Does this really happen - a 5 month old in a lead line class?

[Bravestrom]

I saw an ad on another forum looking for show clothes for a 5 month old - 17lbs baby - to show in leadline - the mom will be holding her on a horse - do they even make approved helmets that small

This boggles my mind that anyone would put a baby this young - that probably can't even hold it's head - because you can't put babies under 9 months in a bike carrier for that reason - and they are risking putting her on a horse in a lead line class.

Does this happen alot?

IMHO - this is ridiculous and should not be allowed or am I just too safety conscious?

[dghunter]

I knew a child who did lead line at about 6 months. I know lots of people who say "first sat on a horse at x months". Not so much showing in lead line but like walking around with people holding them. In this child's case he was on a small pony and his father was walking and supporting his head/back. I never really thought anything of it to be honest but I've also never had kids, just babysat them.

[5]

I could imagine it in one of those wicker basket saddles.

[FalseImpression]

I so agree with you. My son's girlfriend has been provoking me and I do my best not to take the bait... luckily she is 10 hours from me. Yesterday, she was telling me she finally got back on her mare, first time in 2 years... mare reared 3 times... no helmet of course... then because her 9 months old daughter (our granddaughter) was crying that she wanted a ride, she took her on the mare in front of her in the saddle...

I cannot believe my son would condone this (he always wear his helmet on his bike), but I don't think he was even present. Anyway, since she has made it clear she does not really want us in her daughter's life, I keep my mouth shut and hope for the best.... I truly, at this point, don't care if mother has fallen a hundred times and never got hurt... she is endangering an infant's life, but I have no say.

[Kate66]

5 months seems a little odd, although in reality if the Mom is holding the baby on and someone else leading the horse, it's not such a big deal. We took our daughter, aged 15 months (and weighing 15lbs) in a Halloween leadline class, she and the horse were dressed as pumpkins. We had one person leading the horse and one person at either side just holding her on, no saddle and no helmet, but in reality it's a horse that will barely move and I reckoned with one person holding her firmly on either side there wasn't a great deal of risk.

[Renae]

Yes people do it, but yikes!

No leadline pony rides at home until baby is able to sit up on its own very well.

No leadline classes at shows at least until baby has strong enough legs and good enough balance to walk- and still person sidewalking with baby!

[Petstorejunkie]

i was in my first show at 16 months but i think there is a huge difference in development there. 7 months old is pushing it way too far.

[Woodland]

There was a lady with a baby at the open show we were at Sunday - had that kid on with her most of the day - no helmet no vest - nothing! I was trying so hard not to watch!!! :no:

[Meredith Clark]

That's so funny to me! i was never allowed to do lead-line because my mom thought it was stupid to have a division for kids who "couldn't really ride yet" :lol:

I know that some lead-liners are really doing most of the work, but I agree with her to some extent. I see kids crying and screaming that they want to get off all the time with the parents holding them on the horse, or kids just plopped there obviously not knowing anything about riding yet and not really benefiting from showing. What's the point?

This would never happen in my family:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2347/2531427111_5edb88b832.jpg?v=0

but gosh it's cute

[MHM]

This would never happen in my family:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2347/2531427111_5edb88b832.jpg?v=0

but gosh it's cute

I love the fact that the ring at Devon was perfectly dragged for the leadline! :lol:

That being said, I am not a fan of teeny children in leadline. It's just not safe. I've seen a couple of leadline classes when a pony was not perfect, and things went south in a hurry. Any pony (or horse) can have a bad moment, and that's all it takes for a kid to get hurt.

When the kids are really small, they remind me of Cabbage Patch dolls dressed up in riding clothes and plopped on the saddle. :rolleyes:

[IrishKharma]

I admit- I took my 2 1/2 yr old daughter in a leadline class on my 18 yr old mare. I drove to the show specifically just for that class. I prepared the tack, horse, clipped, braided etc.- Just for leadline class.

I realized how inappropriate it was after I had to pick up my daughter from the ground at the line up when my mare shook.

Luckily my daughter was ok (did have a helmet and boots on). She still likes to ride, but I am sooooo cautious now and that was just a good eye opener.

The parent's are doing it for themselves not for the child.

[MHM]

I realized how inappropriate it was after I had to pick up my daughter from the ground at the line up when my mare shook.



Perfect example- the horse doesn't even have to do anything bad for a kid to hit the dirt.

[bumknees]

I went to a local contesting show a few weeks back and someone took that almost 1yo child into all the contesting classes. The kid did have a helmet on because it is required by law here. But the kid couldnt even walk yet. It was a moment of Why bother??? Then I saw who it was and I understood exactaly why the baby was in the class... The grandmother and parents of the kid well ill just say are anot the brightest lightbulbs in hte box... They kinda went into a tizzy when the pony ( maybe a mini) stopped and the kid slid off.. Proceeded to scold the pony... Like I said not the brightest lightbulbs in the box.

[copper1]

I sat my daughter on a pony when she was 6 weeks old. I was of course, standing there, holding her. She went in a lead line class at a local open show when 6months old- two of us walking at her side, while another led the horse. She loved the horses from the beginning and 23 years later is still passionate about them. I see no problem with letting wee ones sit on a quiet horse or pony and having a gentle walk around with all reasonable precautions being taken.

[mvp]

Whatever. Who cares what other people do with their kids?

I think the can't-yet-hold-her-head-up stage kid in the leadline isn't really about the kid, but about the parents. I think the pomp and circumstance around the leadline in general (Huge Deal at Devon) is kinda stupid too, but at least some of the kids really dig it.

But why does the rest of the world care what parents do with their babies?

[trubandloki]

I see no problem with letting wee ones sit on a quiet horse or pony and having a gentle walk around with all reasonable precautions being taken.

I totally agree.

I have to agree with FalseImpression that what she describes is pretty darn wrong and dangerous. But there is nothing wrong with a kid being led around on a horse when they are little.

[hey101]

But why does the rest of the world care what parents do with their babies?

As I currently have a 5-month old, I would be inordinately grateful to you if you ever figure out the answer to this question. BECAUSE THEY DO! Having a child seems to make the rest of the world - complete strangers mind you- qualified and more than willing to stop you in your tracks and weigh in on exactly what you are doing wrong with said child. it's 10,000,000 times worse than nosy horse people feeling the need to weigh in on what you are doing wrong with your horse.

For me the hot-and-cold thing seems to be a big issue. For my horse and my kid! :lol: We moved from Pennsylvania to Southern California a few years ago and therefore I really feel no need to blanket my horse at all. Ever. Even during "winter". Yet I routinely get questioned as to why I don't have a sheet or blanket on my horse during "winter". Um, because it's only down to 45 deg at night, 70 during the day, and I don't clip and the mare sweats if I put something on her?

Same with the kid. My child seems to be a hot sista. If I bundle her up, she sweats and gets clammy and cries to let me know she's annoyed at me. Well I'm not stupid and no one wants to listen to a crying baby, so I figured out pretty damn quick exactly how to dress her to keep her at the temperature that she would like to be. Most of the time that includes NO hat and NO socks. And yet to the strangers on the street, I'm this shy of child abuse. I swear they have their itchy trigger finger on the cell phone to call child services and report me for making my baby suffer in the cold (cold being 70 degrees and sunny)

As to putting a 5-month old on a pony? Not my cuppa. But I"m not weighing in on anyone else doing it- it's their kid and their pony and their risk. My kid will be waiting a few more years (hopefully the rest of her life if my husband has anything to say about it- one crazy horse chick in the family is enough, in his opinion)! ;)

[wendy]

That's so funny to me! i was never allowed to do lead-line because my mom thought it was stupid to have a division for kids who "couldn't really ride yet"

I've always been mystified by "leadline". Also mystified by baby beauty pageants. Let the poor things grow up and accomplish REAL things.

[mvp]

Why the collective and fussy parenting?

If you read sociologists/psychologists/demographers, then the answer to the nosey peeps might have two sources. First, the pressure to optimize kids (as we have fewer) is tremendous. Your 5-month old shouldn't be in leadline but studying some BabyEinstein thing. Is there BabyEinsteinEquitation?

Second, the divide between the kidded and kidless is also widening causing all kinds of pressure. The kidded want their treasures to be the best, while the kidless don't want to put up with kids who are just kids and not well-behaved, miniature adults.

As to your hot kid in Cali. As an adult, I moved from NorCal to the East and my body spent the first year figuring out how to be the right temp. That could be true for your kid, too. Just putting some reality into words for the not-talking yet.

Hopes this helps and dress your mute dependents as you see fit. Screw the comments from others.

[trubandloki]

I've always been mystified by "leadline". Also mystified by baby beauty pageants. Let the poor things grow up and accomplish REAL things.

Leadline fills a spot for people who have a younger kid that wants to participate at horse shows but is not able to do the self steering stuff yet.

And Yes, I suppose they could tell the youngster they are not old enough to show but heck, it is fun.

I really do not see it as anything close to the baby beauty pageant thing.

[Ajierene]

This would never happen in my family:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2347/2531427111_5edb88b832.jpg?v=0

but gosh it's cute

Someone starting riding at my barn in high school and was bragging about how they were in Devon. Come to find out, they were in the leadline division, which requires one A-rated leadline ribbon to qualify or something. Yeah, some great rider.

Personally, leadline, the Greenhorn at some horse trial - not worth my money. If someone else wants to, have at it.

[MunchkinsMom]

I'll just give my two cents worth as a "lead-line Mom".

My daughter did her first leadline class about 2 months shy of her third birthday. She was able to sit up on her own, and knew to "grab the horn" if she felt the least bit off balance. When we got to the end (lineup time) she said "but Mom, I want to ride more!" I told her this was the part where we get the ribbons, then she was happy.

We did leadline after that until she aged out of it, and yes, there were some shows were all I did was showmanship and leadline, then we headed home.

I found that it depended on the show and the judge as to just how serious it was. My daughter was year-end reserve champion her last lead line year in two clubs, and one of them was really tough, with something like 18-20 kids in each class, and they had a whole division with 3 classes (pleasure, trail and equitation), and they were judged on how well the child was actually riding and controlling the horse, the leader was there just as a safety precaution. The other club (an AQHA state affiliate), the class was more of a "beauty pagent", not really judged on ability. At those shows, there were only a handful of kids.

Would I do leadline with a 5 month old child? Absolutely not.

[blton9th]

yes, it really does happen! Two years ago @ Devon I saw a fetus in the lead line class. I still can picture it ever so clearly in my mind, I have to say it was the tiniest little infant. Good/bad/indifferent/ I have my own children to parent what others want to do w/their children is not my business!

[contesstant]

I admit- I took my 2 1/2 yr old daughter in a leadline class on my 18 yr old mare. I drove to the show specifically just for that class. I prepared the tack, horse, clipped, braided etc.- Just for leadline class.

I realized how inappropriate it was after I had to pick up my daughter from the ground at the line up when my mare shook.

Luckily my daughter was ok (did have a helmet and boots on). She still likes to ride, but I am sooooo cautious now and that was just a good eye opener.

The parent's are doing it for themselves not for the child.

This is SO true. I have a 2 yr old. (2 years 4 months.) I have no intention of putting her on a horse until SHE asks to get on one. To me, it just seems like an unnecessary risk. That being said, to each his own. Unless I see something blatantly dangerous, I'm not one to go up to another parent and tell them how to do things with their kids.

[lcw579]

This would never happen in my family:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2347/2531427111_5edb88b832.jpg?v=0

but gosh it's cute

Hey! I know that pair!

yes, it really does happen! Two years ago @ Devon I saw a fetus in the lead line class. I still can picture it ever so clearly in my mind, I have to say it was the tiniest little infant. Good/bad/indifferent/ I have my own children to parent what others want to do w/their children is not my business!

Oh Yeah - seen plenty of those! Was it in a wicker basket? When I was a kid I remember there were always a few of those tiny tiny tots (all in flowing white IIRC) strapped atop saintly ponies in the Devon leadline.

[DeeThbd]

Maybe as someone who works with kids I can give some insight about why we pipe up and comment...
I'll talk about one child in particular, whose mother's substance habits during pregnancy has caused him to be born with severe mental and physical handicaps, which have left him unable to function independently, live independently and work independently. His particular problems are somewhat similar to those a person could experience from a bad fall from a horse.
So....taking that parallel, if something does happen to the child who is too young to safely ride and he/she is hurt, the parent isn't going to live in a cocoon caring for that child....he or she still has to go to school, perhaps need special education in school (which is funded by taxpayers), extra medical care (and we often see benefits and fundraisers for people injured in riding accidents), and in some cases will need (expensive) lifetime care.
If a parent is willing to foot the risk AND all of the needs of the child AND all of the costs of a lifetime of special care, then go for it.
But the minute the rest of us are expected to pay for it, do we not have some say if you are putting your child at risk? And no, the money is NOT my first concern - the well-being of the child is. An adult can make the judgement for himself or herself, but has different responsibilities when entrusted with the care of a child.
Just sayin'.
Dee

[trubandloki]

So....taking that parallel, if something does happen to the child who is too young to safely ride and he/she is hurt,

When does a person become old enough to safely ride? I fell off and got banged up quite a bit the other day so obviously 43 is not old enough.


I agree that toddlers should not be plopped on a horse and walked away from. I see nothing wrong with a toddler on a horse with a person standing there holding on to them. And of course once kids start riding they should wear proper safety equipment. I have never seen a kid in lead line not wearing a helmet.

[MHM]

When does a person become old enough to safely ride? I fell off and got banged up quite a bit the other day so obviously 43 is not old enough.




Presumably at the age of 43, you chose to get on the horse yourself, and chose to take the risk of falling off and getting hurt.

I'm guessing you weren't dressed up and plopped on the horse for the entertainment of your parents.

[wendy]

Leadline fills a spot for people who have a younger kid that wants to participate at horse shows but is not able to do the self steering stuff yet.


I don't see anything wrong with putting a child on a pony and leading it around at home but the showing part? what are you "showing"? showing is supposed to be about showing off your hard-earned skills. I'm an aging adult and I'd like to participate in more shows, but I know full-well it would be pointless due to lack of skills despite hard work. If you can't even steer why attempt to "show"? show WHAT?

[chai]

Leadline for a 5 month old child is, imho, too dangerous. Two of my kids did leadline, but not until they were 5 and able to post because trotting is required. I have seen pictures of infants in leadline baskets and imho it is an accident waiting to happen.

I think jostling a 5 month old child around in a basket on the back of a pony is crazy...how different is it from shaking a baby and we know how dangerous that is. Not to mention what could happen if the pony spooks and the baby is in a basket. If the Mom wants to be in a horse show that badly, she can take some lessons, buy an outfit and get herself in the ring until her kid is old enough to ride.

[onelanerode]

I don't have any issues with leadline classes. You've got to start somewhere, and for some kids, that's where you start.

But a 5-month-old?! Oh HELL no. :eek::no::o

IMVHO, the only riding a 5-month-old should be doing is a 10-second photo op while being held by one parent the whole time, just in case Old Nell does decide to react to that horsefly or motorcycle going by or what have you.

[trubandloki]

Presumably at the age of 43, you chose to get on the horse yourself, and chose to take the risk of falling off and getting hurt.

I'm guessing you weren't dressed up and plopped on the horse for the entertainment of your parents.

I am not talking about the five month old here. I totally think that is too young for a lead line class.

But I must know different little kids than you do.

I know two little ones who totally beg their mother to let them do lead line at any show they are at (their mother braids).

They most certainly are not up there to entertain their mother. They choose to be up there.

[MHM]

Trubandloki, I've seen both kinds of kids doing leadline. The ones who are thrilled about the chance to show off their riding skills, and the ones who are dragged into it, or are so young they're oblivious.

I have no problem with the thrilled ones. It's the other kids who bother me, partly because they're not enjoying it, and partly because I don't want to see them get hurt.

I recall one leadline class last year when a very small child was on a pony who freaked out. The pony started spinning in a circle around the handler, the child's foot was caught in the stirrup, and the whole situation could have ended VERY badly. The handler was trying to grab the kid with one hand and stop the pony with the other hand at the same time, which she was unable to do. At that point, the judge ran over, grabbed the pony's head to stop it, and got the kid's foot out of the stirrup.

I remember another leadline class when a child started to cry and scream because she did not want to participate. The mother ended up carrying her child with one arm while she led the pony around the ring. :rolleyes:

Like many aspects of horse showing, leadline can be done in a fun and relatively safe fashion, or it can be done in a scary and unsafe way.

Personally, I vote for the fun and safe approach.

[hey101]

Presumably at the age of 43, you chose to get on the horse yourself, and chose to take the risk of falling off and getting hurt.

I'm guessing you weren't dressed up and plopped on the horse for the entertainment of your parents.

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Great mental image! Thanks for a good :lol::lol:!

[Hunter Mom]

Leadline fills a spot for people who have a younger kid that wants to participate at horse shows but is not able to do the self steering stuff yet.

And Yes, I suppose they could tell the youngster they are not old enough to show but heck, it is fun.

I really do not see it as anything close to the baby beauty pageant thing.

I think likening leadline to pageants is like comparing potatoes to helium. Not even remotely the same.

My daughter began taking lessons at 4. She soon learned to walk & trot, then canter, and has now (age 7) begun jumping little cross rails. When we go to local shows, she goes into appropriate classes. However, she's not ready for rated shows' short stirrup divisions yet. She does, however, LOVE doing leadline at the bigger shows. She feels like she's doing the same thing as the bigger girls we ride with, and loves the atmosphere. That said, she is always in an approved helmet. As a mom, I love seeing her so happy.