Bitless horses.. check in! [Archive]

sublimequine

Jun. 29, 2009, 12:43 PM

I thought a thread about folks being successful in a bitless setup of some sort would be fun, so here goes! :)

I ride my mare in the short-shanked "english hackamore", and she just loves it. Never leans against the reins, no fighting, she is so much more relaxed. Occasionally I also ride in a sidepull, but at the moment I don't have one that fits her, and on the trails I do like having that bit of leverage should I need it. :lol:

So, what about you guys? What type of bitless is your horse going in, what made you decide that type? How did you figure out bitless was the best choice for you and your horse? I'd love to hear some stories! :yes:

lily04

Jun. 29, 2009, 01:15 PM

I foxhunt both of my ottb's in an English hackamore. I started with the first one because he would get his tongue over the bit and didn't really care for anything with a port. It works so well on him that I started using it on the next one. The older guy even neck reins like a cowpony. As a bonus they can graze all they want during our (mostly me) mental therapy hacks.:)

SmokenMirrors

Jun. 29, 2009, 01:35 PM

I use a run of the mill hackamore on my gelding and on his sister. He does really well when out and about and has always preferred one.

nicbarker

Jun. 29, 2009, 01:43 PM

My oldest horse has a huge tongue and any bit is uncomfortable for him, but its taken years to find the best bitless, mostly because I was a bit slow on the uptake :cry:. Tried sidepulls and rope halters which were OK but a bit crude and now he goes in a bog-standard English hackamore and is an absolute dream :)

Most of my others will go equally happily in that or a lozenge/myler snaffle.

Nic

Diamond Jake

Jun. 29, 2009, 02:23 PM

Never really could agree on a bit that he was happy with. He would flip his head high when we "disagreed" on speed. I was not comfortable with a running martingale.

Tried an S Hack- works well for control for me, but consistently 15 minutes into each ride he would shake his head a couple of times and then rub his face on his leg. Watching the video for Micklem, I suspected maybe the rope nose was making his nose numb or feel funny.

Moved to Biothane sidepull this year, so far so good. Found out he is low Thyroid, so we will see how high up the energy level comes. If he runs through the sidepull, will go back to the S Hack.

I would really like a Dr Cook's. Tried it on Jake and really liked it.

QuzqosMa

Jun. 29, 2009, 04:20 PM

I sometimes ride with a Dr. Cook's bitless bridle, and the horse loves it. Bad thing is the lack of steering, and if he dives for the grass, there's not much I can do about it other than haul him sideways. Wouldn't use it for group rides though, I did that last fall and I might as well have just tossed away the reins, for all the good it did once that Herd-think set in. But that could be true of any bridle in a similar situation.

He's an Arabian...so that explains a lot. :)

SharonA

Jun. 29, 2009, 05:21 PM

I tried an English hackamore with a fleece-lined nose, etc. -- I think it was a Sprenger -- and while it looked beautiful, that thing was _heavy_. Just the hackamore piece (without headstall) was much heavier than a regular bridle. It made me think of the Grinch's dog, Max, when the Grinch tied on the antlers.

Someday I wouldn't mind finding a lighter version of the same thing.

GallopingGrape

Jun. 29, 2009, 05:38 PM

I often ride in a sidepull, but stick with my bit when I want more refinement.. but by far, my horse loves bitless.

sublimequine

Jun. 29, 2009, 05:43 PM

Diamond Jake

Jun. 29, 2009, 05:44 PM

I should take a picture this weekend of this "Peruvian Bitless" or whatever that someone gave me. Does not work for me at all.... but still kind of cool.

I really like this thread! Cannot wait to see who else checks in!

:)

sonata

Jun. 29, 2009, 05:44 PM

My 1/2 arab had a low pallet and thick tongue so all bits made him uncomfortable. Tried the english hack and had a different horse. Rode him in it for over 15 years. Sent his 1/2 sister to a trainer after 18 months off for a refresher course and trainer couldn't find a bit to make the horse happy. Tried her brothers hack on her and instantly had a happy horse. (She has similiar problems with her mouth, but not as severe) I can ride the little girl by herself or with a huge group. Doesn't matter what the other horses are doing, she stays light as a feather

sublimequine

Jun. 29, 2009, 05:51 PM

4whitefeet

Jun. 29, 2009, 05:56 PM

Both of mine go bitless. My girl goes very well in the Dr. Cook bitless, and the hubby horse wears a Jim Warner hack.

After trying to figure out for years which one of the thousands of bits to use, I became overwhelmed (as I suspect alot of horse owners can be) so I figured "What the heck, might as well go without one." ;)

Raleigh's Mom

Jun. 29, 2009, 06:21 PM

The Arab goes in a S-Hack for trail riding, conditioning rides, and endurance rides. He will NOT drink with a bit in his mouth, so that is why I chose bitless for the trail. I started him out in a biothane sidepull, but needed something with a little more rate when we started competing. The S-hack did the trick. When doing arena work, I ride him in a french link snaffle.

The Quarter Horse has been going in a mechanical hack for years now, but he really has lost a lot of his responsiveness (he also has not been ridden much in the last 5 years). I now have him back in a bit --- tried a full check snaffle (and a loose ring french link in the past), and settled on an Argentine snaffle. We are just finishing up a group "performance horse" lessons at a cutting horse farm, and I plan to keep up the work in the new bit.

Shadow14

Jun. 29, 2009, 08:23 PM

I ran this simple set of side pulls for over 20 years, no shanks, no mechanical advantage, just a simple leather strap over the nose but eventually towards the end of Strider dropped it because a simple snaffle bit was actually lighter and to me every pound counted.
My daughter on Strider running a 50
http://i44.tinypic.com/11jvfc8.jpg

Shadow14

Jun. 29, 2009, 08:25 PM

This setup was actually lighter and didn't rub his nose if we ran in the rain.
The dufferin forest 50
http://i39.tinypic.com/15dna5f.jpg

Simbalism

Jun. 30, 2009, 12:38 AM

I ride my TB mare in an English Hackamore. I added a piece of halter fleece on the nose band as I was afraid the fleece lining would pack down from sweat and dirt. I didn't want to make it rub her nose. I started using the hackamore because she is very petite and she always seemed to really hate a bit in her mouth from the time she was first trained. She would grind her teeth on her rubber snaffle. The last bit I used on her was a Happy Mouth bit with a mullen mouthpiece. She liked that the best of any bit, but still would grind her teeth or pull down if you had to keep a feel when she was fresh. I got the hackamore at a silent auction for a few dollars and decided to give it a try. She has been going in this for about 3 years now and I even take lessons in it( starting to get back into jumping again).

dreamswept

Jun. 30, 2009, 01:12 AM

Mitch trail rides in a Herm Sprenger short-shank hackamore. I've got it on a turquoise headstall with a turquoise noseband (with fleece), and a turquoise curb chain. I like having him bitless on the trail because I was having such an huge issue with him trying to graze with his french-link snaffle, and then me having to tug and tug and constantly stay on his mouth. With the hackamore, I get a quick response, and can ride with softer hands as a result -- but still have that "Hey, LISTEN UP!" response when I need it.

I used it in a playday recently because I just wanted him to get a break from having a bit in his mouth for the whole day.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v197/dreamswept/MightyMitch/mitch-playday3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v197/dreamswept/MightyMitch/mitch-playday7.jpg

When we do ring work, I ride him in his french link full cheek or his Waterford D ring.

wendybird

Jun. 30, 2009, 02:22 AM

Hi all - I use an english hackamore on my 10yr old arabian gelding. He loves it. When I got him I used a loose ring snaffle which the former owners used, but he would try and evade any contact, and loll his tongue out the side of his mouth. I used my Cooks, but he didn't like the narrow noseband, so out came the hackamore. It needed an adjustment of the nose band because the cheeks straps would rub the edge of his eyes when contact made, and as I said, he goes just great.
My 8yr old arabian mare does everything in a rope halter, but for our endurance rides she has a simple bridle with a Myler low port comfort snaffle which she goes very well in. She didn't like the poll pressure of the Cook. The english hackamore is too big for her little head, and she hates all the stuff over her nose anyway.
On an endurance ride she tends to take charge in a halter lol so I have ordered a little S so I can try her in that. We do mounted games, hacking, little jumps and of course our endurance, with no problems.
As another poster said - the variety of bits and the claims made get too confusing, so going bitless is the simple choice and it suits the horses too.

GotGait

Jun. 30, 2009, 09:34 AM

I ride in a Colombian bosal. Mine is basically a bit hanger attached to a flat 3/4" nose band. It looks like a fancy halter with no chin strap.

Diamond Jake

Jun. 30, 2009, 09:36 AM

I want pics! I love to see interesting or unusual bitless stuff. :D:D:D

Sublime,
I will take it in just a few days. I am moving from MN to IL tomorrow, and will need a day or two to get settled. I just cleaned and organized my trailer, so I know exactly where it is!

:)
Steph

chicamuxen1

Jun. 30, 2009, 09:58 AM

I'm also a user of the "English Hackamore". Years ago I found a source for these ultra lightweight aluminum shanks which you can see here:

http://www.american-flex.com/bits.htm

I have 2-3 sets now with biothane nosebands that are lined with either neoprene or that waffled PVC material. Super lightweight hackamores, just enough control for the FORWARD horse and you can bend them laterally too.

Take a look around this web site. They sell all kinds of cool stuff for camping, trail riding, make saddle and tack. Very useful source.

chicamuxen

sublimequine

Jun. 30, 2009, 10:53 AM

Sublime,
I will take it in just a few days. I am moving from MN to IL tomorrow, and will need a day or two to get settled. I just cleaned and organized my trailer, so I know exactly where it is!

:)
Steph

Oh, I'm in IL! Where are you moving to? Northern, Central, or Southern IL? :)

chica; The aluminum shanks sounds really nice, but they're kind of expensive! :eek:

Willobeasty

Jun. 30, 2009, 11:08 AM

We ride in A-B Sidepulls, which are basically rope halters with a little chin strap to keep the nose more in place and provide a place to hang the reins. Here it is on a camping trip in the Flat Tops:

http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/2206576810071000871lyboUM

They are great as you can camp for a whole week and only use one piece of gear! And throw them in the washer when you get home, they come out like new.

Just bought a Freedom Bridle though, for my mare, as she gets a little forward in crowds.

Diamond Jake

Jun. 30, 2009, 02:00 PM

Oh, I'm in IL! Where are you moving to? Northern, Central, or Southern IL? :)

chica; The aluminum shanks sounds really nice, but they're kind of expensive! :eek:

Sent you a PM!!!!

;)

IrishKharma

Jun. 30, 2009, 02:55 PM

Is is ok to break a horse using a hackamore?

I have a 4 yr old, started late, used a snaffle for a few rides. I knew I wanted to go to a hackamore (short shanked) and I started using it with him. Are there any hard and fast rules against this I hsould know about?

I have an english hackamore (fleecy covered) but when that gets wet it is so nasty.

The best control I have over any horse is the longer shanked bicycle chain (covered in ribber of course!) hackamore.

Kristiesunny

Jun. 30, 2009, 03:25 PM

I ride all my horses in bitless bridles and have started a young horse withe bitless first and then switched to a snaffle when doing dressage training.

I have Dr. Cooks but I have the release to be an issue. I'm looking at the nutural or some such name like that.

Also friend showed me a pix of her horse and she is using a Jaquima (spelling) I want one of those, she found it on ebay.

No criss cross action under the chin.

But my horses all move very well bitless and listen to my aids. Of course I can ride all my horses in a flat nylon halter and 2 lead lines so maybe that is something to take into consideration :)

Tiger Horse

Jun. 30, 2009, 05:30 PM

My mare goes in a short shanked hackamore for parades and in a bitless bridle (Dr Cook) on the trail. When we are schooling for gait (she is gaited) I use her walking horse bit.

sublimequine

Jun. 30, 2009, 08:33 PM

katarine

Jun. 30, 2009, 08:50 PM

I start colts in a sidepull. No baby should be started in anything with leverage.

I have gone back to a full cheek snaffle on Chip, leaving the Little S and his occasional sidepull behind. Much better communication in a snaffle he's taken a liking too. I'd like to think it's me, but I think it's the bit. I can take up contact and he'll 'shake my hand' per se. We're happy.

Leather

Jun. 30, 2009, 09:52 PM

paintlady

Jul. 1, 2009, 03:58 PM

I was having alot of bit issues with my mare when I first got her. While attending one of John Lyons sessions at an expo one thing he said really struck me... if your horse is showing resistance then less is better. I had been progressively moving from a snaffle to curb bits. I got rid of all the bits and switched to a Dr. Cooks Bitless Bridle. My mare did extremely well in it - no more resistance! I used the Dr. Cooks exclusively for about 1-2 years. I had to switch back to a bit when I decided to do some local showing. The transition was seamless. I can now ride my mare in a mild snaffle (I use a Sprenger Dynamic loose ring) with no problems. I guess we both just needed to step away from the bit for awhile.

sublimequine

Jul. 1, 2009, 06:06 PM

I ride my Paso Fino mare in traditional headgear--a noseband (bosal) and curb strap (barbada). I put it on a regular bridle with snaps.

The reins can either be connected to the side rings (like a side pull) or the lower rings to work off of curb pressure

Here's a pic of her going bitless this past weekend at Sicca Hollow in South Dakota. (The other black thing is just a rope halter.)

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j115/jovianrider/IMG_2150.jpg

How do you get leverage off the bottom reins, if there's no shanks or no curb strap to tighten when the shanks swivel backwards? :confused:

I love Paso tack, but it confuses me to no end. Please enlighten me, because it's gorgeous stuff that I wanna know more about! :lol:

Leather

Jul. 1, 2009, 08:32 PM

How do you get leverage off the bottom reins, if there's no shanks or no curb strap to tighten when the shanks swivel backwards? :confused:

I love Paso tack, but it confuses me to no end. Please enlighten me, because it's gorgeous stuff that I wanna know more about! :lol:

It's not true curb pressure in the sense of it being a curb bit. There's no leverage.

The key to using the PF headgear is that when you give a cue, you pull more "up" rather than back. This causes the "curb" to contact the chin area. (Most PFs are only ridden with a direct rein too.)

So you don't ride with the "curb" constantly on the chin. You want it hanging freely like it is in the picture.

Then when you either want to stop or give a cue to turn, the contact with the chin is the cue (along with some nose pressure.)

If you think Paso Fino tack is confusing, you should see Peruvian Paso tack. It's $$$$$$$!!!

sublimequine

Jul. 1, 2009, 08:37 PM

It's not true curb pressure in the sense of it being a curb bit. There's no leverage.

The key to using the PF headgear is that when you give a cue, you pull more "up" rather than back. This causes the "curb" to contact the chin area. (Most PFs are only ridden with a direct rein too.)

So you don't ride with the "curb" constantly on the chin. You want it hanging freely like it is in the picture.

Then when you either want to stop or give a cue to turn, the contact with the chin is the cue (along with some nose pressure.)

If you think Paso Fino tack is confusing, you should see Peruvian Paso tack. It's $$$$$$$!!!

Ohhh, okay, I get you. So you ride on the sidepull configuration most of the time, but if you want the curb strap to come into contact with the chin, you just lift the reins for that?

goeslikestink

Jul. 1, 2009, 09:17 PM

here subby this will help you

http://www.sustainabledressage.com/tack/bridle.php#kineton

sublimequine

Jul. 1, 2009, 09:24 PM

here subby this will help you

http://www.sustainabledressage.com/tack/bridle.php#kineton

What about it? I'm pretty familiar with Kinetons, I've always wanted to try one but they are near IMPOSSIBLE to find in the US, let alone one in black. :uhoh:

Leather

Jul. 2, 2009, 12:03 AM

Ohhh, okay, I get you. So you ride on the sidepull configuration most of the time, but if you want the curb strap to come into contact with the chin, you just lift the reins for that?

Yup. When a horse is in the training stage, you often start out with the reins attached to the side rings (where the bridle is attached) to teach flexing/bending. You can then either add a second set of reins to the lower ring, or just switch the single rein to introduce "curb" pressure.

The nosebands and curbs come in varying materials/configurations depending upon the amount of control desired.

Nosebands: http://casadosa.com/Scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=24

Curb: http://casadosa.com/Scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=19

whitesage

Jul. 2, 2009, 02:32 PM

I started my horse in a Monty Roberts dually halter and he goes very well in that. I also rode him in a Parelli rope hackamore for awhile, but found he didn't respond too well to so much pressure under the chin.

Now I ride him in a Dr. Cook's bitless bridle. I'm still adjusting to riding him with less rein contact as I have always ridden english and am used to constantly having contact with the horse's mouth. Because the Dr. Cook's works on pressure I think it's important that I keep practicing riding with a looser rein.

My horse is a bit of a piggy on trails eating everything from maple trees to tall grass. I do have to admit to more of those sudden pit stops than I would like. But he's learning with more experience that he's only allowed to snack on command, and I've learned that when he's really decided to go to town, that using my legs 1-2-THREE gets his attention back.

Sage has never had a bit in his mouth and at this stage I don't feel like he needs one. He seems happy. (And so am I, as long as those snacking discussions continue to go my way...)

pandorasboxx

Jul. 3, 2009, 09:11 AM

I ride in a Sprenger English hack. I'm very intrigued by the Kineton but I can't find it in black. That is a deal killer.

sublimequine

Jul. 3, 2009, 01:01 PM

I ride in a Sprenger English hack. I'm very intrigued by the Kineton but I can't find it in black. That is a deal killer.

Same here. Even if I could find a cheap one in another color and have a saddler perhaps dye the straps for me, but I'm not going to spend $80 on just a noseband. :eek:

CosMonster

Jul. 3, 2009, 09:38 PM

I ride my mare in a short shanked English hack, too. I started it because she goes okay in a bit, but never really accepted contact like I expect from a horse. Rather than fight her about it, I decided one day to try a hack, more or less on a lark. Sure enough, she went beautifully in it so I still ride her in it. I ride her with in a snaffle occasionally because I do feel that, barring medical reasons, it is important for a horse to go tolerably well in whatever you want to ride it in. However, mostly I ride her in the hack.

I also ride my young horse in a hack occasionally because he's the opposite--he goes beautifully in a snaffle and tolerably in a hack, but I want to be able to ride him in both. :)

Cindyg

Jul. 3, 2009, 10:29 PM

My horse works beautifully in a Parelli "horseman's hackamore" (really a rope halter with reins). When he came to me, he was a teeth grinder. Gradually, that faded away in the hackamore. I recently tried him back in the snaffle and decided he was actually more responsive in the hackamore; so we're back to the hackamore.

TheOtherHorse

Jul. 4, 2009, 07:54 AM

I trail ride in a short shanked english hackamore on my young horse, as she likes to lean hard on the bit and throw tantrums when she's upset. With the hackamore it is sooooo much better. We still do ring work in a loose ring with lozenge and jump in a french link D, but on the trails she MUCH prefers the hack.

Diamond Jake

Jul. 13, 2009, 10:22 AM

Same here. Even if I could find a cheap one in another color and have a saddler perhaps dye the straps for me, but I'm not going to spend $80 on just a noseband. :eek:

If you guys get me alittle more info on this noseband, I will see if I can find a good supplier for you!

Rode a distance ride this weekend in just the sidepull. Oh did he pull the first few miles! Then once he was allowed to lead he settled very nicely into a loose rein! I am not sure I could have held him the whole time if he would have kept pulling that hard!

Sadie'sMom

Jul. 13, 2009, 04:33 PM

Sadie would go in any bit, but she also goes perfectly fine in one of those string halters aka the Parelli halter. She is very sensitive to it and we've never had a problem. She started using it when she was about 12 yrs old, and is 20 now. And she's a TB that can get nervous. We use her trail riding, arena schooling rides, Poker rides, whatever. (It's so easy to just hop up on her when I decide I have time to ride after all.)

sublimequine

Jul. 13, 2009, 04:56 PM

Over the last couple of months I've switched Sweets back to the Little S hack with the flat, beta noseband. First she loved it, then she hated it, now she loves it again. :rolleyes: She's going perfectly in it right now so hopefully she'll be able to stay in it this time.

It's funny how their preferences can change, isn't it? Especially in mares. :lol:

What bit was she ultimately a fan of, if you don't mind me asking? I have tried every bit under the sun, it seems, to appease my mare.. and nope, she just will not have it. Bitless she's happy as a clam, bitted she's mopey and argumentative. I prefer bitless anyways, but it sure would be nice to find ONE bit she likes. :eek:

Diamond Jake

Jul. 16, 2009, 04:00 PM

I rode Jake in the sidepull for the first time in a novice distance ride this weekend. He was the third horse in the group, and at first I wondered if we were ever going to make it through, he pulled so much!

The we got out front, and he went on a loose rein the rest of the way, happy as a clam!

This might sound crazy, but I might look at rigging a little extra rope attachment in case he gets "pully", one that I can leave on whenever I ride, and just grab it for when he gets a little hard.
I don't know- I am making some of this up as I go!