Toe first landing not in feet?

[chirojerry]

This is my first post here. Been lurking for a few days but would love to get input for my daughters pony.

9yo large hunter pony regularly jumps to 2-9. In may she went lame vet Dx deep flexor tendon strain sprain. Rest iv ledgend and then adequan im. Changed shoes (she is shod in front only) to include 2 degree wedge. This helped her she is not lame currently but her movement is terrible gone is the floaty trot. She is short and choppy and uncomfortable. She is landing toe first and stands with rt toe out front. Xrays show good alignment of lower leg and no bony changes. Opinion by another Farrier is that it is from her withers and shoulders. Has anybody corrected toe first landing without changing the feet???

Thanks for listening Jerry

[Rick Burten]

9yo large hunter pony regularly jumps to 2-9. In may she went lame vet Dx deep flexor tendon strain sprain. Rest iv ledgend and then adequan im.
How long was she rested and how was she brought back into work? When brought back into work, did that include jumping?
Changed shoes (she is shod in front only) to include 2 degree wedge.
Prior to adding the wedge, was her hoof-pastern alignment correct?
This helped her she is not lame currently but her movement is terrible gone is the floaty trot. She is short and choppy and uncomfortable. She is landing toe first and stands with rt toe out front.
Based on the symptoms presented, it sounds to me that the soft tissue injury is not healed(and may have been re-injured) and that there may now be some concurrent heel pain in that hoof.

While the problem may indeed by higher in the limb, given the circumstances, the likelyhood is that it is not.

[Fharoah]

I believe tendon ligament injuries in the foot and pastern and sometimes ringbone or navicular can cause a horse to have shortened strides and toe first landing. Some vets consider toe first landing a 1/5. I would have a full soundness exam with flexions possibly ride the horse undersaddle or give him another three to six months off and see how he looks also make sure his shoeing is really balanced. When my horse was first diagnosed with ringbone he was a intermittent 1/5 he did not bob his head but shortened his stride on turns, he regressed.

[chirojerry]

Thanks for the reply's
She was rested for about 3 weeks and started on the flat and then back to jumping for a show that was coming up. she was back to jumping 1 week after coming back.

Her hoof pastern alignment is much better with the pads.

Going to try different saddle pads to see if this helps.

How long does this type injury need to heal? Are we just covering up symptoms with the adequan??

Thanks again Jerry

[Janet]

3 WEEKS????
I am by no means a vet, but for a tendon injury (as opposed to just a tendon sheath injury) I would expect something more like 3 MONTHS.

[Donkey]

Toe first landing can also indicate hock pain.

If she was being treated for a soft tissue injury, why the legend and adequan which is typically for joints?

With the change in the feet you may have agravated something else.

I'd consider the change in her movement as lameness or at least a big red flag. I'd get another lameness exam.

[tarynls]

I'd get another opinion from a good lameness vet. IMO, three weeks of rest is nowhere near enough time off for a tendon injury. With the tendon injuries I've dealt with (from strains to large bows) my horses have had six months to a year off.

[goeslikestink]

3 WEEKS????
I am by no means a vet, but for a tendon injury (as opposed to just a tendon sheath injury) I would expect something more like 3 MONTHS.

am with you janet - and thats the mimium depending on the injury it can take up to 18mths and more if shes choppy and short strided shes probably lame still and dragging her toes its to with the hinds not being able toget underneath her
get another vet out

please dont tell us you been jumping this horse like it as if working already your going to do more damage

[merrygoround]

3 WEEKS????
I am by no means a vet, but for a tendon injury (as opposed to just a tendon sheath injury) I would expect something more like 3 MONTHS.

Amen! to that!!!!

[chirojerry]

NO she is not jumping. Xrays are clean and flexions are neg. there is no heat or swelling. She has just lost movement.
Back to my original question has anyone corrected via massage,chiro,accupuncture, saddle fitting etc a toe first landing? Will have vet check the hinds.

Thanks Jerry

[Janet]

NO she is not jumping. Xrays are clean and flexions are neg. there is no heat or swelling.
Tendon injuries don't show up on Xrays. If it is the Superficial DFT it may show up on ultrasound. But if it is the Deep DFT, it may not show up with any thing less than an MRI (which is why DDFT was often misdiagnosed as navicular for many years).

Again, if it is the DDFT there may be no heat or swelling, and it may not respond to flexions (the vet cannot easily "flex" the relevant joints, which are INSIDE the hoof).
She has just lost movement.
A clear sign that she has changed her way of going to protect something. Something that hurts if she moves "the way she used to".

Back to my original question has anyone corrected via massage,chiro,accupuncture, saddle fitting etc a toe first landing? Will have vet check the hinds. _I_ don't know of any such cases.

Thanks Jerry

[jetsmom]

Thanks for the reply's
She was rested for about 3 weeks and started on the flat and then back to jumping for a show that was coming up. she was back to jumping 1 week after coming back.



You said that she isn't jumping, yet posted the above. Has she been jumping since 1 week after coming back, or not?

I agree that if it was a tendon injury, it is normally months off.

[Fharoah]

This helped her she is not lame currently but her movement is terrible gone is the floaty trot. She is short and choppy and uncomfortable. She is landing toe first and stands with rt toe out front. Xrays show good alignment of lower leg and no bony changes. Opinion by another Farrier is that it is from her withers and shoulders. Has anybody corrected toe first landing without changing the feet???

Thanks for listening Jerry[/QUOTE]

Is she even strided on both fronts or is he shorter on his injured leg? Often foot or pastern lameness looks like shoulder lameness. Have you had her evaluated on soft and hard footing, flexed, hoof tested, lounged, possibly evaluated undersaddle. With the toe first landing I would be concerned about soft tissue damage in the foot or the pastern. I would get aq second oppinion from a good lameness vet surgeon.

Best Wishes!

[chirojerry]

Well thought I would post update on daughters pony. She is now moving great. Changed a lot of things dont know what was the most important. Here is what was changed.
1. Saddle fit : she was riding in a pessoa pony saddle. The pony is a wide fit the saddle wasnt and not letting shoulders move.
2. Read the book Beating Muscle injuries in Horses by Jack Meagher. Had massage work done by one of Jacks apprentices Robert Altman and by myself (human chiropractor).
3. Treated for ulcers and started smart gut and mare magic
4. Reshod with natural balance shoes again and removed wedges.

She is a different pony now. She is soft in the mouth again (nice foam). Fun to be around no pinning the ears and she is moving very well.

Thanks for listening Jerry

[3 is the limit]

Are you sure of the initial diagnosis? A DDFT injury would take 6-9 months to heal correctly and then need to be brought back slowly. In the OP it doesn't mention how the vet came to his conclusion of what caused the lameness.

Glad your pony is doing better.