Interesting ideas about the future of dressage

[andy.smaga]

I'm not specialized in the Art of dressage, but I thought this could be interesting to have COTH forumites opinion.
http://www.philippe-karl.com/703

[slc2]

Not a fan, but he sure will get a lot of press by touching some nerves.

[siegi b.]

No wonder the FN ignored his letter....

[merrygoround]

Like others, he has some points.

We are becoming a very erudite BB :lol: what with quotes from Jessica, Deb Bennet, and now this. ;)

[cu.at.x]

What is so outrageous about this?

1. Auxiliary reins connected to the bit are forbidden, whether on the longe or under saddle. The longe should always be attached to a cavesson.

2. Tight nosebands are forbidden, both in daily training and competition. (In addition, it is permissable to present a horse without a noseband.)

3. The horse's mouth must be checked immediately prior to every test or performance. Any injury leads to disqualification.

4. Any horse showing injury from spurs to be disqualified.

5. Overflexion (nose behind the vertical) in any movement to be punished with a mark of at most 3.

6. Blocked jaws, tongues pulled up or hanging out and grinding of the teeth in any exercise to be punished with a mark of at most 4.

7. Neck extension (long position in which the mane is nearly horizontal, the nose keeping in front of the vertical) becomes a part of every dressage test, in all three gaits and on both reins.

8. The walk is reinstated as a fully-fledged part of each dressage test, representing up to 30% of total marks possible, at least in tests on E, A, L and M level.
The lateralisation of the walk (horse comes close to ambling) leads to disqualification.

9. In tests for young horses as well as auctions, the young horses must be presented in neck extension in all three gaits, with the rider rising to the trot.

[freestyle2music]

What is so outrageous about this?

OK I bite. But I don't have many time and intention to answer
all this nonsens.

2. Tight nosebands are forbidden, both in daily training and competition. (In addition, it is permissable to present a horse without a noseband.)

What nosebands high nosebands, medium nosebands, low nosebands.
And what happens when you losen the noseband of your horse :confused:
Could it be that it starts a live of it's own, with blisters for the horse as a result.

[class]

What is so outrageous about this?

1. Auxiliary reins connected to the bit are forbidden, whether on the longe or under saddle. The longe should always be attached to a cavesson.

what's so wrong with sidereins?

2. Tight nosebands are forbidden, both in daily training and competition. (In addition, it is permissable to present a horse without a noseband.)

how should the FN monitor every member's daily training sessions to enforce this rule?

3. The horse's mouth must be checked immediately prior to every test or performance. Any injury leads to disqualification.

doesn't this already happen?

4. Any horse showing injury from spurs to be disqualified.

doesn't this already happen?

5. Overflexion (nose behind the vertical) in any movement to be punished with a mark of at most 3.

why is losing balance and going behind the vertical so much worse than losing balance and going above the verticle?

6. Blocked jaws, tongues pulled up or hanging out and grinding of the teeth in any exercise to be punished with a mark of at most 4.

would the grinding/tongue hanging have to happen for the entirety of the exercise to earn a 4 or just for one step? what's a blocked jaw?

7. Neck extension (long position in which the mane is nearly horizontal, the nose keeping in front of the vertical) becomes a part of every dressage test, in all three gaits and on both reins.

i guess this is okay, if it doesn't add significantly to the length of the overall test.

8. The walk is reinstated as a fully-fledged part of each dressage test, representing up to 30% of total marks possible, at least in tests on E, A, L and M level.
The lateralisation of the walk (horse comes close to ambling) leads to disqualification.

again, i guess this is okay, if it doesn't add significantly to the length of the overall test. i'm not sure how it would help or change anything. it's easier to do lateral work at the walk than at the trot or canter.

9. In tests for young horses as well as auctions, the young horses must be presented in neck extension in all three gaits, with the rider rising to the trot.

as a test of balance or connection or what? i'm not sure how many young horses can maintain a canter with their neck flat and their nose out, or why we would want them to.

[Coppers mom]

What is so outrageous about this?

I didn't think that there was much that was outrageous either. All he's really suggesting is a standard for penalties that really should be given anyways. What's wrong with testing that he horse is actually able to stretch, and not hiding behind the bit? What's wrong with making sure the rider hasn't abused the bit or spurs? Nothing, in my humble opinion.

[meupatdoes]

8. The walk is reinstated as a fully-fledged part of each dressage test, representing up to 30% of total marks possible, at least in tests on E, A, L and M level.
The lateralisation of the walk (horse comes close to ambling) leads to disqualification.

again, i guess this is okay, if it doesn't add significantly to the length of the overall test. i'm not sure how it would help or change anything. it's easier to do lateral work at the walk than at the trot or canter.


I don't think they are talking about doing lateral work i.e. half pass/travers/renvers at the walk.

I think they are talking about a lateral walk, where the four beat quality of the horse's walk has been detrimentally affected by incorrect training.

The walk is the easiest gait to eff up, and the hardest to improve, so it provides a good barometer of the horse's overall training.

You can't fake the walk.

[class]

I don't think they are talking about doing lateral work i.e. half pass/travers/renvers at the walk.

I think they are talking about a lateral walk, where the four beat quality of the horse's walk has been detrimentally affected by incorrect training.

The walk is the easiest gait to eff up, and the hardest to improve, so it provides a good barometer of the horse's overall training.

You can't fake the walk.

i agree and i agree. the walk is already shown and judged in every test. how much more walk could be added to the tests? and i wasn't confused about a lateral walk vs. lateral movements at the walk, i guess if you're not going to have any lateral work at the walk then you would just include walking around in circles or straight lines, which is even easier still?

[meupatdoes]

i agree and i agree. the walk is already shown and judged in every test. how much more walk could be added to the tests? and i wasn't confused about a lateral walk vs. lateral movements at the walk, i guess if you're not going to have any lateral work at the walk then you would just include walking around in circles or straight lines, which is even easier still?

They are not suggesting "not having any lateral work at the walk."

They are suggesting disqualifying a horse who demonstrates a lateral (as in two beat) walk.

[class]

again, i understand that.

i am saying, what is the difference between judging 1 minute of walk or 3 minutes of walk? or 10 minutes of walk? if the walk is going to be 30% of the test, i think it will make the tests easier than they are now. like i originally said, any work at the walk is easier to do than work at the impulse gaits. so i don't see the point.

[meupatdoes]

again, i understand that.

i am saying, what is the difference between judging 1 minute of walk or 3 minutes of walk? or 10 minutes of walk? if the walk is going to be 30% of the test, i think it will make the tests easier than they are now. like i originally said, any work at the walk is easier to do than work at the impulse gaits. so i don't see the point.

Oh, now I see what you are saying.

I would think that rather than making the tests longer, they could just use a bigger coefficient.

[mbm]

again, i understand that.

i am saying, what is the difference between judging 1 minute of walk or 3 minutes of walk? or 10 minutes of walk? if the walk is going to be 30% of the test, i think it will make the tests easier than they are now. like i originally said, any work at the walk is easier to do than work at the impulse gaits. so i don't see the point.

well, as far as i understand the walk is the hardest of all "movements" to get a good score once you are at higher levels.... ie: collected walk is a very very difficult movement - which is why you rarely see it done well -

and as has been written by many the walk is the barometer of all work. hence the idea that it should be a higher percentage of the score.

i am guessing that what is being suggested would be more walk throughout the test.... and maybe the rocker added back in etc.

[angel]

A good walk at the higher levels is not often seen because the friggin' reins are too short, and the rider is trying to collect with the hands instead of the seat. The lack of being able to collect the walk with the seat then is followed by impure piaffes...again, too much hand, no seat.

We should bring the rocker back in the higher levels, as well as designating a particular pair of legs with which to begin the trot from halt in the lower levels. We should penalize a rider who rides the majority of the time with the curb bit engaged. We should penalize tight nosebands.