ugh, attempted trail ride with ottb

[2boys]

I am not sure what I am looking for. Maybe support, maybe ideas, maybe just to vent. I tried to take my ottb out for a trail ride yesterday, and we didn't really make it past grazing by the trailer. He was SO "up" and strong, I was NOT going to push any luck I may have. I felt like the slightest ANYTHING would send him into a complete freak out, causing both of us bodily harm. He is so mellow at home (aside from the occasional spook), but it is quiet there. I guess I would like suggestions in regards to making a horse into a confident, quiet trail horse. What does it take?:confused:

[ToiRider]

Were you by yourself or with other riders? I think it is best to introduce trail riding to your horse with some calm, experienced trail horses to follow. Do you have another horse that your horse is used to? Could someone else ride that horse with you?

I don't know anything about OTTBs, but I have read on COTH that transitioning them to other disciplines presents some common issues. I would try posting and asking what issues are presented in retraining OTTBs and how to approach overcome those issues.

[Jaegermonster]

you don't say how long he has been off the track, how old he is, what has he done since leaving the track, what is your riding experience and background?
I have an OTTB mare that i bought as a 3 year old fresh off the track. She's 17 this year, and served me well as a show horse, trail horse, then a foxhunter, then a fieldmasters horse and then I whipped in off her. Everything I ever had was OTT and I trail rode every single one. By myself. A lot.
So it's most likely not the OTT part that's the problem.
You probably need to work with him more.

IME the most important thing in a good trail horse is he has to have confidence in you in order to have confidence in himself.

[War Admiral]

What Jaeger said.

OTTBs have to be *taught* to trail ride; it can be a long process. A lot of them have never been asked to leave the herd before, a lot of them have never had to feel brush & woods closing in on them before. If you can find a rock-solid trail buddy to go out with, that will help tremendously.

[2boys]

I will try to answer as many questions as I can. He has been off the track for a while. He was at a rescue in a field for five months before I adopted him in September of 2007. We have been creeping along in his training, with me working so hard to understand him. We are doing so great together in the ring. He is one of the best horses I have ever ridden-smart and wants to please. He is quite a confident guy too. When something new is introduced (tarps, bikes, etc), he can't get to it fast enough to explore. He is a big puppy with me now when in his comfort zone. We have had to work through his dominant personality, as I am naturally passive and he is naturally strong-willed. We have come to an understanding though, and although I know it is an ongoing relationship, I feel good about the growth we have made. Realistically, to get on *real* trails, I need to ship him out (which is what we did yesterday), but I am planning to clear the acre of woods behind the barn here, to work on tight spaces, things brushing against his tummy (that really pissed him off yesterday). My expectations were too high I guess. I was hoping for the pussycat I have at home. I hear these wonderful stories of people taking their horses out for the first time, and they are angels. I was hoping that would happen to me! I did go with a been-there-done-that horse, which was good. My boy did settle pretty quickly and relaxed while munching grass. It was anytime we did something -anything else, he would turn into dinosaur-neck monster.:confused: I am contemplating sending him to someone who will give him a ton of miles, but I do not have the funds for that now. I also know that *I* am the one who will have to ride him out there eventually. Here is another question; Is it a waste of time to have someone else put mileage on him, when I will ultimately be riding him? I am a *cautious* rider/horse person, but work very hard to present as a confident leader for him (I know someone here mentioned that). I read a lot of Jane Savoie. :sadsmile:

[twofatponies]

It's easy to think trail riding is just something you go and do, and there are a *few* horses who just take to it, but most who are happy on the trails got trained to do that and practiced it - maybe when they were young, or with a previous owner.

It's a whole set of skills - balancing on rough footing, stepping over stuff without tripping, watching where you put your feet, getting used to bushes and birds and logs and deer and water.

Your guy sounds like a sensible type. I bet with some gradual practice he'll get comfortable and understand what he's supposed to do out there, and you'll have a great time. Just take it in steps, as if you were teaching him how to jump or something. One thing at a time!

[matryoshka]

I've trained several OTTB's to do trails. They make great trail horses, as long as they are sane. Sounds like your guy is sane. You put him into a new environment, he got edgy, you got edgy, and you did the right thing not to proceed with your ride. You could have schooled him in other ways, though.

If it had been me, I'd have either opted to hand-walk him on the trail or to ride near the trailer for a bit and expand his comfort zone. Generally, I don't get upset much, so some nervousness and shenanigans on the horse's part are met with calm. Eventually, they get that it is no big deal if the rider continues to act like it is no big deal. I'm a confident rider, and that confidence transfers to the horse. Sometimes it takes a while. ;)

Since you two are not at that point right now, it might be wise to try going out with an experienced trail horse. Either that, or go out with the intention of hand-walking the whole way and only consider mounting up when you are both calm and relaxed. I've done that with young, barely broke horses on their early outings. So far so good.

It has been my experience that OTTB's are great with any kind of machinery. Natural stuff that other horses take for granted seem to come alive when they see an OTTB. I swear my last OTTB wouldn't turn a hair if a firetruck barreled down the trail, sirens screaming. But OMG! A boulder? Has to be a lion! Fallen tree? Hiding a crocodile! And stream crossings had to be built up by width, from narrow to wide as though he'd never seen water before. For a while he seemed to think that one noisy stream was stalking him as the trail would veer away and come back where we could hear it. Once we got through that stuff he was wonderful on the trail. And in case you are wondering, the first few times I took him out on the trail he ran backwards, when he wasn't bucking. (Idiot that I am, took him to a trail that was within sight of the barn he used to race from. Duh.) It worked out. We stuck with walking for the first few rides until he got the hang of it.

I've taken others directly off the track and onto the trail without any bother at all. The horse mentioned above was only ridden a few time in an enclosure before I took him out on the trail. Again, I have a knack for staying calm no matter what the horse does. And if I can't? It's time to dismount rather than wreck.

[Bogie]

I've had several OTTBs. What I've found is that although they are used to all kinds of equipment and man made commotion, horse eating chipmunks, ducks and large rocks can be terrifying :lol:. It's all what they're used to.

I don't always have the luxury of riding with other, more experienced, trail horses when I restart mine. Often I start by hand walking them so that they 1) feel more comfortable and 2) bond with me. One of the big issues is to get them to depend on me to be the leader. I also prefer to start them on trails through the woods rather than in open fields. EVen when I start riding them, I will dismount and lead them by, through or over really scary things. I used to consider it an accomplishment if I only got off once.

As a side note, sometimes when you take out an OTTB it helps for to go first. My current OTTB hated, hated, hated to go behind another horse. For the first couple of years I had him he would throw a tantrum or jig when I asked him to follow but was happy as a clam to go first. Once he got used to the idea that he didn't have to "win" every ride he settled in. These days he goes anywhere in a group and is even foxhunting first flight. So, it does get better!

Good luck!

[War Admiral]

Wasn't going to mention it unless someone else did, but I too am a big fan of leading and (in my case) ground driving on the trails at first. I'm 51 and break too easily for much else!

[AKB]

I would have an experienced trail rider take him out on the trails with a group of old packers keeping him company. Your anxieties about how he is going to behave are probably not helping things.

I bought a barely broken 4 year old 2 years ago. I got my daughters and their friends to take him out on his first few trail rides because I am a chicken. My chicken tendencies could have made him a chicken. I also had an event trainer work with my horse twice a month for several months. Schooling cross country is particularly good for some horses who need to become braver in the open.

[Cindyg]

I just want to sympathize. I have a 21 year old horse who I'm afraid to take trail riding. That's not to say I never take him; but I take him with great caution. Not every horse is ready to go trail riding every day. It can be really scary for the horse. And if not scary, then energizing and exciting. When my guy was 20 (!) I took him to a trainer for a month to work specifically on trail riding. She took him or us out on the trails every day, and it was quite an experience. And while it truly did help us both, it did not result in calm, relaxing trail rides from then on. :)

Much sympathy.

[BarbB]

I have had several OTTBs like matryoshka described.
Never bat an eye at screaming fast traffic, heavy equipment, bells and horns and whistles, but quiver at the sight of a grasshopper or blowing leaves.
Some OTTBs were never farmed raised, they are essentially raised in the track environment.
I had one that in 10 years never failed to snort at a lightning killed tree that we passed on every ride, but he did become a great trail horse fairly quickly.
Think of all the desensitizing people do with horses for plastic bags and noisy trucks and air brakes....you just have to do some of that only for grass and grasshoppers and things moving in the bushes.
A friend with a dependable, unflappable trail horse is your best training equipment, and you being confident (fake it if you have to) is the next thing you need.

[Bogie]

I know what you mean! I'm not far behind you.

I also ground drive but that's a whole 'nother post. Also, I find that at least at the beginning, a nervous horse likes to have you right their to share your bravery.

Back to the OP, I have never had a horse that didn't settle into trail riding. Some stayed on high alert, but they all seemed to enjoy it. My current OTTB trail rides on the buckle now. No jigging, very little spooking and a lot of curiosity. In the beginning I also only walk. My experience is that OTTBs need to learn that it's okay to go slowly. It's not what they are used to, so they need to be taught.

Wasn't going to mention it unless someone else did, but I too am a big fan of leading and (in my case) ground driving on the trails at first. I'm 51 and break too easily for much else!

[Beverley]

My one-eyed OTTB served me well on the trails- he was better solo, actually, in a group, he really needed to be on the lead because he thought he was Secretariat.

Your idea to get someone to put some trail rides on him is, I think, a good one. I say this for two reasons, based on what you've posted. First, he'll get farther faster with a confident rider as 'leader' to get him past the horse eating rocks, and all the lions and tigers and bears out there. Second, the rider can brief you on 'how' he reacts in the face of new surprises on the trail, and so you can be better informed, and thus better equipped, on how to ride him. Even better, if that person after some number of rides can accompany you a few times during transition to give you some tips.

I would also suggest that before your next attempt, you work him in the ring at home, which will both take any 'edge' off and give him a start within the familiar, and then haul out for a brief trail ride.

And, a final tip- obviously you know your horse better than I do, but I can tell you that my horse, when faced with a scary object (or a horse galloping away from him or passing at the trot), would hold his breath, raise his head, become two inches taller at the withers, feel like he was about to turn into a volcano and then...do...absolutely...nothing. Once you find that sort of thing out about a horse, really, pretty much no worries.

[Simbalism]

My Tb is not OT, but I purchased her as an untrained yearling. I did lots of ground work with her including trail walks with me leading her. She inititally was a show horse and kind of spooky.In hind sight I attribute the spookiness to more stall time, more feed. Then we got tired of the show stuff and she became my old lady horse. I joined a riding club and have been trying all sorts of stuff the last few years. When I started trail riding her, I initially did the trail walk thing leading her to see how she would react to stuff( since it had been awhile for trail encounters). After doing this several times I started riding her. I usually didn't have a steady eddie to go with us. If I got nervous about how she was acting, I would get off and lead her and she usually settled pretty quickly. I did lots of bombproofing both at clinics and at home. Being an older person who doesn't bounce, I wanted her to be as unreactive as possible. Another thing I do is use ear pom poms. It was something that had started when she was showing and I just continued it. The other changes in her routine is that she lives out 24/7 and she gets much less grain than she did when showing. I could probably do without the ear pompoms, but hey it's a cheap crutch...hehe. These days we do lots of trail riding( at least 2-3 times a month at area parks). This weekend I am going camping in the mountains with my horse. I went a couple of weeks ago and she was great. Good luck.

[2boys]

I've trained several OTTB's to do trails. They make great trail horses, as long as they are sane. Sounds like your guy is sane. You put him into a new environment, he got edgy, you got edgy, and you did the right thing not to proceed with your ride. You could have schooled him in other ways, though.

If it had been me, I'd have either opted to hand-walk him on the trail or to ride near the trailer for a bit and expand his comfort zone. Generally, I don't get upset much, so some nervousness and shenanigans on the horse's part are met with calm. Eventually, they get that it is no big deal if the rider continues to act like it is no big deal. I'm a confident rider, and that confidence transfers to the horse. Sometimes it takes a while. ;)

Since you two are not at that point right now, it might be wise to try going out with an experienced trail horse. Either that, or go out with the intention of hand-walking the whole way and only consider mounting up when you are both calm and relaxed. I've done that with young, barely broke horses on their early outings. So far so good.

I've taken others directly off the track and onto the trail without any bother at all. The horse mentioned above was only ridden a few time in an enclosure before I took him out on the trail. Again, I have a knack for staying calm no matter what the horse does. And if I can't? It's time to dismount rather than wreck.

Wish someone like you were closer! I wouldn't say that riding a more experienced horse would do much. I have been riding forever, but am just a cautious/conservative/chicken by nature. This guy has brought me further though, than any other horse in my riding, as green as he is. :yes:

I did venture a bit away from the trailer. We (me and my friend with the steady eddie) took turns going around the parking area. Then we went through the gate (WAAAAHHH! What was that? Let's get out of here!!), and let them eat grass in the field for a bit. During this part, he was pretty naughty.

It is nice to hear that you guys have had positive experiences. Thanks!

[jubilee43]

I had my ottb out on a trailride and he was doing quite well. Until I fed him an apple off a tree we passed. (he is completely crazy for apples) He was chewing on half and had to walk over a small grass covered hump in a hedgerow. Apparently he couldn't walk and chew at the same time since he FELL DOWN:lol:
to his knees. It was only about six inches high and gradual and not hidden. He had been over ditches,creeks, down gulleys, over logs so it wasn't like this was a big thing for him. Just got too excited about that darned apple...

[magnolia73]

If you go to CANTER Midatlantic, there are all sorts of OTTB training blogs.... and many tales of trail rides. In general they seem to go out in small groups and get on with it. I think in those situations YOU have to be the leader and stay relaxed. In some of their examples, a horse that starts out hot might need a good trot to blow off steam.

My horse is long off the track and is very pleasant on trails by herself and in a very small group with her leading. She sometimes needs to stop and look at things and can get "dinosaur head". But she is reliable provided I stay calm (I sing to myself if I get nervous).

I think- great idea to have someone else ride him out. Sometimes a person who can chuckle at the hijinx can get a horse over a hump. And its totally understandable to think that heading down a trail on a snort jumpy beast is a bad decision. I'm a nervous rider as well. Having a person try something on her first has been a good system. She gets the best ride possible and when I get back on, I know she will be just fine. ;)

Oh, and last summer, I moved to a barn with trails. The first month I would not leave the ring. Then I rode back to the barn. Then I tried a short trail, then a longer. Within a two months I was out on the power line right of way solo cantering up hills.

[Minerva Louise]

Hey, you did alright! I tried to ride my OTTB around the pasture as our "intro to trailriding" and we had a rodeo! I swear, he went up and down vertically more than he went forward once we got 50 yards from the barn. So we have done and continue to do - lots of hand leading in the pasture. (and he is getting lower protein grain and less of it too) We are slowly working up to farther and farther away from the barn.

When he is not paying attention to me and gets chargey or whatever other badness he is up to that day, he gets to move backwards IN A BIG OL' HURRY. Then we lead some more. It has been slow going, but that is what this horse apparently needs. I don't get why he can go out and walk all over this friggin pasture all by himself and calmly graze, but if he is on a lead or under tack, he is a nut. :( :confused: Oh well, such is how he is. And no, he is not a nut being led around the barn or the ring, in the ring under tack he is a push ride!! My horse is a man of mystery, that is for sure!

My former OTTB was a fabulous trailhorse. They can indeed be wonderful trailhorses. My guy was the go-to guy who always led any nervous nellies past killer rocks, killer bread bags, whatever. With one single exception - COWS!!!!! I never got him ok around cows. He even managed pigs.... but never cows.

[pines4equines]

Another thing I wanted to point out is to take your time. Maybe on day 1, all you do is saddle up and ride to the trailer you mentioned, touch the trailer with his nose and then go home. Do the same thing day 2. Keep doing this and then on day 10 maybe you go 10 feet further. Horse training is not a race and sometimes backing off and doing things slowly will work better for both your confidence and your horse's.

Also, do all this after schooling in the ring in his comfort zone. He'll be a wee bit more tired and you'll have a bit more confidence after schooling...

[Guilherme]

IMO you evaluate a horse for purchase and use on three criteria:

Temperment
Conformation
Way of going

Sadly a huge number of OTTBs fail on the first criteria. This is not such a surprise, as they were bred and born for one thing: running fast.

Put another way, genetics counts.

The training they receive re-inforces this breeding.

A percentage can sometimes do other things (hunting, dressage, jumping) but a really distressingly large number seem to be unable to get past their breeding and training.

Some horses are never going to make good trail mounts. They just don't have the temperment for it. If that's the case the owner should sell them and find one that does. Trying to fit this "square peg into a round hole" leads to frustration and, not infrequently, injury. It's just not worth it.

G.

[Bogie]

Yes and no.

Yes, they are bred to run fast. And yes, their training generally reinforces their genetic predisposition, although I've gotten TBs from trainers who did put a good training base on them and I've ridden OTTBs that were quiet from day one.

I'd have to disagree with you that genetics is the deciding factor for a "huge number" of thoroughbreds, though. In my opinion, you need to factor into the equation that many people who buy OTTBs have no experience retraining them and often buy them because they are inexpensive. They don't have the budget to buy a horse with more training and this translates to not having the budget to help them retrain it. In addition, not everyone has access to a trainer with experience retraining OTTBs. (Note: I am not trying to make any kind of statement about the OP here, this is just what I've observed over time).

I see many people through my association with CANTER who have excellent systems for retraining OTTBs in a methodical way that gives them the chance to learn their new jobs and excel. When I got my first OTTB my trainer at the time had many years of experience with TBs and had a good system for bringing one along. I thank her over and over again for the knowledge she imparted.

As for new careers, I personally see a lot of OTTBs out in the hunt field (I also ride one) and they not only can go out on trail rides, they can do it surrounded by hounds, horses and at speed. When I evented, I certainly saw many OTTBs there as well.

But, they are not for everyone and you do need to understand going into the purchase that significant retraining may be required and be prepared to follow through.

I agree wholeheartedly with your last statement: Some horses are not suited for what the rider wants to do. At that point often the best solution is to move on and find a home for the horse with a job that it likes.



IMO you evaluate a horse for purchase and use on three criteria:

Temperment
Conformation
Way of going

Sadly a huge number of OTTBs fail on the first criteria. This is not such a surprise, as they were bred and born for one thing: running fast.

Put another way, genetics counts.

The training they receive re-inforces this breeding.

A percentage can sometimes do other things (hunting, dressage, jumping) but a really distressingly large number seem to be unable to get past their breeding and training.

Some horses are never going to make good trail mounts. They just don't have the temperment for it. If that's the case the owner should sell them and find one that does. Trying to fit this "square peg into a round hole" leads to frustration and, not infrequently, injury. It's just not worth it.

G.

[Tamara in TN]

I felt like the slightest ANYTHING would send him into a complete freak out, causing both of us bodily harm.


He is so mellow at home (aside from the occasional spook), but it is quiet there. I guess I would like suggestions in regards to making a horse into a confident, quiet trail horse. What does it take?:confused:


I think you must make him brave...only you know that there is no fence between you and <insert scary place...woods,road,graveyard,boogeyman lodging> :) you must ride him like you have him between your leg and the rail right there at the house....

best

[TBDressage916]

My ottb is a great trail horse- when I got him I spent 6 weeks in the round pen walk-whoa walk whoa walk trot walk whoa. and when I knew we had excellent brakes spent the next 6mo trail riding him before we started any "real" retraining. I think though that he was broke very correctly to have a riding horse job after his racing days were finished (which was good because they barely got started before he was dismissed) so I can't take all of the credit but we also did a lot of desensitizing on the ground. But I have found that 1 he does not like big groups- we are good up to 4 or 5 horses more than that is overload, and 2 he does not like to be surrounded by horses, he will lead and he will follow the group but he does not like to have horses in front and in back of him. He is so good that we often take the babies out for their first trail ride with him, unless like the other poster mentioned there are going to be cows- the one thing I can't get him over even after sharing a fence line for 4 months with a whole herd of beefers!

[2boys]

hmmm. Very interesting perspectives here. :D When I got him, I got him because I wanted to get myself something to enjoy riding, as well as give a homeless animal a home. I did a lot of research relating to tbs before adopting him, and feel like I went in with eyes wide open. I knew/know that there will be speed bumps in our journey, I just want to vent about it. I also don't think it hurts to get some wise opinions of those who have been there/done that, so I did. :) Someone posted (I think "Gwendolyn") on another thread, that when others ask her what she will do with her young horse, she says, "Whatever my horse wants to!" I am in that camp with my boy. If he is/we are not meant to be trailblazers, because it is out of our capabilities, then fine, we won't. I am just not sure if we CAN'T yet. By the way, to those who have ties to southeastern MA, any recommendations for ottb-savvy trainers who will give trail mileage? Thanks again for your insight, everyone! Keep it comin'!

BTW, I did think about working him before we went to get the edge off, but I ran out of time, and my friend showed up with the trailer!

[TBDressage916]

I forgot what I had ment to say- as soon as I start bragging about my boy that happens :). Is there anywhere that you can go with trails that also has a ring? We had some places that had trails but also held some shows so maybe you could find a place like that- trailer there ride in the ring and then go out on the trail when you feel like he's paying attention?

[jazzrider]

Wish someone like you were closer! I wouldn't say that riding a more experienced horse would do much. I have been riding forever, but am just a cautious/conservative/chicken by nature. This guy has brought me further though, than any other horse in my riding, as green as he is. :yes:

I did venture a bit away from the trailer. We (me and my friend with the steady eddie) took turns going around the parking area. Then we went through the gate (WAAAAHHH! What was that? Let's get out of here!!), and let them eat grass in the field for a bit. During this part, he was pretty naughty.

It is nice to hear that you guys have had positive experiences. Thanks!

I really, really wish that 10 years ago when I got my OTTB (my first horse) and wanted to work to make him a good trail horse that one of my horse friends would have pushed me to send him to a trainer to put miles on him. If you really are a cautious rider -- if you can afford to send him to a trainer -- do it. Once they've done that, work with that trainer out on trail for a month or two. This will put you and your horse more on even ground, with him having a little trail time under his belt. Your confidence won't be undermined by his nervousness at starting out, and he'll build confidence out there with someone who's an expert and knows the OTTB mind. :yes:

[rodandmicha]

Well, not sure if this is helpful but I am the proud owner of an OTTSTB :-) And people have always told me that Standardbreds are quiet, no problem at all to trail train...well, they hadn't met my guy yet :-) He is high strung (now in his twenties and STILL prancing around with his tail held high) and just a spooky kind of guy. Well, I'm not experienced and lack confidence, so the blind leading the blind. But guess what, we made it out onto the trails eventually, it just took us longer than it would have taken maybe an experienced rider.
I just did a ton of ground work (natural horsemanship and anything to keep busy...), then lots of undersaddle in the arena and finally I just handwalked him along with a couple of friends who were trail riding. Then I just tacked him up and walked him, until I felt, hey, he seems pretty calm, I'll hop on him and see for how long we can make it...eventually we made it the whole ride.
My friend (who has been a professional dressage trainer for over 20 years) just told me recently:
I've never regretted once getting off a horse but many times have I regretted NOT getting off :-)
So there, if it gets tricky, just get off and try again when both of you are calmer.
This above mentioned friend by the way just brought her OTTB to my barn and just took him out for his first trail ride ever, as if it was nothing...so there, you never know :-)

[foxrider]

2boys:

I think you've have gotten some excellent advice from some experienced OTTB owners. I don't happen to be one, but I'd like to make a suggestion that would be good for any owner interested in trail riding skills. In my area ( the NW ) we have trainers that have " trail challenge " courses set up and offer clinics to teach trail skills to all levels, from the novice who just wants to mosey safely down the trail to competitive riders. These courses consist of natural-looking obstacles set up in an arena; wooden bridge, water-filled trench, boulders, stumps, etc.. There is usually a gate to open, a tarp or two to walk on, etc.. It's lots of fun and can be done in-hand as well as in the saddle.

Naturally, this doesn't take the place of " real " trail riding practice, but it's a fun, safe beginning to help a horse and rider gain some initial confidence. And you might meet a new trail partner or two!:yes:

[Kyzteke]

I will try to answer as many questions as I can. He has been off the track for a while. He was at a rescue in a field for five months before I adopted him in September of 2007. We have been creeping along in his training, with me working so hard to understand him. We are doing so great together in the ring. He is one of the best horses I have ever ridden-smart and wants to please. He is quite a confident guy too. When something new is introduced (tarps, bikes, etc), he can't get to it fast enough to explore. He is a big puppy with me now when in his comfort zone. We have had to work through his dominant personality, as I am naturally passive and he is naturally strong-willed. We have come to an understanding though, and although I know it is an ongoing relationship, I feel good about the growth we have made. Realistically, to get on *real* trails, I need to ship him out (which is what we did yesterday), but I am planning to clear the acre of woods behind the barn here, to work on tight spaces, things brushing against his tummy (that really pissed him off yesterday). My expectations were too high I guess. I was hoping for the pussycat I have at home. I hear these wonderful stories of people taking their horses out for the first time, and they are angels. I was hoping that would happen to me! I did go with a been-there-done-that horse, which was good. My boy did settle pretty quickly and relaxed while munching grass. It was anytime we did something -anything else, he would turn into dinosaur-neck monster.:confused: I am contemplating sending him to someone who will give him a ton of miles, but I do not have the funds for that now. I also know that *I* am the one who will have to ride him out there eventually. Here is another question; Is it a waste of time to have someone else put mileage on him, when I will ultimately be riding him? I am a *cautious* rider/horse person, but work very hard to present as a confident leader for him (I know someone here mentioned that). I read a lot of Jane Savoie. :sadsmile:

I haven't read all the posts, so this advice may have been offered before.

First I would look at his diet -- many TBs can be amped up pretty good by grain. Also -- his down time is spent in a large pasture or turn-out or is he stalled? Most (not all) TBs are high energy, reactive horses -- they were bred to race -- so it could be he is abit over fed for his activity level.

Second, he got trailered to the trail head, correct? You didn't just ride him off the property?

So, how often does he get trailered to new places? Is that a common experience for him?

Lastly, you can't underestimate the power of the herd. I've had horses start to get anxious when I took them to the end of the driveway -- and these were horses that were total buddas in THEIR pasture or THEIR arena.

I did the same thing with one of my mares, and it was one of the STUPIDEST horse-related things I've ever done. She was always so mellow at home -- I wrapped her in a hay tarp once for fun -- so I did NO prep work for her registry inspection as a 4 yr. old. So that day I put the bridle on (first time in 1 yr), took her off the property away from her herd (1st time in 2 yrs.), trailered her to a strange stable, and stabled her overnight. The next morning she was an absolute nutcase!!! I have never seen this mare behave like that before or since.

Almost caprioled one of the inspectors in the noggin (!) and when her turn to show off her paces came, she tore around the arena like Secretariat on meth. She was a total booger and just barely in my control.

As a result, she just missed score high enough for Elite status -- and that's a shame 'cause she's a nice mare.

Turns out she was ovulating that day, and the horse in the stall behind her was a breeding stallion -- I'm sure that didn't help either.

But the point is, we can never forget they ARE horses. You need to go back and take smaller steps. Try hand-walking him to the edge of your property if you can. Trailer him more -- and walk him around if you don't feel safe riding him.

I've never done it, but attending one of these "De-Spook Your Horse" clinic might be helpful if it's correctly taught. From what I hear it helps you and your horse learn how to deal and face scary situations. You can't possibly pre-expose a horse to each new thing, but you CAN teach him (and you) how to deal with panic in the horse. Then it doesn't really matter what sort of new thing you see out there.

Maybe sent him out for trail training -- there are people in my area that will concentrate on trail for your horse. You DO have to be able to ride out whatever the horse gives you, however, although these days the tendency is to expect the horse to just behave all the time. But they are horses, and so they shall always remain.

I love TBs -- I spent over 10 years on the track doing everything from galloping to walking hots to grooming to training. I developed a great fondness for them. Now I have other "hot" breeds (Arabs & Akhal Tekes), but I can still admire a really solid TB.

Good luck.

[2boys]

First I would look at his diet -- many TBs can be amped up pretty good by grain. Also -- his down time is spent in a large pasture or turn-out or is he stalled? Most (not all) TBs are high energy, reactive horses -- they were bred to race -- so it could be he is abit over fed for his activity level.

Second, he got trailered to the trail head, correct? You didn't just ride him off the property?
So, how often does he get trailered to new places? Is that a common experience for him?

But the point is, we can never forget they ARE horses. You need to go back and take smaller steps. Try hand-walking him to the edge of your property if you can. Trailer him more -- and walk him around if you don't feel safe riding him.

Good luck.

He gets about 1/2 quart of Purina Strategy each day. :)

He was trailered to the trail site, and I know that this added to his stress. At least he didn't sweat during the trailer ride this time!

I also set up a new grazing paddock for him, so that he is away from the others, and getting desensitized to more activity. I wish I could trailer him more......

[matryoshka]

If he was trailered to the races, this may have upped his nervousness that day. I've had a couple of those, and they get excited just by the trailer ride, thinking they are going to race. We had one at the lay-up farm who had to be tranqed to pull her mane because that reminded her of race day. The pulling itself didn't seem to bother her, but she got more excited with each pull. It took us a while to puzzle out her strange reaction--she started pacing and sweating and nickering, not having a pain reaction.

Anyway, it might help to trailer him someplace, let him graze, lead him around, play with him, etc. then bring him home just in case he's one who raced from the trailer. I didn't think of that aspect of things.

[Minerva Louise]

He gets about 1/2 quart of Purina Strategy each day. :)

He was trailered to the trail site, and I know that this added to his stress. At least he didn't sweat during the trailer ride this time!

I also set up a new grazing paddock for him, so that he is away from the others, and getting desensitized to more activity. I wish I could trailer him more......

A half quart isn't so much ---- BUT ---- Strategy is 14% protein. I took my guy off Strategy and put him on a lower protein feed. My guy also dropped a lot into the aisle and that stuff molds in a dramatic fashion. Super Gross!

What kind of hay/forage does he eat?

[Bogie]

Protein doesn't make a horse hot; starch does. Strategy is pretty low in starch, but not the lowest out there. Half a quart is only about 3/4 lb which isn't very much. I think that to meet a horse's nutritional needs you need to feed about 3 lbs per day. Unless you are supplementing this with a vitamin/mineral mix you might want to consider feeding him slighly more or switching to a ration balancer if he doesn't need the calories.

Personally, I feed my OTTB a ration balancer, alfalfa pellets and rice bran or corn oil.

I've played around with what to feed him and how to keep him in good weight without giving him rocket fuel.

My own OTTB also gets free choice grass hay and soaked alfalfa/timothy cubes. If your horse is prone to ulcers, feeding alfalfa can help both prevent and cure them. Plus, it's considerably cheaper than Gastroguard!

A half quart isn't so much ---- BUT ---- Strategy is 14% protein. I took my guy off Strategy and put him on a lower protein feed. My guy also dropped a lot into the aisle and that stuff molds in a dramatic fashion. Super Gross!

What kind of hay/forage does he eat?

[Beverley]

Actually, lower protein made a difference with my OTTB. I fed free choice grass hay, plus he got beet pulp to keep weight on, and a bit of 10% sweet feed. I found that just withholding the sweet feed on hunt mornings was the difference between Mr. Oil-Painting-Over-The-Fireplace-Hunter and Secretariat.

[certifiedgirl]

I just got back from the first "solo" trail ride with my TB mare, and I must say I am completely thrilled. We did about 8 miles out in the hills around Morton Wa.
I was very concerned that without her buddy (security blanket) she would be a nutcase but she was actually better on the trail than she has ever been. Instead of concentrating on getting super close to the other horse, she was watching where she put her feet and felt a lot more controlled going down hills.

This mare is pretty laid back for an OTTB but she has only been doing trail for a couple of months. I've found that the trailering thing is significant with my horses, the more they go out, the more relaxed they are about it. I do have one that washes out every time we trailer her, unless I do it consistently (like several times a week).

Don't give up on your TB, I think some of them just need a little more time to "get used to nature"! My six year old gelding, who was an awesome trail horse at three (before I sent him to the track) has been getting a little too hot on the trail for my taste, after a 10 mile ride last month I felt like I'd galloped five or six racehorses!

So, I sent him back to the guy that started him undersaddle for a few weeks for a refresher. I like to do that when necessary, as he is really good at working them thru silliness and teaching patience! (something I'm not so good at). He is currently learning to be roped off of and to not be deathly afraid of cows, hey, I figure every bit of experience he can get will help make him a better horse in the long run.

And I second whomever mentioned don't be hesitant to get off and hand walk your guy if he starts getting too amped up, that just isn't any fun and tends to feed on itself.

[2boys]

He gets a grassy mix of hay with NO alfalfa. Although he is forward-thinking, he is really not a hyper, stereo-typical tb. I don't know how much his diet is a factor. He is very quiet at home, but new situations can get him strong (like this one in particular). Coincidentally, I think my kooky quarter horse has created some spookiness in him.

Regarding the trailer, it may be from his rides to the track that stressed him out. He also had a long ride from New Jersey to MA when I adopted him, which couldn't have been relaxing.

"Certifiedgirl", don't rub it in. :lol:

[matryoshka]

I haven't found protein to make my horses hot. In fact, IME, TB's need more protein than most other breeds. Without it, they just don't seem to muscle up the way they should. Perhaps what some are seeing on more protein isn't an "amped up" horse but one who feels as well as he should. Perhaps the lower energy horses who are kept that way through lower protein are not quite themselves.

I have found excess sugar in the diet to be problematic. I'm careful about the NSC in anything I feed. Sugar is wasted calories that doesn't add nutrition and messes with their systems. I deliberately add alfalfa to the TB's diets to help keep their weight up. I have not noticed them getting nasty, overly pushy, or to have excess energy. My horses are on 24 hour turnout. That might make a difference.

[Bogie]

Most sweet feeds are high in starch.

I found that just withholding the sweet feed on hunt mornings was the difference between Mr. Oil-Painting-Over-The-Fireplace-Hunter and Secretariat.

I also feed alfalfa both because it's higher in calories and because it's very effective at preventing/curing ulcers. I have a very anxious TB and I haven't found that feeding alfalfa has caused any behavioral problems. In fact, quite the opposite. Mine is also on 24/7 turnout.

I deliberately add alfalfa to the TB's diets to help keep their weight up. I have not noticed them getting nasty, overly pushy, or to have excess energy. My horses are on 24 hour turnout. That might make a difference.

[TBCollector]

Please consider sending your horse to someone (old cowboy preferably) who will put miles on your horse in a western saddle and a snaffle. I have done this with every one of my OTTBs and I'm confident my eventing trainers (one of whom posts here) would say it was a job well done.
The worst part about trying to do it yourself: Thoroughbreds, especially green ones, can be very unforgiving. And if you're nervous, believe me, he's going to feel it...times 100! If you aren't confident when you're riding him, he's going to know it. You just can't fake it with a thoroughbred.
Be safe!

[certifiedgirl]

"Certifiedgirl", don't rub it in. :lol:

Sorry, I was just so surprised today that I couldn't help but brag on my mare a little. Just wanted you to know that there is hope! OTTBs can do it. :)

[matryoshka]

It's okay to brag once in a while. Just don't make a habit of it. :lol::lol: Seriously, it's nice to hear good things about OTTB's. I've enjoyed those that I have worked with, one or two excepted.

[2boys]

The worst part about trying to do it yourself: Thoroughbreds, especially green ones, can be very unforgiving. And if you're nervous, believe me, he's going to feel it...times 100! If you aren't confident when you're riding him, he's going to know it. You just can't fake it with a thoroughbred.
Be safe!

Oh, don't I know it! Being a more tentative rider, the transition to him was veery enlightening! I have worked really hard to overcome many tendencies, in order to be a good leader for him. I guess I look at it as our latest speedbump. As I mentioned, I am absolutely considering sending him off to someone. However money is very tight, and he really needs to go to the right person. I have yet to find anyone fitting that bill.

[caffeinated]

If you go to CANTER Midatlantic, there are all sorts of OTTB training blogs.... and many tales of trail rides. In general they seem to go out in small groups and get on with it. I think in those situations YOU have to be the leader and stay relaxed. In some of their examples, a horse that starts out hot might need a good trot to blow off steam.

Exactly.

:)

Most of our guys, though, really are very quiet on their first couple trail rides. But I think a lot of that is also how much time off they've had and the environment we put them in before they start getting ridden.

How long has this horse been off the track, and what was his letdown scenario? Ours get several months in some giant fields, full field board with a herd. Then, generally speaking, their first trail rides go like clockwork.

Usually we go in a pair or small group, and if someone does happen to get nervous, forward is generally the answer. If they're working, they have less time to think about what's going on around them or focus on it. Additionally, and more importantly, is the rider staying fully relaxed and not worrying about stuff. If you get tense or choke on them to try and keep them together, they'll start to think there *is* a reason to be concerned.

[TBCollector]

Oh, don't I know it! Being a more tentative rider, the transition to him was veery enlightening! I have worked really hard to overcome many tendencies, in order to be a good leader for him. I guess I look at it as our latest speedbump. As I mentioned, I am absolutely considering sending him off to someone. However money is very tight, and he really needs to go to the right person. I have yet to find anyone fitting that bill.

Where exactly are you? If you do decide to call someone in to help with him I can ask one of the guys I've used (and respect) who they would recommend.

[Jleegriffith]

I will offer up some advice and also be a voice of dissent. I have had a ton of ottb's and some truly never enjoy the trails and never become a "fun" ride out there for a rider that wants to enjoy themselves. That doesn't mean you stop trying but at some point in time you have to look at the horse and see the whole picture. I have had horses that are just lovely by themselves but put them in a group and then turn themselves inside out. On the other hand, I have horses who are relaxed in a group but ask them to go alone and you better strap yourself to the saddle.

I start trail riding my Tb's within the first week of their retraining if possible. I get somebody to go with me on a really brave and safe horse who will stay calm if everything gets nuts. You just never know what will happen. Start on the easiest trail you can find with no major distractions. Put your horse really close on the other horse and just putz along. Maybe just walk but if they are really hot then trot..trot and trot some more until they take a deep breathe and relax and then pat them and try the walk again.

I find the worst thing you can do and what many people make the mistake of doing is pissing off the horse who is already scared. You want to pick at them and make them walk because the rider is scared. Nope, you can not do that. Put on a neck strap, a martingale and make sure your girth is tight when you are on and then just get on and go. For the really silly horses keeping their feet moving is the key to staying on. I might do some lateral work and move them all over the trails but just keep their brain on you. Takes some practice and some guts from the rider but it can be done. I stay as relaxed as possible and I am confident in my routine so that allows me to stay on task when things go bad. If they start rearing, jumping around or getting stuck just go forward! Forward is your friend;)

Make sure you lead person knows their job which is not to leave you stranded. I make my hubby do the first rides with me because he knows the drill. Stay with me and do not get in front of me nor behind me. Most of the time we trot side by side. A rider who can not control their horse while riding with you can make for a bad experience. One bad experience i the beginning can take some time to fix.

Once you have done some group trail rides then you can approach the solo trail rides. I sometimes go out alone with those who don't like to do the group rides but it all depends.

The majority of the horses are great on the trails but some better than others. The current CANTER horse that is with me for retraining was quiet and brave on the trails from ride #1. He has also foxhunted and anybody could ride him out. He is more comfortable out of the ring than in it. He trained for racing off the farm so I am sure he was ridden out in the open a lot. That makes a difference.

I have had some horses who never improve. I can MAKE them trail ride but boy oh boy it is not fun. My older horse is 23 yrs old this year and I am sure he could still buck me off on the trail and I rarely fall off. He was always so difficult and just found things to spook at so he could do some airs above ground combined with the spin and drop the shoulder move. Made me a good rider but trail riding wasn't fun!

Is it worth spending the money to get the horse miles with someone experienced? Yes!!! The horse has to learn their job first and then the rider will feel more comfortable knowing the horse has already done it. What I try to do is ride the horse out first a few times and then take their owner out on the horse in a relaxed environment. It really does help. I can also evaluate the horse and give an opinion. At times I have told someone I didn't think their horse was going to be suitable for what they wanted to do if they wanted to trail ride alone or in groups or go hunting. Some horses just don't have the mentality for it.

[2boys]

Where exactly are you? If you do decide to call someone in to help with him I can ask one of the guys I've used (and respect) who they would recommend.

I am in SE MA.

[matryoshka]

Jleegriffith reminded me of something. When I took my more excitable OTTB to a dog trial (dogs, guns, numerous gaited horses), he was upset by the gaited horses. I think they must have sounded wrong to him. We were with another horse whom he looked to for support. Whenever a group of gaited horses would come flying along (we were sticking to a walk at this point just gettting to the hunt field), I'd take him to the pony position with the other horse, and he settled down. This means I kept his head at about the other horse's shoulder on the right side. We hit upon this solution by accident: Butch just naturally did it for support when about 10 horses came up on us suddenly.

So, if you are considering going out on the trail again with him, you might want to try riding him in that postion with a steady buddy first. The other horse has to be cooperative. It wasn't something we planned, but it worked beautifully for my guy. Once he got used to the gaited horses, he was fine.

He was also fine with the gunshot. However, one of the young entries forgot herself and chased the quail straight at us, so we had the dog run practically between our legs. He stood for that just fine, but I was embarrassed because I think I should have gotten out of the way quicker. I was just happy we didn't hurt anybody with some of the antics he went through when he first tried to follow the dogs instead of docilely staying with the field.

[DMK]

IMO you evaluate a horse for purchase and use on three criteria:

Temperment
Conformation
Way of going

Sadly a huge number of OTTBs fail on the first criteria. This is not such a surprise, as they were bred and born for one thing: running fast.

Put another way, genetics counts.

The training they receive re-inforces this breeding.

This rather cracks me up since I am ponying my 2 year old TB off my 17 year old show horse who is an OTTB. Hard bitten endurance riders and regular trail riders at our state forest are regularly in awe that I would do such a thing, never mind the whole TB aspect.

Yes this is the view from the middle of the river while, riding a krazee OTTB and holding a wild unbroken 2 year old AND juggling a camera... :
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24594726@N04/3567103662/sizes/l/in/set-72157615756010070/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/24594726@N04/3567098872/sizes/m/in/set-72157615756010070/

It's their "breeding" don'cha know" :lol:

You know, "bat shit crazy" and fast rarely wins races. Good race horses do have excellent temperaments. They have to. Racing requires too much discipline and willingness to listen to a human at a moment when a horse's natural drive is least likely to "want" to listen. Nutcases don't make it and go on to other careers, just like every other nutcase in equine sports - it is a distinction without a breed bias. The only edge I will give an OTTB is that perhaps his "flight" response has been finely honed ... as much as any other horse who relies on speed (see polo pony, barrel racer and first flight fox hunter as well) A horse without the discipline to be a good show jumper will also go on down the road. The trick is not to buy one of those horses regardless of whether he came from the a) track or b) some random sporthorse trainer.

Like everyone said, you need to ride the horse like he's a good horse. If you ride him like you expect him to freak out, chances are he won't disappoint you. But JLee is right - not every horse wants to be a trail horse, just like not every horse wants to jump xc or be a show jumper or a dressage horse and not every rider is the right person for that horse's needs. BUt after that, TBs, OT or otherwise are generally pretty good eggs about the whole thing.

[Jleegriffith]

It has been my experience that some of the most successful racehorses in terms of earnings and races ran are the easiest to retrain. They are smart, willing and generally have seen more things in their time on the track than many show horses ever will. You would think because these horses know how to "run fast" they would want to go all the time. Ha, it is actually quite the opposite and they get home and take a deep breathe and running is pretty far from their mind.

I just sold a 12 yr that made over $100k and ran over 60 races and his new owner says he is so slow!

These guys are smart enough to know when they are supposed to be racing and when they are just allowed to relax. I wish more people got to work with them to see that a lot of these statements are pure misconceptions.

[magnolia73]

I think we could fill up a whole BB bandwidth with tales of lazy OTTB's who thinking hacking out is divine once they get the hang of it. I hacked my friend's TB on the buckle through big pastures this weekend- unknowingly, he had not been ridden all week. When my friend cantered off on his friend, (another OTTB who finds hacking out divine) he barely even looked up, much less charge off.

All horses have the ability to pitch a good fit. I used to board with the hottest little QH mare and you bet your ass I preferred being on steady 5 yo OTTB Niki vs silly Rose. So much is in how you handle it- Rose's owner shrugged off the issues and went on. Rose will always be hot, but is well matched. I would have probably made Rose a basket case. There was another QH there that did stupid stuff- his owner would stop, panic, put him away, freak out- he did develop issues. And he was a quiet, somewhat dull horse.

[grayarabpony]

This rather cracks me up since I am ponying my 2 year old TB off my 17 year old show horse who is an OTTB. Hard bitten endurance riders and regular trail riders at our state forest are regularly in awe that I would do such a thing, never mind the whole TB aspect.

Yes this is the view from the middle of the river while, riding a krazee OTTB and holding a wild unbroken 2 year old AND juggling a camera... :
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24594726@N04/3567103662/sizes/l/in/set-72157615756010070/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/24594726@N04/3567098872/sizes/m/in/set-72157615756010070/

It's their "breeding" don'cha know" :lol:

You know, "bat shit crazy" and fast rarely wins races. Good race horses do have excellent temperaments. They have to. Racing requires too much discipline and willingness to listen to a human at a moment when a horse's natural drive is least likely to "want" to listen. Nutcases don't make it and go on to other careers, just like every other nutcase in equine sports - it is a distinction without a breed bias. The only edge I will give an OTTB is that perhaps his "flight" response has been finely honed ... as much as any other horse who relies on speed (see polo pony, barrel racer and first flight fox hunter as well) A horse without the discipline to be a good show jumper will also go on down the road. The trick is not to buy one of those horses regardless of whether he came from the a) track or b) some random sporthorse trainer.

Like everyone said, you need to ride the horse like he's a good horse. If you ride him like you expect him to freak out, chances are he won't disappoint you. But JLee is right - not every horse wants to be a trail horse, just like not every horse wants to jump xc or be a show jumper or a dressage horse and not every rider is the right person for that horse's needs. BUt after that, TBs, OT or otherwise are generally pretty good eggs about the whole thing.

Exactly. :yes:

OP, find a buddy to go with, you'll be fine. It'll be safer and more fun that way anyway.

[matryoshka]

I think part of the point here is that the OP's horse has not been proven one way or the other yet. From her work at home, it sounds like the horse is sane. He may or may not like the trail, but she has to get him going on the trail first before she knows this. It sounds like he is sane, therefore the only problem is figuring out how best to get him on the trail. We are trying to come up with some inexpensive ideas.

I'm guessing the OP is going to be a much better rider by the time she gets him going. ;) More confident, too, if all goes well.

[johnnysauntie]

I just took my snorty, look-y OTTB out on his first trail ride this last weekend. IT wasn't perfect but he was pretty good - due, no doubt, to the fact that we were in the company of two very, very experienced horses and riders. I could almost see his thoughts forming as we watched the other two horses go down a steep, slippery slope in front of us - as we started down, he was not happy, but the other horses stopped for us, and he saw them, and somewhere in his pony brain he figured out that the reasonable thing to do was to follow. So, ditto others on this board who suggest finding quiet, experienced buddies for those first few rides. Good luck!

[FairWeather]

what a lot of people fail to realize is that racehorses are almost *never* alone. They are ponied together, they train together, they race together, they train together. they ALWAYS have company. It is absolutely unfair to take a herd animal away from what they know--being with buddies--and expect them to be great.
Have I done it without prepping them for it? Absolutely! But only because I have enough experience to know what horses will handle it and which ones will not.

You can equate it to jumping. Just because you've asked them to do it, doesn't mean they should automatically do it--you have to take time to teach the skills to jump, just like you have to take time to take the skills to ride an OTTB on the trail alone.

[ArtilleryHill]

Count me among those who disagree with Guilherme's assertion that a "huge number" of OTTBs "fail" on temperament. In my experience, very many turn out to be great at a surprising variety of other jobs, from showing and eventing to foxhunting and, yes, trail horses. It certainly is true that some don't pan out, some are hotter than others, and some horses just don't seem suited for a particular job, as can happen with any breed. But I find that it's more common that riders aren't suited for doing the initial retraining, not that the horse doesn't have the temperament to be retrained (I'm not saying that's the case in the OP's situation, as I don't know the OP at all).

There are plenty of riders, including some very good riders, who don't have the experience retraining an OTTB or just don't want the hassle of dealing with a greenie. For the most part, that's what these OTTBs are: green to the non-racing sports and often young to boot. But the young ones also have an upside: they offer great prospects for retraining before they're set in their ways. I know of some OTTBs that truly were unsuitable by temperament, and those were pretty much nuts at the track, too, making them unsuitable for racing, as well, as someone pointed out earlier.

It is true that OTTBs have a particular "language" from their racetrack lives, and it helps to understand that context if you're restarting one yourself (a good example of that language is the ponyig example someone mentioned, and a similar one is the need to be in company, because they're rarely out of company at the track).

But to say that many fail the temperament test? Nah. I know many an ex-racehorse that won't bat an eye at things many made horses in other breeds and jobs would look askance at, like big rattling vehicles and traffic. But an OTTB might well spook at a cow because he's never seen one. And when they do spook, they're quicker and more athletic about it than many other breeds would be. None of which is an indication of temperamental "failure."

[2boys]

I DID NOT TAKE HIM OUT ALONE.

[ArtilleryHill]

Not sure who you were directing that to, but I wasn't implying that you took him out alone. I used the rarely-alone thing simply as an example of how having the context of a horse's racetrack life can make a difference in how the rider perceives them and handles their new-life training. My post was less a response to you than to Guilherme. Sorry if that wasn't clear!

[matryoshka]

... And when they do spook, they're quicker and more athletic about it than many other breeds would be. None of which is an indication of temperamental "failure."Have you ridden many Arabs? They teleport out from under the rider. I find TB spooks much easier to ride out, since thy aren't quite as agile as some of the other types of horses I've ridden.

I've had no problems taking OTTB's out alone...or no more than any other type of horse. When you think about it, few horses spend any time alone unless they are the only horse on a farm. They all have to adjust to being taken out alone. But OTTB's have a reputation, whether well earned or not, of being nuts. This hasn't been helped by the unethical practice of tranquilizing horses to make them appear calm, and the rider gets them home to find the horse is not what they thought. I've heard many such stories over the years.

Add to their reputation the idea of how fast they are once they get going, and you have a recipe for a nervous rider. One thing I noticed is that my OTTB's rarely wanted to run uncontrollably--it only happened at an endurance ride with many cantering horses and one galloping up behind us. Otherwise, they hit their working pace and hold to it. It is cool. They are trained to run at a good clip, stay in control, and to ease off after a while.

One suggestion I have is never to pull back on both reins at once. Jockeys bridge the reins, the horse leans on the bit, and they run holes in the wind. To keep them from becoming runaways, provide support but don't allow them to lean. To slow down or stop, use one rein at a time. If they do get too fast for comfort, it is important to get them off their forehand. My preferred method is to alternate reins until they give to me.

[DMK]

yeah, matroyshka, I've had some QHs drop and spin on a dime so fast that they did leave the proverbial nine cents change behind (and me), and ayrabs... well I have ridden them and suffice to say I respect them and know enough to know they aren't my cup of tea, but they too can leave the scene of the(ir) crime pretty damn fast.

The one thing I think most former racers have is a sense of power and speed and how to engage that engine from a standstill. It may not be a faster start gear than an arab or QH (who didn't race), but once it is engaged they know how to use the tools, so to speak. I think that undercurrent of a powerful engine overwhelms a lot of less experienced riders or even more experienced riders who have never really ridden a horse with a powerful "idle" speed.

[matryoshka]

... I think that undercurrent of a powerful engine overwhelms a lot of less experienced riders or even more experienced riders who have never really ridden a horse with a powerful "idle" speed.Yep, the intimidation factor. We're all susceptible at some point or another. This feeling of power is one of the things I miss about my excitable OTTB. There was nothing like him cruising through a field, wind whipping my face, and that easy gallop...

Bank on Frank is calmer, and he's a sprinter rather than a longer distance horse. He'll blow the doors off anything given a chance, but he doesn't have that easy, mile-eating gallop.

[ArtilleryHill]

But OTTB's have a reputation, whether well earned or not, of being nuts.

Yes, that's what I'm talking about. The reputation isn't always deserved! They might be different from what people are used to dealing with, but it doesn't make them nuts.

I spent much of my youth on Saddlebreds and one Arab, and both breeds were pretty damned quick. The OTTB I currently have is the quickest thing I personally have ever sat on. He's like a striking snake. But I'll defer to your greater experience with Arabs! And of course it varies from horse to horse. Another OTTB in our barn is a big fellow, and he seems to me to telegraph his spooks and execute them more slowly than my smaller horse does.

[Anyplace Farm]

Oh, I just wrote a long reponse and it timed out. Gotta love that.

In short, stick with it. I had one that was a nightmare at first out on trails and turned into a downright billy goat out there. He was great and loved going out. It was not pretty in the beginning.

Going out with a large group one time really helped.

Stick with it. Given time, they adapt. Imagine what life at the track was for him -- being kept in most of the time. Totally unnatural for a horse, right? He adapted, though, right?

Mine was 11 when I got him and had been off the track for years. It can be done.

[Jeannette, formerly ponygyrl]

Haven't had a chance to read all the responses, so apologies if this has been said already, but worth thinking about how many new elements you are introducing, and if there is a way to break it down into smaller steps - like, if just for instance you (not specifically *you* OP) have been walking in the ring at home, then you want to ship to another place to ride out of a ring in tall grass past a herd of cows, well, maybe you could first "trail ride" around your pasture.


Then maybe you could ship to a cow free ring first, and ride away from home in a ring.

Then maybe you could you could find a team penning day, and trailer over to watch that from the ground.

If you can find some tall grass which will tickle his belly while you graze and lead him through it, and THEN you take him away from home fro the trail ride past the cows, well, at least you have met the pieces individually.

I knnow my chicken OTTB is MUCH braver at a trot than a walk - and like others have said, machines are no worry - he just left a crowd clapping at his focus during a dressage lesson when a fork lift was moving plywood up a barn side while we rode. Never batted an eye. If it had been a squirrel, mind you, I likely would have felt more concern from him...

[grayarabpony]

I DID NOT TAKE HIM OUT ALONE.

Learn how to ride better then. Geez.

[2boys]

Learn how to ride better then. Geez.

Are you joking? That sentence was in regards to a few people recommending I take him out with a buddy. I think I made the impression at some point that I took him out alone. If you were not joking, thanks for the impressive insight--very deep.

In response to all of these wonderful and supportive posts, thanks again. My gut says that he can do it. What is in question, is whether I should have someone super brave give him mileage, or if I can do it. He has already brought me so far.....

[grayarabpony]

Of which I was one (suggested taking him out with another horse).

You will probably do fine riding this horse on the trail eventually. Can you take him out with some of his pasture buddies for a ride? Or even get someone to walk with you, lead him a little while if he gets upset.

Many of the horses I've ridden are OTTBs and they were very fun trail horses. Especially once they're settled and you can find an open space to gallop. :D

If he was my horse I'd work him in the ring, then take him for short walks away for cool-out too.

[2boys]

Of which I was one (suggested taking him out with another horse).

You will probably do fine riding this horse on the trail eventually. Can you take him out with some of his pasture buddies for a ride? Or even get someone to walk with you, lead him a little while if he gets upset.

Many of the horses I've ridden are OTTBs and they were very fun trail horses. Especially once they're settled and you can find an open space to gallop. :D

If he was my horse I'd work him in the ring, then take him for short walks away for cool-out too.

My summertime plans are to clear the acre and a half out back so that I can hack him out there after I ride. I am excited to do that. His pasturemates are both big, giant chickens, and would not be very helpful. In fact, I think that my qh is part of the problem...:sadsmile:

One error that I made last week, was to not do enough forward. I know that when he gets apprehensive about things, a nudge forward really helps. I was not brave enough to do that last week. I know that that would have helped, and many people have mentioned it, which is a terrific idea.

Thanks again for the advice everyone. If I seemed snippy, I apologize. I did not intend that. I just wanted to clarify, because I think that being alone vs. with a good buddy is a huge factor. I am one of the most humble, and "appreciative-for-any-help" horse people you could find.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

I am not sure what I am looking for. Maybe support, maybe ideas, maybe just to vent. I tried to take my ottb out for a trail ride yesterday, and we didn't really make it past grazing by the trailer. He was SO "up" and strong, I was NOT going to push any luck I may have. I felt like the slightest ANYTHING would send him into a complete freak out, causing both of us bodily harm. He is so mellow at home (aside from the occasional spook), but it is quiet there. I guess I would like suggestions in regards to making a horse into a confident, quiet trail horse. What does it take?:confused:


I haven't read this whole thread .... but if he is quiet at home...he will get quiet out on trail rides. It takes a rider who is confident and quiet to make him confident and quiet. If you can't do that...then get someone on him who can initially...that will then help you be able to give him a confident ride. I have taught many to trail ride alone...with no buddy horse...but it can be a lot easier with a quiet buddy.....I'm also a pretty confident and relaxed rider though too.


Start out small and slow. Work him at home so the edge is off...and then go somewhere new where it is also quiet...don't make your outings at a really busy busy location. With OTTBs....walking isn't always right there...so if he feels antsy when starting out...put him right to work forward. Not galloping or even cantering...but trotting. Ride to a point with purpose...even if it is just across the field. You have to pick a spot and ride to it...so he understands there is a purpose. Then see if he will walk a bit. Keep it short. And repeat often until he comfortable doing it.

I try to walk the most if they will tolerate it (speed--canter+--can rattle them more)...but sometimes you do have to go right into the trot work. Just remember...with a TB and especially an OTTB....you do not just run them off their feet and get to the bottom of them. So this is a mental exercise. Don't try and take him out on a trail after he hasn't been ridden in several days...and don't try and take him out on a really active trail ride....or on a windy (or worse, cool and windy) day

Most figure it out quickly and really enjoy it. I had a 100,000 stakes winning TB that after a few months of work, I put my dead dead beginner mom on for a walk (and a bit of trot) trail ride out on a 3,000 acre preserve.....and he happily packed her around like a saint.

[2boys]

Oh, why can't just one of you wise ottb lovers live close to me, looking for a fun project!?!?!?!:sadsmile:

[wendybird]

I haven't had a LOT to do with OTTbs, but one of my friends has them regularly and the first thing she does is turn them out with a steady paddock mate. Tbs mostly have no experience of living outside - some haven't a clue about fences and they need time to get used to the wide open spaces. Given that they can see for miles, it's no wonder that the world is strange and spooky to them when removed from the safety of their stalls and yards. If he could live out 24/7 he would get that exposure to nature that he needs and a steady mate would help him do it.
I hope all goes well for you. Cheers. W.

[2boys]

If he could live out 24/7 he would get that exposure to nature that he needs and a steady mate would help him do it.
I hope all goes well for you. Cheers. W.

He does live outside 24/7, but it is in a very wooded area. I strongly agree that the vast space was overwhelming for him. He didn't quite know where to look! Unfortunately, to turn him out in such a space is not really an option.:(

[Bogie]

I live west of Boston.

You are welcome to come and trail ride with me (and my OTTB) any time. I'm in a barn right on the trail system here . . . I find that my OTTbs do well if you start riding them on trails that are in the woods before you take them out to big open fields.

Oh, why can't just one of you wise ottb lovers live close to me, looking for a fun project!?!?!?!:sadsmile:

[2boys]

I live west of Boston.

You are welcome to come and trail ride with me (and my OTTB) any time. I'm in a barn right on the trail system here . . . I find that my OTTbs do well if you start riding them on trails that are in the woods before you take them out to big open fields.

Where are you? You can PM me if you'd like. :)

[Anyplace Farm]

He does live outside 24/7, but it is in a very wooded area. I strongly agree that the vast space was overwhelming for him. He didn't quite know where to look! Unfortunately, to turn him out in such a space is not really an option.:(
My OTTB was the exact opposite. He liked the open space because you can see the boogie man coming. When I moved him from a 500 acre farm to a small private farm with woods right up against everything, he was more worried because he mostly could not see the deer stalking us until they bounded out of the woods and across the bottom of the ring. Like all horses, in time, he got it and understood the deer had no interest in eating him and he settled. He was just amazing about the deer after awhile. Had several literally bound up from naps right next to him and he'd barely flinch.

[Beverley]

He does live outside 24/7, but it is in a very wooded area. I strongly agree that the vast space was overwhelming for him. He didn't quite know where to look! Unfortunately, to turn him out in such a space is not really an option.:(


Ah, woods. Let me tell you a tale- probably doesn't apply in your case, but ya never know.

One fine day while hunting in the piney forests of Arizona, my horse was just A. Basket. Case. Couldn't figure out why. Next day, hunting in the open sagebrush, he was fine. My lightbulb finally went on days later after much pondering. He'd been born and raised in desert/open spaces and had never been in tall trees before. Logically he assumed there was a predator in every tree. The next summer I made a point of taking him into the mountains and on the trails, he was fine in meadows, tense and holding his breath in the woods. After enough trail rides/mileage he got over his fear of the woods, even where cattle or sheep lurked behind the trees- but it wasn't an issue that it had ever previously occurred to me to think about!

[lizathenag]

I ride my excellent OTTB on the same trail several times a week. I didn't get out for a week and the flowers had bloomed. Evidently they were the horse eating kind.

oh well.

[2boys]

I ride my excellent OTTB on the same trail several times a week. I didn't get out for a week and the flowers had bloomed. Evidently they were the horse eating kind.

oh well.

:lol:

[jengersnap]

Mine loves trails, trees, obsticles, things to make her think. She's not as great in open spaces but a trot will usually be enough to get the wiggles out. Otherwise, if there's lots going on she's comfortable just looking and watching and observing it all. I second the idea of either riding with a confident horse/rider pair (or more then one!) or let someone more confident then you are feeling ride him out and you take a companion instead. He needs someone who telegraphs nothing but calm acceptance of the world around him in the saddle for the first few rides until he gets that "I'm the MAN" swaggeringly confident stride so many of our TBs are known for. It's the rider that reaffirms all is well.

[Anyplace Farm]

Something else you might try if you have no one to ride out with is to strike out on foot, leading the horse tacked up. I'd probably put a halter over the bridle with a good, long, safe lead. Wear gloves. Bring a stick. Go for a hike w/your horse, you leading the way. Most horses are happy to follow with you leading the way because this way, they aren't the first to get gobbled up by the boogie monster.

Decide at what point you want to turn around, do so and mount and ride back home. What horse doesn't love to go back home?

Keep your trek short initially, then building the length of the ride. Eventually, he'll most likely feel comfortable with the trail because the two of you have taken it together enough.

If he is still jumpy on your way back, then be prepared to walk more of a distance on the way back and get on at a point where you are fairly certain that he'll be comfortable 'leading the way' with you on his back.

[chism]

IMO you evaluate a horse for purchase and use on three criteria:

Temperment
Conformation
Way of going

Sadly a huge number of OTTBs fail on the first criteria. This is not such a surprise, as they were bred and born for one thing: running fast.

Put another way, genetics counts.

The training they receive re-inforces this breeding.

A percentage can sometimes do other things (hunting, dressage, jumping) but a really distressingly large number seem to be unable to get past their breeding and training.

Some horses are never going to make good trail mounts. They just don't have the temperment for it. If that's the case the owner should sell them and find one that does. Trying to fit this "square peg into a round hole" leads to frustration and, not infrequently, injury. It's just not worth it.

G.

I have to respectfully submit that this is NOT solely an OTTB issue. I've known many non TB's that are unsafe out on a trail & I know many OTTB's that trail ride beautifully. It's all about giving them positive experiences so they can be confident. I own four OTTB's, whom I bought right off the track. Every single one of them trail rides like a champ, three of them will even go out alone now. It takes time & patience. Temperament is not breed specific.

[AlfalfaGirl]

I don't have an OTTB but I do have an OTQH! Red raced for 3 years with some success..garnering an AQHA Register of Merit in racing with a .98 AAA speed index. He does have quiet a bit of TB blood and is built somewhat like a smaller TB.

I wanted a trail horse. Red's former owner turned him out in the pasture after racing for a rest and occasionally rode him around her property. He never spooks at machinery, trucks, cars, etc. Most race horses don't. They are used to all kinds of stuff rattling around.

I got hurt trying a horse (after 26 years of not riding) last November so I am not anxious to get my leg the color of purple anytime soon so I am a cautious rider that had to get back into a groove of riding. I started in the arena. My husband started riding Red out of the arena first and around the marsh trails near by. I rode on my 50th birthday out on the trails with my husband on a borrowed very calm trail horse. Red went along quietly. Two days later I went with a friend. He spooked at something (we think it was a snake) but all he did was jump like a pawn forward and to the left and stopped dead in his tracks. He is not spooky thank goodness. I started slow following other horses that were used to these trails. I have slowly increased my own confidence.

I took him up to his former owners and we followed her horse and Red would follow former owner anywhere...even going through water that he always acted like was liquid fire. Following her gave ME confidence too.

Once I trailered him to ride which a group of gals in my new Brenderup. Got to the trail and there was a huge motorcycle thing going on. I got on Red (trails were wet, muddy and yukky) and he was acting like someone charged him up. I ended up getting off, walking him, and putting him back in the trailer and took him home. I guess the trailer ride in a totally different ramp trailer, the loud cycles and mud were too much for me. Red would have probably calmed down but I didn't have the cajones at the time. I am working on me, too!

Red is a pretty lazy kinda laid back guy which is great for me. I did take him on a big trail ride sponsored by former owners Cowboy Church. It was his first trail ride with lots of horses. I trailered him for 75 miles to get there. We had to tack his shoe back on and get in another trailer and go 8 miles to the trail head. Red was pretty excited by that time. Off we go and he is having a good time. He wants to be at the front and I was having to hold back this normally lazy slow moving former race horse. He got right up behind the wagon being pulled by mules with music blaring right in his face and he loved it. I think Red thought he was back at the race track...lots of people...lots of horses...the wagon I think he thought was the starting gate! :lol: :lol: :lol:

We rode 7.5 miles down roads that were either sandy or rocky and stopped for 2 hours at former owners house for lunch. Started off again and he got REALLY over done by the wagons taking off. Later, truck going by I pulled into a driveway and he started going sideways and I tried to move him forward but he didn't want to go through the ditch. He backed into a yucca plant :eek: poked himself in the butt, sidestepped across the front of the ditch and former owner came across the ditch and grabbed his halter and led me out. That day we rode 14.5 miles through water half way up to his knees following former owner, had horses with teenagers blast by, blaring music, cranky mules that were throwing themselves over when we would stop to rest, 18 wheelers, trucks, cars going by, crossed bridges, etc.

It did a TON for my own confidence. I was able to control Red when he was obviously quiet excited, and had a blast doing it.

I ride out on the ranch on a regular basis with the girls there. They are riding Arabian, and Tennessee Walkers and Quarter Horses. So different temperments going on. Every ride makes me more confident and Red more confident.

Go slow and introduce him and yourself to how he reacts. Don't be afraid to pack it in...I have and I am glad I did. I do NOT want a repeat of last year. I am afraid if I was thrown like that again I would never ride again. We just bought my husband a horse that was trained for cutting and team penning. He is not a relaxed trail horse at all and we are slowly introducing him to the trails.

Try to go with someone experienced and that is on a trusty old trail horse as others have suggested. It makes a difference in your horse and you too.

Sorry to drag this out but I am working with the same thing right now. My horse is coming along pretty good but he still has a long way to go.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

IMO you evaluate a horse for purchase and use on three criteria:

Temperment
Conformation
Way of going

Sadly a huge number of OTTBs fail on the first criteria. This is not such a surprise, as they were bred and born for one thing: running fast.

Put another way, genetics counts.

The training they receive re-inforces this breeding.

A percentage can sometimes do other things (hunting, dressage, jumping) but a really distressingly large number seem to be unable to get past their breeding and training.

Some horses are never going to make good trail mounts. They just don't have the temperment for it. If that's the case the owner should sell them and find one that does. Trying to fit this "square peg into a round hole" leads to frustration and, not infrequently, injury. It's just not worth it.

G.



Bullsh&t. I've had over a dozen OTTBs....ALL of them dead quiet on trail rides (in company and alone)...good minds and very nice horses. Hell....I had a stakes winning well bred OTTB who could pack a dead dead beginner out on trail rides when he was less than a year into his re-training. He was also fantastic alone.

IME...it is the exception to have an OTTB that isn't good out hacking quietly on the trails. And yes...there are exceptions.

BUT they do require a good rider to re-train them off the track. Someone who knows what they are doing. They do need to be on a knowledgable feeding program....and some need to be in consistent work and have good turn out. Really...this can apply to a whole lot of horses...not just OTTBs.


Although I do have one that I can get right on after months off....including months of stall rest...and go right out on a trail ride on the buckle. Just like any horse though....riders must find horses who match their abilities and personalities. And an OTTB right off the track isn't one that I would recommend for begginers or someone without experience in green horses.

[Vesper Sparrow]

If you watch enough races, you'll see that the horses who just bolt often don't win anything. The ones who have good heads, who can deal with the excitement of a race, can be steered through the pack and rated when they need to be, do win. Plus, OTTBs have to learn to deal with the distractions of a crowd, all the equipment and hubbub of the track and paddock and, last but not least, the starting gate--all while being fed massive amounts of grain and not getting much turnout. They have to be trainable and have reasonably good heads.

From what I can see, TBs vary in temperament just like any other breed. At my barn, we have TBs who are quiet as can be on the trail and warmbloods and draft crosses who no one would want to take on a trail ride.

[cashin_IN]

SING! or say your ABCs, count whatever. it will make you fell stupid and relax you if your horse acts up. i have done a few trail rides with my OTTBs making the WHOOOO hooo (the hooo in a lower tone)sound almost the whole time while making circles til i was dizzy. i had my OTTB (he had already been retrained) 10 days and hitched a ride with friends to an out of state trail ride/camping weekend (since he was perfect at home, even rode out alone). we saddled, everything was great.... til two kids galloped past us... and all hell broke loose. after jigging for at least a mile, me close to tears (because i am a wimp, with an affinity for Tbs that can kill me), i got off, and walked. he calmed, i got back on, and made lots of circles anytime he got excited or upset. ain't much they can do with their heads on your knee. eventually he calmed and the next day he was lovely.
fast forward a few years, my OTTB rides double at night at the big 3-400 horse trail ride campsites. and gallops through the woods like freaking Cigar!

my point in this rambling post is: you have got to work through your fear. or fake it til you make it. son't be afraid to get off and walk, don't be afraid to talk or sing or BREATHE! trust me they know when you're not breathing, it makes you tense.

[soduswoods]

i retrain tbs to trail ride. but first are you taking a fresh horse out. does your horse relax in the pasture. or are you trying to take a stalled fresh horse out. lungeing will not really help here since it is being able to be comfortable in the great out doors.
all my horses go out on trails it doesnt matter if they are off yesterday or last yr. it is also how you handle strange situations do you tense up. if you show any fear here that is how they will remember it. if it is just another day riding then they adapt very well. I have no ring and any riding is out on the trails.
also take longer trails that gives them time to get excited, then tired lastly relax and find out it is not so scary. if you are relaxed and can handle the horse galloping, if he is a quiet galloper this works allow him to gallop as long as he wants. don't go fast just a canter speed is good until they relax. then let him come down to a walk, most tbs are taught to gallop it is a relaxing exercise for them once they do so they can relax they do know once they are done galloping they walk back home.
also just trail ride for a while once they understand it is just a other way to ride they look forward to the ride.

[matryoshka]

i... if he is a quiet galloper this works allow him to gallop as long as he wants. don't go fast just a canter speed is good until they relax. then let him come down to a walk, most tbs are taught to gallop it is a relaxing exercise for them once they do so they can relax they do know once they are done galloping they walk back home...I have found this to be true. My boy would get all worked up and lathered when held to a walk but would dry out and relax once allowed to gallop. However, he only got to gallop as a reward for keeping to the pace I set at the beginning of the ride. There is no point in allowing them to think they get to gallop every ride as soon as they get to an open field. Not saying you suggested this, but if done very often, it becomes a habit. We need to change their expectations, not pander to them. JMHO.