Does anyone soak hay at a boarding barn?

[3Spots]

My 3yo was diagnosed with IAD and now I have to minimize the dust/pollens in his barn, including thoroughly wetting or soaking his hay.

I am at a 60-horse boarding barn and cannot figure out a good, non-messy way to make this happen.

Mostly it is all the water than makes a mess near his stall. There is no good place to dispose of the water. I can drag the muck bucket to a tree, but I am not going to get the hired help to do that. The tree will be waterlogged after doing this three times a day!

I found a large stock tank with a spigot at the bottom to which I could attach a hose and supposedly drain the runoff water 50 feet away, but that still seems impractical; I've just moved the mud puddle 50 feet awayl.

He choked once on pellets so I am a little leery of using them dry; and if they have to be soaked, I am back into th (slighty easier) problem in that I have no runoff water, but how do i ask the guys to soak them and then come back to feed?

I bought the TC bagged low starch feed for right now, but it is very expensive and believe it or not, he is sneezing and blowing MORE on that feed than on hay! Even with that, I have to pre-bag it into serving portions -- and a gallon bag holds a pound of it -- so I'm using the XXXL zip lock bags for the next couple days, but that program is not going to work well. I can only store two days feedings in the prescribed stall boxes in front of each stall.

Just looking for any creativity I might have missed. I have thought of moving him out of area on lay-up to see if he improves and then bringing him back to barn, and trying to reintroduce hay. I have also thought of asking the barn if I can pay a premium to have someone soak the hay somewhere else where there is a drain and bring it to his stall.

This is not fun...

jan

[samtoney]

I have had good luck with soaking the hay in a muck bucket. I was able to do a days hay ahead of time. I soaked the hay over night so that it is ready for the next day. If you are able to get a muck bucket with the rope handles, then hook on a lead rope and pull or use smaller drinking buckets to fill with the old water and carry away to dump....or use a dolly and wheel it away to the designated area. I have also found that my horses actually like the soaked hay water for drinking?!?!? The soaking of the hay has make a HUGE improvement in his breathing and symptoms.

[butlerfamilyzoo]

While i prefer soaking it and letting them drink the water in a muck tub as mentioned above...

I did work at a large facility (91 stalls i think it was) that had 6 of its horses on "soaked" hay. What their workers did was wheel a bale of hay on a cart into the wash stall and hose the bajeebas out of it for a good 10min. Workers like this, they got to stand around and chat... Then they wheeled the drenched hay out to feed and sat it in muck tubs in the stalls. Greatly reduced the amount of water they had to dump, if any, as most the horses licked up the access in the bottom of the tub. You could do similar, fill your muck tub far away from the barn, let your hay soak, bring in wet hay only to feed, leaving the bucket out there. You could even re-use your water a time or two possibly depending on the situation.

I dont agree with soaking hay a day in advance if you are in humid climates. Granted, this time of year might be alright, but it will get rank over the warmer months!

Feeding soaked pellets wont require hauling off water, he'll drink up any "soup" left in there.

I've fed that TC you are using, i agree, i think it has more dust than most feeds out there. You could soak that as well. My horses get fed soups at every meal as i also feed soaked beat pulp, but i dont drain water, they just get a bucket of slop. No one complains, my buckets get licked dry. :)

[Lieslot]

How about buying a hay steamer, perfect for IAD horses.
It's pricey but it may solve a lot of water hazzle.
Smart Pack has both the small travel hay steamer bag as well as the larger set-ups.

[JWB]

Do you have a wash rack with a good drain? Since I was only soaking hay for one horse at a time, I got a large cooler with wheels and a drainage spout. Stuck it in the wash rack, dropped in 2 flakes and filled with water.

Come feed time, we emptied the water (out the spout and down the drain) and rolled the hay in the cooler over to the horse's stall.

It was very easy transport and no mess.

I also had a friend with a wheelbarrow that had a drainage spout.... She'd soak hay in that and roll the hay to where she wanted to feed it but I could never find one like it so I just used the cooler.

[LD1129]

My boarding barn has a horse with allergy problems and needs his hay soaked. We put a large rubbermaid trash can (with lid if flies are bad) outside his stall door. It makes only a tiny mess when grabbing a soaked flake to throw in his stall. We soak a few flakes at a time and change the water once a day.

To empty we use a hand dolly and just wheel it out side and dump. When we rinse and fill again with a hose next to his stall. Its actually not that bad when I am working. (I work 1 day a week at the farm)

[Mach Two]

Do you have a wash rack with a good drain? Since I was only soaking hay for one horse at a time, I got a large cooler with wheels and a drainage spout. Stuck it in the wash rack, dropped in 2 flakes and filled with water.

Come feed time, we emptied the water (out the spout and down the drain) and rolled the hay in the cooler over to the horse's stall.

It was very easy transport and no mess.

I also had a friend with a wheelbarrow that had a drainage spout.... She'd soak hay in that and roll the hay to where she wanted to feed it but I could never find one like it so I just used the cooler.

That's a GREAT idea!

[Fairview Horse Center]

I got a large cooler with wheels and a drainage spout. Stuck it in the wash rack, dropped in 2 flakes and filled with water.

Come feed time, we emptied the water (out the spout and down the drain) and rolled the hay in the cooler over to the horse's stall.

It was very easy transport and no mess.


Super idea! I have an Ice Cube cooler, http://www.costsaving2u.com/images/Igloo%2060%20Qt.%20Ice%20Cube%20Wheel%20Cooler.jpg and I bet I could get about 4 flakes in that to soak. I would just remove the lid to not have to mess with it.

[3Spots]

Lieslot, I had no idea they made such a thing! That might be something I ask the barn owner about; perhaps there are others that might benefit from this machine. As such, I don't think they'd let me keep it in the barn aisle. It is interesting.

The idea of just leaving the hay in the muck bucket didn't occur to me. To adequately soak a couple flakes requires a lot of water. I think it would be like "bobbing for hay" -- does your horse have to push the hay down and submerge his nose in water in order to take a bite? If my horse would drink most of the water, and if it didn't matter to use the same water all day long, this could work. His stall is near the hose, and it wouldn't take much to put hay into the bucket and fill it with water.

ButlerFamilyZoo, I saw a "nursery cart" in another thread that had vented sides which would allow for spraying down, but I understood that once it dried, it was as pollen-y and dust-y as ever, thus it would have to be done 3x a day. Not sure my barn mgmt would go for that. Wash racks are a distance from the stalls. And your comment about the TC Low Starch now convinces me not to use it -- the TC grass forage is billed as "dustfree" but has a lot of molasses on it. I didn't think a 3 yo needed that either!

JWB: A cooler! Perfect. It has wheels and a lid. Okay, if I can go that route, I think that is what I'd use.

LD1129, so at your barn, the hired hands are expected to empty the trash can of water daily? that is not seen as an imposition?


I am in denial about this whole IAD diagnosis although he did have high mast cells. It just came on so suddenly and severely, not a gradual thing. And when he was at the hospital he started to get better without soaked hay or sprayed down stall. Makes me think it is unique to the air quality because of recent fires, but the hospital vet said "no, it's IAD."

Are your IAD horses young? Are they ridable? Can you go out on trail with them? How much work can they tolerate. Is this a daily issue or does it come in "attacks?"

Thanks for the great ideas,
jan

[findeight]

Just throwing these out there...you may be better off at a smaller facility with less dust and activity. Or, maybe, a change in stall location to a quieter part of the barn with less traffic?

Noticed that a change to the pelleted bedding helped quite a few with respiratory issues in my barn, including a huge improvement in my own. Basically, less dust is better for most of them IAD or not.

Honestly, I'd look for that smaller barn that might even soak the hay for you and have less traffic and dust then a big place-maybe a heck of alot cleaner overall too.

The fact he was better at the hospital even without soaking his hay is a huge clue about the direction you should be contmplating with this youngster. He needs a cleaner environment.

[3Spots]

Hi findeight --

I neglected to say I did move him to a cleaner barn when I brought him back from the hospital. The old barn wasn't as clean, but it was roomier and not a training barn. He did board next to an arena, so the dust level was higher.

So it's at the new place that I am trying to figure this out. This is a pretty high end place and I doubt it can get much cleaner. Hence my concern that they don't want a bunch of water, hoses, tubs, etc, making it difficult to keep clean aisleways (only one type of tack trunk allowed, blankets have to be stored when not in use, etc) or looking nice.

We have rice hull bedding, everything watered (arenas, roads) twice a day, mare motel with a nice breeze, lots of trees. He's not in the main traffic area, away from arenas. So from that point, I think it is as good as I am going to get unless I send him a couple hours away. It is SoCal, so no grass pastures. Turnouts here are all dirt. But right now he isn't being turned out, and at the hospital he was in a dirt stall and still did okay.

So, it's the air or the hay best I can figure. We did have recent fires, although he wasn't directly in the smoke cloud we were within 10 miles. If I can't make it work here, I might need to rehome him, hence my question about whether they are ever really ridable, etc...

[Fairview Horse Center]

He did board next to an arena, so the dust level was higher.
.

When I worked at a barn with an indoor, we had a lot of horses that developed a problem when stabled next to the arena. As soon as they were moved to another barn, they were fine, no soaking, no other changes.

I neglected to say I did move him to a cleaner barn when I brought him back from the hospital.

I bet you have already solved your (his) problem.

[butlerfamilyzoo]

Have you talked with barn management about the issue?

Soaking hay is nothing new. I'm sure they've dealt with it before, or willing to set up a system to do so. It is not an imposition to ask, you are THEIR client. Will it cost you more, possibly, possibly not. (And my pet peeve, if it does cost you more, does that extra go to the employee that has to take the extra time and muscle to do so, or does it line the owners pocket... That really ticked me off that the BOs charge extra for blanketing, but the employees saw none of that when they were doing the work...)

If you asked them to give the "drenched" hay and remove in an hour so as not to let him have access to it all dried out, i think it would be fine. If they set it into a muck tub in his stall, it will drain and puddle in the bucket, so i cant imagine it drying out too quickly on you.

They will "bob" for hay... :) But the hay floats to the top as they eat it down, so not too much nose dunking required unless they just like it that way, and yes, i've seen horses up to their eye balls getting that good bite out of there... :) But it does use a lot of water, and he's not going to drink down a muck tub full of hay. I like the cooler idea, what if you painted it to match the barn colors and ask if it could be allowed in the aisle? That "Fusion" spray paint bonds to plastic. Its not brilliant, but would make things easier for the staff since they could wheel it out at the end of the day.

I've worked in a few high end barns that would have made something like that work for you. Like i said, horses with this need is nothing new! :)

Good luck!

[msj]

A friend used to put the hay in a muck basket. The muck basket was in one of those wheeled muck basket holders. She'd fill the muck basket with water, let it soak and then wheel it over to the wash stall and tip it over to drain. To be honest the only problem I saw with that was the top part of the hay didn't really get soaked. At most it got dampened when she dumped the water. But I suppose you could put less hay in so it didn't stick out the top.

Good luck. I've been soaking hay for 4 yrs now and where I soak it, it's too far to use the cart method so I've developed other methods that work for me.

[*horsiejumper*]

Hay steamer? any links?

[3Spots]

horsiejumper, go to smartpakequine.com and search for the steamer there. Quite the piece of equipment!

ButlerFamZoo -- no, i haven't asked the barn yet. We just brought him to the new place Thurs night, and the barn managers were at a show on the weekend. I'll see if I can get something in place tomorrow. Thanks for the fusion paint tip as that might be a requirement. Blue and red are the only cooler colors I ever see, lol!

Fairview Horse Center, gosh I hope you are right!

[staceyk]

Hmmm I saw one at rolex -- you have to do a bale at a time and the recommend you feed it all in one day--best when there are multiple horses. It takes some power and it takes up a lot of space. I actually signed up to win one but wondered what on earth I'd do with it. Quite a contraption, not for a smaller barn.

I wonder if you could put the hay in a hay net, dunk it or spray it in a wash stall, hang it in the stall till it drains, and use a wheelbarrel to transport.

[AKB]

We fed Dengie (lucernefarms.com, I think) for years before our allergy horse was again able to eat hay. Soaking hay did not work well for us. If you don't soak long enough, the dust and mold are still present. If you soak too long, the hay begins to spoil. I found soaking the hay to be laborious and messy.

After starting Dengie, and eliminating all hay in the barn, our horse's respiratory symptoms disappeared completely for 5 years. The first year that we started giving him hay again, he had some minor symptoms in the summertime. This summer and fall, he has had more symptoms again. We've been giving Ventipulmin and a few days of dexamethasone. I hope we don't have to go back to Dengie, but we may be headed that way.

[Chardavej]

A horse I have you have to soak her hay, the easiest thing I found was two muck buckets and two round laundry baskets (not hampers, but the small ones you can carry on your hip to do the laundry) I drilled holes all in the bottom of the laundry basket and it has the holes all over the sides. I would put three flakes in it and set it in the muck bucket. I had a large stone to set on top so the top gets wet too.

I would soak it all day, and then pull the laundry basket out and the water would drain back into the muck bucket, then put more in and let it soak all night for in the morning. Also good for IR horses to get the sugar out of the hay.

Also be advised, just putting it in a cart and spraying it heavily for 10 minutes doesn't work well at all, we tried that too.

[SOTB]

If the barn management doesn't have a better idea, I think the cooler idea is pretty good!

[anita m]

A mare at my barn has severe allergies (gets bronchial inhalers almost daily) and is fed a bagged forage in lieu of hay (less dust and mold) and also is bedded on some sort of commercial cardboard based bedding. And she is located in a stall that gets lots of air circulation and isn't near the sawdust pile. She also is careful about nighttime turnout because the dew/mold at night on the grass really aggravates her condition.

[mrsbradbury]

Have you asked the BO or manager how they want you to handle it? I am willing to bet if you are at a clean and classy place they will be happy to soak the hay for you in an appropriate location, or direct you on how they want it done.

We soak the hay for an allergy mare in a muck tub outside her stall, and dump the water outside. We also keep a watering can nearby just is case. It really doesn't make that much mess, and we are here for the horses after all.

[analise]

The barn I used to go to had a few horses that needed soaked hay. What they did was fill up the big muck tubs mentioned in the thread already with water. Then when it was time to hay the horses, they'd toss a few flakes into the tubs first, hay everybody, and then come back and toss the now-soaked hay into the stalls. Periodically, they'd drag the tubs to the end of the aisle and dump them (pretty good drainage out the back though so no puddles and I think they must've dumped in the wash stall that was in the second barn for the other horse). Seemed to work pretty well, with a minimum of fuss.

[murphyluv]

how long do you have to soak the hay for?

[3Spots]

Well, I talked to my vet and she said that for right now, while he is just getting off antibiotics and still on steroids, we shouldn't change his food drastically. So no more of the bagged forage (which was dustier anyway, go figure!), and i just put a big feeder in there with instructions to hose it down as well as they can, letting it sit in whatever water accumulates.

We are going to see if the steroids plus new environment get him over this acute phase, and then see if the hay is the problem. If it is, then I will look at soaking in the cooler idea. Our problem is disposing of waste water. His stall is next to the hose, but not next to a drain. So the cooler would be excellent for wheeling the water away to drain by a tree. I don't know if they will let me keep a cooler in the aisleway, though.

Since I am not allowed to "test him" with exercise to see how bad his cough is, I have no idea if we are getting better or worse. He has been heard to cough twice in the last week, while eating. But that is how he was before. At least this time the coughs have not involved phlegm, although they still sound wet and deep.

If I have to soak hay, I am guessing it will be for life. (ETA: oh you mean how many minutes? I think 30 minimun from what I've read!) And my reading says that soaking hay really doesn't get rid of all the spores, despite how clean the hay is to start with. That might drive me to a complete feed or soaked pellets and skipping hay altogether.

I really haven't figured out if he will have episodes and be ridable in-between, or if he will always be this bad.