Hard time cantering straight and foward

[Soldier06]

First off this is not my horse, so if you could also provide kind ways to suggest your ideas to the owner that would be much appreciated (I would hate to make the owner feel bad/guilty about the situation).

I ride a young gelding for someone, who thinks the world of the horse but the horse has a past that I believe is now leading to some physical issues. The horse is very lazy by nature, and rather stubborn. However the canter is horrible, completely up and down, swaps off when asked to go forward and literally cannot be straight. I have ridden crooked, inside out horses but this horse is beyond that. There is no physical way that a human being could make this horse straight, not various respected trainers and certainly not myself. It is also impossible to get this horse off his forehand, has NO desire to step under, swing through his back or think about carrying himself (again not just with me). Also he trips behind and up front. The trot is heavy, but more forward and not so restricted. The canter is maybe an 8 foot stride, and incredibly uncomfortable.

Horse was (and not completely broken of it as far as I'm concerned) a rearer. As in stand up on a regular basis rearer. He's never gone up with me, which I partly think is because it would hurt too much and because I'm smarter than to push the horse too much (I have no desire to get hurt on a horse that is not my own). My own horse has a rear in him as well and the last time he went up he wrenched his back badly. He was "lame" for a good 2 days following and needed Robaxin (but has never gone up again).

Personally I feel it went something like this:
Horse wrenched his back, probably multiple times, got pushed through it, making him more stubborn, compensated severely, and resulted in a horse that I believe is lame in his hocks, and SI, and probably very sore up front from compensating. I don't think it started out as something significant, but built and built from compensation and lack of lay-up.

Logical? Anyone experience similar canter issues? How did they resolve/what was the diagnosis? Owner will listen I just want to start him in the right direction so this doesn't become a money dumping pit, because we all know how quickly a horse can become that. ;)

[ThoroughbredFancy]

I would suggest having this horse looked at and worked on by a Chiropractor.

[IsolaBella09]

Ditto on the chiropractor and maybe some massage would help. If the horse can go into a program with a reputable trainer, it may help his straightness and manners. I don't know where you are, but I know a bunch of great trainers in NJ that are amazing with young horses. PM me if you want information.

[Hampton Bay]

Have you tried taking him into a field and just letting him go? Don't try to force him into any kind of frame, just let him canter. What about on a lunge line? What I am wondering is if this issue is only when he is asked to carry weight and use himself correctly. He might need some fitness in the canter before he can do what is being asked, especially if you are trying to sit his canter vs. half-seat.

As for talking to the owner, can you just tell her that you suspect that since he is having this kind of issue that he is sore somewhere? If she truly loves this horse, she would probably want to have him checked over if she thinks he is hurting.

[Soldier06]

Trust me, I couldn't care less what he does with his head, as long as he goes, but he doesn't. Won't even go forward out in the field WITH ANOTHER HORSE! Lazy and stuck doesn't even begin to describe this horse.

Would love a chiro, any suggestions for one in MA? Also, what about Lymes, Sel. deficiency, something more internal...?

[TrottingHills]

I'm not a trainer, but I was thinking this sounds a bit like lyme to me - get his blood pulled just to see. Sounds like the horse can use a chiro and make sure the saddle fits properly - maybe the horse needs time off to heal - if he doesn't want to go forward when turned out, then this is more than a stubborn issue - he's in pain

[Soldier06]

Sorry, I meant cantering in a field under tack, not t/o. I'm starting to think Lymes could very well be a possibility, and an easy way to approach the subject as 2 of ours get tested yearly (fall), since one has had it and we need to cover all our bases with the other, he's a little special. ;)

Saddle(s) fit, no visible back pain upon palpation, or body soreness when grooming but I'm not convinced that equates with sound. ;)

[RiverBendPol]

Lyme, ulcers, EPSM, sore back. What are the canter transitions like? I'm leaning toward EPSM.
Ann Crawshaw is a wonderful chiro in MA. She lives in Sherborn, works all over everywhere.

[Hampton Bay]

Does he canter out in the field by himself? I know that can sometimes be difficult to determine if you have a sedentary group of horses or do not spend a ton of time where you can watch their antics.

What breed is the horse?

I dunno, all the ones I have had who refuse to canter under saddle have ONLY done it under saddle. It was just like they were afraid to do it because they might lose balance (or in one case, just lazy and didn't like to work). Giving them their heads and getting in a half seat always worked with those guys.

But surely just telling the owner that this is not normal behavior should suffice for getting someone out to check him over.

[TheHorseProblem]

If he won't go, it's very likely he is in pain. I tried out a horse for sale that was like this. On my third ride on him (he was at my barn, what the heck) he took off in a running buck and I got hurt when I came off. I believe he was running from pain. He never bolted with the beginner (!) who eventually bought him, also because she never pushed him.

I wouldn't ride this horse if I were you!:no:

[Soldier06]

Canter transitions are lurchy at best, head throwing and swinging out at worst. Easier from the walk, trot seems to make the transition more sticky. I canter him in half seat, sitting is just far too uncomfortable, canter is up and down and sort of in a circular/washing machine like motion. Never does the canter feel "true" you can never follow the motion w/your arms/hands like you could on a good hunter. There is no moment when you could soften and just sit there, you are always pushing for forward and desperately trying to hold him straight, it's a challenge every stride. There is no "transition within the gait" either, you have the same canter, whether you try and "collect" (using that term VERY loosely!) or send him forward, it doesn't change.

Trot is much better after cantering however, and the trot is good to start.

I will be talking to the owner this weekend about this as I feel it has had substantial time to improve if it was a "training issue".