine close after dark.

PA has open season on them apparently. Anyone want to turn their foxhunting attentions to the Coyotes of Washington Co.? Pretty please?

[Dance_To_Oblivion]

OP - I am not terribly far from you and when we moved here in May my neighbors warned me about the unusually large coyotes we had here and that they were breeding with stray dogs which was making them more aggressive and less fearful of people. I have only seen one so far and it really was huge! It was not however on my property. I hear them at night but so far they stay on the back of my fields not up by the house or the barn. When I have foals I will certainly keep them in at night for a while!

[dbadaro]

i'm originally from the midwest. up there people keep donkeys on their farms. this usually helps keep the coyotes away. don't remember if it's from their braying or if they will actually charge coyotes though.....anyways, maybe think about getting a donkey or two.

[GoForAGallop]

i'm originally from the midwest. up there people keep donkeys on their farms. this usually helps keep the coyotes away. don't remember if it's from their braying or if they will actually charge coyotes though.....anyways, maybe think about getting a donkey or two.

Some (not all, some are cowards!) donkeys and mules will actually charge/kill a dog. My mule, while very friendly with my farm dogs, has made it clear that any strange dog will not be leaving the property.

[Arcadien]

Timely thread; after years of hearing coyotes are around me, last week I had them yipping & howling in my front yard. Really weird, strange (new) sound for this area. Methinks the coyotes are doing a bit too well, the deer population is down.

My 11 mo old Caucasian Ovcharka pup is my prevention plan, his breed is supposed to grow large enough to handle wolves so yotes shouldn't be a problem.

I read about the woman killed by coyotes, and it sure got my attention! I did a little research and it seems last adult human killed by a yote was at 30 years ago.

Incidentally they did manage to shoot one of the 2 attacking animals, so I'm pretty sure they know it is a pure coyote, not some kind of hybrid.

Scary thoughts on Mischief night!

[Equibrit]

You might find this a more reliable source of information; http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article6895020.ece

for the FACTS.
" Bridgit Leger, a spokeswoman for the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, said that police reached the scene quickly and shot one of the animals, apparently wounding it. But the wounded animal and a companion coyote managed to get away. "

[Nancy!]

We have a small pack that lives on our property. I've prevented an attack on a friend's small dog by rushing the coyote and I've also had my old dog attacked while we were riding.

We usually don't have the gun ready when we see them, but if I see them when I'm riding, then it's "fox hunt" time. I basically chase them off the property at an extremely high rate of speed. My horse loves this!

[hessy35]

I have read this entire thred, but this link below speaks about the coywolf. It is very real.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32976657

[FatCatFarm]

We've had a terrible coyote problem. They have deccimated our outdoor cat population. Anyone we couldn't get in on a regular basis has eventually disappeared. We now get all cats into the house at night with the exception of our two old lady barn cats who just absolutely hate to come in. I've lost thousands of dollars to coyotes if you consider all the money I put into the cats lost with spay and neutering, vaccinations and healing their hurts. It's been heart breaking. We tried shooting just to ward them away but a few nights later they would be back and coming right up to the house. We've tried luring them in with calls hoping to shoot them; we've tried trapping them with a large Hav-a-Heart trap; next we'll try snares. We're fed up. I now have two donkeys who reside in the barn area at night and a Great Pyrenees dog who patrols the property. I'm usually a live and let live person too, but the Coyotes have gotten beyond bold here and we're completely fed up with them.

I too saw the news article about the girl in Canada who was killed. I know there have been at least two incidences here in the states of coyotes attempting to drag toddlers off.

I had a hair raising incident last fall when I was out in my round pen after dark working a stubborn pony who was refusing to be caught. My round pen is behind my barn and there are no lights out there. Our property borders 800 acres of wooded water authority property. Just after night fall while I was still out there I had a pack of coyotes come to just the other side of fence lince where the round pen is and start howling and yipping/barking at me. They would not stop with me yelling at them. My husband who was in the house all the way up the hill heard the racket and came out with a rifle to finally get them to knock it off and leave. So I wouldn't bet anything against the possibility of them going after people. Not one cent.

[Foxtrot's]

We have a lot around here. If people own sheep they are a problem especially at lambing time. However, that does not justify, in my opinion, a get a gun and kill them attitude.
Farmers just take precautions that usually work.

Actually, I love their howling. When an emergency vehicle with is sirens on goes past it sets them off and they start howling. In the spring when the pups are learning to cry it is a beautiful song.

The wild ones are small, timid and live 90% on voles and small mamals. One of my cats did do a mysterious disappearance once.

We had a lot of rabbits over the recent past years, now a lot fewer since the coyote population has grown. Before that there were no rabbits. It ebbs and flows.

The worst are the coy-dogs and there are some of those here, too. Bigger, stronger and more fearless. I rather feel that the balance of nature should be left alone for the most part. We just have to learn to live with these wild animals as they are a gift to us. A lot of people do not like herons because they fish in their ponds (including ours) but I admire them and they are making a comeback after being down in numbers for a few years.

[SMF11]

Before people get too upset about wolf-coyote mixes, wouldn't that combination be just as fearful of people? (Wolves are very fearful of people). Crossing a dog with a coyote might however create an animal with wild/hunting instincts that is not as afraid of people.

Having said that, I'm convinced we have a wolf-coyote cross here -- besides seeing a huge coyote once, and seeing its huge scat (much larger than my 60 lb. dog's), it has an eerie half-howl. Not yips like the coyotes, but a wolf's howl, cut off halfway through!

[JSwan]

If you're in NY it might very well be a coy/wolf. That's where the studies were done in timber wolves.

I don't think anyone knows what to make of it. Reintroducing an extirpated species like the wolf was supposed to drive out coyote and result in a balance between predator and prey species.

Evidently the wolves didn't get the memo.

[cssutton]

Of course the wolves got it.

They heard the farmer say "Screw those damn coyotes!"

CSSJR

[subk]

i saw the story, and was really, really surprised, as that is not like any sort of coyote behavior i've ever seen or read about.

we have coyote around here, have had them trot right through our paddocks, but unless they seem sick, we don't worry about them.

I read the story but it really doesn't concern me. Every year or so there is a story of someone being killed/attacked by a white tail deer. It happens. It would be stranger if there were the occasional deer attack but no coyote attacks. Deer don't bother me either.

You actually can't "get rid" of coyotes. If their population is threatened the size of the females' litter will increase.

[equusus]

Of course the wolves got it.

They heard the farmer say "Screw those damn coyotes!"

CSSJR

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Lieselotte]

I heard from someone in Iowa that llamas will help keep coyotes away. Apparently it's becoming a problem there, with coyotes having attacked some miniature horses this summer. This particular breeder protects her foals with a herd of llamas...
Don't know how expensive they are -- and they do spit if you're not nice -- but it seems like a great "watch dog" solution...

[FalseImpression]

I did read that they found the carcass of the coyote that had been shot. There was also a plea from the victim's mother to spare the coyotes and only shoot the one that attacked, not every coyote the Ministry of the Environment people met! She stated that her daughter loved nature and animals and would not have wanted a massive cull of coyotes.

[JSwan]

That's an awfully nice thing for her mother to say. To think of others (including animals) while she is grieving.

[lolalola]

There are coyotes now in central NJ. I have seen them in my yard and around the neighborhood for the past few years.

[D Osborn]

I live in the city and we have them, on the golf course,and close to my school. About 25 were "relocated" and I think we need to do round 2, as I saw one crossing the road not long ago and one dead in the road. They will lure dogs off, and then the pack kills them,and they are big. You can always tell when they are prowling, a lot of lost little dogs and cat signs go up.
They are not afraid of much, and getting worse. They are a menace. I understand we are taking their land etc etc, but when they start chasing horses and luring away animals to kill them they need to go. They DO go after children and small animals. They rank right up there with large lizards for me!

[cssutton]

One thing that gets under my skin.

People say that we should leave them alone because we are taking their land.

BS!!

There were no coyotes east of the Mississippi until 30 or 40 years or so ago.

As far as we on the east coast are concerned, coyotes are an invasive species.

[JSwan]

Yeah - that's usually the uninformed person that doesn't know much about nature. To them, every issue with wildlife is because we've destroyed their habitat or whatever some AR group has put out there as "truth".

I was reading Michael Korda's book and he got on his high horse about the evils of foxhunting - as foxes are an endangered species.

Ummmm... no.

I don't find much success correcting those misconceptions - it seems people believe what they want to believe and science and research doesn't matter. It's all about feelings and perceptions. Weird.

[cssutton]

Also:

It was not intended for man to hide under the bed while wild animals eat his pets, his livestock and pillage his garden.

The idea that you can't shoot a bear or wolf that is eating your cattle, or kill some rattle snake lying in wait for you in your darkened path between the house and the barn just because some idiot in DC brands him as endangered, is beyond me.

If any such critter tries to take over my life, I promise you he will truly be endangered.

CSSJR

Protect your privacy. Replace Google with IXQUICK at www.ixquick.com.


If we do not wish to lose our freedom, we must learn to tolerate our
neighbor's right to freedom even though he might express that freedom
in a manner we consider to be eccentric.

[ljc]

The coyotes around here love to come in my mini horse field and steal the horses' toys. I've found jolly balls and other toys in their dens (we're next to a creek and the coyotes have made coyote cities in the brush alongside the creek). I'd love to get a video of a coyote jumping the fence and grabbing a jolly ball.

My point is, I worried like crazy about the coyotes when we moved here. I came from the suburbs - coyotes were "wild animals." Well, around this part of California, coyotes outnumber just about everything. I see coyotes every single day. I see them when I come down to feed in the morning. I see them when I'm riding. I see them when I bring the horses in at night. I see them when I'm walking my dog. They are all healthy, well-nourished coyotes. They ignore my horses (apart from stealing their toys). I've seen my big horses chase them out of the field. I've done everythign I could to make it difficult for the coyotes to get in the field but they can climb/jump anything - I have six-foot wooden fences with no-climb wire and they jump up. I've put up bottom wire that goes a few inches into the ground - if the coyotes really want in, they can dig under it.

I will never have a small dog. I will never breed my minis and risk a foal's life. I keep my medium-sized dog next to me or fenced in. Other than that, there's only so much one can do.

[jaimebaker]

3 days ago I had a terrifying experience. I was out feeding my horses and heard the most god awful sound I've ever heard. LOUD, deep, yelling. Almost sounded human. I mean, I was shaking as I ran to get my gun. It was coming from the woods behind my mares' pasture. And my horses were losing their minds running and snorting. Now, we've got a farmer that leases some of our land for his cattle. I thought one of his cows must have been dying or was injured. I walked back to the woods, pistol in tow just in case. I saw the cows gathered in the area that I heard the noise. I noticed one laying down and the others surrounding her. So, I thought, surely something was wrong with one of the cows. Called the farmer and he came out. So here we go, ready to pull this cow up. And he looks over (how I missed this, I'll never know) and said 'Well, there's a dead deer...that's what they are upset about'. There was a very small fawn laying on the ground. No spots, but absolutely tiny, maybe 40lbs. I walked towards it and an ear flicked. Not dead. Long story short, a coyote had brought it down and the cows chased it off. And apparently, I heard the attack. I heard the first scream, and all the ones that followed for the next 10 minutes. I've looked high and low on youtube for that sound so my hubby could hear it, and can't find it. It wasn't bleating, crying, or any other high pitched noise like what I've been finding. It was deep, loud, long, and almost had a gutteral growl to it (not coyote either). The farmer had gone to roll the fawn over to see what damage was on the other side, and it let out that yell I had heard all morning so that's definitely the noise. No significant damage that I could see, but his rectal area was ripped up and he was steadily dripping blood. Farmer put the little guy out of his misery because he could not stand. I went out the next day, but they never came back for the kill as the deer was still there, pretty much undamaged. But I did do some tracking and found definite coyote prints closest to the deer. Only appeared to be a single one. Both coyote and deer prints were right next to one of our ponds (where this happened) so I figure the deer was a victim of circumstance and decided to get a drink of water at a bad time. Found some dog prints around as well, but I'm guessing those are my dogs since one went out to investigate while it was happening. But kept his distance.

And then, the farmer had a calf go missing two weeks ago.

Most of the time we have little to no problems with coyotes. It's coy dogs and feral dog packs that cause the most destruction and loss of livestock. There was a pack of feral dogs a few years back that were pulling calves out as they were being born. It was just awful. Farmers were waiting with their cows at night and shooting the dogs on sight. Took a while, but the pack was finally disbanded and mostly destroyed.

Our property is surrounded by two state parks. Nothing but woods and we are a mile off the road with 140 acres. We've had them around for years. Every now and again, the coyotes will leave and the foxes move in. Then coyotes come back, and my foxes leave. Stays pretty consistent.

[jaimebaker]

when they start chasing horses and luring away animals to kill them they need to go.


That is standard coy dog procedure. ESPECIALLY luring animals out. They lured my farmdog years ago. Coy dogs will send out a bitch in heat, while the males lie in wait to attack. Found my dog 4 days later. He was not too terribly bad, just a mess of puncture wounds on his head since that's also their MO of attack. Still have the same farmdog and he never ventures to the woods anymore. And this happened 9-10 years ago.

So, what you are describing is not coyote behavior I have seen. It's coy dog. And that's an entirely different ballgame.

[D Osborn]

You are right, the packs of wild dogs do it too, but so do the coyotes. I have friends who were walking their lab, and one Coyotes came up-to play-not. Then all hell broke loose. I think only because they had a shot gun was what saved the dog.
I don't like either, and the problem is only getting worse around here, as the south is just getting hit by the economy as the rest starts to recover. Lot of abandoned dogs and cats:(

[Bluey]

That is standard coy dog procedure. ESPECIALLY luring animals out. They lured my farmdog years ago. Coy dogs will send out a bitch in heat, while the males lie in wait to attack. Found my dog 4 days later. He was not too terribly bad, just a mess of puncture wounds on his head since that's also their MO of attack. Still have the same farmdog and he never ventures to the woods anymore. And this happened 9-10 years ago.

So, what you are describing is not coyote behavior I have seen. It's coy dog. And that's an entirely different ballgame.

We don't have coydogs here, but pure coyotes and they do lure dogs out and the pack jumps on them and kills them.

My neighbor lost several dogs to that, including two great pyrinees.
One half grown dog his wife just let out to potty one evening, the dog ran after a coyote, was jumped and dragged off and killed before they could run out to help their poor dog, killed him right in front of her eyes.

Coyotes have their place, but it really is not around where houses and barns are.
Keep them scared off, for their safety and that of all your animals.

[jaimebaker]

We don't have coydogs here, but pure coyotes and they do lure dogs out and the pack jumps on them and kills them.



While the situation you are speaking of may be true, and maybe it was full coyotes I wanted to correct your statement. If you have coyotes, you have coy-dogs. Period. Coyotes aren't going to be that picky that they only breed with other coyotes. So if you have coyotes and dogs in the same area, yes, you will have coy dogs.

ETA: And if they breed with certain breeds of dogs similar in size and color, you would have little to no way of telling if they were coy dogs or full coyotes.

[Dune]

That is standard coy dog procedure. ESPECIALLY luring animals out. They lured my farmdog years ago. Coy dogs will send out a bitch in heat, while the males lie in wait to attack. Found my dog 4 days later. He was not too terribly bad, just a mess of puncture wounds on his head since that's also their MO of attack. Still have the same farmdog and he never ventures to the woods anymore. And this happened 9-10 years ago.

So, what you are describing is not coyote behavior I have seen. It's coy dog. And that's an entirely different ballgame.

No, it's coyote behavior as well. We've witnessed it many, many times in my neck of the woods. We had one that would come onto the farm and for about 2 weeks straight, it would come and play with the trainer's dog. Finally, we explained to her what *could* happen and she stopped them from "playing" and the coyote went away.

[2foals]

We have quite a few coyotes around us. We also raise sheep and have a flock of laying hens, so we have to be a bit more conscious of the coyotes. For the horses I'm not so worried about the coyotes but I wouldn't really want them around my barn or too close to my foals, etc. I'd be upset if they ate my barn cats, I've got some pricey barn cats! (vet bills)

For the farm in general, we have a livestock guardian dog. He doesn't hunt or kill coyotes or other wildlife (except mice and carpenter bees, which he eats). In fact, my husband jokes that the only way he could kill something is to drive it to suicide with his incessant barking. But he seems to have set up the farm as "his territory" and if something comes on it, he harasses it and bothers it until it leaves. We haven't seen a coyote on the farm since we've had him, although we hear their music just about every clear night.

A lot of people say, "shoot them," but that just doesn't seem like a practical solution for a lot of reasons. Plus, when possible I think that a "live and let live philosophy is a good thing. Since you have GSDs, could you possibly get them out to the barn with you more often? I wonder if the coyote would be more reluctant to come around your barn if they smelled your dogs?

BTW, for 24/7 protection of the sheep, we use a guard llama, but I wouldn't get one of those just for the reasons you mention.

I'm interested to hear about the "luring" tactic of coyote/coydogs. It has always interested me (and once annoyed me) that our LGD won't "go after" or chase predators, maybe that is a safety instinct.

[graystonefarm]

We too have a coyote problem. 2 of my cats disappeared this year who were born on my farm over 10 years ago. Neighbor said she heard the attack and it was definitely a coyote. Then I saw them just a couple of months ago at dusk. They traveled across the farm field and into my pastures with my horses! I was on the back deck talking on my cell phone to a friend and I sprinted out there and chased them away. 15 minutes later they were back and I once again sprinted out there and they ran into the woods. I called the State wildlife agency who said that we can legally shoot them without a license as long as they are on our property and there are no seasonal restrictions for hunting coyote. I'm just waiting for the remaining crops to be harvested before the hunt begins. I can't even kill a mouse usually ut if we don't take care of the coyotes, they will likely kill my remaining cats. Unfortunately, my cats are easy pray since they are trusting with people and dogs. We too get our barn cats vaccinated and spayed/neutered and its my responsibility to care for them.

[FatCatFarm]

We are getting a second Great Pyrenees and possibly a third, no puppies this time, older dogs who already know their job so I will have my own "pack" to thwart any coyote pack that may come around. Hopefully they'll now decide our place is not worth their bother and pass us by. My stock is big enough that they should not be a threat to the Mini Donks and Horses and I am not breeding, but I am sick to death of them carrying off my kitties. Wild things should stay wild and not be preying on farm animals. There is no shortage of food for the coyotes in the woods around here. They're just being infuriatingly opportunistic.

[CosMonster]

I read the story but it really doesn't concern me. Every year or so there is a story of someone being killed/attacked by a white tail deer. It happens. It would be stranger if there were the occasional deer attack but no coyote attacks. Deer don't bother me either.

You actually can't "get rid" of coyotes. If their population is threatened the size of the females' litter will increase.

Actually it's kind of funny but according to a pamphlet put out by the forest service that I have around here somewhere, deer are the most dangerous mammal in North America. They seriously injure and kill people much more frequently than bears, wolves, coyotes or mountain lions, but it's not nearly as interesting a headline I guess. :lol: I personally know 4 people who have been injured enough to require a hospital visit due to deer attacks, and have yet to meet anyone who has been mauled by a predator.

Back on topic, if you live in North America you probably have coyotes. They're really not much to worry about. Some of them get huge, too...I've seen some freakishly large ones in areas where they most likely weren't hybrids. I have a bunch around my house, but I've never had a problem. I'm like Bluey, I shoot at them when they're on the property but don't try to hit them for the most part. They learn pretty quick to stay away. Otherwise I leave them alone, because they're always going to be around so there's not much point in killing them IMO. Plus, I kind of like them. I think they're pretty and I love to hear them talking at night.

[buschkn]

In fact, my husband jokes that the only way he could kill something is to drive it to suicide with his incessant barking.

:lol::lol::lol:

I am going to LOL over that one for a while. I actualy have 5 big dogs. 2 GSDs, a Golden mix, a Basset/Heeler mix (short but 65 lb), and now my own Semi-LGD. He is a Pyrenees mix (w/?golden?- who knows) and sweet mary can he bark at night. A common refrain in the wee hours now is "Owen SHUT UP!"

My dogs have about 1 acre fenced in behind my house, and then when I can I take them out back in the big hay fields to run and play and explore more. I just worry so much about something happening to them, they are like kids to me, so when they run off into the woods and don't come back right away I am always paranoid.

And it pisses me off that I can't have a damn barn cat. Everyone around me has 20 cats it seems but noooo, they have to come after mine. Oh well, guess I'll get some black snakes for mice control. ;)

I don't want to kill anything, but if a coyote ever comes after or harms one of my dogs or horses, its ON.

[Kaleigh007]

About 20 yrs ago at the Saratoga National Park they used to have midnight walks in the park. The coy dogs were out of control and stalking the people so much so that the rangers started going out with the people with rifles. We were also told not to ride alone on the trails due to the problem. My Dad shot one and it was a large as a GSD and quite ugly.

[CosMonster]

a Basset/Heeler mix

I have to say I've had Bassets and I have Heelers and while I love both, this sounds like a crazy mix. I'd love to see pictures. :winkgrin:

[Marcella]

I've seen huge coyotes and they never bothered horses.

If you have other animals, some action might need to be taken against them that involves a .45. A pack walked across the ice to our island (yes, I live on a 3 acres island) and we had to eliminate them because they destroyed our chicken flock and the resident Canada geese. Coyotes will hunt in packs, similar to wolves, when food is tight. Not quite normal, but it does happen. Best to be ready. I am all about living with nature. All about it. But when you go outside and shake a broom and scream and yell and those animals growl at you, then you really need to do something about that.

[CDE Driver]

We have coyotes, lots of them. I have seen some really big ones with beautiful coats (that I think would look better on me :) ) They never are a bother here and eat the little varmits.

I do have a question for the geneticists among us. Roughly thirty years ago we started seeing coyotes with bob tails. The first time we saw one we thought maybe someone shot the tail off of it. But every year now there are one or two that have a short tail. Are there dogs with genetically short tails or are all of them bobbed? I can't believe I don't know this! Anyway, would that genetic mutation carry on through generations? This year I saw three pups, one with the short tail.

[FatCatFarm]

Back on topic, if you live in North America you probably have coyotes. They're really not much to worry about. Some of them get huge, too...I've seen some freakishly large ones in areas where they most likely weren't hybrids. I have a bunch around my house, but I've never had a problem. I'm like Bluey, I shoot at them when they're on the property but don't try to hit them for the most part. They learn pretty quick to stay away. Otherwise I leave them alone, because they're always going to be around so there's not much point in killing them IMO. Plus, I kind of like them. I think they're pretty and I love to hear them talking at night.

Well, you're fortunate they've left you and yours alone. We started out just shooting to ward them away too, but that didn't work after a while and they called our bluff. Now, I will kill any that I can on or around our property. I don't want to exterminate them but I do want them to stay the hell away. I used to think they sounded "pretty" off in the distance. Now that's just a harbinger of potential trouble and grief. I too agree that they are like rats and will always be here but just like eradicating rats from the property so will I coyotes.

BTW Buschkn re: your Great Pyr's barking, you may already know this but that's just a function of the GP doing it's job. Owen is just announcing his presence and telling any and all would be intruders that he is on watch and they just had better not come into his territory or else. Our GP is very nocturnal too and does alot of barking. Normally it would bother me but after all the trouble we've had with coyotes, I now find it comforting and go right on to sleep. With adding two more GP's to the property, it might be quite a den out there with them all doing it, but I bet I will no longer have a coyote problem. Worth it to me.

[CosMonster]

I don't think I'm particularly lucky, although I do live in a very rural area out west where perhaps our coyotes are not as accustomed to people, I guess. We have a very high population around here and everywhere I have kept horses my entire life, and I have only ever heard of one coyote attack on horses and that was a young foal. Coy dogs have been a problem when I kept my horses in more populated areas. To me they're just a fact of life, though, like rattlesnakes or mountain lions or bears. If I had an aggressive one I'd shoot it sure, but at least in my experience that is highly unlikely. Perhaps it is a regional difference.

[Foxtrot's]

Yesterday there was a news item. A coyote attack on a hobby fram in Maple Ridge, BC.

They went out to see four coyotes around a downed horse. They were eating it from the back end. The owners cut off the blanket but it had to be destroyed. He chased them away, whereupon three of them turned back towards the man, the fourth ran away. Only when an ambulance with its sirens on went by that it scared them away. This family is used to seeing coyotes around their property. Wildlife officials say that an attack on a grown horse is almost unknown. They are usually pretty timid, but as we encroach on the bush with developments they must be getting more habituated to humans. (Like bears.)

This, coming so soon after the death of the country singer in Cape Breton has put coyotes at the top of many people's kill list.

Generally, we find that the coy-dogs are the more fearless and larger.

[Kairoshorses]

We have had them kill cats, attack our dogs (we have a big sign that only dogs can read which says "SUCKERS LIVE HERE" and all the strays come here to be fed, spayed, etc.)....and I've been very afraid for my foals when they were small.

One of the dogs who read our sign brought four puppies up to the house...and they were the most tick-infested dogs I've ever seen. I made a bed for them on the front porch (fearing they'd infest our dogs in the fenced in back yard) with food and water...and the dog started barking incessently at 4 am. At about 6 am I came down to yell at her, and I found all but one of the puppies shredded in the front yard. Coyotes had come up to our front friggin' porch!

I don't like them.....I wish I could find a way to keep them away!

[Bluey]

We have coyotes, lots of them. I have seen some really big ones with beautiful coats (that I think would look better on me :) ) They never are a bother here and eat the little varmits.

I do have a question for the geneticists among us. Roughly thirty years ago we started seeing coyotes with bob tails. The first time we saw one we thought maybe someone shot the tail off of it. But every year now there are one or two that have a short tail. Are there dogs with genetically short tails or are all of them bobbed? I can't believe I don't know this! Anyway, would that genetic mutation carry on through generations? This year I saw three pups, one with the short tail.

Bob tailed dogs happen due to a mutation that was bred for.
The trouble with that is that the mutation is a spinal defect and when expressed with two genes, by crossing two parents with that mutation, you get some puppies that have an incomplete spine and die on you.

At least that is what the breeders I have known told me.

I found this on google:

You cannot change genetics by surgery.
The bob tail is a mutation that happens from time to time in dogs and in certain breeds was selected for as a positive trait.
The problem with the bob tail gene is as it is a spine defect it can sometimes be associated with defects further up the spine leading to debilitating disease or a non viable puppy.


Read more: http://www.justanswer.com/questions/cx2x-bob-tail-x-gene-selective#ixzz0Vna8jJOt

[JSwan]

Yesterday there was a news item. A coyote attack on a hobby fram in Maple Ridge, BC.



Oh God - that must have been horrible.

You know - one of the things that is beneficial about hunting with dogs (or hounds) is that predators (or prey/game animals) can be discouraged from and maintain their fear of - humans and human activities.

Livestock Guardian Dogs are a good example of how domestic dogs can be used to protect livestock - but packs of coyotes or coy/dogs could overwhelm such a dog - or render the dog ineffective on large holdings.

But organized, lawful hunting with dogs or hounds.... well I've seen that work. That predator scoots.

[equineartworks]

We have coyote here. And they get big. There is a misconception that they are small and fox like. I saw one last year that had me 99.9% convinced it was a wolf...not a coyote.

[equineartworks]

Generally, we find that the coy-dogs are the more fearless and larger.

Coy-dogs scare me, and we do have those as well. They are fearless, and that isn't good.

[mjrtango93]

I was woken up at 4:30 this morning to the lovely sound of coyotes howling! Thanks guys! Around here coyotes aren't really a problem though, the tend to be on the smaller side, and curious but timid by nature. The will somewhat follow you, but run and hide if you look at them. If you even raise your voice they are long gone. I still am making my hubby take our dog out later though, no way am I letting my old, 3 legged dog out alone in the backyard with coyotes calling so close. I don't live on a farm either, we live in the burbs, but we back up to open space.

[Cayusepapoose]

I was listening to the coyotes kay-aying and whooping in the open field next door last night.
I'm not far from Maple Ridge where the young horse was attacked; the owners had mentioned that they'd seen 13 to 15 emerge from that den at times. When coyotes are faced with environmental pressures, they will produce huge litters of pups numbering in the high teens.
Years ago now back in Calgary where I'm from, there was a growing problem of stray dogs breeding with coyotes; attacking and killing young stock. One of the first orphan foals I raised was from a man who had a pack of greyhound mix dogs that he used to hunt these hybrids. Very sobering to see them in action.

[HorseShine]

Here is a link below for the owner's account of the 1 1/2 year-old QH who was killed in Maple Ridge. This is what she had to say on Horse Council of B.C.

http://forums.hcbc.ca/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=7590

I guesstimate that the poor horse weighed approx. 800 pounds. It's not much more of a stretch that if the coyote pack is large enough, they can bring down a full-grown horse. Never again will I be complacent about a coyote pack's ability to kill an adult horse! *horrors*

Part of her statement:

When I was on the phone 8 coyotes charged my husband so I called police and conservation. <snip> If they charge a 6'2 260 pnd man (i would never have believed it if I didn't see it with my own eyes) don't think they are not going to attack a child.
It's true, they have no fear anymore.

[BeastieSlave]

Wow. I guess I'm another lucky one. We have coyotes at the farm and I've never seen one (other than crossing the road near the farm) or had much trouble. I hear them all the time and I see droppings all over, but never within the pasture fences. I've had a few of the more adventuresome cats vanish, but can't prove it was coyotes.

Maybe it's because the farm is so big (1,500 acres) and is mostly maintained for hunting various fowl that there is enough room and food for them not to venture near the equine part of the farm. Whatever the reason, I haven't had any problems with them and the farm's owner hasn't either. Believe me, if they were threatening his precious birds, he'd be doing something! From the droppings I've 'investigated', it sure looks like small rodents make up most of the farm's coyotes' diets - though they do seem to enjoy blackberries, or maybe their dinner does?

[2foals]

:lol::lol::lol:

and now my own Semi-LGD. He is a Pyrenees mix (w/?golden?- who knows) and sweet mary can he bark at night. A common refrain in the wee hours now is "Owen SHUT UP!"



It's taken a few years, but we don't even hear the barking anymore. The dog lays out in the grass and barks at slight changes in the farm ambiance all night.

My DH really was annoyed with our LGD for the longest time when we got him, I mean the dog was the perfect appearance of uselessness, he thought it was just chance the coyotes, foxes and skunks left around the same time.

Can the Pyr sleep out in the barn aisle? Could you put an invisible fence up around the barn area or part of the barn area so that 1-2 of your dogs could stay out there at night or at least spend more time out there?

[buschkn]

I know my dog is just doing his job, which is great. In fact the male Shepherd sometimes is leading the refrain, too. Tonight my Basset/Heeler (and yes- he is hilarious looking) was at it.

I don't mind the barking TOO much myself, but I do have neighbor's reasonably close, so I worry about disturbing them. We are quite friendly so I ask them all the time if the dogs keep or wake them up and they say they almost never hear them, so that's some relief.

As for keeping them in the barn at night or something like that, I have thought about it, but since there isn't anything to kill now (no more cats) I don't want to take a chance that something could happen to one of my dogs. If they can take down an 800lb QH, they can surely do some damage to my dogs. :(

Right now I am just ignoring the coyotes and hoping they keep their distance with my pack of Barky McGees sounding the alarm.

[smm20]

The bob-tail is a recessive gene that appears in canids, as well as other species. Some researchers hypothesize that it is linked with domestication. This hypothesis is supported by data from the Siberian Fox Farm Experiment (http://www.floridalupine.org/publications/PDF/trut-fox-study.pdf). When researchers selectively bred for friendliness towards humans, recessive traits began to show up in the later generations, including short tails.

If these tails are present in coyotes, there could be several explanations: 1) recessives coming out and persisting due to the size of the gene pool, 2) hybridization with dogs, or 3) selection within the coyote population for a linked trait.

We have coyotes all over AZ, including in the city centers. I see them all the time at the barn. They don't bother us very much.

[Foxtrot's]

Saskatchewan has a bounty offered for coyotes until the end of March - $20.00 each. A measure to protect livestock, but I hate to see a bunch of gun totin'
people out after them. Responsible farmers is one thing, but March is just when all the babies arrive, coyotes, calves, sheep.

SaskPacer maybe will chime in with the debate.

[cloudyandcallie]

We have coyotes, lots of them. I have seen some really big ones with beautiful coats (that I think would look better on me :) ) They never are a bother here and eat the little varmits.

I do have a question for the geneticists among us. Roughly thirty years ago we started seeing coyotes with bob tails. The first time we saw one we thought maybe someone shot the tail off of it. But every year now there are one or two that have a short tail. Are there dogs with genetically short tails or are all of them bobbed? I can't believe I don't know this! Anyway, would that genetic mutation carry on through generations? This year I saw three pups, one with the short tail.

Oh no, I hope the coyotes aren't fooling around with our natural bob tail aussies. Several breeds have some natural bob tails, including australian shepherds. Let us know if any of the bob tail coyotes have blue eyes.

And yes, the bob tail gene is handed down, altho unlike the manx cats, I think the gene is recessive in aussies.

[Mimi La Rue]

We have lots of coyotes here! Above my barn there is a big hill where tons of coyotes live and you can hear packs of them howling every night. Sometimes I come across them down in the stables late at night and there are always a few of them. Most of the time they don't even seem scared of me. They will just stand still and watch me but if I get close enough to them they will eventually walk away. Never heard of a coyote attacking a horse. I guess they are more into all the bunnies that live at the stable.

Most of the trainers have barn cats that stay out all night. I don't understand why. Most are the sweetest cats too. Just because they have lived so many years there doesn't mean one night their luck might just run out. I have heard many stories about coyotes getting cats and dogs.