Abscess from injection - Warning: Nasty pictures

[*JumpIt*]

I've been on an adventure with my pony friend who I ride for his owner. Poor guy has been fighting a nasty abscess on his neck from an injection for a month now.

So let me give you the run down -

9/15 - Injection given - EWE, Botulism, something else I can't remember....they were given on both sides of the neck

9/14 - Complete personality change - pony who normally is a cribber, biter, wiggly, energetic Morgan completely dull. Just standing in his stall. Big, glazed over eyes, no biting no wiggling, most depressed looking pony ever. Got the vet out thinking colic, vet believes it is a reaction to the injections and to give it a few days.

9/17 - Still no improvement and swelling begins around injection site. Called vet who still says it is a reaction and cold hosing 2x's per day begins.

9/19 - Swelling still is growing, it is hard and pony won't put his head down to the ground to eat because it is so uncomfortable/painful, flinches at touch. :(

9/21 - Have vet out again steroid shot and put on antibiotics, diagnosed as abscess and wait it out. The swelling now is about 10" wide and goes from middle of his neck to about 3" away from his withers.

9/22 - Personality returns, neck still as hard as a rock and no change in size but does not appear painful. Call vet about every other day, vet says to keep waiting it out.

9/27 - Swelling starts to go down.

10/01 - Swells up again.

10/4 - Gets soft in the middle and seeps some then stops. Hot compresses and furazone to try and pull it out.

10/8 - A small spot (dime size) softens and the skin seems to crack and it bleeds and pusses.

10/10 - Spot grows bigger and swelling surrounding it goes down and moves into the spot and spot grows into a lump the size of a large walnut.

10/13 - Size of a lemon.

And now the reason you opened the thread, pictures from today http://i947.photobucket.com/albums/ad319/quailroost/Fortune/BLECH.jpg and http://i947.photobucket.com/albums/ad319/quailroost/Fortune/EWW.jpg . When I first walked up to him today I swear it looked like a brain was growing out from the side of his neck. :eek:

The yellow stuff is the furazone, the skin is cracked but there doesn't seem to be any real drainage. I have a feeling that any day now the whole thing is going to rupture. It has perplexed our vets, my BM, and trainer none have ever seen anything like this happen before.

Pony has to split his legs wide to get to grass but other wise acts like his normal mischievous self.

Has anyone had an abscess from an injection? Has anyone seen something this bad?

We are continuing to put hot compresses and furazone on it to try and get the thing to open up but nothing is happening other than it getting bigger and grosser. :P

[AKB]

Our one horse always gets swelling at the site of his tetanus vaccine, but never anything like in your picture. I wish the owner had given the vaccines 1 at a time so you would know which vaccine caused this (if the vaccine is the cause, rather than just bacteria at the injection site).

Can the vet ultrasound the lump to see if there is an abscess inside?

That lump is quite impressive. Keep us updated. I think it is going to be a long time before that lump is completely gone.

[kypeep]

Yes, I have experienced this same thing first-hand in a neighbor's horse. By any chance did the horse get a Strangles intra-nasal at the same time?

The reason I ask is this. My neighbor requested that I do her horse's vaccines, as I always do the majority of my own. She had EWT and Strangles intranasal for them on this particular day. I gave an EWT to one horse, readied the Strangles, and my husband administered it. I sterilized my hands (or so I thought), gave the next horse its EWT, readied the Strangles, and husband gave it again. Some time later (2 weeks? 1 week? 3 weeks? Can't recall exactly), the 2nd horse shows all the same signs of this horse. Ultimately its neck "blew out" just like this.

After conversations with vets, I came to the conclusion that I had somehow gotten the Strangles at the site of the EWT shot or on the needle I used to administer the EWT shot. How, I do not know, as I am extremely careful about sterilization when I mix and pull up Strangles intranasal because I'm aware such an abscess is possible. Obviously, I missed something. Fortunately, my neighbor still likes me.

The lesson I took away from this is that I always, always do my Strangles separate from anything else. I don't even think now of going near a needle when I'm doing the Strangles intranasal.

One thing I did notice last time I mixed and pulled up a Strangles (I was watching very carefully) - some of the vaccine did leak out around the top when I was shaking the bottle. So now, one more step in the process for me - hold bottle with paper towel when shaking, wipe down bottle when done, and dispose of all immediately in garbage can far away from barn. I'm a little paranoid now, after that abscess I created....and it was eventually about twice the size of the one you're showing here. Healed with no scarring, thank goodness.

[ddashaq]

My friend's horse came with a golf ball size dent in his neck and because we lived in a very small community, she asked her vet about it. It turned out that he had an abscess the size of a basketball in his neck after vaccinations when he was a two year old. I don't know the entire story other than eventually it drained and left the golf ball sized dent. The vet never vaccinated him in the neck again, always in his chest because it drains better. She said that it was the worst reaction she had seen in the 30+ years she had been in practice.

[bhebert19]

I don't know too many details but my mothers horse got a abscess from a vaccine a few years ago... The things I can tell you about it is the vet came out and actually cut it open a put drainage tubes into... Lots of cold hosing and I am sure meds... And the other thing the vaccine company covered all the cost of the vet visits for the abscess... I know he was sound through it all and it never really seemed to bother him... But thats all I know... Good luck hope the pony feels better soon!! :D

[kypeep]

Yes, if a vet administered vaccines, the company will typically reimburse - or so vets have told me. In my neighbor's case, since I administered the vaccines, we didn't even ask if they would. However, I give her shavings free of charge whenever she needs them and horse-sit as needed. Figured it's the least I can do!

[*JumpIt*]

Nope didn't get the strangles. I have asked the vet about puncturing it but he said he wouldn't know where to start and didn't want to just slice into his neck. Now that it looks like it is about to pop they want to let it happen naturally.

[flyracing]

Sounds like you may need to go vet shopping! Furazone is not a drawing agent!! It will do NOTHING for an infection it cannot touch (aka an abcess). Here is what furazone says it is idicated for:
"Fura-Zone Ointment is indicated for the prevention or treatment of surface bacterial infections of wounds, burns, and cutaneous ulcers"

Note use of the word "surface".

I've seen this three times. Two times it was treated actively in attempt to get the horses back to work and reduce risk of permanent cosmetic damage. So I can't say how long this will take to heal with out vet care... probably many months. The two vets that I've seen treat this have both lanced (cut a slit in to the abcess) and throughouly cleaned out the abcess. In one case it was packed with an antibacterial preperation (don't remeber how many times it was changed) and drainage tubes were put in and the other time the wound was cleaned out daily with watered down betadine using a large syringe to squirt the water in, a drainage tub was added when the hole closed up to much for cleaning. One vet's hole was thumb (daily cleaning) sized the other about 1 1/2 inches long (packed). Both horses were given SMZ's for 10 days and banamine for the first couple of days until comfortable. Neither had any visible injury/marks once healed.

The third horse was treated with 3 different types of antibiotics but died around 6 weeks after abcess. It was heartbreaking and wasn't until after the necropsy that they learned the abcess had pressed on the spinal chord and caused him to stop breathing (was paralized for about an hour before death, but seemed perfectly fine before that besides having a painful lump on his neck) They also found the infection was causing necrotic muscle death (actually turning the tissue black) and they said once they opened it, the abcess was the worse they had ever smelled. They thought that because the abcess was "unable to find a way out" the bacteria began affecting the muscle health. Very sad as the owner was very involved, but trusted the vet that it "needed more time" and no one thought it would have ended this way! :(

Your vet will probably need to ultrasound to find the best spot to lance and place drainage tubes. Good luck! I hope you have a happy ending!

[kypeep]

Yes, please keep us posted. And what Flyracing said above is what the vet ended up doing for the horse I mentioned.

[AKB]

At least in people, you can't open and drain an abscess unless you know where it is. Until it gets a soft spot, it can be hard to find. I have seen MDs cut multiple holes in abscesses and miss the spot. You have to find the pus pocket or cutting holes is worse than doing nothing. Putting ointment on the outside of an abscess seems to protect the skin from damage from scabbing, and also helps keep the scab soft so it can continue to drain after it is open. I wouldn't fault the vet for having you use ointment on the outside.

Talk with your vet about ultrasounding the area to look for an area to drain. You also could try to take the horse to a board certified surgeon. When one of our boys had an infected pastern, we had him seen by a surgeon.

[*JumpIt*]

Sadly the pony is not mine and the owner wants to spend as little as possible. I will definatly update if anything changes.

[Daydream Believer]

I once saw a horse get "gas gangrene" in its neck from injections. When they burst from two sites, you could put you finger in one hole and out the other. It was super nasty. I really prefer to give shots in the brisket area when I can for this reason...much easier for abscesses to break out and drain if they are going to happen.

[hitchinmygetalong]

Sadly the pony is not mine and the owner wants to spend as little as possible. I will definatly update if anything changes.

:eek::eek::eek:

That's a horrific looking wound that needs to be properly treated. Ah well, I guess a dead horse is cheaper than a vet bill.

:eek::eek::eek:

[*JumpIt*]

She'll pay what ever is necessary of course, but is not wanting to go the full ultrasounding route because it seemed like it is going to pop on it's own. Nothing I can really do about it since I have my own horse and as much I'd like to can't afford to pay for anything on the pony.

[hitchinmygetalong]

Sorry, I don't buy it. If she will "pay what is necessary" then she should be willing to pay for proper veterinary care. I don't know a single vet that would take a look at that and say, "It should pop on its own."

[JSwan]

There is NO way in hell any vet said that's going to pop on its own.

You and the owner are CRAZY not to treat that wound aggressively. Do you realize how much pain that animal is in?????

I weep for that horse.:no:

[whbar158]

I know of lots of abscesses that have popped on their own including ones much like this horses. The vet has seen the horse, has given a care option, and the owner is following those instructions. People are so quick the judge and condemn people around here if they don't do it exactly they way YOU feel like they should. Many horses do just fine with the wait and see approach with things like this.

[Walela]

I would try Neosporin ointment three times a day, this WILL draw the infection to the top,it may take a week or so but, it will draw..What do ya have to lose at this point anyway, I did not mean that in an ugly way either..Wishing you the best with your guy


Sadly the pony is not mine and the owner wants to spend as little as possible. I will definatly update if anything changes.

[*JumpIt*]

If it were my horse I would have already done something more but since he is not mine I can do nothing but follow directions and comment when allowed. I have no say in the matter.

The pictures show it at it's worst, last time vet was (and said to let it wait and see) it was about a 1/3 that size and wasn't open but for a small spot. Vet is suppose to come out again today, he may decided that today we can cut into it.

I am just at a loss, I have no control and can't change anything but pony doesn't seem to be bothered by it. I want to do what's best for him but he is not mine. I'm doing the best that I can do given the circumstances.

I'll talk with the owner and vet today about using neosporine instead of furazone.

Thanks for the good wishes, I really hate it for the little man.

[JSwan]

I have no say in the matter.

The pictures show it at it's worst, last time vet was (and said to let it wait and see) it was about a 1/3 that size and wasn't open but for a small spot. Vet is suppose to come out again today, he may decided that today we can cut into it.


I bet the vet is going to want to do something at this point. I'm not one to call the vet for every little thing - and I've treated plenty of abscesses in various species of livestock.

Sometimes owners can be penny wise and pound foolish.

[midwestrocket]

If its an abscess I'd treat it the same was as you would one in the hoof or anywhere really. Epsom salt hot compresses as often as possible and slap some poltice on there. Poltice is a drawing agent (inexpensive too) and let that stuff do work!

jingles for poor pony!

[Grataan]

Nope didn't get the strangles. I have asked the vet about puncturing it but he said he wouldn't know where to start and didn't want to just slice into his neck. Now that it looks like it is about to pop they want to let it happen naturally.I use my ultrasound probe in cases like this-you may or may not find a place to drain it.

[Thomas_1]

Sadly the pony is not mine and the owner wants to spend as little as possible. I will definatly update if anything changes. For goodness sakes, the horse needs proper treatment.

If the owner can't be bothered then just tell her she might as well just get the horse shot and save herself time, trouble and money!

[spaghetti legs]

Amen Thomas. You wouldn't let your dog or kid run around with that on their body... why the horse.

You need to think about your friendship with this person if she can't even be bothered with appropriate veterinary care for her animals.

[Ghazzu]

I would try Neosporin ointment three times a day, this WILL draw the infection to the top,it may take a week or so but, it will draw..What do ya have to lose at this point anyway, I did not mean that in an ugly way either..Wishing you the best with your guy


Sorry, but neosporin isn't any kind of drawing agent.
You could smear canned frosting on the skin and wait a week and it would probably have a similar effect...

[greeneyelioness]

Hi OP,
I PM'd you about this and I want to give you (and everyone on here) a bit of advice. I am wondering if this is possibly necrotic tissue erupting from a shot of Banamine?
I'm an equine vet tech on her way to vet school (HOPEFULLY!!) and a long time ago, a vet I worked for told me that you should absolutely never ever give Banamine IM (shot directly into the muscle) as it will cause exactly this type of reaction: necrotic tissue erupting from the injection site. He explained to me that if it is given IM then the surrounding tissues will die and need to be debrided (cut away) and may not fully heal.
Not every horse will have this type of reaction to IM Banamine but he said would you want to find out that your horse is one of the ones who do? I didn't so he advised to always always always give Banamine IV.
It would be interesting to know if Banamine was recently given IM to this horse. Without a doubt this needs to be debrided and allowed to heal with hopefully normal healthy tissue, but it may not. It may not ever fully heal depending on what was injected there.
I hope that this poor horse gets treatment soon as that looks very nasty and if it becomes septic, it could infect the rest of him and then all you'll have is a stupidly high vet bill that at the bottom says "euthanasia."

[Ghazzu]

Hi OP,
I PM'd you about this and I want to give you (and everyone on here) a bit of advice. I am wondering if this is possibly necrotic tissue erupting from a shot of Banamine?


If you apply Occam's Razor to this case, you don't need to invoke IM flunixin.
The horse got multiple vaccinations in the general vicinity just prior to the abscess.

[threedogpack]

yep, had this happen to a mare I owned. The abcess got to be the size of an orange, I called the practice repeatedly, vet assistant refused to let me talk to him as the mare was eating/drinking/pooping/peeing. By call #4, my M-I-L walked through the room and yelled loud enough for Vet Assistant to hear "sue the bastard!" and I got to talk to him. He came out that day, lanced it and it sorta drained for 2 days, then I found a pressure point and it erupted. I flushed it with peroxide and it healed in less than a week with no visible scarring or dent.

[Petstorejunkie]

Nope didn't get the strangles. I have asked the vet about puncturing it but he said he wouldn't know where to start and didn't want to just slice into his neck. Now that it looks like it is about to pop they want to let it happen naturally.

Get a new vet, seriously. lancing an abscess isnt rocket science. Hell, i've done it myself on goats
FWIW if you want to be uber careful, do an ultrasound. It will show where the biggest pocket it, then lance, insert drain, voila!
That has to be ungodly painful for that poor pony to have going on.

[Blinkers On]

At the very least change the uracin for icthamol which will draw...

[LauraKY]

I'd vote for ultrasound and lancing. Sounds like you're spending more on vet calls overall than if you had just done the ultrasound in the beginning!

[sdlbredfan]

This comment, (" have asked the vet about puncturing it but he said he wouldn't know where to start and didn't want to just slice into his neck") and the fact that it even happened after (same Vet?) vaccinated means a new Vet is needed. Sheesh...

[Fharoah]

I would be concerned about the abcess becoming septic.

[Thomas_1]

An abscess is pus that form in response to bacteria accumulation.

Septic means containing disease causing or infective organisms.

By definition an absscess IS septic.

After all this time and with neglect to properly and effectively treat, the concern should be the likes necrotic tissue, invasion of important vital structures e.g. muscles, massive septicaemia.

The owner needs to step up and take responsibility and get this sorted!

[rcloisonne]

Could this be a vaccine-associated sarcoma?

I had a two year old cat develop something like this back in the early 90s. The tumor like thing had to be surgically removed. The vets said it was caused by one of the routine vaccinations. Common in cats but I'm not sure about horses? My cat recovered fully after surgery and lived to age 17. No more vaccinations for her though.

Too bad the vets are the "wait and see" type and the owner such an unfeeling cheapskate. :mad: Poor horse.

[JustJump]

That wound needs to be lanced and drained by a competent vet. If there is no one available to administer after care, it's on the verge of needing to go to a clinic for continuing treatment.

Finances are a problem for so many, but these things don't just get better because you 'hope' they will.

Whoever said pennywise/pound foolish is on the mark.

[horsegirl123]

I feel for the poor guy. He can not feel comfortable during all of this. I am still stomped using Furazone as a drawing agent when it is clearly not one. I would be concerned if the vet recommended this as one. I am by no means a vet but would get a second opinion. As a horse owner you have to be pro-active ask lots of questions if you feel something isn't right. Saving a dollar today may cost you a $100 tomorrow. Please keep us posted. I am sure they are thankful to have you as a friend.

[spaghetti legs]

any update on this?

[*JumpIt*]

I was trying to wait til I got the pictures but pony got poped on friday. It gushed "healthy" yellow a good bit and now it is steadily draining and on the mend. Should be completely healed up in a few weeks, vet says there won't even be a scar. Pony is going to be fine, happy as a clam. Thanks for all the jingles and concern. :)

[Penthilisea]

For abcessed, rather then furazone I've always been told to use a drawing salve, such as ichthamol. My QH gets horrific abcesses on his body from tick bites, many each season, even with assiduous use of anti tick products, there is always the first one bite of the season before I think it's warm enough and a last bite of season when I think it's too cold for ticks.
Good luck with your pony!