Exercises to fill in those divots on either side of the withers?

[Risk-Averse Rider]

You know the ones... the ones that are starting to fill in on Mr. Blondie.

What exercises are particularly good for building those up?

Thanks.

[BornToRide]

They usually build pretty good on their own with regular work as long as the saddle does fit correctly and allows for that. You could probably speed up the process some by doing more lateral shoulder work.

[buck22]

well, if they're starting to fill in then just keep up the good work! :D Correct riding, imho, and in my own horse who did have significant hollows, his own penchant for stretching (and my subsequent rewarding of it) really worked a miracle and filled in those gaps in short order:
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c54/buck1173/dman2.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c54/buck1173/dman.jpg

*we* do about a dozen of these every morning, as *we* beg for breakfast. :lol: The pictures don't do justice, I have to get better ones, he gets his chest nearly in the dirt and the muscles besides his wither and in the back by his SI just BULGE, its really neat. :D and I love how his hiney looks all up in the air :lol::lol: I squeeze the charmin :lol::lol:

but the downside is he promptly out grew every saddle I owned. So I had to go shopping again ;)

[Risk-Averse Rider]

That's how Mr. Blondie begs!!!!!!!

If he's in cross ties (which he isn't very often), he does that a lot before I put the saddle on. He doesn't get many treats these days, because they make him immediately start cribbing, but I used to reward that stretching all the time.

Mostly when he's being tacked up now, he's tied to the trailer, eating out of the hay bag, and there's not really room for him to stretch. But he still does it once in a while.

[ToesIn]

Did you teach this stretch? If so, how? My Snuffy could really use this one, I think.

[buck22]

oh how great! I don't give treats either.... well, the ooooocassional peppermint under saddle for an exceptional deed :winkgrin:... but otherwise I just *reward* with about a TB of his morning hard feed sprinkled into his pan while he waits for me to prepare breakfast.... so, technically he's not getting anything additional, but he feels special :D

I actually didnt' teach this, I caught him doing it naturally about a year ago after he got curried well. I thought it was cool and praised. Then he did it more and more frequently, and I praised every time. Since moving to the selfcare place I'm at now -- as I don't allow begging or ornery behavior during breakfast -- he got creative and started stretching as a way to earn praise, and hopefully a appetizer ;) clever boy, it worked. :lol: way to train mommy :D

then it got to the point he wouldn't stop stretching, he just wanted handouts all day (like the other buckskin doofus who won't stop spanish walking :no::lol:)... so I had to wean him off the behavior best I could and make it somewhat word oriented. I say "lets see a stretch" and he'll go down... it works about 50% of the time :lol: mostly he has me trained :lol:

It *did* do wonders for his topline though. wonders!

[Risk-Averse Rider]

A couple boarding barns ago, a fellow boarder saw Mr. Blondie doing this and was very concerned. She had recently lost her best-ever horse (also a palomino) to a bad bout of colic - and apparently he stretched like that when he was colicky. She was very cool about it, and didn't want to alarm me, but she let me know about her horse. I don't see any indications that Mr. Blondie does this as a sign of distress, but...

Very sad when she lost her boy.

[buck22]

A couple boarding barns ago, a fellow boarder saw Mr. Blondie doing this and was very concerned. She had recently lost her best-ever horse (also a palomino) to a bad bout of colic - and apparently he stretched like that when he was colicky. She was very cool about it, and didn't want to alarm me, but she let me know about her horse. I don't see any indications that Mr. Blondie does this as a sign of distress, but...

oh how coincidental. when I moved to the place I'm at now, my b/m noticed my horse stretching like this and also thought it to be colic and called me. Very observant. It is mildly alarming to see in an animal you don't know.

I will say, though not a sign of distress when he does it, I am now concerned when he doesn't do it. There have been times, after our ride, that he decides to show off while we're chatting with friends. Then there are other times, I beg him to stretch down after a ride and he doesn't or only goes half heartedly... I wonder about any discomfort over the back? though i can palpate to my hearts delight and never find any reaction from him... :(

[WNT]

One of my favorites is stretchy work on a hill. Working at a walk or trot up a long low to moderately steep hill is one way. Another one is if you are comfortable schooling on the flat in an open field on a hill. It's really nice if there is a little valley between two low hils so you get uphill and downhill work. It is very tiring, so plan for plenty of break time. I've been doing this for about a month, and my horse has already worked out of his saddle I use for when he has lost topline tone and into my wider one.

[Ambrey]

well, if they're starting to fill in then just keep up the good work! :D Correct riding, imho, and in my own horse who did have significant hollows, his own penchant for stretching (and my subsequent rewarding of it) really worked a miracle and filled in those gaps in short order:
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c54/buck1173/dman2.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c54/buck1173/dman.jpg

LOL, I have one that does the cat stretch! He also can scratch the outside of one leg with the opposite hoof- freaks people out when they see that. Just doesn't look like something a horse should do! ;)

As for the OP, I've been taught that correct work really using the back and working on the bit is the best way to fill that in. Can be done longing as well, with side reins, and pushing them forward into the bit with the whip as a cue. Seems to be working for mine (cat stretch/leg crossing boy was having topline issues).

[JB]

I will say, though not a sign of distress when he does it, I am now concerned when he doesn't do it. There have been times, after our ride, that he decides to show off while we're chatting with friends. Then there are other times, I beg him to stretch down after a ride and he doesn't or only goes half heartedly... I wonder about any discomfort over the back? though i can palpate to my hearts delight and never find any reaction from him... :(

Yep, me too with Rio. He loves to do it before a ride, and if he doesn't want to, or only does it half-heartedly, I take note. It requires a good bit of movement over various body parts, so if he can't move some part properly, or it's uncomfortable, I pay attention and see how the ride goes. If he'll stretch after the ride, I know it was just a kink somewhere that the ride worked through.

[rivenoak]

Trotting up the "work hill" in the S Mtn dustbowl. ;)

[Risk-Averse Rider]

We have an approximately 1 mile slightly uphill dirt road in our neighborhood. I used to trot the boys along it back when we were all in shape ;-)

I guess we'll be trotting the 56th St - 64th St section more.

Thanks, all.

[dbadaro]

you can also teach them to bow. i taught my horse to bow and it really helped with his topline!

[Risk-Averse Rider]

you can also teach them to bow. i taught my horse to bow and it really helped with his topline!Interesting.

[mvp]

The wither hollow muscles are primarily the lower trapezius-- originating at near the top of the spinal processes along the wither and joining the scapula, perhaps on the back side (tailward) of the scapular spine.

The problem is that they are seem to do very little mechanical work, perhaps just helping to stabilize the front end of the body during movement. They exist primarily because they were built into horses' ancestors whose shoulders were built differently, and where perhaps they had a larger mechanical function.

So you can, perhaps think of spot training exercises to work these puppies out especially, but it will be tough. I do like the idea of teaching my horse to bow or do Downward Facing Dog. In fact, to my horror, he did choose to do this when he was younger, better muscled there and had a saddle that was too narrow or the wrong shape for him. I was never sure if he was trying to fix some tense muscles near his withers or his lower back.

As horses age, they stop rebuilding the muscle they loose and we see that effect in the thin lower trapezius muscle.

My soundness guru vet had a cool idea: Go get one of those hand held electric stimulator massage things and apply it directly to these dinky, rotting muscles.

I guess this means that if I really loved my horse I'd buy him a vibrator. Silly as it sounds, it might help me fix the problem since he's too stupid and I'm too lazy to teach him yoga.

[monstrpony]

I was never sure if he was trying to fix some tense muscles near his withers or his lower back.


I have one who was pretty muscularly messed up when I first got him, lots of tension across his back and probably some lower back issues. He used to do "downward dog" fairly often. I don't see him do it as often now that he's got some suppleness and freedom in his back muscles.

OTOH, my mini-donkeys have no tension whatsoever in their lives; the only stress on their lower backs is supporting their overgrown mid-sections, and they do downward dog fairly often. Go figure.

[Risk-Averse Rider]

OTOH, my mini-donkeys have no tension whatsoever in their lives; the only stress on their lower backs is supporting their overgrown mid-sections, and they do downward dog fairly often. Go figure.
:lol:

[mvp]

It also depends on how ambitious the animal is. I'll bet the mini-donkeys are smart, self-preserving hedonists. Whatever their "stress" they are willing to think outside the usual Equid box and do yoga if that's what it takes to manage this body type.

[monstrpony]

That may just be *THE BEST* capsule characterization of a mini-donkey that I have ever read! :lol: :lol: :lol:

[katarine]

walk and trot hills long and low...if they are on slack and slinging their heads for momentum, they aren't using their backs properly.

Carrot stretches and downward dogs. My donkey doesn't do any yoga that I know of :)

[Ambrey]

OTOH, my mini-donkeys have no tension whatsoever in their lives; the only stress on their lower backs is supporting their overgrown mid-sections, and they do downward dog fairly often. Go figure.

That explains so much about my cat-stretching pony.