Any Swaybacks Out There? [Archive]

TikiSoo

Jun. 21, 2009, 08:08 AM

Anyone remember the old "Our Gang" series? They had a big white swayback mule whose back looked like an elbow pipe. Buckwheat would sit right in the bend with his legs dangling down which always made me cringe!

When I was a kid, the sight of an old swayback horse in a pasture was a common thing. I rarely see any swaybacks anymore. Is it genetic and been basically "bred out"? Or is it just that I don't see as many horses around in general?

BeaSting

Jun. 21, 2009, 08:47 AM

This is General Lee. He was born with lordosis and it never affected his ability to comfortably carry a rider. I used to take him out on the trail for hours at a time and we competed in many judged trail rides. A good friend of mine got him when she went to look at a horse for sale by an elderly man dispersing his hackline. He refused to sell her the horse she was interested in, and adamantly insisted that Gen was the one that she wanted, to the point of actually loading him in her trailer and telling her that she could come back and pay him ($200) after she rode him for a week. She had incredible fun with him, and later gave him to me, and I had more incredible fun. I can't help but smile every time I think of him.

http://i722.photobucket.com/albums/ww229/BeaSting_Blair/GeneralLee.jpg

I still see the occasional swayback, but usually they're elderly, retired horses or older broodmares.

Rivendellhorses

Jun. 21, 2009, 09:17 AM

i have a boarder that has one. He's a 23 year old ottb gelding. it's sometimes a pain to keep weight on him as he shows it a lot more than a normal horse. And we can't put too much weight on him, b/c of his back. But he's still feisty and does miles of trails on the weekends. (When its not raining...non stop...like it is now...grrr...)

Here's Casee :) http://rivendellhorsefarm.com/caseepage.html

Ajierene

Jun. 21, 2009, 09:29 AM

You have never seen a swayback until you have seen the one at my barn. The owner supposedly rode him in the past and he's always been like this - well, since he apparently broke his back as a two year old and they didn't notice and rode him anyway or some such nonesense.

He is about 15.2HH at the whither, 14.2HH at the middle of his back and 15.2HH at his croup. That's right, he's a U...

I don't know how anyone rode him or especially put a saddle on him! I can't find a good picture now. I may have to take one just to post - it's scary, but he's a sweet guy otherwise.

Probably better available horse care and more knowledge about how horses mature and how to avoid that swayback have decreased the amount of swayback horses.

rabicon

Jun. 21, 2009, 09:34 AM

Here's our old man that we had to put down about 2 years ago. He was 32 years old at the time of this photo

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2875435050103994293uejRQo

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2297178430103994293pspvDn

msj

Jun. 21, 2009, 11:19 AM

Rabicon, your buckskin looks like the old guy I have as a companion to my OTTB. Same color, same dapples, and same sway back. :)

Shadowbrick is 27 and is a long bodied QH to begin with. Now, with a lovely sag due to aging, his back will collect water in a rain storm! :lol: I really have to be careful he doesn't get rain rot. :eek:

I think a lot of horses that do have a long body will be more prone to becoming swaybacked than a short-coupled horse.

I rather imagine that my OTTB will end up the same. It isn't that his withers are particularly high, it's that his back is low and a bit long. He was 7 when I bought him and a bit low in the back then and I've noticed he's getting more so as he ages. He's 17 now and I imagine by the time he gets to be Shadow's age he'll be just as swayed.

I know if Shadow were sound enough to ride, I'd fit between his withers and butt like someone riding a camel with 2 humps! :D

Amwrider

Jun. 21, 2009, 11:22 AM

I have one in my barn also, he is my lesson horse and is an ASB. It is hard to keep him looking in good weight, he can carry a lot of pudge around his tummy but his hips will always seem to poke up more than other horses.

It is seen more prevalently in ASBs and the ASHA is helping to fund research at the University of KY on finding the gene/s responsible for lordosis. Unfortunately it looks like it is several genes acting together so there is no way to establish heridity yet...dominant, recessive, sex-linked....no telling. it also seems to be passed clustered to desireable genes.

Studies ar showing that the swayback is caused by vertebra that are wedge shaped instead of box shaped, and that it does not pinch or deform the spinal cord. The back on a swaybacked horse is just as strong and healthy as that of a normal horse unless it causes kissing spines. The only issue becomes saddle fit.

I have to run an errand but will look for a link to the article when I am back.

Here you go:
http://www.equisearch.com/horses_care/health/anatomy/swaybacks_081205/?imw=Y

eventchic33

Jun. 21, 2009, 11:24 AM

There is a trainer at Charles Town track that runs a very swaybacked TB.

apachepony

Jun. 22, 2009, 03:20 AM

I've seen two serious swaybacks.

One was a mare with a foal. As far as I remember, she was a rescue, but someone along the line had to breed her. :eek: Her back was very similiar to this:
http://www.sherralsequineartstudio.com/Customs/swayback%20horse%20448%20kb.jpg

The other was the WORST i've ever seen (or can imagine). It was an ancient pony mare whose back dipped down to where a normal horse's belly would have been. I was horrified that she had a foal at her side, but I later found out it was an orphan foal she had taken in. Phew. Believe it or not, she was much worse than this horse:
http://www.rockingnranch.com/images/SillyPix/horsefunny.jpg

nightsong

Jun. 22, 2009, 03:39 AM

I remember at least one The Three Stooges episodes with swaybacked horses, including one bay that was a racehorse they had. Speaking of which, there is a horse currently on CANTER with a pretty bad swayback.

http://www.equinestudies.org/ranger_2008/ranger_piece_2008_pdf1.pdf
Here's a link to reasons for a low back.

PicturePerfectPonies

Jun. 22, 2009, 05:02 AM

I had one for a while. He was 7ish if i remember correctly. He had a screw loose mentally. Was given to me to see if i could do anything with him and after a month or so i decided it wasn't worth it to me, i considered him dangerous. If you looked at this horse wrong he had a major melt down. Lucky for him (he was facing euthanasia) a girl in the barn i was working out of at the time had fallen in love with him (when he wasn't being a loon he was very sweet) and i told her if she wanted him she could have him. I visited them about 18 months later and was astounded by his progress. She was riding him, he was calm, quiet, had a brain....it was amazing. She had even done a bunch of exercises and improved his sway quite a bit.

I also attended Midway college in kentucky for a while. They had a big (supposedly) dutch warmblood, that used to show over 4ft fences, and school high level dressage (or so they told us, i can't verify that at all), who was pretty severly sway backed. He was a very well trained horse. He was used consistently at all levels and seemed to enjoy work and never showed signs of pain.

Same barn the first horse I mentioned was at had two schoolies that were sway backed. One was retired (thankfully) but the other was one of the best school horses i've ever had the good fortune of teaching lessons on

ReSomething

Jun. 22, 2009, 09:15 AM

I can remember "Blackie", who was a locally famous horse where I grew up and quite a swayback, retired old guy. Lately I've run across a TB filly born swayback and running right now. I got curious and looked on pedegreequery for photos of her popular sire line and sure enough if you look for it both the first and second sire have a hint of low back. Also I've gotten into saddlebreds and my first ride was a very swaybacked darn near 30 year old, but spry enough to scratch his ear with a hind foot. Saddlebreds do have a higher occurance of the condition.
I don't know if there are fewer lordotic types in general - I mean you can't tell with a saddle and good padding so if the horse isn't out in a pasture or stripped at a show you're not likely to see it.

sisu27

Jun. 22, 2009, 10:20 AM

msj

Jun. 22, 2009, 11:25 AM

Does this count?:

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2879249770103114374rdpZiQ

This is my 12yo thbd. I would say he is long backed and weak loined but not exactly sway backed however others disagree and say he is sway backed.

Would like to see the studies that indicate vertabrae shape as the cause and that it does not inhibit the horses abilities. Interesting.

I wouldn't call him swaybacked YET, but he's built like my OTTB and probably will end up that way by the time he's into his 20's. I would say that as long as you keep riding him regularly to keep his stomach muscles tight, his topline shouldn't change a lot.

Amwrider

Jun. 22, 2009, 08:03 PM

This is my swaybacked ASB, he is the best up/down horse ever born :D and has a home with me for life. He is 23 years young and is navicular but we are managing.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc12/arbordale_photos/COPPER%201986%20Saddlebred%20Lesson%20Horse/Copper3.jpg

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc12/arbordale_photos/COPPER%201986%20Saddlebred%20Lesson%20Horse/1000515_053.jpg

How could you not love this face....
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc12/arbordale_photos/COPPER%201986%20Saddlebred%20Lesson%20Horse/colorfulcopper2.jpg

BeverlyAStrauss

Jun. 22, 2009, 11:41 PM

We have had several swaybacks in the rescue- the proper term is lordosis- three are winning at local horse trials and hunting, you wouldnt know they were sway unless you took the saddles off. Ginny has a Capote filly at the track with the worst sway back I have seen outside of ASBs- she was born that way, the mare is normal and all of her other foals have been normal. She can run a bit and is a great ride. Biggest problem is saddle fitting. The least of your worries is falling off if they quit at a fence ;-)

There was a great article in Equus years ago about it. These horses seem to be able to do anything that normal backed horses can do.

Spooks

Jun. 23, 2009, 12:27 PM

caradino

Jun. 23, 2009, 12:34 PM

rainechyldes

Jun. 23, 2009, 12:39 PM

We have one. It's been a slowly developing swayback, so I tend to think it's age, rather then true lordosis(sp?), as he is 19 this year. He is still in full competition, we spend time working on keeping his topline as solid as we can. Doesn't appear to bother him so far, but it's still a mild case, our vet hasn't been concerned over him so far.

seamusdarcy

Jun. 25, 2009, 08:18 AM

I have a slightly swayback draft X that I ride. Has anyone who rides a swayback horse ever tried a swayback pad. Cashel has one that is thin on both ends and thicker in the middle. It costs over $100 and I was wondering if it would help. Any ideas?

ReSomething

Jun. 25, 2009, 09:38 AM

Yes, the swayback saddlebred is ridden with a special pad but I have never looked for a brand name. He is used in WT lessons and gets along OK. The gaited shops like National Bridle carry a selection of padding.

Chardavej

Jun. 25, 2009, 10:12 AM

I have one. Mine is a 12 y/o OTTB with lordosis (the congenital kind, not the age-related sagging kind). There is absolutely nothing wrong with him - it just looks a little funny and saddle fit is tricky. He can do, and has done, everything a horse with a normally curved spine can do. He has no problems related to his back whatsoever. He raced, I show him all summer in the hunters and eq., and he is a great trail horse. This is what he looks like naked:

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f87/harderea/Picture008.jpg

This is what he looks like jumping:

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f87/harderea/_MG_0256-ok.jpg

GORGEOUS!!!! Love him!! Does he have white at the top of his tail?

This is my swaybacked ASB, he is the best up/down horse ever born and has a home with me for life. He is 23 years young and is navicular but we are managing.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/c...se/Copper3.jpg

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/c...000515_053.jpg

How could you not love this face....
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/c...fulcopper2.jpg

Oh what a sweet boy! I love him too!! I will take both of them please, drop them off in my pasture anytime!

qhwpmare

Sep. 20, 2009, 07:12 PM

There is a sway back OTTB at my barn.The owner got him as a 5 year old and he was always swayed. He will lay down when ridden and when being tacked up.I say he is dangerous and will eventually hurt someone. He is very seldom ridden...pretty much a paddock puff.Lucky for him!!

Amwrider

Sep. 20, 2009, 07:25 PM

They should get him checked out for kissing spines. It can be quite painful for horses that have them.

Bluey

Sep. 20, 2009, 07:28 PM

Our stable in the early 1970s had a swayback open jumper.
We used a western hospital pad, a regular fleecy thick English pad and his Stubben and he was fine to ride.

He had come from Ireland as a steeplechaser and then moved on to jumper and we assume he was born like that.
He also was the soundest horse we had, in a barn of very sound horses.

My main ranch horse is slightly swaybacked, has always been like that.
We don't use any special pads, since all my saddles seem to have fit him well, better than they have fit horses with fatty, mutton withers and full shoulders:

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a298/Robintoo/Horses2-20-07168.jpg?t=1253489079

He is 19 this year and bred from running quarter horse stock, so some TB in him back there.
He is also extremely sound and has always been.
I would not pass up a sound horse just because some swayback, if he fits you.

jeano

Sep. 20, 2009, 07:37 PM

This is a really interesting thread--my neighbor has several swaybacked horses, one an elderly gelding, one elderly broodmare, and her riding horse, a ten year old mare. The ten year old has a very long back. The elderly brood mare is fat and the ten year old is very fat. None of these horses gets much exercise and they get all the short sweet grass they can cram in their faces, out 24/7, and supplemental feed also. They get hay all winter and generally stay fat all year long. (As do my two, but my guys have what I consider to be normal backs.)

Neighbor is having connipitions about saddle fit. Horse is very wide (did I mention she's fat??) but every saddle pinches behind her withers and leaves dry spots. Neighbor thinks a parelli saddle will fix everything, oops, dont want to derail this thread. There are occasional bucking issues that may well be related to saddle problems. I have thought all along this is a problem that may not have occured if the horse was fed less and ridden more (there's a big sagging belly to go with the long sagging back. Doesnt look like pics on this thread of some very fit looking horse with some swayed toplines.)

Once brought a more or less normal looking western saddle (used) home from the local feed store to try--put it on my horse, did a double take--underside of this saddle had been completely re-worked to accomodate a VERY swaybacked horse. Think of it being built up with layers of padding to fit in the U. Darnedest thing I ever saw. I didnt buy it. But it might have helped the neighbor's horse......

Thousands of years ago saw a young foal with a horrendous dip in its back--there had been talk of putting it down at birth but its people decide to wait and see. I wonder if a back like that can self-correct to any degree?

suze

Sep. 20, 2009, 10:09 PM

There's one here that belongs to a boarder. Pretty bad but not as bad as those two posted
by apachepony. She's lame on all four, but don't know if it's related to her back or not. She belongs to one of those boarders we avoid like the plague.

DressageFancy

Sep. 20, 2009, 10:57 PM

Do any of you remember the episode where Mr. Ed had a friend who was embarrssed because he was swaybacked? He and Wilber tried an inflatable saddle pad and I can't remember all the rest of the nonsence they tried.

Bugs-n-Frodo

Sep. 20, 2009, 11:33 PM

My mare's back dropped with age. She was long in the back and weak in the loin. When I worked her, we CONSTANTLY did exercises to strengthen her back. She was a trooper, was retired from racing, did hunters, and dressage up to first level, had a baby and has been a great girl. I do not have recent pics of her back, but she started to drop after she was retired and had Frodo. She is a pasture puff now, so, no worries.

Whoanellie

Sep. 21, 2009, 02:07 AM

Pilgrim (http://www.tierrescue.org/Pilgrim.htm) was rescued from a feedlot in 1999. He's been with us for 10 yrs. He doesn't have a sway back though. His spinal issue is that he has an upward curve combined with an "S" curve. Due to this, he is unrideable. It was thought that as he matured he would be able to drive. Unfortunately, as time went on the spinal deformity was such that driving would cause him to be very uncomfortable.

The deformity does not hamper his gait and he moves nicely. No problems rolling or getting up. The only thing that he cannot do as well as other horses is rear up. Which is fine with me! He can rear a bit when playing with other horses, but his front end doesn't come up off the ground very high.

Although he is a character and very opinionated, he's never had anyone interested in adopting him.

Farecentro

Sep. 21, 2009, 05:43 AM

We had a Welsh Cob foal with Lordosis born at a local farm. I wish I could find the photos as it was the worst case I've seen. It became apparent at around 8 weeks and got steadily worse. He was given a few years out in the field to see if it stabilised at all however he was eventually PTS on the vets advice as it was so extreme. Neither the mare or the stallion had ever produced a foal with this condition before and were not crossed again.