landing heel first.......please help me to understand

[preferred]

I've been hearing that my horse is not landing heel first in the front.

Can someone explain the concept behind this, how to correct with past experiences of this same issue, and what the limitations are.

Thanks in advance

[Daydream Believer]

This question probably belongs in Horse Care. Maybe the mods will move it...you will get more replies there.

When a horse moves, just like with a person, the back part of the hoof/foot should impact the ground first on the landing phase of the stride. Just as with a person, the foot rolls through the impact phase to the point of breakover and then off the ground.

Many horses with problems related to trim/shoeing, heel discomfort, or even poor conformation can have a toe first landing. Think of what it would look like in a person...the toe impacts before the heel does. It is considered by some vets to be a Grade 1 lameness and generally a toe first landing indicates a problem that needs to be addressed.

The best way to "see" it is to crouch down and have someone lead a horse to you, past you and away and watch to see what part of the hoof hits first...does the hoof land laterally level or does it land on one side and roll to the other side, does the hoof land flat or heel first.

I will say that a "flat" landing is often the best you will see just walking a horse up and down a barn aisle...it can be very hard to always see that heel hit first. Also on an uphill, the toe will always hit first...very normal. On a downhill, the heel will hit first. It is level ground where you will see if your horse's movement dynamics are correct. If you see dirt kicked up at the toe (at the landing phase) when a horse walks or trots also in an arena, that is often showing that the toe is hitting first as well.

Toe first landings are not as common on back feet but I've seen it in horses with hock/stifle problems.

It's hard to say how to correct it because it can be caused by many different problems ranging from poor hoof care/trimming/shoeing to thrush, "navicular" or an injury. I also do think some horses are set up this way by their conformation and it's very hard to get correct movement on them...ie horses built very downhill with narrow upright feet that is common to many stock horses. It's not a surprise that these types of horses often suffer from navicular syndrome/disease.

There are some who feel that a toe first landing can contribute to the development of navicular syndrome or disease...in that the incorrect movement dynamics sets up the horse to become sore...and then the problem cascades and worsens over time.

It is really important to find a hoof care provider who knows the importance of movement dynamics and makes an effort to get a horse comfortable or correctly trimmed/balanced to achieve a flat or heel first landing. I nearly always watch horses I trim walk and am shocked at how many clients tell me that I'm the first hoof care provider who has ever done that.

[preferred]

thanks for the insightfull reply.

horse is landing rather flat footed not digging the toe into the ground. horse is 7 and finally learning to balance onto his end end and off his forehand.

His xrays show good angles with no issues.

[oharabear]

I absolutely agree with DB.

I am no expert, but typically my farrier looks at my horses' when they walk to see how they are landing, and if they are landing toe first (or flat-footed), he then takes off a bit more toe (the "breakover point"). The theory, as he explained it to me, is that the longer toes don't "break over" at the end of the stride as quickly (when the heel is leaving the ground and the foot is about to go forward). If they have a late breakover from a long toe, then the leg doesn't have enough time to fully extend before the hoof is coming back down again. By taking off a bit of toe at the breakover point, it allows the hoof to leave the ground on time and therefore has enough time to fully extend so they can land heel-first.

Again, my disclaimer is that I am *not* an expert, nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night, and I hope that I am translating that correctly. ;)

You'll probably get way more (and better-educated) responses over in the Horse Care forum.

[alteringwego]

it's a shoeing issue and should be taken up with your farrier.

[preferred]

thanks so much! new farrier will see him in a few weeks.

[EqTrainer]

Actually.. it's usually a trimming issue but your farrier can do that, too :lol:

Sorry, I could not resist.. long day stuck inside..

Seriously. It could be the trim and/or the shoe but it could also be a pain issue as DDB outlined. If your new farrier doesn't say ah ha! and fix it very quickly, you will want to call your vet. Horses walking on their toes is not a good thing

[Fixerupper]

This question probably belongs in Horse Care. Maybe the mods will move it...you will get more replies there.

When a horse moves, just like with a person, the back part of the hoof/foot should impact the ground first on the landing phase of the stride. Just as with a person, the foot rolls through the impact phase to the point of breakover and then off the ground.

Many horses with problems related to trim/shoeing, heel discomfort, or even poor conformation can have a toe first landing. Think of what it would look like in a person...the toe impacts before the heel does. It is considered by some vets to be a Grade 1 lameness and generally a toe first landing indicates a problem that needs to be addressed.

The best way to "see" it is to crouch down and have someone lead a horse to you, past you and away and watch to see what part of the hoof hits first...does the hoof land laterally level or does it land on one side and roll to the other side, does the hoof land flat or heel first.

I will say that a "flat" landing is often the best you will see just walking a horse up and down a barn aisle...it can be very hard to always see that heel hit first. Also on an uphill, the toe will always hit first...very normal. On a downhill, the heel will hit first. It is level ground where you will see if your horse's movement dynamics are correct. If you see dirt kicked up at the toe (at the landing phase) when a horse walks or trots also in an arena, that is often showing that the toe is hitting first as well.

Toe first landings are not as common on back feet but I've seen it in horses with hock/stifle problems.

It's hard to say how to correct it because it can be caused by many different problems ranging from poor hoof care/trimming/shoeing to thrush, "navicular" or an injury. I also do think some horses are set up this way by their conformation and it's very hard to get correct movement on them...ie horses built very downhill with narrow upright feet that is common to many stock horses. It's not a surprise that these types of horses often suffer from navicular syndrome/disease.

There are some who feel that a toe first landing can contribute to the development of navicular syndrome or disease...in that the incorrect movement dynamics sets up the horse to become sore...and then the problem cascades and worsens over time.

It is really important to find a hoof care provider who knows the importance of movement dynamics and makes an effort to get a horse comfortable or correctly trimmed/balanced to achieve a flat or heel first landing. I nearly always watch horses I trim walk and am shocked at how many clients tell me that I'm the first hoof care provider who has ever done that.

This is probably the best post about foot balancing I have read on this BB.

A 'million' years ago a really excellent blacksmith taught me this and it is a dying art...to look at the feet as part of the 'dynamics' and not something apart.

[Daydream Believer]

Gosh thanks Ponyfixer. :) We need a blushing icon but I don't think this forum has one.

[EqTrainer]

No need to blush! Just :D it was a *great* explanation!

[Daydream Believer]

Thanks Gail. :cool:

Since Rick hasn't shown up to tear my post to pieces (in deleta) than it must not be too bad...either that or he just hasn't seen it yet! :lol::lol:

[whicker]

my vet, who is a lameness expert is also a world champion in endurance. She wants the hoof to land flat. She has a treadmill and takes video to slow down the footfalls to analyze them. Her horses stay sound for many years. Mine have still been active and doing well in their late 20's. I have one of hers that is 25 and still going strong.

[egontoast]

Heel first is good but hoof landing flat is OK, too, as I understand it. Toe first is not good because it may suggest heel pain for whatever reason or at the very least it means the hoof is likely landing with the coffin and pastern bones out of alignment thereby setting up the horse for more problems.

There is a thread in horse care a while ago -search for 'toe first landing' or something like that.

Sometimes this is difficult to discern from the naked eye. A video camera which allows you to advance the playback frame by frame is really useful for analysing the gait.

[Fixerupper]

The best way to "see" it is to crouch down and have someone lead a horse to you, past you and away and watch to see what part of the hoof hits first...does the hoof land laterally level or does it land on one side and roll to the other side, does the hoof land flat or heel first.

Absolutely, the 'heel first' should not be exaggerated and at higher speeds it does actually translate to 'flat' ...so flat is good as long as it is not 'toe first'.
The other point that DB brought up and which is equally important is that the foot must also be 'laterally' balanced. If it isn't, this can cause 'rotational' stresses through the whole leg, especially on tall horses. (like repetitive stress syndrome in people)

[narcisco]

I have seen foundered or laminitic horses walk "heel first." I agree with Whicker, flat is best.

The horse moves to take the pain off the most sensitive area. A foundered horse will try to walk on his heel rather than the toe, where the tip of the coffin bone is. A navicular horse will move toe first, then heel to take the weight off the heel where the navicular bone is.

All of this can be slight or severe. Trimming and shoeing can be the sole culprits.

[Roan]

my vet, who is a lameness expert is also a world champion in endurance. She wants the hoof to land flat. She has a treadmill and takes video to slow down the footfalls to analyze them. Her horses stay sound for many years. Mine have still been active and doing well in their late 20's. I have one of hers that is 25 and still going strong.

Interesting. My vet sounds a lot like your vet, right down to the credentials. You don't live in NoVA, do you?

Eileen

[Fixerupper]

ooops.. moved to 'Horse Care'...now the s#!% is going to hit the fan :lol:

[AZ Native]

I've been hearing that my horse is not landing heel first in the front.

Can someone explain the concept behind this, how to correct with past experiences of this same issue, and what the limitations are.

Thanks in advance

DB's post was excellent as usual. Here is an except and link to an article on the subject that you may find helpful :


''Understand that all this talk of heel first landings is about the natural alignment of the bones during locomotion; NOT the outer heel we see. If a horse's heels are artificially raised and they (heels) happen to hit the ground first, P3 may STILL be toe first on impact and causing the same unnatural forces. All of this research can be summarized by saying that the long held notion that raising the heels provides "slack" to the deep flexor tendon and thus decreases stress on the navicular bone, is untrue. While it may be true in the standing horse, it works the opposite way for the horse in motion. A low heel, a short breakover, a healthy functioning hoof and a heel first landing minimize stress to the deep flexor tendon and thus the navicular region''



http://www.hoofrehab.com/NavicularSyndrome.htm

[grayarabpony]

I've always heard slightly heel first, especially if the horse is in a discipline where the horse has to push up and as forward such as jumping and dressage.

[txladybug]

If I had a horse that was leaning towards a toe first landing, and otherwise had correctly trimmed/shod hooves, I would aggressively treat for thrush even if it was not readily evident.

[Rick Burten]

Since Rick hasn't shown up to tear my post to pieces (in deleta)
You did mean "minutia" didn't you? ;)
than it must not be too bad...either that or he just hasn't seen it yet!
Actually, it is a very good and informative post. And, I hadn't commented on it because it needed no comment by/from me.

So, if its kudos you want, then its kudos you get.

[Daydream Believer]

You did mean "minutia" didn't you? ;)

Actually, it is a very good and informative post. And, I hadn't commented on it because it needed no comment by/from me.

So, if its kudos you want, then its kudos you get.

Yes, minutia or whatever...I have some lack in my vocabulary that I need to work on!

Well, I wasn't really asking for kudos, but I appreciate the feedback. :)

[starkissed]

It is not ideal for a horse to land toe first. Here are some videos that are pretty good and show heel first landing:

barefoot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6yLEdr2EOM

shod
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fql-xsofeg0

hoofboot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAFhrE5NXIc

and this horse is doing a more toe-first hoof land
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW-sXbWBhn4


My horse does not have shoes and he was a little bit sore and the couple times I watched him go he looked toe-first. And the reason was he had really bad thrush in some of his feet! So he really didnt want to land on his heel at all. Now that I have treated the thrush, it no longer hurts him, so now we are just waiting for the frogs to grow back.

[caballus]

What most people don't know or understand is that the shock absorption and energy dissipation apparatus for the equine hoof is in the rear 2/3rds of the hoof ... the frog and the digital cushion. Both are 50% liquid (think anatomical gel pads). Plus, most of your 'soft tissue' is back there rather than in the front of the hoof and leg. The soft tissue is more capable of absorbing shock than bone. So, that being simple anatomy of the equine digit then one can understand the reasoning of why the horse *should* be landing heel first. :)

[Chall]

If they have a late breakover from a long toe, then the leg doesn't have enough time to fully extend before the hoof is coming back down again. By taking off a bit of toe at the breakover point, it allows the hoof to leave the ground on time and therefore has enough time to fully extend so they can land heel-first.

Can you explain this further ? IIRC you are saying longer toe= longer time before breakover=shorter stride? I was under the impression that shorter breakover meant shorter stride, longer breakover=longer stride. But perhaps I am mixing up "distance covered" and "time on the ground" being lengthened with a longer toe and you mean time in the air is shortened. I also thought the leg was over extended with too long toes. Can you clarify I'm a bit (genuinely) confused.