Rachel out of Belmont Stakes

[ArtilleryHill]

Statement by Jess Jackson on behalf of Stonestreet Stables and Harold
McCormick:

“Rachel Alexandra is an incredible thoroughbred who has proven to be
the best three year old in racing today. We are elated by all the
attention her wins in the Oaks and Preakness has garnered the sport.
The many letters and emails we have received from young girls and racing
enthusiasts lets us know that many fans are proud of Rachel. When we
purchased Rachel, our goal was to restore the sport’s vitality and
grow its fan base by extending the racing careers of its stars.

After careful consideration, we have decided not to run Rachel
Alexandra in the Belmont Stakes next weekend. We have advised Calvin
Borel, Chip Woolley and Belmont of our decision. We thank them, the
media and the fans for their many courtesies and patience while we
pondered.

We know the media and many fans would have liked to see her run in the
Belmont Stakes — we feel the same. But all of us sincerely interested
in the horse must agree that we only want to see her run when it is best
for her. While she is in great shape, having strong works, and
recovering well from her amazing performances, we feel Rachel deserves a
well-earned vacation. Since March 14, Rachel has won four graded races
with just two weeks rest between her last two victories. We will always
put her long-term well being first. And, of course, we want to run her
when she is fresh.

Rachel, her owners, her trainers and her fans can continue to
anticipate an exciting campaign. All major races will be considered as
we look to the rest of Rachel’s racing career.”

[DLee]

Relieved.

[vineyridge]

Relieved.
Totally predictable. And predicted at least here.

[sophie]

Relieved here, as well.

[haligator]

Relieved also! RA deserves some time off. Am looking forward to seeing her this summer!

Hallie
Hallie I. McEvoy
Racing Dreams, LLC

[Gunnar]

Thanks! :sadsmile: Poor RA must be tired! :no: I still love her and will have to root for MTB! :cool:

[Barnfairy]

Well thank God that's been announced so we can all move on now.

Don't forget to look for Rachel A. in the August issue of Vogue (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/51005/rachel-poses-for-vogue-bird-gallops).

*BF frames her face with hands*

Strike a pose!

[cloudyandcallie]

Good for the owners! She needs to rest and run in the breeder's cup.

And she'll be in Vogue? Great. (My aussie's mother was in Vogue in 1971 and I still have a copy of it given me by the breeder when i bought my dog then.)

So now I'll root for MTB, unless a filly pops up to run against him.

[grayarabs]

Asking because I don't know. How could one compare the racing schedules past months of RA and MTB? She has raced in more - closer together - hence needing a rest?
(more than MTB).

[iloverocky]

[QUOTE=Barnfairy;4130269]
Don't forget to look for Rachel A. in the August issue of Vogue (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/51005/rachel-poses-for-vogue-bird-gallops).
QUOTE]

I guess the photo in the article is RA being led to (or maybe from) the photo shoot? If so, I wish they had left her mane unbraided as she is just gorgeous with her mane down.

[Barnfairy]

Asking because I don't know. How could one compare the racing schedules past months of RA and MTB? She has raced in more - closer together - hence needing a rest?
(more than MTB).RA has campaigned pretty intensely this year, winning every time out, usually in graded company:

Feb 15 - Martha Washington S @ Oaklawn (AK), 8F

March 14 - Fair Grounds Oaks @ Fair Grounds (LA), 8.5F, G2

Apr 5 - Fantasy Stakes @ Oaklawn, 8.5F, G2

May 1 - Kentucky Oaks, 9F, G1

May 16 - Preakness Stakes, 9.5F, G1

Until she came up against MTB, Rachel made most of her wins look easy.



Here's MTB's history at 3 for comparison:

Feb 28 - 2nd in the Borderland Derby @ Sunland Park (NM), 8.5F

Mar 29 - 4th in the Sunland Derby, 9F

May 2 - 1st in the Kentucky Derby, 10F, G1

May 16 - 2nd in the Preakness, 9.5F, G1

[luvmytbs]

[quote=Barnfairy;4130269]


I guess the photo in the article is RA being led to (or maybe from) the photo shoot? If so, I wish they had left her mane unbraided as she is just gorgeous with her mane down.

That photo was taken on the front side of CD after one if her races.

[iloverocky]

[quote=iloverocky;4130393]
That photo was taken on the front side of CD after one if her races.

It must have been some time after the Preakness? The Wiggins' barn didn't braid her mane for her races.

She is a lovely girl anytime, but I think a simple loose pulled mane really makes her stand out.

Her winning the Oaks:
http://blog.indianracing.in/wp-content/uploads/1090/2009/05/rachel-alexandra-z.jpg

Her winning the Preakness:
http://blog.al.com/birmingham-news-sports/2009/05/large_Preakness%20winner.jpg

[MintHillFarm]

I agree with her connections and happy to see that Rachel will get a well deserved break.

[rcloisonne]

I agree with her connections and happy to see that Rachel will get a well deserved break.
Oh good grief! Whatever happened to TBs who could run multiple heats of several miles per day without getting "tired"? Three weeks off isn't enough for her?

Horses like Exterminator ran (and won quite a few) actual races every few days, often carrying tremendous weight. He ran for many years and lived to the ripe old age of 30. Don't they build 'em like that anymore?

The Belmont is not a race for this filly even if she weren't "tired". Her connections know that. Nothing I saw in the Preakness made me think she has the stamina for the longer distance.

[Laurierace]

[quote=iloverocky;4130393]

That photo was taken on the front side of CD after one if her races.

That is definitely the stretch at Pimlico. Maybe they were schooling her in the paddock.

[Beezer]

Oh good grief! Whatever happened to TBs who could run multiple heats of several miles per day without getting "tired"? Three weeks off isn't enough for her?

Horses like Exterminator ran (and won quite a few) actual races every few days, often carrying tremendous weight. He ran for many years and lived to the ripe old age of 30. Don't they build 'em like that anymore?



And we also used to go cross-country in stagecoaches, ships were the only way to cross oceans, mail was delivered by the Pony Express and -- gasp! -- there was no such thing as the Internet. Things change.

As great a horse as Exterminator was, today's horses, under today's racing conditions, would have him beat. Just like today's race cars would blow the doors off yesterday's models.

It was a no-brainer for RA not to run in the Belmont; Jess Jackson is many things, but a stupid businessman is not one of them.

[Lori T]

Whew! Now I can talk! Well, somewhat..Calvin has felt that RA was not recovered enough to ride in the Belmont. Calvin made the right choice, they all did, they all put the horse first, as it should be. I think we can all say we are relieved!

[Daydream Believer]

Oh good grief! Whatever happened to TBs who could run multiple heats of several miles per day without getting "tired"? Three weeks off isn't enough for her?

Horses like Exterminator ran (and won quite a few) actual races every few days, often carrying tremendous weight. He ran for many years and lived to the ripe old age of 30. Don't they build 'em like that anymore?

The Belmont is not a race for this filly even if she weren't "tired". Her connections know that. Nothing I saw in the Preakness made me think she has the stamina for the longer distance.

Ditto that! Even Man O' War raced weekends back to back.

I agree also that she just doesn't have the mile and half in her against the likes of MTB who clearly does.

[ivy62]

Agreed, I am glad about the choice. I do not want to see another horse pushed beyond it's limits for greed. I like RA and respect her as a great horse. I hope she is with us for many years to come as a racer.....before the breeding shed...
I think the loose mane does her neck justice...A good rest she needs after her schedule..and I am sure that MTB will need one too.....
A lot of great race horses did not win every race, not even Man O'War!

[blackstallion2]

;)My money's on Calvin!

[J. Turner]

It seems like a great outcome for all. Can't wait to see how Calvin rides MTB in the Belmont and how the little gelding with heart comes out for the party.

[Barnfairy]

Horses like Exterminator ran (and won quite a few) actual races every few days, often carrying tremendous weight. He ran for many years and lived to the ripe old age of 30. Don't they build 'em like that anymore?
...and yet when discussion comes around to low profile iron horses --of which there are plenty!-- running two, sometimes even three times a month, several months out of the year, right through to age 8, 9, 10, so often their connections are accused of running them into the ground.

[Ghazzu]

The Belmont is not a race for this filly even if she weren't "tired". Her connections know that. Nothing I saw in the Preakness made me think she has the stamina for the longer distance.

I'm sure her connections were aware of that, but I still give them props for not caving and running her.

[kcmel]

Glad to hear it. Rest up for Zenyatta!

[War Admiral]

I'm sure her connections were aware of that, but I still give them props for not caving and running her.

I do too. Must say though that from everything I have heard about Jess J., he DOES do the right thing for the heese.

[Beverley]

...and yet when discussion comes around to low profile iron horses --of which there are plenty!-- running two, sometimes even three times a month, several months out of the year, right through to age 8, 9, 10, so often their connections are accused of running them into the ground.


Good point.

When I watched Seattle Slew win the Preakness, my money to show was on a little local horse named Iron Constitution- who came second and rewarded my $2 bet handsomely. He was well named, had already raced a number of times that year.

[Angel Undercover]

I am also happy, I feel that RA's connections made a good decision. I also agree about the braids though, I don't know why but I'm not usually a huge fan of braids on racehorses.

[Mara]

Glad to see it. I don't think she's a 1.5 miler, and I'd love to see her run again this year. The Belmont takes it out of a horse, for certain.

I think all of Jackson's horses go to the races braided, at least the ones with Asmussen do. I don't like it either - the braids always look uneven and sticky-uppy.

[Equilibrium]

...and yet when discussion comes around to low profile iron horses --of which there are plenty!-- running two, sometimes even three times a month, several months out of the year, right through to age 8, 9, 10, so often their connections are accused of running them into the ground.

Amazing isn't it? And don't mention they were broken as yearlings. In the "old" days they use to break them in June of their yearling year.

Back to RA, delighted she's not running in the Belmont. She has had a hard season and that just wouldn't be fair.

Good luck to MTB and his connections.

Terri

[danceronice]

I don't think it's out yet, but I don't blame Jackson for trying to run the filly. The reason that Jess Jackson wanted to run the filly so much is because he isn't going to be around much longer. He has brain cancer. Some of you all were wondering about the shaved head. Now you know. It will probably come out soon in the media soon since it is starting to come out in the major racing circles.

Maybe some of you will respect him a little more now. He has obviously had it for awhile. He isn't quite the media hog that some of you claimed him to be. If he was, his cancer would have been in the media a long time ago. He would have wanted people to feel sorry for him and to hog the limelight. He really doesn't want to take the attention away from his horses after all....

And what does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

[Calamber]

Anything to change the subject for what is the obvious. Mr. Moneybags never did intend to run in the Belmont, what he cared about was how to up the value of a mult-million dollar horse to a multi-multi-million dollar horse. If it were not obvious enough already, what these types of people care about is how many millions more they can up their value and maintain it, makes the most sense not to run them too long cuz they would not maintain that "value". Why does he not talk about what to do for the longevity and durability of the breed? Why would he not have been talking about how he can prove her ability to run the classic distances, and how we can get back to the more durable class of horses instead of the sickening moves to up her "market" value. Oh yeah, real concerned about the horses.

[Laurierace]

Anything to change the subject for what is the obvious. Mr. Moneybags never did intend to run in the Belmont, what he cared about was how to up the value of a mult-million dollar horse to a multi-multi-million dollar horse. If it were not obvious enough already, what these types of people care about is how many millions more they can up their value and maintain it, makes the most sense not to run them too long cuz they would not maintain that "value". Why does he not talk about what to do for the longevity and durability of the breed? Why would he not have been talking about how he can prove her ability to run the classic distances, and how we can get back to the more durable class of horses instead of the sickening moves to up her "market" value. Oh yeah, real concerned about the horses.

I don't have the slightest clue what you are talking about.

[Filly85']

And what does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

What are you talking about????????

[vineyridge]

Jeeze. Only in America would a 12f race be considered a grueling test of stamina!

Leaving out all the slams against Mr. Jackson and his program, I do agree that Classic horses should run Classic distances AT THE MINIMUM. I'm kind of sick of all the 4.5, 5 and 6f races that are the majority of races run on this continent.

[LaurieB]

Anything to change the subject for what is the obvious. Mr. Moneybags never did intend to run in the Belmont, what he cared about was how to up the value of a mult-million dollar horse to a multi-multi-million dollar horse. If it were not obvious enough already, what these types of people care about is how many millions more they can up their value and maintain it, makes the most sense not to run them too long cuz they would not maintain that "value". Why does he not talk about what to do for the longevity and durability of the breed? Why would he not have been talking about how he can prove her ability to run the classic distances, and how we can get back to the more durable class of horses instead of the sickening moves to up her "market" value. Oh yeah, real concerned about the horses.

I'm with Laurierace. I can't make any sense out of this either. :confused:

[Mara]

I'm with Laurierace. I can't make any sense out of this either. :confused:

Add me to that list.
For one thing, Jackson has no intention of selling the filly. So why would he be hell bent on increasing her value? So he can pay a higher insurance premium?

And I am tired of seeing snide remarks ("Mr. Moneybags", etc.) about the fact that the guy is rich. He worked hard for it. Glad to see he's investing it in racing instead of, say, NASCAR.

[justalittlex]

yes Mara yes.:)

[DLee]

If it is indeed true that Mr. Jackson has cancer, I really think it is sad that you felt the need to announce it on this board, when he has not. Cancer is personal until one decides to make it public.

[Toadie's mom]

Add me to that list.
For one thing, Jackson has no intention of selling the filly. So why would he be hell bent on increasing her value? So he can pay a higher insurance premium?

And I am tired of seeing snide remarks ("Mr. Moneybags", etc.) about the fact that the guy is rich. He worked hard for it. Glad to see he's investing it in racing instead of, say, NASCAR.

here here!

I was happy to hear the announcement and am sooooo hoping for the Zen/RA matchup. 2 such totally different running styles should make it one of the best races of the year. Well, kind of like RA and MTB :D

[Calamber]

Mara, I am sure glad that you know precisely what Mr. Jackson (aka Mr. Moneybags) has in mind for the future of RA, maybe you are right since he does not really need money it appears. What I was getting at for those who either do not want to think about it or just cannot understand is that that the value of a horse is not determined in a few races which are not in either open company or at the longer distances. We are not trying to breed quarter horses here. What is so hard to understand about durability and longevity and Mr. B's lack of concern for that? Perhaps RA needs a breather and a rest and perhaps his is not the most important decision respecting the racing TB, his is just the most egregious. The only defense for him I can come up with is that most of the big name owner/breeders are doing more or less the same thing.

How many have made public statements about the future of the breed, or recently made decisions regarding that instead of how much they can get at the bloodstock sales or by selling breeding shares? I would be happy to be proven wrong so please someone share one or two with me. Kindly do not mention the hundreds of thousands spent to save Barbaro, they have produced three more of the same breeding so that already proves the point. Maybe Barbaro stepped in a hole, I certainly hope so as that was the most ghastly injury ever in a Triple Crown race and would be the only reason I would ever consider duplicating that line. I am just not happy when someone believes they can just buy a race and then a bunch of our good citizens who should know better run right along with the decision with the rose colored glasses slapped firmly on the face, all in the name of feminism of course.:winkgrin:

[rcloisonne]

Maybe Barbaro stepped in a hole, I certainly hope so as that was the most ghastly injury ever in a Triple Crown race ...
Eight Belles injuries were worse. What is your point?

Personally, I don't believe RA's connections ever planned to have her go on to Belmont. All the "wait and see" anticipation was pure drama for the media. JJ loves attention which was why he purchased RA for an enormou$ amount of money and ran her in the Preakness. He knows she wouldn't have a prayer in he** of winning the Belmont even if she were rested.

And as far as I know, entering a horse in ALL of the Triple Crown races has never been considered "running a horse into the ground" though very few appear to be up to the challenge in recent years. :no:

[Filly85']

Of course he never planned to run her in the Belmont. Of course. That makes all the sense in the world. He doesn't want to run the filly while he is still alive. He just wants to let her sit in her stall and eat hay. It would be absurd to run a horse that you paid millions for to race while you are still alive. He decided not to run her because he never planned on running her. Yeah, that's it. No, who would want to race that filly in the Belmont anyway? No, he doesn't want to run her in the race that eluded him in 2007. That wish would be crazy.

[Acertainsmile]

Mara, I am sure glad that you know precisely what Mr. Jackson (aka Mr. Moneybags) has in mind for the future of RA, maybe you are right since he does not really need money it appears. What I was getting at for those who either do not want to think about it or just cannot understand is that that the value of a horse is not determined in a few races which are not in either open company or at the longer distances. We are not trying to breed quarter horses here. What is so hard to understand about durability and longevity and Mr. B's lack of concern for that? Perhaps RA needs a breather and a rest and perhaps his is not the most important decision respecting the racing TB, his is just the most egregious. The only defense for him I can come up with is that most of the big name owner/breeders are doing more or less the same thing.

How many have made public statements about the future of the breed, or recently made decisions regarding that instead of how much they can get at the bloodstock sales or by selling breeding shares? I would be happy to be proven wrong so please someone share one or two with me. Kindly do not mention the hundreds of thousands spent to save Barbaro, they have produced three more of the same breeding so that already proves the point. Maybe Barbaro stepped in a hole, I certainly hope so as that was the most ghastly injury ever in a Triple Crown race and would be the only reason I would ever consider duplicating that line. I am just not happy when someone believes they can just buy a race and then a bunch of our good citizens who should know better run right along with the decision with the rose colored glasses slapped firmly on the face, all in the name of feminism of course.:winkgrin:

If you knew anything about racing, you would know that you cannot "buy" a race.... to many things can go wrong to take that kind of risk.

[Filly85']

Mara, I am sure glad that you know precisely what Mr. Jackson (aka Mr. Moneybags) has in mind for the future of RA, maybe you are right since he does not really need money it appears. What I was getting at for those who either do not want to think about it or just cannot understand is that that the value of a horse is not determined in a few races which are not in either open company or at the longer distances. We are not trying to breed quarter horses here. What is so hard to understand about durability and longevity and Mr. B's lack of concern for that? Perhaps RA needs a breather and a rest and perhaps his is not the most important decision respecting the racing TB, his is just the most egregious. The only defense for him I can come up with is that most of the big name owner/breeders are doing more or less the same thing.

How many have made public statements about the future of the breed, or recently made decisions regarding that instead of how much they can get at the bloodstock sales or by selling breeding shares? I would be happy to be proven wrong so please someone share one or two with me. Kindly do not mention the hundreds of thousands spent to save Barbaro, they have produced three more of the same breeding so that already proves the point. Maybe Barbaro stepped in a hole, I certainly hope so as that was the most ghastly injury ever in a Triple Crown race and would be the only reason I would ever consider duplicating that line. I am just not happy when someone believes they can just buy a race and then a bunch of our good citizens who should know better run right along with the decision with the rose colored glasses slapped firmly on the face, all in the name of feminism of course.:winkgrin:

There are plenty examples out there. If you knew anything about racing, you would know some of them. There are plenty of people who breed to race for themselves and just enjoy the sport. It's nice if the horses can earn their keep, but that's not why I'm getting into racing. Making money is my last concern because so few owners actually make money. I just want to enjoy my horses and the sport. That's why I'm getting into TB racing as an owner/breeder. I just purchased my first broodmare, and she will be bred next spring.

If you want to be another example, then go get a great education, a great job, and buy your own racehorses. Then, you can influence the sport a little bit. Instead of complaining on a message board about people that you obviously know nothing about, do something productive. Talking only gets you so far. You have to actually do something. That's what is so wrong with racing. All talk and no action!

[Barnfairy]

And as far as I know, entering a horse in ALL of the Triple Crown races has never been considered "running a horse into the ground" though very few appear to be up to the challenge in recent years. :no:
Off the top of my head, I can think of several from this decade who have run all three: Big Brown, Curlin, Hard Spun, Giacomo, Afleet Alex, Smarty Jones, Funny Cide, and Scrimshaw.

In 2004, Master David skipped the Preakness after running in the Derby, but used the Peter Pan in between to prep for the Belmont.

In 2002, Rachel Alexandra's sire Medaglia D'Oro ran all three Triple Crown races, and went on to race through age five.

Oh how times have changed; would Larry Jones --and the whole industry, for that matter-- have received the same kind of public flogging regarding Eight Belles had that fatal event taken place in Exterminator's day?

Prepping to get into the Derby and then going on to run all three Triple Crown races is a lot to ask of a growing horse, but rather than lack of soundness, overwhelmingly I think the reason we see so few go on to do it is because there is little incentive to do so. We've gotten away from 12F races in this country -- the value of being the Belmont winner has diminished. There is more money now in the breeding shed than on the track, and that, my friend, is where the problem lies.

[rcloisonne]

Off the top of my head, I can think of several from this decade who have run all three: Big Brown, Curlin, Hard Spun, Giacomo, Afleet Alex, Smarty Jones, Funny Cide, and Scrimshaw.
Well, yes. But how many running the Derby compete in all three? I know there are a few but the majority don't.

In 2002, Rachel Alexandra's sire Medaglia D'Oro ran all three Triple Crown races, and went on to race through age five.
A wonderful horse, Medaglia D'Oro. Heck, I've even suggested him more than once as a potential "Sporthorse" sire. His stud fee is a bit too rich for those folks though. Heck, most of them think $3,000 is extremely high. :lol:

Oh how times have changed; would Larry Jones --and the whole industry, for that matter-- have received the same kind of public flogging regarding Eight Belles had that fatal event taken place in Exterminator's day?
I'll be the first to voice an objection when people knowingly run horses into the ground (and I'm sure most here know that). However, I never blamed Larry Jones for what happened to Eight Belles. When bad things happen it's human nature to look for a fall guy. Larry was "it" this time. IMO, it was that video of him breezing the filly that set him up for it.

Prepping to get into the Derby and then going on to run all three Triple Crown races is a lot to ask of a growing horse, but overwhelmingly I think the reason we see so few go on to do it is because there is little incentive to do so. We've gotten away from 12F races in this country. There is more money now in the breeding shed than on the track, and that, my friend, is where the problem lies.
You'll get no argument from me about that.

[vineyridge]

All I can say that it would be quite an outcome for Mr. Jackson if RA meets and beats Zenyatta. If it takes a long rest for her to be able to do that, which Zenyatta has already had, REST her.

Winning the Preakness and then going on to defeat an undefeated mare would certainly put her way up in my vote for HOTY.

[Laurierace]

I don't know, but just maybe, he wanted to run the filly because he is dying, but she really wasn't ready to run.

Dying or not, that is the mark of any horseman. I certainly wouldn't want to go to my grave knowing I ran a horse that had no business running but that is beside the point, you do what is right for the horse, period. Wanting to do something for any reason is one thing, following through when it apparent its not the best choice is another.

[Laurierace]

What I was getting at for those who either do not want to think about it or just cannot understand is that that the value of a horse is not determined in a few races which are not in either open company or at the longer distances. We are not trying to breed quarter horses here. What is so hard to understand about durability and longevity and Mr. B's lack of concern for that? Perhaps RA needs a breather and a rest and perhaps his is not the most important decision respecting the racing TB, his is just the most egregious. The only defense for him I can come up with is that most of the big name owner/breeders are doing more or less the same thing.

How many have made public statements about the future of the breed, or recently made decisions regarding that instead of how much they can get at the bloodstock sales or by selling breeding shares? I would be happy to be proven wrong so please someone share one or two with me. Kindly do not mention the hundreds of thousands spent to save Barbaro, they have produced three more of the same breeding so that already proves the point. Maybe Barbaro stepped in a hole, I certainly hope so as that was the most ghastly injury ever in a Triple Crown race and would be the only reason I would ever consider duplicating that line. I am just not happy when someone believes they can just buy a race and then a bunch of our good citizens who should know better run right along with the decision with the rose colored glasses slapped firmly on the face, all in the name of feminism of course.:winkgrin:

Ok I am still confused as to what you are talking about. Once a horse is born, you can not change their pedigree. Running them in longer races will not change their propensity to max out at a certain distance. They could run her a mile and a half once a week for the next 5 years and that would not change her ability to throw foals that can go a mile and a half or not.
Runnng a horse that is not ready for a race is just stupid and will not enhance their durability. If anything it will shorten their career, possibly to the point of having zero more races. Not sure how that helps anyone.
And what the hell is wrong with repeating the cross that created Barbaro? Not to mention some of them were already on the ground before he came along as well as before he rose to fame. Save for one step, it was an incredible outcome and Dynaformer is know to be a very durable sire. Maybe they should cull the mare? I seriously don't get you at all.

[Larksmom]

Then why haven't the sheiks done it yet with the derby? They come over here every year, and buy up what looks to be the cream of the crop-and where does it get them? Zip, zero, nada. They left with arguably the two best two year olds last year, and neither one has even-well, Midshipman started, but what about the other one? Vinyard Haven? What has become of him? Can anyone in the world afford better care than those guys?
You know, I am mostly just a casual fan of racing, but I have been a fan for over 40 years. I don't think Calamber KNOWS as much as FEELS. It is fine to have an opinion, even be very passionate about it. even to be WRONG. But passion doesn't equal truth.

[grayarabs]

Is MTB the only horse entered in the Belmont that also ran in the Derby and Preakness?
Musket Man not running the Belmont?

[Frog]

Of course she's not ready for the Belmont- all she ever does is gallop once around the track.

[iloverocky]

Is MTB the only horse entered in the Belmont that also ran in the Derby and Preakness?
Musket Man not running the Belmont?

Flying Private, if he is still on for the Belmont, will also have run all three legs.

[danceronice]

What are you talking about????????

It's a more erudite way of saying "who cares?" Whether or not her owner has cancer (and if he does and it has not been announced in the media, should you be blabbing his medical condition here?) is really not relevant to anyone's opinion of the horse or management of her. Possibly I'm just jaded, having been on the internet as long as I have, but bringing up the I/he/she/it is DYING, now AREN'T YOU A HORRIBLE PERSON is generally one step up from Godwining as a way to lose your own argument.

[Mara]

Flying Private, if he is still on for the Belmont, will also have run all three legs.

And if ever a horse has shown he isn't ready for this level of competition. . .

[LaurieB]

And if ever a horse has shown he isn't ready for this level of competition. . .

Considering that he ran 4th in the Preakness, ahead of Papa Clem, Big Drama, Terrain, General Quarters, Fresian Fire, Pioneerof The Nile, and others, I think I'd probably have to disagree.

[Barnfairy]

...how many running the Derby compete in all three? I know there are a few but the majority don't.Has there ever been a time when the majority of Kentucky Derby entrants go on to run in both the Preakness and the Belmont?

...I never blamed Larry Jones for what happened to Eight Belles.Neither did I, but right or wrong, the backlash against Jones serves as proof of the change in public mindset towards the sport --and acceptable use of horses in general, including the weights they should carry or pull-- compared to the days when horses were still the main mode of everyday transport.

Heck, many modern trainers themselves are quoted as saying the Triple Crown campaign from Derby prep to Belmont is too demanding on a horse.

As a filter of the 3 YO cream-of-the-crop, it's supposed to be hard...but the Triple Crown race distances are, well, outdated. D. Wayne Lukas has suggested changing the distances, and I can see his point (even if I don't support it -- but on the other hand I don't see a trend towards 12F races coming back in this country any time soon.)

[Filly85']

It's a more erudite way of saying "who cares?" Whether or not her owner has cancer (and if he does and it has not been announced in the media, should you be blabbing his medical condition here?) is really not relevant to anyone's opinion of the horse or management of her. Possibly I'm just jaded, having been on the internet as long as I have, but bringing up the I/he/she/it is DYING, now AREN'T YOU A HORRIBLE PERSON is generally one step up from Godwining as a way to lose your own argument.

Hyperbole anyone? I didn't say anyone was a horrible person. Where did I say that? But, the arguments about Jackson not ever actually wanting to run the filly in the Belmont and just 'pretending' he might because he wanted to be in the spotlight are absolutely ludicrous. If you're going to spew false and unintelligible information, people are going to call you out on it. There are facts and then there are opinions. Opinions don't overweigh facts. Some of the real trainers and horse people on this board are trying to educate some of you all, and you just won't listen.

And everyone will find out about the medical condition sooner or later... I will refrain from saying anything that hasn't come out in the media yet from now on.

[Acertainsmile]

Of course she's not ready for the Belmont- all she ever does is gallop once around the track.

And your qualifications as a trainer are...????

[Equinoxfox]

WELL all I can say is .. I am GLAD they are not racing her and for once a trainer is putting the horse first. She needs rest and time. nothing else matters. Give those legs a break.
It really bothers me at how the trainers will run these young horses so hard.
( I know nothing about racing and do not pretend too) . THIS is my opinon. Just glad the horse will get the break she deserves.. And then some .;)

[Acertainsmile]

WELL all I can say is .. I am GLAD they are not racing her and for once a trainer is putting the horse first. She needs rest and time. nothing else matters. Give those legs a break.
It really bothers me at how the trainers will run these young horses so hard.
( I know nothing about racing and do not pretend too) . THIS is my opinon. Just glad the horse will get the break she deserves.. And then some .;)

The bolded part is a little much... do you really believe that this is the first time a trainer has put his horse first? Believe it or not, most trainers do put their horses first, always. Opinions can often be valid when backed by facts.

[loshad]

What kind of jerk discusses someone else's medical condition on a major horse forum when that person hasn't seen fit to announce it himself? Klassy. Really, really klassy.

[Sing Mia Song]

Okay, I'll stay away from Jackson's medical history and his suspected alterior motives...and just say that not running RA makes perfect sense.

She has dominated her division, and now she has proven that she can beat the boys. Winning the Belmont would prove nothing further, but a loss could tarnish her. Basically, she has nothing to gain and everything to lose.

It makes much more sense to back her off, give her a little break, freshen her against 3YO fillies in the fall, and either face Zenyatta or older males in the BC Classic.

[shawneeAcres]

Okay, I'll stay away from Jackson's medical history and his suspected alterior motives...and just say that not running RA makes perfect sense.

She has dominated her division, and now she has proven that she can beat the boys. Winning the Belmont would prove nothing further, but a loss could tarnish her. Basically, she has nothing to gain and everything to lose.

It makes much more sense to back her off, give her a little break, freshen her against 3YO fillies in the fall, and either face Zenyatta or older males in the BC Classic.


I agree totally with this and have been saying so all along. Why run her in preakness, she has absolutley NOTHING to prove at this point!

[Laurierace]

I agree totally with this and have been saying so all along. Why run her in preakness, she has absolutley NOTHING to prove at this point!

Well being that she won the Preakness I guess there was a pretty good reason to run her in it.

[lizathenag]

poster probably meant Belmont!

[Frog]

And your qualifications as a trainer are...????


Don't recall saying I was a trainer! Bless your heart if I said something that you misunderstood. I am NOT a racehorse trainer. Hope that clears things up!
Just an athlete.

[danceronice]

And everyone will find out about the medical condition sooner or later... I will refrain from saying anything that hasn't come out in the media yet from now on.

They certainly will if you keep shooting off your mouth. If a medical condition isn't out in the media it's considered bad form in most circles to go running around making announcements about it, especially in ways that look like trolling for sympathy instead of arguing the facts.

[ivy62]

In the medical profession the HIPAA regulations forbid us to discuss any health related issues about anyone unless it is directly involved in the care of the patient. We can get fired for looking up our own stuff!
It is just bad taste to discuss other peoples medical problems without their permission
JMHO
I am glad she is not running, she needs a break but I still would like to see her against older mares and horses before I call her HOTY.....If MTB wins the Belmont and has a good showing later in the year I think he would get it...

[Filly85']

Does anyone wonder why I know about it? Maybe because it is out and the media just hasn't written about it yet. NO, that couldn't be it. Of course not. That doesn't make any sense at all (rolls eyes).

The racing community is pretty tight knit. If something happens, pretty much everyone knows about it. Someone that has no connection whatsoever to Jackson and has never even met him before told me about it. But, since so many people have a problem with it, I have deleted all the posts. Sorry, I can be young and stupid sometimes, and I lack good judgment when it comes to certain aspects of social skills at times.

Ok, loshad, I'm a jerk you win!!!! I can't please everyone. Of course, this is an internet message board too, and some people will argue with a brick wall even if they are dead wrong. Just like some people are still arguing that Jackson never wanted to run the filly in the Belmont as a fact. This was the only place that I posted the info because I don't post anywhere else. This is also the last time I ever post anything that hasn't come out in the media yet again...I promise!!! I was wrong, and I won't make this mistake again!

[shawneeAcres]

Well being that she won the Preakness I guess there was a pretty good reason to run her in it.

Sorry I MEANT the Belmont, my fingers weren't caught up with my brain! LOL

[vxf111]

It's HIPAA (Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act). Sorry, leftover anal retentive tendancy from when I used to work for the US Dept of Labor and had lots of calls from people wanting to speak to either Mr. Cobra or Ms. Hippo. :)

[danceronice]

Does anyone wonder why I know about it? Maybe because it is out and the media just hasn't written about it yet. NO, that couldn't be it. Of course not. That doesn't make any sense at all (rolls eyes).

The racing community is pretty tight knit. If something happens, pretty much everyone knows about it. Someone that has no connection whatsoever to Jackson and has never even met him before told me about it. But, since so many people have a problem with it, I have deleted all the posts. Sorry, I can be young and stupid sometimes, and I lack good judgment when it comes to certain aspects of social skills at times.

Ok, loshad, I'm a jerk you win!!!! I can't please everyone. Of course, this is an internet message board too, and some people will argue with a brick wall even if they are dead wrong. Just like some people are still arguing that Jackson never wanted to run the filly in the Belmont as a fact. This was the only place that I posted the info because I don't post anywhere else. This is also the last time I ever post anything that hasn't come out in the media yet again...I promise!!! I was wrong, and I won't make this mistake again!

Especially if you heard it third-hand--how do you know for absolute certainty it's true? It's just not a good idea, especially with someone where, if he WANTED it known publically (and remember this is a public board with LOTS of people involved in the racing industry, not to mention thanks to google anyone can find it) he would have said something himself and had half a dozen TV cameras right there to report it.

It's a very good idea to have deleted everything, though that's closing the barn door after the fact. It also had nothing to do with the argument at hand.

And I agree with ivy62--I would like to see her run against older mares and horses before declaring her HOTY. That or run at even weights with the three-year-old colts, but THAT's not gonna happen.

[Filly85']

Especially if you heard it third-hand--how do you know for absolute certainty it's true? It's just not a good idea, especially with someone where, if he WANTED it known publically (and remember this is a public board with LOTS of people involved in the racing industry, not to mention thanks to google anyone can find it) he would have said something himself and had half a dozen TV cameras right there to report it.

It's a very good idea to have deleted everything, though that's closing the barn door after the fact. It also had nothing to do with the argument at hand.

And I agree with ivy62--I would like to see her run against older mares and horses before declaring her HOTY. That or run at even weights with the three-year-old colts, but THAT's not gonna happen.

Because the person that I heard it from is a big gun in the sport and never gets the info wrong. And the info I gave out had a lot to do with the ridiculous argument at hand. And how do you know that others involved in the sport on this message board don't already know the info I gave out, and just didn't say anything about it because they are a little wiser than me?

[Laurierace]

You might want to drop the word never from your vocabulary as it tends to come back and bite you in the behind when you least expect it. It sounds like you learned your lesson about running your mouth, if so then something positive came from this drivel.

[ivy62]

vxf111- thanks for the correction, I just hear about it all the time but never seen it written out a lot...
Personal info just doesn't belong on a public forum unless the person it belongs to said it or at least gave permission to let it out...
JMHO
Cannot wait to see how the fall lays out for races.....

[imjustjoking22]

Mara, I am sure glad that you know precisely what Mr. Jackson (aka Mr. Moneybags) has in mind for the future of RA, maybe you are right since he does not really need money it appears. What I was getting at for those who either do not want to think about it or just cannot understand is that that the value of a horse is not determined in a few races which are not in either open company or at the longer distances. We are not trying to breed quarter horses here. What is so hard to understand about durability and longevity and Mr. B's lack of concern for that? Perhaps RA needs a breather and a rest and perhaps his is not the most important decision respecting the racing TB, his is just the most egregious. The only defense for him I can come up with is that most of the big name owner/breeders are doing more or less the same thing.

How many have made public statements about the future of the breed, or recently made decisions regarding that instead of how much they can get at the bloodstock sales or by selling breeding shares? I would be happy to be proven wrong so please someone share one or two with me. Kindly do not mention the hundreds of thousands spent to save Barbaro, they have produced three more of the same breeding so that already proves the point. Maybe Barbaro stepped in a hole, I certainly hope so as that was the most ghastly injury ever in a Triple Crown race and would be the only reason I would ever consider duplicating that line. I am just not happy when someone believes they can just buy a race and then a bunch of our good citizens who should know better run right along with the decision with the rose colored glasses slapped firmly on the face, all in the name of feminism of course.:winkgrin:

Jess is in racing for the genuine love of it, not to make money- he has plenty of that, and money is not easily made in racing anyways.

[ivy62]

Calamber- I have to disagree about the amount spent on Barbaro...There are other horses that have had catastrophic injuries, Nureyev, Hoist the Flag etc that have had catastrophic injuries and had difficult recoveries and went on to stud. I honestly believe that Barbaro really just took a bad step, his breeding is hardy and sturdy..look at McDynamo for Pete's sake...To do what he did and for so long has to say sturdy. ALso, if you recall Nicanor was no where near running in the TC races but he may still turn out to be a nice racehorse!
Also, wasn't it Dancinginmydreams that had an injury like Barbaro was cared for at NBC and lived to have a beautiful colt? She looks happy and is well cared for..
Also, Eight Belles I think was worse then Barbaro by a long shot. I wish breeders would breed for distance and stamina and some do, as a I believe Barbaro was. He was not heavily raced at a young age. Actually, if you remember that was one of the questions about him was the light racing schedule...
The boy girl thing transcends ALL sports(and jobs too!) so racing is no different. that is why there is a weight allowance also. That is not about breeding it is about sexism....
I'll get off my soap box now.

[Laurierace]

I shouldn't say this because the last thing I want to do is rehash the whole Barbaro thing but I wanted to set the record straight. They spent NOTHING to try to save Barbaro. It was all pro bono, so take the whole money thing out of the equation. And any idiot can see that breaking two legs is worse than breaking one leg, not that it matters. Dead is dead. Seriously what does any of this have to do with anything?