Donating a Young Horse

[LetsChat]

I have a friend who is interested in donating her young horse to a college program. The one she is interested in is Findlay in Ohio. They have a green broke program and she felt this young horse might be a good fit. Does anyone know about this program, how they treat the horses, if they take young horses with about 60 days undersaddle. Any information, suggestions or comments would be great. She has too many horses and doesn't have the time for this young horse but feels he has potential.

[FancyASB]

There are stories on Saddlebred Rescue, trot.org and Tuesdays Horse about Bomerang a Saddlebred gelding that had been donated to a riding school program. It is a very sad story, so tell your friend to be VERY cautious. I'm not saying that the college program she is interested in would do this but staff changes down the road may be a problem, etc.. Be sure and look at his before and after pictures when he was adopted. Story on Tuesdays Horse with helpful information about donating a horse. http://tuesdayshorse.wordpress.com/2009/06/17/the-boomerang-effect-take-care-when-donating-a-horse/ http://forum.saddlebredrescue.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2628&SearchTerms=Boomerang He ended up at the New Holland auction in PA and sold to a kill buyer for $60. Saddlebred Rescue bought him from the kill buyer see page 1 for his picture at auction, he was identified and had been a top show horse, page 4 under saddle at SBR and page 8 at his new home in Kentucky. http://trot.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4409&highlight=Boomerang This poor horse had been on the road with the Amish for 12 years and then thrown away. All because the riding program did not contact the owner that donated him!

[SEPowell]

I've seen many thoroughbreds from college programs at New Holland. That was an eye opener.

[msj]

Friends donated a mare to Findley last fall for a $20,000 tax deduction. The mare wasn't 100% sound to begin with and by spring Findley had them come and take the mare back. I doubt that anything Findley did caused any more problems to the mare. I did understand from friends that Findley does have an excellent program. Considering they asked the people that donated the mare to come get her rather than run her through an auction says good things to me about the school. :)

I had donated a horse to a local 'Christian college' quite a few yrs ago. I told them when I donated him that he had to be brought back into regular riding gradually as he hadn't been ridden regularly for several months. Also that he was cold backed (and long backed to boot) and that he had to be girthed up evenly and slowly from both sides. By spring they sent me a letter that he had developed what sounded like neurological issues and they had to put him down. To this day, I honestly think they sold him to a student as I know this particular college did sell some of their donations as I was offered to come try one that had been donated only a few months before. :(

[starrunner]

I don't know a ton about Findlay, but I'd double-check that the horse's environment fits your desires as well.

Different universities stall 24/7 (or near it) with very little turnout. Others have 24/7 turnout with ample shelter (but no blankets for our thin skinned friends).

[LetsChat]

Wow - thanks for all the feedback. It's is just so hard when I comes to relinquishing ownership of a horse. Even horses that get *sold* can eventually end up in the wrong hands. I feel for her, she has to get rid of this one, either sell or donate to lighten the monthly bills but of course wants a great home for a deserving horse. Any other ideas? Findlay was noted because they have a young horse program and this horse just has 60 days. Any other suggestions? There are no guarnatees even if he gets sold but I am sure the highest probability of success would be the option she would take. Not looking to make a lot of money, just lessen the expense and find a good home!

[LetsChat]

I just read that story about the saddlebred. People are disgusting, I feel for those kind, sweet animals who just keep on going. [edit] Poor babies.

[LauraKY]

Make sure everything is in writing (right of first refusal, etc)! I know Midway College in Kentucky has all horses out on 24/7 turnout, no shelters. The older horses have very sore backs with no chiro. They also resell/give away their donations after 2 years. Same thing goes for some of the other college teams we have had interaction with.

Too many places out there without a conscience!

[LetsChat]

Yikes - I never knew that. I figured a school would be able to use vet students and that the vet care would be better than average. :(

[Tamara in TN]

I have a friend who is interested in donating her young horse to a college program.



once a horse is donated it becomes the sole property of the school...

folks who expect happy ends for "company property" (aka free horses) distributed to teenagers of unknown skill sets and worse managed by coaches of unknown ability are setting themselves up to be disappointed..

it seems to me like donating an animal for surgical research and wondering why he came back missing parts...

no tax write off in this world could compel me to do that....

best

[mvp]

There's no such thing as a (morally) free donation.

If I had a horse for whom it was clear, at 60 days in, would not fly on the open market, I'd be really honest with myself about what kind of life that horse might have. Being started in a school situation isn't the best way, even for a sane and sound horse. I can't imagine it's a good option for one who has obstacles. What happens to these horses after they are started at the school? Do they remain schoolies forever?

Donate the horse if you want. But know that once the horse belongs to the school, you get no say about what happens to it. To me, that might not outweigh the benefit of getting the horse off my payroll or the tax write-off.

[Wonders12]

As a college student :) ... Have your friend take a good look at the program. I know Findlay has a wonderful Equine Science program. Be weary, ask a lot of questions, but not all college programs are slaughter houses.

When sent to the right place, a horse will get more love and attention from horse-crazy girls than he could ever imagine. So don't just look at the horror stories (and I'm very sorry to those of you who have had one) but weigh the pros and cons of a particular university.

[JWB]

When I was at Hollins, there was a "waiting list" of horses to be donated. The horses there got excellent care and at the end of their useful college careers there was generally a long list of waiting students to take them home. I know I took a gelding with a suspensory injury home - the school gave him to me, and another girl took home a fabulous equitation horse who couldn't hold up to the jumping any more. These horses were not sold - they were given to good "forever" homes. Could I have sold him? Yes - but after riding with the school for several years, they were pretty good judges of character.

This school ONLY took horses that were sound enough to jump and of high enough quality to win at rated shows.

Look at the program though. A vet school in the area got tons of "donated" horses every year - of shape, size and description. Most of these horses were not destined to years of peaceful retirement teaching young horse-crazy students how to "care for" horses.... I know a lady who donated her melanoma-riddled mare to them and was shocked to learn that the mare had been euthanized and dissected to study the progression of the disease.

[Movin Artfully]

In terms of donating horses to schools: Findlay has a wonderful reputation for their equestrian program. Hands down one of the best equestrian colleges in the nation. Contact their program director for specifics. I would not hesitate to consider sending a horse there.

Another smaller school that I thought was very, very good was Saint Mary's of the Woods College in Indiana. Horses were very well cared for with regular turnout and I thought very highly of their program directors, who I saw directly work with students/horses from 2000-2006. SMWC received an ex-show mare that had like 500+ AQ points. The mare could have taught a blind potato how to ride...a once in a lifetime saint...and I think it was a nice deal for both parties.

Realistically...I cannot imagine any program wanting an untrained young horse. They are a dime-a-dozen. I know several schools in Illinois/Iowa offer student colt-starting classes at a reduced training cost to the owner. Personally...I would never send a young horse to be trained by a random student. Many of the students are "horse-trainer-wannabees" with very little talent or experience. I think you would be better off to pay $600-$1000/mo to a professional if you were keeping the animal.

[jilltx]

once a horse is donated it becomes the sole property of the school...

folks who expect happy ends for "company property" (aka free horses) distributed to teenagers of unknown skill sets and worse managed by coaches of unknown ability are setting themselves up to be disappointed..

it seems to me like donating an animal for surgical research and wondering why he came back missing parts...

no tax write off in this world could compel me to do that....

best

Yup. What she said. :)

I have no experience with this college. That being said I HAVE made the decision to donate a horse to a "program", and I am still suffering the consequences of that some years later. Be very very careful, and make sure your friend understands what "relinquishing ownership" really means.

[JollyBadger]

You (or your friend) can go to Findlay's site - they have a whole page of info about how to donate a horse to the program. Dave Duncan or someone else from the English farm will be able to answer any questions your friend has about the donation process, requirements, etc. I'm sure they'd be more than willing to allow your friend to visit the facilities as well, before making a final decision.

http://www.findlay.edu/academics/colleges/cosc/academicprograms/undergraduate/EQST/eep/howtodonate.htm

[TBDQ0328]

I went through Findlay's english equestrian program, and am familiar with both the english and western from working in the Admissions office as a graduate assistant. Most of the horses in the english program were donations, and there are some VERY nice horses there. They have a wide range of horses - everything from horses that will pack around beginners to horses that will win on the A circuit or upper-level dressage horses.

Findlay does do both colt-breaking and green horses in both programs - usually starting horses as sophmores and working with the greens as juniors. Its all very supervised by the instructors - each group of students has a set time that they ride at so that the instructors are there to help. Each student is assigned a horse for a semester or a year and that is the horse that they ride, turn-out, clean the stall for, etc. The horses are given the summers off or can be leased out to approved students. Horses are matched to students based on personality and experience.

Most of the horses that retired from the program are given to students, and each horse usually has a list of students who have previously inquired about taking the horse listed in their file. They have occasionally put one down due to normal things that happen like colic, and have occasionally sold some on to students or to people who inquired about that horse specifically.

They will also take horses in for training for the semester or the year if your friend does not want to relinquish ownership.

The school does look for nice green young horses - they can be trained by student to be reliable school horses and brought up through the levels. And not all the students are "horse-trainer-wannabees". We get all ranges from some who are indeed beginners to students who come in doing the Big Eq or riding mid-upper level dressage, etc. and most students do double major, usually with business to be more well-rounded.

Horses that come in for donation are usually put on a trial period and ridden by several students to get a feel for the horse's personality and ablity. If your friend is interested in donating she should call up the director of the program she's considering (Steve Brown for western, Sam McCarthy for hunter/jumper, Janet Harms for dressage) and go visit and ask a ton of questions. Get a feel for the school, the program, the students, and the instructors.

I just went through as a student, and while I'm familiar with what happens with-in the program, I'm not as familiar with the administrative side. Hope that helps

[FancyASB]

Post 186 - Another smaller school that I thought was very, very good was Saint Mary's of the Woods College in Indiana. Horses were very well cared for with regular turnout and I thought very highly of their program directors, who I saw directly work with students/horses from 2000-2006. SMWC received an ex-show mare that had like 500+ AQ points. The mare could have taught a blind potato how to ride...a once in a lifetime saint...and I think it was a nice deal for both parties.

Read post 99 about Bomerang the Saddlebred gelding and what happened to him - he was donated to Woods College!

[starrunner]

Two different schools entirely Fancy ASB--he was at William Woods, which makes sense because they have a saddleseat program.

[FancyASB]

Sorry my mistake, but still the same horrible life for Bomerang being donated to a college program. He suffered for 12 long years with the Amish.

[starrunner]

I understand all of the hesitation about donating to college programs.

However, I don't really see the difference between that (for the most part) and selling to a private owner. Once the horse has left your control, they have left your control.

I have acquaintances that have sold horses for a good price to owners that they thought would be great (had million dollar facilities), only to have the horses starve in under a year.

Stuff happens.

I think if someone does their homework on the program they're being donated to, you can have reasonable success and if you routinely contact the program asking if the horse is working out and if it isn't (if you want to), be willing to recover/take the horse back.

Another university I know that takes green horses is University of Wisconsin-River Falls. They also take well bred reining and cutting mares for their repro program.

They have a hunter/jumper and a western program. It's easy work for the jumpers. I think the most they usually jump is just over two feet. All English horses are ridden in snaffles without martingales or other devices. The goal is to improve the rider and accordingly the horse without their use. Horses are on 24/7 turnout with ample shelter, heated automatic waterers, and are segregated based on caloric needs. I don't think I've ever really seen a thin horse there. They're usually on the furry, plump side.

Lesson horses are often sold in the spring at the auction that sells their high end reining/cutting hores in for training. Prices are usually pretty fair for the current market and it's not uncommon for people to come and buy their old lesson favorites back. Occasionally, horses are rehomed through private sale if there's interest.

Horses aren't stalled, nor blanketed. Horses that require shoes probably should be donated elsewhere.

Just wanted to give my opinion of another school.

It would be nice (in my opinion) if people from the various schools could give insight on the acquisition and disposal of lesson horses in their programs.

[LetsChat]

In terms of donating horses to schools: Findlay has a wonderful reputation for their equestrian program. Hands down one of the best equestrian colleges in the nation. Contact their program director for specifics. I would not hesitate to consider sending a horse there.

Another smaller school that I thought was very, very good was Saint Mary's of the Woods College in Indiana. Horses were very well cared for with regular turnout and I thought very highly of their program directors, who I saw directly work with students/horses from 2000-2006. SMWC received an ex-show mare that had like 500+ AQ points. The mare could have taught a blind potato how to ride...a once in a lifetime saint...and I think it was a nice deal for both parties.

Realistically...I cannot imagine any program wanting an untrained young horse. They are a dime-a-dozen. I know several schools in Illinois/Iowa offer student colt-starting classes at a reduced training cost to the owner. Personally...I would never send a young horse to be trained by a random student. Many of the students are "horse-trainer-wannabees" with very little talent or experience. I think you would be better off to pay $600-$1000/mo to a professional if you were keeping the animal.

The horse currently is out with a trainer at $1500 a month but my friend has three other horses and this horse is the least compatible. Once donated she would not want the horse back. The point is to re-home the horse and at $1500 a month she would rather get it off the books than continue to pay for something she will never use.

[LetsChat]

Any other ideas???

[SarahKing]

There's also Otterbein College in Westerville Ohio (just northeast of Columbus). I don't know if they accept donations, but you could check them out.

[starrunner]

Looking for other schools to donate to? What are your wishes/locations/etc?

I know of lots of other schools, just let me know what she's looking for.

[Sacred_Petra]

Just brainstorming here, but has your friend looked into any programs with lesson horses? Maybe one of them would have some advanced students who could use the experience riding green horses. If she just wants to get the horse off her hands for now, and sell later when it has more miles or the market is better, some of my riding classes require students to have their own horses, and your friend may be able to find a student who would pay for the horses board, farrier, and vet bills in order to ride in a certain class if they don't have their own horse.


Personally...I would never send a young horse to be trained by a random student. Many of the students are "horse-trainer-wannabees" with very little talent or experience. I think you would be better off to pay $600-$1000/mo to a professional if you were keeping the animal.

This is slightly off topic to the thread in terms of options for your friends horse, but I had to address this comment. I have to disagree that many of us are "trainer-wannabees" with very little talent or experience. In my program of 30 some students we have 1 "wannabe" and 1 person with less experience, but that person is working very hard to reach the same level as the rest of us, and is doing a very good job. I don't know about other programs, but my program is hard work, and the wannabes don't last. You may have had a bad experience with a student once, but for whatever reason, please don't assume we are all no talent wannabes who've never put serious time in to developing our riding. Its comments like this that cause us a lot of problems finding our internships, when trainers hear people saying that we're no talent wannabes with no experience they tend to internalize that thought and become unwilling to give us a chance.

[Lazy Palomino Hunter]

I haven't read all the responses, but overall I know there's hesitation about donating horses to college programs.

I'm a graduate of Sweet Briar College in VA, and I can vouch for very good treatment of their schoolies. I know that many of their donations were made on the stipulation that when the horse was "done," the person who donated them would be informed (and some go back to their donors). The school invests a lot of money in the care of their schoolies, from nutritionists to chiropractors, saddle fitters, and accupuncturists. They get turned out all night, every night, and 24/7 on weekends. I would donate to them in a heartbeat.

As far as the responses I saw wondering why a school would want a "just-started" horse... I know SBC has a schooling program. They take donations of nice young horses, which then become projects for experienced riders. They get pretty top notch training, and the majority of the rides on the horse are under strict supervision.

I can also say that I know the head coach at Saint-Mary-of-the-Woods (Krista Steinmetz), and I have nothing but absolutely wonderful things to say about her. :) I don't know much about their program, but it might be worth looking into.

[elmerandharriet]

Findlay is a really nice school and they have a really nice set up. A friend of mine donates to LEC (lake erie) and they call her when the horse no longer fits into the program to see if she wants it back. As far as donating goes I donated my horse to a therapy program I made sure that in the contract that they were to call me whenever the horse didnt fit into the program and I would take him back maybe you could work something like that out into the contract so YOU know he wont be going to a sale if it makes you feel better

[LetsChat]

Thanks everyone for all the great advice. I have passed it along and I know she has been in contact with two colleges already and will be going out for visits next weekend :) Yes, I was a little shocked when I heard that Finlay had a young horse program but I do think it is a great idea and it's nice to see other schools do too. As I have said, this horse needs to be re-homed, it isn't a situation where she wants the horse back or is looking for this as a "training" opportunity. This is a need to have the horse go somewhere were he will be used and appreciated and I have to say I would think a college setting would be just that. There are a lot of wannabe trainers out there in the "real" world too so it's a risk whether you sell a horse private or donate it. The horse is valuable but there isn't time to spend training him for sale, she wants something that will work for his current training level. If later on the school wants to sell, then that is their perogative. As I said, you can sell the horse to a person, have them train it, they sell it and two years later the horse winds up in a bad situation, it is life, unfortuantely.
And for those who said the horse isn't valuable in the market, it is a nice horse, there just isn't time to "make him up" so the option is to let someone who can, do it, and if they make money in the end, more power to them. Thanks again for all the great suggestions, we definitely have the ball rolling and it seems this good guy is going to find a useful life which is most important! :yes::yes::yes:

[Sassenach]

When I was at Hollins, there was a "waiting list" of horses to be donated. The horses there got excellent care and at the end of their useful college careers there was generally a long list of waiting students to take them home. I know I took a gelding with a suspensory injury home - the school gave him to me, and another girl took home a fabulous equitation horse who couldn't hold up to the jumping any more. These horses were not sold - they were given to good "forever" homes. Could I have sold him? Yes - but after riding with the school for several years, they were pretty good judges of character.

This school ONLY took horses that were sound enough to jump and of high enough quality to win at rated shows.

Current student at Hollins :) and the program (and horses!) are absolutely fabulous. My ponies would be in heaven if they were at the barn and got to live in the pastures that the horses do!

The stable and facilities are top notch, instructors are great and the barn management and staff can't be beat.