looking for written work on horse behavior

[marta]

i need a written source that talks about basic horse behavior, specifically that they are flight animals and relatively unpredictable.

if anyone can point me to something i'd appreciate it.

[saultgirl]

The Truth About Horses by Dr. Andrew McLean
PhD (Equine cognition and learning), BSc (Zoology), Dip Ed

http://www.aebc.com.au/AndrewMcLean

[CB/TB]

Temple Grandin's books, Animals in Translation and Animals Make Us Human, have a lot of "why they do this" information- and so much of it makes perfect sense.

[JanWeber]

"Reading the Horse's Mind" by Jackie Budd published by The Lyons Press (www.lyonspress.com). Very effective educational tool for diplomatically pointing out dangerous behaviors (people especially)...

[marta]

i'm looking for some real basic info confirming what we all know - they get scared - they run, they can be unpredictable, etc.

i'll check out the sources you listed.

thanks again!

[Good Old Sledge]

Desmond Morris, Horsewatching. The guy that wrote The Naked Ape. Really some interesting stuff.

[equinelaw]

Desmond Morris, Horsewatching. The guy that wrote The Naked Ape. Really some interesting stuff.

Really? I didn't know he wrote a book on horses. I really need to get out more. I'll bet its great.

[Bluey]

Maybe you can make this work somewhere in what you need:

http://www.thehorse.com/viewarticle.aspx?id=6346

[equinelaw]

Maybe you can make this work somewhere in what you need:

http://www.thehorse.com/viewarticle.aspx?id=6346

Great name for the university of the first person who asked: Royal Dick Vet School University of Edinburgh:winkgrin:

[Oldenburg Mom]

The Truth About Horses by Dr. Andrew McLean
PhD (Equine cognition and learning), BSc (Zoology), Dip Ed

http://www.aebc.com.au/AndrewMcLean

THANK YOU FOR THIS LINK.

I downloaded the lectures/papers (http://www.aebc.com.au/articles)that were available, printed them out, and read most of it on the train on the way home.

This is a clear, IMHO, insightful explanation of how, why, where, and when horses learn. I think it's correct that WE are responsible for many behavior problems, I've always thought that, and now I know why.

I was particularly appalled by this: As I have mentioned previously, animals are wired to associate a stimulus with a particular response. Clear light aids that lead to clear consistent responses naturally result in calmness because they afford controllability and predictability to animals with regard to their behavioural world. In 1977, Professor Frank Ödberg and Dr Marie-France Bouissou pointed out the high wastage rate of performance horses in a presentation to the Waltham symposium. These researchers revealed that one study showed that 66.4% of horses sent to slaughter were sent there for behavioural reasons and were between the ages of 2 and 7 years. In another study they showed that of 2970 horses sent to a Munich slaughterhouse, between 25% and 50% were there for non-medical reasons, and most were less than 3 years of age.

I think these are important papers, that should be read by anyone that really cares about the welfare of the horse(s) they're training. I gave a copy to my trainer ...

Again, many many thanks.

[Bluey]

THANK YOU FOR THIS LINK.

I downloaded the lectures/papers (http://www.aebc.com.au/articles)that were available, printed them out, and read most of it on the train on the way home.

This is a clear, IMHO, insightful explanation of how, why, where, and when horses learn. I think it's correct that WE are responsible for many behavior problems, I've always thought that, and now I know why.

I was particularly appalled by this:

I think these are important papers, that should be read by anyone that really cares about the welfare of the horse(s) they're training. I gave a copy to my trainer ...

Again, many many thanks.

Just remember that, at times, there may be somewhat of a disconnect between the academic world and the nuts and bolts world of hands on training.

Not that many horses with problems sent to a slaughter house are really just not trained properly, some are really not amenable to sensible training in a reasonable time frame for the consistent results we expect of a trained horse.

Remember, not every inmate in prison was an abused kid either.;)

Keep that in perspective when reading academic papers.

[Oldenburg Mom]

No, B., the message I get from that quote is something quite different—quite, quite different, and more in keeping with the European attitude that horses are livestock, like cattle and hogs. This is not an attitude—whether right or wrong—that is prevalent in the US... in my opinion. It is easier to cull—regardless of the reason—if you have this attitude, and in many respects, probably more cost effective.

Having said that, the issue here is not slaughter. We've had quite a few discussions about that on CoTH—and when all is said and done, very few individual positions change (IMHO). What is more important, to me, is the sanity behind what he's written. Have you read all the articles I linked to above? All 8 of them? He's got a lot of information there that is practical. When I pointed out some specifics to my trainer, they were familiar topics.

Anyway, not trying to hijack this thread, just wanted to say thanks.

[saultgirl]

No, B., the message I get from that quote is something quite different—quite, quite different, and more in keeping with the European attitude that horses are livestock, like cattle and hogs. This is not an attitude—whether right or wrong—that is prevalent in the US... in my opinion. It is easier to cull—regardless of the reason—if you have this attitude, and in many respects, probably more cost effective.

Having said that, the issue here is not slaughter. We've had quite a few discussions about that on CoTH—and when all is said and done, very few individual positions change (IMHO). What is more important, to me, is the sanity behind what he's written. Have you read all the articles I linked to above? All 8 of them? He's got a lot of information there that is practical. When I pointed out some specifics to my trainer, they were familiar topics.

Anyway, not trying to hijack this thread, just wanted to say thanks.


His book was very interesting. A very scientific, non-biased view, I thought. You're welcome.

[Oldenburg Mom]

His book was very interesting. A very scientific, non-biased view, I thought. You're welcome.

Ah! So the excerpts from the site are only portions of a larger book?

[marta]

i don't mind your hijack.

i'm shocked by the excerpt you posted. i will read the articles that were linked. this is a very interesting topic, not one that i've seen discussed much.

[Kneigh]

I liked "The Horse's Mind" by Lucy Rees, a British author. It was published in the mid-late 1980's, but it is well worth reading if you can find a copy.

[Oldenburg Mom]

i don't mind your hijack.

i'm shocked by the excerpt you posted. i will read the articles that were linked. this is a very interesting topic, not one that i've seen discussed much.

The articles can be somewhat difficult reading ... but, maybe that's because I'm not a trainer.

Back to the quote, yes, I was surprised, but I have to admit, for me the numbers bred in Germany alone, never made sense. Never. I remember reading that in one year alone, over 4,000 (or was it 6,000?? I don't remember) but I began running the numbers. 8,000 foals (4 colt, 4 fillies), just in one area in Germany?

But I didn't mean to raise this issue ... this isn't what the articles are about.

[sid]

I think the the "Introduction" in Cherry Hill's book, "The Formative Years" is very concise and easily understood. Especially how their instinctive behavior relates to training.

[matryoshka]

Desmond Morris, Horsewatching. The guy that wrote The Naked Ape. Really some interesting stuff.I was going to suggest his book as well. It isn't just for horse people. He wrote a book called Manwatching, too. I think he's an animal behavioralist.

[Equibrit]

Horse Watching by Desmond Morris
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Illustrated-Horsewatching-Desmond-Morris/dp/0091877849