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View Full Version : Spinoff. Getting excused in a flat class



DancingQueen
Jul. 29, 2009, 10:52 PM
Ok so this clip is driving not riding. Also not saying that there was anything the judge could have possibly done at this particular event.

Nonetheless, I think this link illustrates how a little freshness one one horses part can derail a whole class in a terrible way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03YcT74h5Mg

Most of the time it doesn't go this bad but nothing is to say this or worse couldn't happen in a hunter hack. Imagine a fall off, some plastic chainlink fencing and a baby carriage....

I guess my opinion is if you are excused, it's probably for a good reason.

indygirl2560
Jul. 29, 2009, 11:04 PM
I've excused myself from a flat class before! I was taking a greenie to his first show and he flipped out and tried to bolt/freak several times, so I excused myself out of courtesy to the other riders, (since we obviously wouldn't have placed anyways). Mr. Brat went back to the warm-up ring. lol

dghunter
Jul. 29, 2009, 11:14 PM
OH MY! :eek: The comments say everyone was okay? I thought the announcer did a good job trying to keep everyone under control, especially once people started screaming.

I've excused myself from a hack before. Mare was being a rank idiot so I went into the middle and stood there. Judge told me that I did the right thing. I was very young at the time-like 12? I think I surprised myself by excusing myself :lol:

DancingQueen
Jul. 29, 2009, 11:17 PM
Ha ha. I have never had to pull myself out yet (knock wood) but good for you for realizing it yourself and not hanging in there at the risk of creating a perfect trifecta (what we call it when one fresh horse makes 3 completely innocent bystanders hit the dust)!

dove
Jul. 29, 2009, 11:50 PM
that video is terrifying!!!

kateh
Jul. 29, 2009, 11:55 PM
GOOD GOD! Was the announcer the only person with any common sense?? Maybe h/j people are more used to loose horses (post-fall, etc), but I feel like most competitors would know better than trying to leap out in front of a scared, galloping horse. Or that one guy who tried to grab the horse's reins as it flew by-he probably did some shoulder damage there. I think that video just took 5 minutes off my life.

hunter1985
Jul. 30, 2009, 12:16 AM
Oh My God

superpony123
Jul. 30, 2009, 12:54 AM
holy. cow.

probably one of the more horrific horse videos ive seen. wow. :no:

Taken By Storm
Jul. 30, 2009, 01:02 AM
I had something similar happen in a flat class several years ago. There were about 20 of us in a short stirrup flat class and one rank little pony bucked and bolted, throwing his rider into the fence. We were cantering at the time and before the anouncer could ask everyone to halt their mounts the pony had caused several more to act up. Before we knew it, about have the class was out of control. I, thankfully, had a saint of mare who merely kicked out at the offending pony and continued on her way at a nice lopey canter. :D By the end, I think there were only 3 or 4 us still mounted! It was a little nuts to say the least.

As for the video, I wish people would learn 3 things when a horse is loose:

1) SHUT UP!!!

2) DON"T try and grab the reins!! (can we say lameness and rope burn!)

3) WATCH WHERE THE HORSE IS GOING!!! Why on earth would anyone take their eyes of a horse that is out of control in such confined quarters???

nlk
Jul. 30, 2009, 01:35 AM
When we were on High School Equestrian team my freshman year there was one Junior who constantly excused her self to the middle of the ring. Most of the time it was because she was pissed she was in a class she didn't want to ride! :lol:

As for the class on the you tube video I have a few things to say:

1. I agree with the other posters that apparently people need to learn how to act around terrified horses.

2. Running after them doesn't help

3. jumping in front of them doesn't help

4. Screaming doesn't help

Also I saw maybe ONE person do the smart thing. When the announcer called for them to come to the center of the ring only ONE person got out of there cart and unhitched their horse. I am sorry but that would be the first thing I would do. Then there was the other woman (the last horse that bolted with buggy....) After she almost got ran into repeatedly she still just sat there and watched the horse get closer and closer without getting out or unhitching (which at that point might have been hard) I also think that was the woman who got flipped out. I also feel that should have tried to get the horses out earlier.

Roan
Jul. 30, 2009, 01:41 AM
. . .
Also I saw maybe ONE person do the smart thing. When the announcer called for them to come to the center of the ring only ONE person got out of there cart and unhitched their horse. I am sorry but that would be the first thing I would do. Then there was the other woman (the last horse that bolted with buggy....) After she almost got ran into repeatedly she still just sat there and watched the horse get closer and closer without getting out or unhitching (which at that point might have been hard) I also think that was the woman who got flipped out. I also feel that should have tried to get the horses out earlier.

This video was posted a couple of months ago in OC.

The woman you are referring to is disabled. That is why she did not get out of the cart. She couldn't, which is why -- when you watch the video carefully -- you see a man drag her out of the way after she gets flipped out of her cart.

Eileen

jvanrens
Jul. 30, 2009, 11:23 AM
Also I saw maybe ONE person do the smart thing. When the announcer called for them to come to the center of the ring only ONE person got out of there cart and unhitched their horse. I am sorry but that would be the first thing I would do. Then there was the other woman (the last horse that bolted with buggy....) After she almost got ran into repeatedly she still just sat there and watched the horse get closer and closer without getting out or unhitching (which at that point might have been hard) I also think that was the woman who got flipped out. I also feel that should have tried to get the horses out earlier.

nlk, do you have much experience with driving? I have some, not a lot, but some, and unless I had a good "pit crew" I can't picture how trying to unhitch in the middle of a panic situation would be a good thing. It takes about a couple of minutes at the best of times to unhitch a horse, in a situation like on the video, you'd want somebody heading the horse and a person on each side, or I can just see a bigger mess waiting to happen if you've got one side undone and the horse being unhitched gets into panic mode! That can be an even bigger mess IMHO. One of the race trainers at the barn had one of his good racehorses come unglued for some reason only known to the horse when he'd only undone one side of the jogger (and with the quick hitches they use it takes almost no time at all) and he got dragged halfway down the track trying to get the horse under control without either of them getting killed. He was lucky, even though the horse almost impaled himself at the girth with a shaft, they were both relatively unscathed, though my friend thought he was going to have a heart attack!

stormdancer753
Jul. 30, 2009, 11:23 AM
My pony was dismissed from an entire horse show at Santa Cruz (four or five days) due to her poor behavior! :eek:
This was just before we took her on a two-week trial, and purchased her, back in 1990! :eek:
Don't worry, it all turned out alright in a few years, so long as she was ridden very accurately around other horses. :lol:

nlk
Jul. 30, 2009, 11:27 AM
This video was posted a couple of months ago in OC.

The woman you are referring to is disabled. That is why she did not get out of the cart. She couldn't, which is why -- when you watch the video carefully -- you see a man drag her out of the way after she gets flipped out of her cart.

Eileen

Interesting to know. However why didn't the person handling the horse up front help bring the horse and driver closer to the middle? There was a person up front I think. I understand keeping the horses quiet etc but it seems to me that after watching them almost get nailed three or four times before the actually did it would have been worth a try.

Also as to unhitching the cart I had noticed in the video that two or so people had done that when they went into the center so that 's why I thought to bring it up.

I personally will stick to my saddle :D

vacation1
Jul. 30, 2009, 11:34 AM
[QUOTE=Roan;4271802] The woman you are referring to is disabled. That is why she did not get out of the cart. She couldn't, which is why -- when you watch the video carefully -- you see a man drag her out of the way after she gets flipped out of her cart.[QUOTE]

:eek: Poor woman, to have limited mobility in a situation like that, not that the other people in the ring seemed to have gotten out very quick. This video seems to make the rounds - I've seen it several times before, and I think it was on FHOTD at one point. At first they do all seem to be chasing the first loose horse very aggressively and maybe not a great idea, but toward the end they seem to be trying to keep it away from the people/horses/carts in the center of the ring, and that horse really just keeps coming back through the center for some reason. I just don't understand why so many people stayed in the ring for so long. The drivers and their people were kind of stuck, and I guess the officials felt it was their place, but it made a pretty big crowd.

RugBug
Jul. 30, 2009, 11:49 AM
The woman you are referring to is disabled. That is why she did not get out of the cart. She couldn't, which is why -- when you watch the video carefully -- you see a man drag her out of the way after she gets flipped out of her cart.


Suddenly, there is some understanding for me. I saw this video awhile back and for the life of me couldn't figure out why that woman didn't get out of her cart.

I think this is a pretty decent reminder that even if you think you're horse isn't going to freak out, you should get off. You never know what is going to happen and it's safer for everyone to be dismounted.

AmandaandTuff
Jul. 30, 2009, 11:52 AM
The person that led their horse out of the arena had the right idea in my mind. Unhitch and get out.

Seems like it would help if they had a chute setup outside the arena. Let the horse out the arena gate into the chute and he'll have no place to go and will have to stop.

Imagine the equipment damage and how many of the horses may have had issues after the incident.

Pirateer
Jul. 30, 2009, 01:27 PM
Yikes, I bet that turned into one EXPENSIVE class for everyone involved.

Czar
Jul. 30, 2009, 03:49 PM
Wow...just wow - my heart was pounding just watching that video.

So it said no person was hurt but the hackney that they kept down...was it's leg broken?

As far as doing anything else...I don't see what could have been done differently. The horses were so beyond reason that they didn't even care who or what they ran into - even the people standing right in the middle close to the announcer's booth were ran into..there was nowhere TO go.

Quite frankly, I thought it may have been a good idea, as some tried, to grab onto an errant rein as the horses were so panicked that they weren't just running themselves out of steam around the outside. They were trying to get close to the other horses and the situation just kept escalating. Sure, it may have resulted in lameness but a situation like that also could have resulted in death...human and horse.

Pirateer
Jul. 30, 2009, 03:52 PM
So it said no person was hurt but the hackney that they kept down...was it's leg broken?


Agreed- does anyone know?

Czar
Jul. 30, 2009, 03:56 PM
Raises a question though...WWYD...in a flat class if a horse bucked off it's rider and was careening around the ring - get off or stay on?

Personally I feel much more comfortable ON my horse if something is going terribly wrong as I feel that I could stay on better than I could hold on when on the ground. I guess the only thing with that is if the horse actually runs into you and knocks your horse down...I suppose in that case, it would be better to be holding than riding.

NMK
Jul. 30, 2009, 04:17 PM
If you choose to stay on, keep your horse's butt towards the oncoming horse. Therefore if it hits you it hits your horse in the rear and you stand a good chance of not getting hurt too badly. The worst collisions are head to head or getting T boned. I would stay on and put my horse's head away from the action, and his butt exactly towards it.

This was rule #1 when I was an exercise rider. Each track usually has a horn that blows if there is a loose horse on the track-- a noise you never want to hear if you are out there.

Nancy

Gry2Yng
Jul. 30, 2009, 04:21 PM
That video is about the scariest thing I have seen in a long time.

I really appreciate the advice NMK. It is good to learn some sort of tactic if the worst ever happens.

AppendixQHLover
Jul. 30, 2009, 04:25 PM
I can't see the video at work but I will need to see it later.

I have pulled off into the middle with my old horse if he was being terrible. I have had to a couple times with current horse. Current horse has having back issues and kept throwing his head up in the air. He cold-clocked me in the forehead. I went into the middle because I thought my nose was bleeding.

A show up the local fairgrounds has some scarey stuff. A brillant gate person shook the ribbon bag and popped it. It was real loud. My horse just about had a coronary. The rest of the show was interesting to say the least.

Old hrose...we were in the middle if he was having a moment. I have no problems going into the middle if my horse is having a meltdown.

NMK
Jul. 30, 2009, 04:41 PM
Also want to add DO NOT GET OFF. You are safer on a horse with his butt to the oncoming traffic than you are standing by or next to him. Stay on, be calm, and get the turn on the forehand going.

Nancy

SprinklerBandit
Jul. 30, 2009, 04:54 PM
I only get off a horse in a situation like that if I'm on a horse I think is likely to join in the fun. On my old mare, I'd just pull up and wait. I try to leave enough room for the loose horse to go around us either on the rail or in the center. If the horse is making laps, I just ride to the middle.

On my new girl, though, I'd probably get off. I'd rather risk breaking the bridle than getting thrown and scaring her.

RugBug
Jul. 30, 2009, 05:03 PM
Also want to add DO NOT GET OFF. You are safer on a horse with his butt to the oncoming traffic than you are standing by or next to him. Stay on, be calm, and get the turn on the forehand going.

Nancy

Seriously depends on the horse. With my horse, you're safer on the ground. Butt to the action means you are going to get run away with no doubt. He, however, has great grounds manners and can be hung onto easily. Which is why, when rehabbing, I felt better about handwalking than the under saddle portion.

Know your horse...I guess would be key.

Astraled
Jul. 30, 2009, 07:01 PM
Every person and every horse made it out okay. No legs were broken.

Here's a link to some discussion on an Arab board: http://forums.ablackhorse.com/index.php?showtopic=23248&st=60

Look for post #69

BarbB
Jul. 30, 2009, 07:38 PM
The only one I saw that was a victim of his own stupidity was the one close to the camera that apparently thought he could stop a runaway by standing in front of it and waving his arms.
There is one like that on a racing video, I think that one got killed.

The rest seemed to be trying to get out of the way, a runaway horse zigzagging and pulling a cart sideways has got to be terrifying coming right at you. There were a couple of people who should have been run over and weren't.

I was glad to hear everyone survived. I don't do driving, never have, never will....this is exhibit A. :D

I have seen a flat class that turned into 'last man standing' it was no where near as scary as this video.

sp56
Jul. 30, 2009, 08:18 PM
Stay on or get off. Depends on the situation. A stallion got loose in a ring full of kids on ponies. Getting off, abandoning the ponies, and getting the hell out of there was the right thing to do! Won't go into the details, but clearly there were several poor decisions made that day. haha. Everyone was okay for the most part...

If there was a loose horse in a show, and I was on my old good guy, I would stay on and go to the center. If I was on my greenie, I'd probably get off for fear of being the next one bucked off chasing my horse around a ring! ;)

Across Sicily
Jul. 30, 2009, 08:36 PM
I saw that video many months ago and it still terrifies me. I drive quite often and I am *always* wary of getting in a terrible accident. There's just not a lot you can do when the horse decides he's finished and takes off. Hard to bail, and you know if you do the horse is just going to get in more trouble. :( One of my trainers handles the young driving horses, and occasionally they will get to leaping and plunging and doing stupid stuff. He's broken a couple of shafts and things, but that's about it. My heart always basically stops, but he continues on with aplomb.

Fwiw, I would have unhooked if I'd been in there. I know a header or two would have appeared from my barn and I am adept at hooking and unhooking horses. It does not take that long and there are certainly measures I would have taken to make sure that the more 'dangerous' parts were unhooked first - undo the tie-down first, then unhook the traces on both sides, and only then take out the shafts from the tugs. In theory, that way if the horse had gotten loose and gone running off, there would have been minimal damage and the cart would have slid right on out.

As far as excusing myself from the ring goes... I only ever had to do it once with a half-Arab mare who trotted in and decided that was quite enough. Stopped and spun like a reiner. I was in my PdN saddle (which we all know does not have a seatbelt) and it was all I could do to not go flying off. She eventually stopped and I excused myself politely to go work the snot out of her somewhere else. She later started the spinning just outside the ring, and only when the show was actually in session (would go in fine the rest of the time... sneaky thing). I've also excused myself when my gelding bit his tongue and was bleeding EVERYWHERE. Wasn't sure what it was from being on top of him, and better safe than sorry.

MintHillFarm
Jul. 30, 2009, 09:21 PM
It seemed that at the end when the ambulance went through the ring, that the hackney was not in the picture anymore, or maybe it was just the angle. I have to watch it again as when they roped him, that is when he hit the ground it seems??

What a frightening video!! All the more so as my computer kept buffering it.
I always thought that if things go bad in a driving class, it is very bad.

MintHillFarm
Jul. 30, 2009, 09:33 PM
Another comment, now that I read on ablackhorse that the physical injuries were not serious, I can only imagine the emotional aspect! What a traumatic experience for all.

As for the placings, I was curious if they had even pinned the class. So they did, interesting...I guess they had to.

As we all know when we fall off we get back on, in this situation though, I can only guess if I would ever drive again competitively!

Peggy
Jul. 30, 2009, 10:06 PM
A few years ago one horse bucked off its rider during the victory "gallop" for a county-level 2'6" medal and then took off. Most of the riders were intelligent enuf to get in the middle of the ring and kind of hide behind a jump standard. Some got off, some didn't. One person wasn't so bright and dismounted on the rail. Her horse got away from her and joined the other one. There may have been on additional escapee. Horses were caught and no one was hurt, but it was an exciting few moments.

There is no longer a victory gallop for that particular medal.

hunter1985
Jul. 30, 2009, 11:43 PM
At the NC State 4-H horseshow we have a "Versatility class" where they change tack from english to western in the ring.
It can be very scary seeing all these people with saddle,s bridles, helmets, show clothes all coming at you from one end of the ring to the other. They ran up to the horses, and spooked one really bad. This horse got loose and ran around the ring creating a domino effect making one or two other horses get loose. Needless to say, the people are to WALK slowly to the horses now, no running!!

Montanas_Girl
Jul. 31, 2009, 07:13 PM
Back in Montana's younger days, we excused ourselve from several flat classes. I remember one memorable class at the Ag Expo Center in Franklin, TN. I think it was a long stirrup or super green hunter class. There were around 12-15 horses and ponies in the ring, mostly green-on-green combinations, along with a full set of jumps. They never broke down the outside lines for flat classes at those shows, and the space between the outside lines and the concrete arena walls was only wide enough for one horse - maybe two if they were both exceptionally well behaved. The announcer called for us to canter going the first way of the ring, and Montana bolted before I even had time to react. We were screaming towards this kid on a pony who was passing between an outside line and the wall. I was yelling "Head up! Runaway!" all the way down the rail, but she either didn't hear me or didn't know what to do, and she just kept cantering down the rail. Just as we came up on the heels of the pony, Montana ducked his shoulder, spun to the inside of the jump, and took off bucking across the diagonal. I finally managed to get enough leverage on my inside rein to bring him down to a trot. By this time the rest of the class had been asked to walk. I turned my head, tipped my helmet to the judge, and kept trotting, straight through the ingate and out into the warm-up arena, where I finally got him stopped. It was NOT our finest moment! :eek: :lol: Luckily, those days are well past him now.

PletchersMom
Jul. 31, 2009, 07:27 PM
OMG.....That really makes you think about the next time you enter a ring, whether it is riding or driving. How gut wrenching that was to watch.

Hunter Mom
Jul. 31, 2009, 07:34 PM
I had seen that video before, and it was scary. Back in the dark ages, I drove my saddlebred and my arabs, and it is a fun thing to do. I never saw anything go wrong myself. HOWEVER, you do know that there is little you can do if something goes south. Never stopped me or any of us from driving.

Actually, you don't have the ability to easily unhitch a horse quickly - in a fine harness there are multiple tugs, tiedowns, etc, that have to be undone.

FWIW, this was a regional Arab show, too. Not hackneys.

enjoytheride
Jul. 31, 2009, 09:22 PM
this was a qualifying class for nationals and these horses had been in this ring the day before, and this was actually the reverse. The steward got together with the judges and they pinned based on the little bit they saw after all the riders agreed to this. There were not enough carts to run the class again.

They believe the horse that started this was stung by a bee, he is an experienced harness horse.

The rope missed the horse and the shaft of the cart ran into the gate. That horse was kept down to unhitch the cart and to treat some rope burns. One person went to the hospital with a sprained thumb, and one person had chest pains. Everyone drove again including the horses.