Opinions on price of event horse

[event1]

I saw a horse over the weekend at a horse trial that I am potentially interested in purchasing. I am not sure what to make of the price and I wanted some opinions-this BB always seems to offer helpful opinions. The horse is a 7 year old draft cross mare (1/4 clyde 3/4 TB believed) that is 16.2 hands, well put together (not too drafty), a lovely mover in all three gaits and a nice, green but brave jumper with super tight knees (she had one rail in stadium). She was competing at her very first competition ever (a USEA santioned show to boot!) and finished 12th (I think). Trotted most of her fences in stadium due to lack of experience but was certainly game and was generally unfazed by the whole experience. She was in the BN division. The price of the horse is 18K. I have not priced many draft crosses and I really like her...but the general concences amongst my buddies is that that is too high-what do you all think? Thanks in advance for your imput!

[deltawave]

That is thousands more than I paid for a going, amateur-proof CCI* horse! :eek:

I'd expect almost any sane, reasonably well-schooled horse to go around a BN HT, trotting a lot of the jumps, without necessarily thinking it's a five-figure animal. I wouldn't even look at a horse with bad conformation. And I'm guessing with a 12th place finish her dressage can't have been THAT great--not that you'd make a decision based on the placing, but I guess what I'm asking is what is it about her that makes a) the seller or b) you, the buyer think she's worth that much money? What's she been doing for 7 years that makes her so valuable? That is a VERY high price, if you ask me.

[Mary in Area 1]

For comparison purposes, we have a similar horse for sale, but has gotten ribbons every time out this year at BN, totally sane and safe, only 6 years old and asking 12K.

Yours sounds overpriced to me unless her movement and jumping are exceptional.

[IrishDeclan]

I don't pretend to be a horse pricing expert, but $18,000 seems really high for what you described. I could see maybe paying that much for a super well bred young prospect who was consistently placing and winning at BN. Although these days you could find a really nice experienced Prelim packer type for that, so why not go that route?

[event1]

Thanks for your responses so far...! Deltawave, her confirmation is really very nice...I am not sure why you think it is bad..? Thanks for your imput! I am considering buying a horse that has done much more and I am aware that there are some really nice horse/deal out there right now-she just struck my fancy and I have taken a young horse up through the upper levels before-except back in 1985-that horse was 5K and that was alot of money! She is just another option and gathering opinions about her price is hopefully going to help me decide what I really think I should do. I appreciate everyones two cents!

[ThirdCharm]

Holy mercy that sucker better come with a golden ticket to the 2012 Olympics stapled to its forehead.

Around here that would be worth about $5K, unless maybe a family member has done a CCI****?

Jennifer

[lstevenson]

I agree with the others, the horse sounds way overpriced. Age 7 is too old to be that green and still expect top dollar, and with being a draft cross the horse should definitely be under 10K IMO.

[SevenDogs]

I agree -- VERY overpriced.

[Sku]

I definitely agree with everyone else - way overpriced. I've been looking at horses on Dreamhorse lately, and without being too specific (I'm definitely not selling) I've found a 12 yr 16h 3'-3'6' mare with changes and show experience for $12,000, a 7yr old packer with experience in BN and training for $10,000, and a 6yr old warmblood with experience in Novice for $8,500. And this is just in my general area and out of the first 10 or so ads that popped up.

$18,000 is completely unreasonable for a horse with no show experience, that is still trotting fences in stadium. The 12 yr old 3'-3'6 mare I mentioned has a long show record of placing in the top 4 in A circuit classes, yet she's only $12,000.

I would definitely continue to look around. In this economy, you can find some absolute steals. As someone mentioned, for $18,000 you can easily get a prelim packer. It makes me wish I was in a place to buy a horse right now, because I've seen some absolutely incredible deals.

[luise]

She should be more like $5K. I recently bought a horse, and for that price you can get a very nice, safe, novice/training horse in that age range. I would pass.

[AKB]

Where we are, in Northern Virginia, I know several 4 and 5 year olds who have sold for about $20,000, with similar levels of training. My concern with the price on your horse is that he is a 7 year old with the education of a 4 or 5 year old. I would wonder if he has been hard to get started or if the owners are not too organized. This would make me check the horse out very thoroughly before buying and offer a lower price.

[pegasusmom]

I am with Mary in Area 1 - we also have a similiar beasty for sale, consistently in the ribbons or wins at BN, Novice and now Training, priced much lower.

[yellowbritches]

High in my book, too (especially considering it is a buyer's market right now!). If I had her, she'd be in the 5k-10k range, depending on just how nice she was and what her brain was like. 18k for me is a very nice, young (4-6), good moving, good jumping TB or TB type that can put three good phases together, preferably placing well up the order after dressage.

Before we took my very nice TB off the market for me to keep, he was priced at 15k (and we were negotiable). He was 4, had done a couple of novice events. He had ok dressage (not winning, but he'd finish in the ribbons), good show jumping, and clear, no fuss xc. He is has an ok trot and a stellar canter and is scopey as hell. We were marketing him as an upper level type prospect, but his good brain enabled us to market him to amatuers and YRs, too. We obviously had him marketed and priced right, as we got lots of interest...he just routinely acted like an ass when people came to try him! He liked me too much...

[EventMore]

Has she hunted? I have done a (very) little business in the hunting world, and here in New England hunt people sometimes pay $20-25K for safe, attractive, young hunt horses. Seems very high to me, but safety and the right look are important to many of the weekend warriors who hunt. Horses are worth whatever people will pay for them.

If you want her, offer what she is worth to you. The worst the sellers can say is no. You don't have to like the sellers or respect them for their pricing - you just have to like the horse. :)

[rabicon]

WOW, I know of a hano/qh right now in my area that is about 8 going Novice and in the ribbons for 15K obo. Also know of some other very nice TBX going higher with great dressage scores (high 60's) going about 20-25K. I'd keep looking, that is really high for that horse.

[deltawave]

Since you never posted pictures (at least none that I saw) my comments on conformation were simply to point out that "good conformation" is a no-brainer for me, not exactly a "plus". In other words, it's a mandatory thing, not something to pay extra for. :) A horse with bad conformation is worth nothing to me, basically.

[Speedy]

I would never in a million years pay that much for a 7 year old that has just completed its first HT (and ended up 12th to boot). If I were buying something at that age, it would have to be a going, proven event horse for the price.

If the horse caught your eye, though, and you have a really good feeling about it, you can't discount that. You might think about talking to the seller and floating the idea of making a substantially lower offer. The seller may be open to it in this market, you never know unless you ask.

[IrishWillow]

I have a lovely, sound, good minded horse that is a 1/4th draft. She has a similar level of training (abeit, just turned 4 May 15 of this year), and I'll probably price her at $10k when I put her on the market. She is quiet, a very nice mover, and has a fancy jump. Plus, is very sensible and easy to deal with. I agree with another poster, if the mare has foxhunted, she could go for much more. I'm in Tx, and good young hunt prospects (read: SAFE to hunt on) easily go for $10-$15k.

[Jazzy Lady]

For that price, I'd be looking at a 7 year old either winning EVERYTHING at Novice with an ammy that has potential for at least prelim, or solidly going training level. Maybe not winning the dressage yet...

[basil's mom]

I agree with every one that the price is high. That said I have a 5yo draft cross going training level and winning. Stunning mover and jumper. Since everything I own is for sale, and I am constantly asked about him. I have him priced WAY to high ($25,000) just so I can keep him, and not have to deal with trial rides. The owner of the horse you are intrested in may be in the same boat.

[Donkey]

Where we are, in Northern Virginia, I know several 4 and 5 year olds who have sold for about $20,000, with similar levels of training. My concern with the price on your horse is that he is a 7 year old with the education of a 4 or 5 year old. I would wonder if he has been hard to get started or if the owners are not too organized. This would make me check the horse out very thoroughly before buying and offer a lower price.

I agree. If she was 4 or 5 I could agree to the price, she's young and has "potential"

As a 7 year old I would think she needs more miles before I'd shell out that amount. I'd be very wary as to why she was started so late.

[JER]

I agree. If she was 4 or 5 I could agree to the price, she's young and has "potential"

As a 7 year old I would think she needs more miles before I'd shell out that amount. I'd be very wary as to why she was started so late.

While I agree that $18K is a considerable asking price, there are some legit reasons for pricing a horse like this.

7 is young. If the horse has good fundamentals, they'll move up quickly. My current mare did her first HT at 6.5; at 7, she's doing well at Prelim. My old horse started eventing at 13 (he was a fieldhunter) and was still fine at Prelim at 19.

What else has this horse been doing? Like someone else said, if it's been out hunting and performs well there, the price is not unusual. If the horse would make a suitable show hunter or AA jumper horse, then the price is not high at all.

If the horse has been hunting or spending time in the show ring or being training by a pro, the owner has a considerable amount of money into the horse.

But you can always make an offer.

[Lincoln]

It always seems like prices are way too high when you're looking and way too low when you're selling.

I've been looking for what seems like forever (I'm in New England) and have yet to find the "right" horse to ease the transition from DQ to eventer. (Needs decent enough gaits and brain for dressage to enjoy riding it every day but safe enough to pack my clueless tail around jumping.) I gave up and bought a baby OTTB, and compete on various borrowed horses. I would dearly love some sort of TB or TBx that I could own and go and do with but haven't found it yet. In that same category we're talking about here - safe at N and maybe T but not going to go Prelim.

I'd say that if you've found the "right" horse, bend heaven and earth to make it happen. You are paying way too much money whatever you pay - since as others have said the horse is worth what you're willing to pay for it. There is a lot of chemistry in this stuff. Also a lot of projection and dreaming that happens when you first meet, so make sure the horse really is right, not an idea of right. At the end of the day, the operating costs dwarf the cash outlay, and if it's the right horse who's counting except you if you paid a little too much. If it's the wrong one, however, be prepared to take a bath pretty much no matter what you paid!

[Bogie]

Yes, it seems high. But as others have said, maybe there is more background about what the horse has been doing.

The bottom line is that a horse is "worth" what someone will pay for it. Only the buyer can determine the magic mix of characteristics that makes their day.

Do you get on this horse and feel invincible and safe? Does it make you grin from ear to ear? Those are intangibles but they are definitely "worth" something.

It also depends on how long you have been looking and how desperate you are to buy a horse.

Also, asking price and selling price are not always the same. Especially in this economy!

[Debbie]

As a comparable, I sold a TB cross (1/4 draft) for $20K earlier this spring. She was five and had 5 events under her girth - 2 BN and 3 Novice all with good outings although just out of the top 3 places. Dressage scores in the very low 30s and clean XC trips. She was about to move to training. The mare is 16.3 and an ammie ride with scope and aptitude for at least prelim. Oh, she had also been out foxhunting although that wasn't compelling for her buyer.

I'll also agree that a lot of horses are selling for less than asking. I enquired on a 2 year old last week and the price I was quoted was nearly half of the asking price in print. We were firm on the price for our mare, but your mileage will vary from horse to horse, so it doesn't hurt to ask if you like her.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

She may not be overpriced (no one here on the Web would know unless they actually know this mare themselves)...however, she isn't priced to sell quickly. Her sellers probably believe that this horse is fancy and has talent. They probably think that with a year of showing she will be going Prelim (or marketable as a show horse) and worth 30K+ so why sell her cheap now.


The question you need to ask is are YOU willing to pay that for her...

[eventersmom]

Being 7 without much of a show record wouldn't concern me very much simply because many draft crosses are slow to mature and some owners choose to be conservative in beginning their jumping careers. That being said, I would probably make certain that the horse wasn't held up due to illness or injury.

We have a lovely 3/4 tb 1/4 draft cross and she just began competing in recognized events last year at age 6. She wasn't physically or mentally mature enough to begin prior to that although she had been to many schoolings, clinics and low key hunter/jumper shows. Her siblings routinely sell in the $7k range as weanlings and in the $15k range as yearlings but her sire (now a gelding) was well known to produce competitive sport horses.

While I probably wouldn't pay $18k, it doesn't mean she isn't worth every bit of the asking price. Do some investigative work, see how her siblings and half siblings are selling and find out if the price being asked is reasonable in comparision to the rest of this stallion's offspring.

It's worth taking time to do some checking around. All draft crosses are not created equal!

[quietann]

Too much.

As a comparison... my Morgan mare cost $12K last spring, in a fairly high-priced area, and I now think that was a bit much as the market was starting to tank. She'd done a few unrecognized HT and been 1st or 2nd in every one (she is a really good dressage horse and had wins in Training Level and a few placings in First.) She is very very fancy (Palomino) and beautiful, has one major confo flaw (toes in in front) but is otherwise very nice. It turned out she was way too talented for me -- she clears 3'6" easily and could have been a Training or even Prelim level horse with the right program, but is extremely hot over fences and not for the timid! As a dressage-only horse now, I am enjoying her.

[eventer4eva]

event1, you've got a pm.

I do know this horse personally, and she is very nice!!!! not $18k nice, but I know the owner and I don't think she would refuse a reasonable offer.

[Meredith Clark]

I don't know the horse but I've also noticed that pricing recently has been crazy-pants. I see AMAZING horses for really cheap prices because people just can't afford to keep them... then I see young green horses that people think they can get 20k and above for.

I guess the latter sellers don't NEED to sell the horse but I just don't know what people are thinking sometimes.

[Bobthehorse]

I agree with the others, the horse sounds way overpriced. Age 7 is too old to be that green and still expect top dollar, and with being a draft cross the horse should definitely be under 10K IMO.

Agree. The only way a horse that green is going for 18k is if it has obvious potential for Intermediate/Advanced and is closer to say, 4-5 years old.

[ShayDarra]

I agree that it sounds high. I just bought a very green broke 3 yo Clyde/TB cross for $2,500 from Louisiana. Admittedly, she knows next to nothing (but has a great temperment), but you could pay for a LOT of training with the remaining $15k.

Good luck.

SD

[WWGeorgeMorrisD]

In my area, that would be a high price for what you describe.

[RacetrackReject]

In my area she would be less than $5k (Texas). For comparison, I found this guy on the local classifieds. He is $5500, shorter and 3 years older but a much more experienced packer type. http://www.southeasttexas.com/classifieds/detail.cfm?id=450803&classified_code=999&zipcode=&distance=0&type=general

[purplnurpl]

She should be more like $5K. I recently bought a horse, and for that price you can get a very nice, safe, novice/training horse in that age range. I would pass.

this is what I was thinking.

[foxhavenfarm]

Way overpriced.