Anyone with expirence w/"dead tail"?

[Woodland]

I have a horse in my barn, a new boarder - fancy schmany WP horse - who acts like his tail is "dead". He barely swishes at flies but does react when I poke at his dock with a finger. But just barely. He also does not drop to pee.

Which made me wonder if these two things are connected. Owner is a "newbie" very nice and has no clue if the boy has had his tail "done". Horse passed an intense PPE out on the west coast before she moved here(work transfer).

I am concerned as she wants to show circuit and about the dropping thing. He holds his tail bone straight, does not lift to poop. He was $25K and has a very accomplished show record - recent WC etc.

So are these things connected? I never ever have had a horses tail "done" I think it is a despicable thing to do. That coupled with the lack of ability to drop has me very concerned. It's Sunday I will call the barn vet in the AM

Thanks!

[Ghazzu]

The innervation of the retractor penis muscle arises in the lumbar region.
If the nerves were deadened from a failed tail block that far cranial, the horse would be unable to stand.

Aside from which, nerve damage would result in paraphimosis, or an inability to retract the penis into the prepuce, not a failure to drop during urination.

[Huntertwo]

I boarded with a gal whose QH *show horse* had a blocked tail. Very very sad to see this horse in the pasture being eaten by flies and there wasn't a darn thing he could do about it besides drop to the ground and roll...grrrr

Honestly, I never noticed if he dropped or not to urinate.

I would imagine the sheath would need to be cleaned often as it would be very unsanitary not to drop to urinate.

[Bluey]

In AQHA shows, the stewards check for altered tails and if she is going to show, she may be caught and fined or maybe set down from showing.
She may want to check the rules on that.

Judges, stewards and association representatives are watching and can tell from the way a horse moves and will come "a checking".
They became very strict about this a few years ago and still insist about this in every judging seminar.

Some geldings won't hardly if at all drop, it is just the way they go about it, but it is good to have the vet check, especially with a new horse.
I am surprised the vet check didn't show if his tail was altered in any way, it is standard in show horses to check for everything thoroughly.

[randomequine]

This may not be the case, but the farm I board my horse at while I'm at school only has three other horses on the property, all the BO's. They're great at showing/taking care of their horses, but don't know how to do little gritty things such as clean sheaths. One day, the girl (my age) was commenting that her older gelding no longer dropped to pee. I, being the nosy soul I am, said "well, you should clean his sheath and get him checked out if it's not normal". She asked me how, and the teaching commenced.

He's a real docile guy, so I went gung-ho, and he had, I kid you not, the biggest bean I had EVER encountered, even in medical books. It had to have been the size of a walnut....I'm surprised he could urinate at all!!!!! Either way, I got it out and he began dropping again.

May not be the case, but a good anecdote in case no one has checked.....

[saddleup]

I was horse shopping all summer and found a really nice gelding whose tail had been blocked years ago. I didn't buy him for that reason. In his current home he was kept with a fly sheet on, soaked in fly spray every day, kept under fans except for one hour of turnout each day. His tail was kept braided and banded to keep poop out of it because he couldn't lift his tail at all. It was just too much maintenance for me, and although I really liked him I didn't want to take on that kind of problem.

I'd never had any experience with that before, and was honestly disgusted at what was clearly mutilation, all for the sake of points? Made me crazy.

[Bluey]

To deaden a horse's tail, so the tail would not wring around, if a horse had a tendency to do that, was a stupid idea.
They seem to have had several ways of doing that, some putting something like a band around the dock high for a few minutes before a class and the horse then would not be able to move the tail as much.

Some then got the idea of blocking the nerves that lift the tail, many times with alcohol and it wore off after a few days, unless it didn't and then they had problems, as by then it had become illegal.

There was a time where vets would even cut the tail nerves, but that thankfully didn't last long.

There are breeds that do cut tail nerves, so the tails go over their backs, like in some gaited or arabian horses, for certain kinds of classes.
Then there is the draft horses where that is also done, but there a complete, surgical dock of part of the tail.

I think it is all questionable and, in AQHA horses at least, illegal.

If a horse doesn't has a quiet enough tail for the class you are showing in and it is not because of the bad riding irritating the horse, go do something else or sell the horse to someone that can use such horse without altering their tail.:yes:

[Tiffani B]

There are breeds that do cut tail nerves, so the tails go over their backs, like in some gaited or arabian horses, for certain kinds of classes.

I just want to clear up some misinformation here... in Saddlebreds, a ligament is cut, not nerves. The horses have FULL USE of their tails afterwards and can swish and clamp their tails just as well as before, unlike the deadening done for QHs. Not defending it, just correcting this poster's info.

Anyways, I have seen several horses who do not drop to pee. I wouldn't think it has anything to do with his tail. I'd make sure he's clean, and other than that, it's not a big deal.

[Bluey]

I just want to clear up some misinformation here... in Saddlebreds, a ligament is cut, not nerves. The horses have FULL USE of their tails afterwards and can swish and clamp their tails just as well as before, unlike the deadening done for QHs. Not defending it, just correcting this poster's info.

Anyways, I have seen several horses who do not drop to pee. I wouldn't think it has anything to do with his tail. I'd make sure he's clean, and other than that, it's not a big deal.

Yes, sorry, I was talking about altered tails, any one kind of alterations and forgot to say it was ligaments on the raised tail alterations.
Many of those have to be kept in tail harnesses for the alteration to work, or they will lower again in time.

Thanks for the correction.:)

[Woodland]

He can move his tail - it's just slow and deliberate. No violent fly shooing outbursts.

The PPE covered the tail and the paperwork says "Tail: normal use and function".

I have requested that she have his sheath examined by the barn vet. And his tail checked as well. We show AQHA & ApHC tail fixing is a no-no. I'll let you know what the vet says.

[atlatl]

A new gal at our barn bought a very nice WP horse who's tail had been done, the vet explained it to her when the horse arrived. She did not know about the "tail rule" and had planned to show the horse on the AQHA circuit. After breaking the bad news to her, I recommended that she contact the seller and make it clear that the horse had been misrepresented. She got some money back and since it was an alcohol block, the horse eventually did get some motion back.