Denny and the "10,000 hours"

[merrygoround]

What a great article. I'll leave it to you technologically talented ones to put it up on the forum.

Makes a "Chronicle" subscription pay for itself :yes:

[lizathenag]

that is why one subscribes. . .to read those articles.

I think I might have the 10,000 but some of it was logged in a western saddles moving cattle around the Colorado mountains for several summers in the 70s.

and quite a few were spent hacking the 5 miles to and from our Pony Club meetings in the 60s.

[metzengerstein]

COTH has kindly made denny's column available to non-subscribers.

Thank you!

"The 10,000-Hour Club: Are You a Member?" (http://www.chronofhorse.com/index.php?cat=23007043187207&ShowArticle_ID=1331706091419217)

[XenophonKnows]

At age 38 I put myself in the 27000 hour club.

[whicker]

The hard part of the 10, 000 hours is staying sound yourself to use the knowledge on the horse that you finally mostly understand how to ride. And can afford the lessons from a master with 40,000 hours...:lol:

[Sandy M]

I didn't ride almost every day when I was in high school - just once a week lessons, and occasional begged or borrowed rides, but he says if you are 22, it would take until you're 50. Well..... I bought my first horse when I was 24, and I'll be 64 in July. I think I've probably logged the 10K by now. LOL

[Christa P]

I can honestly say I am WAY past 10,000 hours, probably over 20,000 - I started riding when I was 2 or 3, was completely independent riding the ponies by 5 and I am 40 now. I have had horse all those years trying a variety of disciplines, but mostly dressage and trail riding with some eventing and H/J when I have had appropriate horses.

In my time I have gotten very good at bringing horses along from scratch, fixing problems, and putting on solid flatwork. I can school most upper level dressage movements, though I have not competed at a high level. As for jumping, I have not had the horses to jump seriously on a regular basis but I have no problem bringing them along to the ~3' level or Novice eventing.

I also drive - singles and pairs.

Christa

[Ajierene]

Not to pick on Christa P, but I laugh every time someone says 'I have been riding all my life, since I was one, etc'. Until you are physically and cognitively able to comprehend the mechanics of riding, you are going for a ride. The only thing I can think of someone that young learning is balance.

A friend did some research and I tend to agree with her that you cannot really start learning how to ride until about the age of 8 (individuals will vary, that's a given).

So, anyone logging hours, should probably start at the age of 8 and see how long they have been riding.

What I don't think Denny or many of the 10,000 hour advocates really think about is type. My step-sister and I started taking lessons at the same time. Both rode once a week in the winter and more in the summer (she leased, I worked to ride). She rode at a farm in Delaware where lesson horses were required to be dead broke. I rode at a farm in New Jersey where horses were routinely taken straight from the track (that's right, no 'letting down' time) and put into the lesson program. Many half broke/half sane or otherwise less than perfect horses were ridden by me.

By the time I got to college and moved to Delaware to go to the University, our riding was vastly different. A buck would unseat my step-sister and I would just sit up and drive the horse forward. I was far from the best, but still much better than my sister, who had essentially logged the same amount of hours. My sister is one of many examples of people putting a lot of hours in the saddle but not really becoming better riders because of it. Nothing wrong with it, just an observation.

I also believe that owning a horse should add hours that you need. I have noticed this with myself and saw it with my sister. Her mom had bought her a horse during my senior year of high school. So while I was riding different horses, different personalities and levels of difficulty, she was riding one. I noticed recently that since in the last few years I have really only ridden my mare, my riding has not 'improved' per se because I was no longer getting the experience of different rides.

So while I agree in part with the '10,000 hour' concept, I believe being a good rider goes much deeper than that.

[Ambrey]

So while I agree in part with the '10,000 hour' concept, I believe being a good rider goes much deeper than that.

Because learning involves more than time. Aptitude, motivation, quality of instruction, attention... and 100 other factors all come into play.

But I think it's a valid point, that time is one of the factors that you just can't avoid. Not the only factor, but without it you don't get far.

[woodcat]

10 years of experience? Or one year's experience 10 times.

[rainechyldes]

Neat article.



I began riding at 8/9 ish, bareback - you know the usual all around the countryside, etc. Just usual horse crazy kid bombing around stuff.
By the time I was 16, I was still doing the same, could jump pretty much anything in the bush, go over it/through it, etc (yes I did get caught jumping cattle guards bareback on my mare (this was a very painful day when my father found out) I think my mare's gaurdian angel worked overtime. I pretty much rode several hours after school all year round, plus all day sat & sunday (8 hours or so easy in the summer) we covered many many miles.

When I was 16ish
I got my 1st saddle, and woo got my very 1st riding lesson. (aka I got a job:))
Makes me think of what my very first instructor said to me.

She eyed me up as I'm trotting around the ring in my new saddle, which I still trying to figure out how it work.(had never posted in my life) And said.

You ride like an eventer.

Say what?

I've never shown, ever ridden in a saddle, nada. Had been me and my horse and my one bridle for years.
I always wondered why she thought I had evented.

Neddless to say, once I got the basics of the saddle organized, I took to that fancy jumping pretty easy, and rode jumpers for years in competition

[Christa P]

Not to pick on Christa P, but I laugh every time someone says 'I have been riding all my life, since I was one, etc'. Until you are physically and cognitively able to comprehend the mechanics of riding, you are going for a ride. The only thing I can think of someone that young learning is balance.
.

Actually my parents owned a boarding barn and were very involved in the horse buisness. They got my brother and I a pony when I was 2 and by the time I was 5 I was able ride the pony on my own, as in unsupervised (and possibly saddle and bridle - I don't remember exactly when that started) and I frequently did - WTC and jumping, even trail riding by 6 or 7. I know it is not common, but for kids that basicly grow up in the barn it is possible.

Christa

[eyedoc]

Actually my parents owned a boarding barn and were very involved in the horse buisness. They got my brother and I a pony when I was 2 and by the time I was 5 I was able ride the pony on my own, as in unsupervised (and possibly saddle and bridle - I don't remember exactly when that started) and I frequently did - WTC and jumping, even trail riding by 6 or 7. I know it is not common, but for kids that basicly grow up in the barn it is possible.

Christa

I agree. The article states that the 10,000 hours is not advanced movements. Thus, even if the child only learns to balance on a horse at an early age and can hang on for a lead-line class they are ahead of the 8 year old who sits on a horse for the first time. Also factor into this the comfort level with horses, etc. These two riders could easily surpass one another later, but there is an advantage from the get-go if one logs hours in the saddle...even at a young age.

[Bats79]

I've been in the horse training and breeding business for 37 years - don't have any other life although I'm doing more teaching than riding now.

I think my clock might be in reverse. :)

[Vesper Sparrow]

I don't have a hope in h*ll of racking up 10,000 hours since I rode intermittently as a kid (although some of it was the riding bareback and jumping logs in the woods variety) and only started back at the age of 51. With a four year old, though, maybe I'll be getting double points for a while.

But the kids in my eventing barn are well on their way. At our BO's insistence, they hack out, ride green and/or difficult horses (including just OTTBs), ride bareback, etc., etc. I've noticed that when they do get a horse with half-decent gaits, they do very, very well in the local dressage shows.

[grayarabpony]

Not to pick on Christa P, but I laugh every time someone says 'I have been riding all my life, since I was one, etc'. Until you are physically and cognitively able to comprehend the mechanics of riding, you are going for a ride. The only thing I can think of someone that young learning is balance.


Which is extraordinarily valuable, and what most people struggle with.

[butlerfamilyzoo]

I dont agree with the "not really riding until 8" as i have known lots of younger kids riding on their own, not being led, not on total push button ponies... I knew a 6yr old that was a better h/j rider than most in their teens. I also knew another 6yr old who ran barrels, started at 4... Won buckles every go out and was by FAR not on a pushbutton horse, you couldnt have paid me to get on that psycho thing... :) That girl had some balls of steel.

I think kids raised in a barn get the opportunity to log those "real riding" hours WAY sooner than say the 8yr old that takes lessons once a week... I went trail riding with a kid a few weeks ago that was 7 who's 5yr old gelding was being a pig the whole ride, he handled him beautifully. It makes a huge difference if you are plopped on the babysitter pony before you can walk and work your way up on a daily basis... :)

[2ndyrgal]

I was put on a horse in my earliest memories, you DO learn balance, and the instinctive reactions to changes in balance that you need to compensate for (or you fall off). Rode bareback as soon as we could get the ponies to stand next to something so we could grab a fistfull of mane and clamber on. Rode around the neighborhood, a dead end dirt road with several large farms, woods, hills, you name it, like wild indians. Invaluable experience from the time we were about 7 til we were 14. Rode every day from 14 to 20 for 2-3 hours a day, anything we could throw a leg over, jumped anything that didn't move, and our trainer was schooled in classical dressage and show jumping. Fast forward over the next 20 years I spent at a harness horse track, which will make you learn how a horse moves and where his body language and feet are. His attitude and well being. Thousands of things you can't teach. Only able to afford spoiled or crazy for years, you do get what I call a "recipe book" of things that enable you do deal with or prevent certain behaviors or events. You might be 17 and fit as hell, but my 48 year old carrying and extra 20 pounds, desk driving self will take you to school when it counts, your horse stumbles and stops on his way to that xc fence, off you come, my horse does the same thing, and I'm sitting up and helping him back on his feet. You can't catch Dobbin in the field or load him on a trailer or clip his ears, I have very little problem. It's not the age, it's the miles. It's making a study of The Horse, of every breed, shape, size and discipline, over a lifetime. It's why people like Denny have evented, foxhunted, riden in Endurance competitions, probably driven and maybe farmed with horses. It's a lifetime with the species, and I'd bet my hat there isn't anything with hair on it that he and JW and co, can't ride better than al the young guns. I'm not sure how many hours I've got, but I'm pretty sure it's more than 10K.
I'm still learning. Still logging the time. Well spent.
The old saying was that shooting pool well and riding well were signs of a misspent youth.
Guilty as charged.

[TheHorseProblem]

Thanks, MerryGR, for posting this. I sent the link to all my struggling rider friends, and we're all giving ourselves huge pats on the back for continuing to pursue this sport, even in the face of heartbreak and injury.

Oh, and I get to keep the book.:winkgrin:

[slc2]

I do agree with the 'no real riding til 8', in fact, a trainer I worked with, fei, long listed, developing horse list, selected to work at gladstone, despite having extremely ambitious plans for her children, wouldn't even allow her children to take lessons til they were seven. DId not believe in having them do anything much more than be led around on a pony and goof around on their own with a safe, old pony, til then.

And no, actually, I've never seen a six year old that rode that well. They are immature, mentally, physically, neurologically - always. Their body proportions and even their strength and balance are just not there. I think they're far better off taking swimming and early gymnastics, actually...and I don't think any riding they do til 7 or 8 should be so all fired ambitious.

And I think most people have pretty romantic ideas about the riding they did when they were young children. And I don't think it has that much value. All sorts of 'natural' looking little riders just aren't interested in working that hard, or accepting instruction, which I think is more important than any sort of 'natural ability'.

I think it is good if the very early riding whets their appetite for more, and gives them a familiarity and ease with horses.

I think the amount of instruction and riding and competing they do from 8-12 or so is pretty much that, familiarity, love of riding. After that I think it becomes all about how much instruction they get from 12 to 18, and how good a quality that instruction is.

[merrygoround]

Thanks, MerryGR, for posting this. I sent the link to all my struggling rider friends, and we're all giving ourselves huge pats on the back for continuing to pursue this sport, even in the face of heartbreak and injury.



Oh, and I get to keep the book.:winkgrin:

Good work persevering, as a member of the "no longer shatterproof group" I say "Ride on!"

Ha! What foolish friends you have, allowing you to keep that book. :D

[Eclectic Horseman]

That's the long version.

An old friend use to say after a certain point it was all about "TITS." (Time in the Saddle.) :lol::lol: