RIBBY Thoroughbred

[LuckyWun]

Anyone have issues with their thoroughbreds beings extremely ribby? My 5 yr old is painstakenly ribby and he gets fed 3 times a day, with hay to munch on the enitre day. The hay i was told is a 21% protein, really green stuff. He loves hit. For some reason I can count every single one of his ribs. I tape weighed him and hes a whopiing 1100 lbs. When I got him he was malnourished and extremely thin. Its been more than a yr and his feed schedule has been consistent. Anything else i can give him to cure the ribbiness?

FYI: He's ridden about 3x a week if that, and he's somewhat spooky. Has salt block and access to fresh water 24/7.

[caffeinated]

Kind of hard to say without knowing more about his situation and lifestyle.

How much turnout is he getting? Is it on grass?

What kind of feed are you using? And how much (by weight)?

Any supplements?

History of ulcers?

[LuckyWun]

Hand grazed. Has access to hay 24/7. In a stall. Is on 1 scoop of the missing link supplement with glucosamine.

i believe he gets a combined amount of 5 quarts of Equine Senior divided morning, afternoon and evening. The B/O swears that he will founder with anymore grain in combination with the hay which he claims is 21%.

There has to be something else I can give him. I just moved him to this new place at the end of may. was not ribby when he left the other barn.

[joiedevie99]

Senior feed is complete feed. If you read the directives on the bag, you are instructed to feed much more of it than 'normal' feed since it is meant to be both forage and grain for horses that can't eat traditional forage. My senior gets 4 qts. of Nutrena Senior 3x per day- and has gotten up to 6 at some points. She also gets as much nice grass hay as she will eat, plus a 2 flakes of alfalfa.

[Jaegermonster]

That's a lot of grain. I agree with the BO, I don't usually like to feed more than 6 qts or so 2x a day (that's two scoops)
Obviously he needs more fat than he is getting or he wouldn't be ribby.
Why is he on Senior Feed? I think I would find something that is a high fat feed and start him on that. I have TBs that I foxhunt, I feed Nutrena XTN and they are fat as pigs.

[merrygoround]

If a horse is able to chew and swallow hay-some horses chew, and then spit it out as a "quid"- Equine Senior is a waste. Are you sure he has access to hay 24/7?

I would switch him over to a high fat feed, forget about hi protein, if his hay is truly that high, he doesn't need anything more than 10-12%, and add oil to his diet. Start with one or two ounces.

Equine Senior is designed to be the only feed fed, and for a large senior horse, 10 or more pounds fed free choice is not unusual.

[LuckyWun]

I feed him at night so i know that he is getting atleast a scoop and a half of grain. I mix that with the supplement and corn oil and a little bit of a hoof and coat conditioner. The B/O could be bulljoshing me saying he is being fed and he isnt feeding him enough so that he could cut cost. There is no way for me to prove otherwise. I am giving the B/O the benefit of the doubt that my horse isnt keeping his optimal weight.

[Riley0522]

Why don't you try keeping him out? My guy was the king of ribby, and 24/7 turnout has made him a FAT, happy horse. He's also crazier than ever, but his feed really hasn't changed, but being at a barn with a bunch of ladies has :no:. Just for reference he eats:

1/2scp Carb Guard (12% Protein, 8% Fat, 25% Fiber)
1/2scp pellets (hometown brand) (11% Protein, 6% Fat, 8% Fiber)
1/2 scoop Vintage Performance LS (12% Protein, 12% Fat, 20% Fiber)
A generous amt of corn oil (about 1 cup)
1/2 scp TractGard

AM and PM. So he does get 6qts twice a day, and I really wouldn't want him getting anymore. He gets hay x3.

Since he's been out 24/7, he's easily put on 150-200lbs.

[spotmenow]

In a stall all the time? He may be pacing off his calories or simply stressing them off.

I have three TBs boarded here, all "hard keepers". One is 18 and is therefore on a Senior feed (6 lbs./day) and 1 pound of Empower. I suspect ulcers, but owner doesn't want to acknowledge. Anyway, he gets all the hay he wants (he will only eat second cutting) and 12 hours of grass a day. I have to stall him for at least part of the day or night, season dependent, so that he will eat enough, but he wants OUT when its time.

Second is a (10 year old) mare that lives out all the time, comes in for grain 2x a day and gets Empower with her Safechoice/alfalfa pellets. Currently eating (daily) 1 pound SafeChoice, 1 pound alfalfa pellets, 1 pound Empower. 12 hours grass a day and all the hay she'll eat.

Third is a (10 year old) gelding that lives out all the time, comes in for grain 2x a day and gets 1 pound Empower, 5 pounds Safechoice split into the two feedings. 12 hours grass a day and all the hay he'll eat.

All an excellent weight despite their history of being hard keepers.

Sooo...I don't think that feeding a horse upwards of 6-8 pounds of grain a day is excessive but think that he may need a higher fat feed (I know that Nutrena's Senior isn't that high in fat) and added fat as well. I'm a personal fan of Empower and/or Nutraflax. However, I'd think about some lifestyle changes if he isn't getting turnout and investigate ulcers, worming, dental, etc.

[Tamara in TN]

Hand grazed. Has access to hay 24/7. In a stall. Is on 1 scoop of the missing link supplement with glucosamine.

i believe he gets a combined amount of 5 quarts of Equine Senior divided morning, afternoon and evening. The B/O swears that he will founder with anymore grain in combination with the hay which he claims is 21%.

There has to be something else I can give him. I just moved him to this new place at the end of may. was not ribby when he left the other barn.

well....he will stand a better chance of foundering on a 21% hay than he will on ES....my 10 hh pony who is quite old gets 10 pounds of Senior a day....;)

my thought is any horse on free choice 21% alfalfa (as no other hay can hope to come close) and having no turnout on grass "should" be hotter than damnit and greasy fat stupid and quite a pill to handle...

the ES is alfalfa meal based as well...thought honestly your BO has no idea how to feed it either apparently....my thoughts are this:

either the hay is not 21%
he's not got free choice hay
or he has a terrible recurring case of worms and/or bad teeth...

something in the equation you have given us does not = ribby 1100 lb animal

best

[NSF]

I got an OTTB once that was 5 at the time. He was very hard to put weight on. My trainers gave the woman we boarded with a horrible time for "not feeding him enough". He was getting the maximum amount of grain our vet allowed. This was 20 years ago and the only feeds around (that I was aware of) were corn, cob (wet or dry) and oats. He also got all the hay he would eat and his stall opened to his own pasture. It was like that for a year or two and then he became an "easy keeper".

I have another TB, not off the track, who just turned 3 and is going the same thing except that I believe his weight loss is due to some growth spurts. He's ribby but I'm trying to be carefull with what I feed him since he's still growing so much. He's getting all the hay he wants plus beet pulp and orchard grass pellets.

[Liberty]

...I just moved him to this new place at the end of may. was not ribby when he left the other barn.

So obviously it's something that has changed from his living environment/feed regimen where he was before the move and where he is now. Look at the differences between the two. Was he "somewhat spooky" at the previous barn? What other, if any, personality changes have you noticed?

[Jaegermonster]

of course I didn't even mention to check your deworming protocol, assuming that it was probably ok.
But that is the first thing I would check, and then maybe put him on the daily dewormer and change his feed to a high fat feed

[ThoroughbredFancy]

I had very similar issues with my young OTTB as well.

The grain that has worked best for him is Vintage Performance LS (5.5 lbs a day). My second choice would be Carb Guard.

I do add Canola oil to his feed for extra calories.

He gets as much hay as he can at my boarding barn with Timothy/Alfalfa cubes for lunch. (2lbs)

He also gets one pound alfalfa pellets with each feeding.


Flax has also helped his coat, not sure about weight though.

Aside from figuring out this diet that works great for him I Power Packed him and saw a difference. Gained a few pounds and coat looked a little better.

I treated him for ulcers and saw no difference in weight or temperament. Of course I wasn't 100% sure that he had them anyways.

It did take me about a year to get him to where I wanted him to be. He's certainly come a long way. Good luck with your guy!

[Rhyadawn]

I would check his teeth, and when he was wormed last. Is he restless in his stall?

I like senior feed for hard keepers because its a complete feed, but I do find that it sometimes lacks fat. Although before upping feed, I up hay.

How long has he been off the track (was he even on the track)? Sometimes its just an adjustment period for them (they look worse before they look better). I find with the OTTBs I've worked with it took about a year before they looked really good. I don't like to rush it, its too much of a shock to their system.

The other thing is too, at 5 he could be going through a growth spurt. And they never look good then

[Petstorejunkie]

there is something his new environment isnt providing.

you can shove all the hay you want in front of my horse, but if he doesnt get 12+ hours of grass grazing a day he'll quickly waste away. Some horses are just like that

[ladipus]

Anyone have issues with their thoroughbreds beings extremely ribby? My 5 yr old is painstakenly ribby and he gets fed 3 times a day, with hay to munch on the enitre day. The hay i was told is a 21% protein, really green stuff. He loves hit. For some reason I can count every single one of his ribs. I tape weighed him and hes a whopiing 1100 lbs. When I got him he was malnourished and extremely thin. Its been more than a yr and his feed schedule has been consistent. Anything else i can give him to cure the ribbiness?

FYI: He's ridden about 3x a week if that, and he's somewhat spooky. Has salt block and access to fresh water 24/7.

Hard to say w/out more info..but..

Have his teeth been floated-usually every 6months?,what's his deworming schedule?Panacur power packs get rid of encysted stongyles,followed up by a consistent rotational including Equimax(ivermectin/praziquantel) for tapes,or a daily deworming program

If he's a spooky/nervous type he could have ulcers...Finish line's u7 gastric aid or Corta Flex u guard work great and have really helped all my tb's,along w/ a good probiotic to aid digestion-fastrack,probios,or tractguard are good choices

Next...what's he eating?grain?how high is the surgar/starch content? often times feeds w/ high starch/sugars like in the 20% range such as sweet feeds,and even some senior feeds tend to irritate sensitve tummies and often aggrevate or flair up ulcers...possibly switching to a high fat/low starch/high fiber feed would benefit your boy....Triple Crown Low Starch,Blue Seal Vintage Performance LS or Purina Ultium work great

also plain soaked beetpulp is great too for adding cool/low starch fiber/calories to the diet....and if after all of that -if more weight gain is desired there's always rice bran which comes in various forms

but most importanly....is hay hay and more hay....free choice-top quality hay,and turnout as much as he'll tolerate does the most good-more so than what feed you give him.

be patient..it takes time..and if he's off the track it sometimes takes them a good year or longer to fully let down...and don't switch things all at once...try adding/subtracting these things one at a times to see if it makes a difference.

Also...if you can give him alfalfa that's great for adding calories,and helps ulcer prone/ulcer horses

[LuckyWun]

His teeth are fine, he gets wormed every 6 weeks (rotational), and he doesnt have any stall vices. Can't crib because of cribbing collar. The only thing I havnt checked was the possibility of ulcers. that i will have my vet come out and do.

[CherishtheMoment]

Has he been power packed for worms? i would do a fecal count and go from there. I currently have a OTTB that I aquired off the track earlier this year and he worries himself if he is alone in the barn. I had to put a buddy with him at all times and now he is fat and happy. Make sure yours isn't worrying himself because he is alone or cannot see other horses. :yes:

[LuckyWun]

He has a buddy, an older TB, to keep him company. He also has toys that he plays around with. I've seen this myself when I'm lounging around the barn.

[LuckyWun]

Ive never had him power packed. You should be able to tell if he has worms just by looking at his feces cant you?

[LuckyWun]

Ive never had him power packed. You should be able to tell if he has worms just by looking at his feces cant you?

[ThoroughbredFancy]

Ive never had him power packed. You should be able to tell if he has worms just by looking at his feces cant you?

Fecal counts are not always accurate.

Also the type of parasite that a Power Pack targets is encysted within the intestine wall so it would not show up in a fecal unless the cysts were to break and the parasites were to come out. That often has ill effects on a horse so you don't really want to wait until it comes to that.

My guy never had any major signs of a large parasite load physically or in his fecal matter. He was a little slimmer but nothing much. However, after I Power Packed him he seemed to look even better and he stopped having small bouts of colic...not sure if that was just coincidental.

[hunter1985]

One of our boarders horses was in the same situation. Ribby horse, never gained weight no matter what. We found out he had a heart defect or a heart murmor. They started him on red cell, or some other similar product and he has been so much better since. You may want the vet to check his heart and bloodwork.

[Sabovee]

Switch to High Fat diet (or supplement with weight sup, add beetpulp)
TURNOUT
Lysine - this often helps my hard keeper OTTBs
Check for Ulcers
TURNOUT

Seriously - nothing helps them stay happy, fat and sane like getting turned out as much as possible.

[nightsong]

There has to be something else I can give him. I just moved him to this new place at the end of may. was not ribby when he left the other barn.
It's not up to YOU to add anything. The new barn is not taking care of him. Just the fact that a five-year-old THOROUGHBRED is being fed an inadequate amount of a SENIOR, COMPLETE feed plus hay and grazing shows you they have NO IDEA.
You want to educate yourself on horse nutrition as you don't recognize this MAJOR problem. This is a good site: www.gettyequinenutrition.biz (http://www.gettyequinenutrition.biz) . She lets you know that what you are calling "grain" (in your case it's a complete feed, which means it has all the forage, which means hay, grass, etc., in addition to all else the horse needs; you're not supposed to feed hay or anything else with "complete" feeds) and she calls "concentrates" is really what you need to add to the equine's forage (remember, that's the hay, grass, silage, roughage stuff) to make a complete diet. Neither you or the barn owner/manager/feeder has a CLUE.

[broughton_sporthorses]

My TB is not super ribby, but if he drops weight off the first thing that shoes are his ribs. Has he been wormed lately?

When EI hit Australia last year, I turned all my horses out with limited hard feed (just supplements and enough to keep them going) and my TB got so fat! I couldn't believe it. We put him out into a big grassy hilly-ish paddock, and he just bloomed. Now we keep him in a big grass paddock all the time.

[BornToRide]

When EI hit Australia last year, I turned all my horses out with limited hard feed (just supplements and enough to keep them going) and my TB got so fat! I couldn't believe it. We put him out into a big grassy hilly-ish paddock, and he just bloomed. Now we keep him in a big grass paddock all the time.That just shows you again how well simple nature works - thanks for sharing :)

[Proffie]

I have a 6yo TB that is a hard keeper too. What really helps him is rice bran (about 4 cups per day) and Tri Amino supplement, which is a mix of amino acids and has Lysine in it. That really helps him keep a topline.

[nightsong]

I just moved him to this new place at the end of may. was not ribby when he left the other barn.

May is just last month. A horse losing so much weight so fast?? I'd have the vet out.

[hollyhorse2000]

Talk to your vet.

Discuss treating your horse for ulcers (as well as addressing feeding regime, etc.).

You have changed his environment (one cause) and he is stalled for much of the day (another cause). You can easily test this theory with one tube per day of Ulcergard, obtainable online for about $30 a tube. You don't need an RX. Give him one tube a day for 10 days. If you see him put on weight (and look like he feels better), then you have your answer. The complete treatment is one tube per day for a month, which does get pricey. I personally treated with the 10 days of full tube and then 1/2 tube for another 10 days and then probably four weeks of 1/4 tube before switching to twice-a-day Smartpak Smart Gut.

My mare put on weight after the 10 days and looked fabulous with nothing changed except the Ulcergard. I was floored and felt very guilty, too, that I hadn't picked up on it earlier. she is maintaining her weight with the SmartGut.

Good luck.

[Twigster]

Seriously - nothing helps them stay happy, fat and sane like getting turned out as much as possible.

I couldn't agree more! Turnout has done WONDERS for my 18 yo OTTB physically and mentally. She was ribby and super spooky before I moved her from a stall with limited turnout. We are now saving on board AND I have a very happy horse that has gained to almost a perfect weight, the vet says she looks better than he ever thought possible, and I have more $ to spend on horsey treats (because you didn't actually think I would save it did you? :lol:)

[SecondEdition]

Ive never had him power packed. You should be able to tell if he has worms just by looking at his feces cant you?

With the naked eye? No. He could have a high level of worm larvae in his manure and it would look fine to the naked eye. With a microscope? Maybe. If he has an encysted strongyle infestation, even a fecal exam by your vet probably wouldn't catch it. Quest Plus or PowerPack (ideally) would target those...

But it sounds like you need the vet out to help troubleshoot. And I would worry about your barn's nutrition knowledge...what they are feeding him doesn't inspire a whole lot of confidence in them

[Little Indian]

I had a lot of issues with Bentley and his weight, but have finally (!!) gotten it figured out and he looks fantastic now! I wish I had taken a picture of him today out in the turnout. He looks like a completely different animal. He is getting 1 scoop of Triple Crown Complete, 1 scoop of Manna Super Elite 10 (in the light blue bag with a jumper on it) and two scoops of Forco a day for lunch. He also gets 2 flakes of alfalfa am and pm. He used to be on beet pulp with a weight gainer and never saw a difference in his weight. To be honest, I really only noticed a difference when I added the Forco to his diet. I noticed a weight gain within the week of him starting on it.

[lovemyrobin]

One thing that worked on my OTTB was Ultimate Finish added to his grain AM and PM. He was also on Senior feed and Neighlox. I also used Ultimate Finish to put the weight on my Conn/TB mare when I got her--she was about 200 lbs underweight.