How big an indoor?

[cottonwood]

I am in the process of planning an indoor arena (woo-hoo!) and am trying to figure out what size is optimum. It is for my own personal use only, so it doesn’t need to be big enough for group lessons or multiple longing sessions. I will use it mostly for flat work with greenies but would like it large enough to at least introduce them to jumping. Probably would only jump up to 2’6” or 2’9” inside. I am just so tired of being unable to ride do to lack of good footing or daylight -

Those of you in a similar situation, what are the dimensions of your indoor? Are you satisfied? What is the optimum eave height?

What are the advantages and disadvantages of metal frame vs. wood frame?

Obviously budget is important, I don’t want to overspend but I don’t want to make a big investment that is too small to be useful. Any stories and experiences you can share would be greatly appreciated!

[Bluey]

Here are two sites with dimensions and prices and pictures you can kind of guess by:

http://www.ranchandgolf.com/index.html

http://www.rhinobldg.com/

Could you go around your area with a long tape and measure what other people use.;)

[InstigatorKate]

I like 70x140 for an indoor. That said, if the cost was a big difference, 60x130ish is sufficient. I think 120 is too short.

[merrygoround]

If you need to cut back somewhere in the dimensions, cut back on length, and go for 70' wide. Site it so that you can have the option of adding on the length when you hit the lottery!!!

Good luck!:)

[2DogsFarm]

My indoor is 60X120 - built for my use only.
I may be wrong, but I think it is nearly the size of a small dressage ring.
My builder suggested an eave height of at least 14' for jumping - I went with 16'.

I find it adequate for both horses - my Big Guy (17h+) is handy enough to manage the turns at the short ends and the smaller horse (my Hunter) has no problem jumping a mini-course of 3 to 4 fences (2'6"-2'9") set on the long walls and diagonal.

[Robin@DHH]

I have known folks who only had a 50 by 100 and were happy to
have that to use. We have a 60 by 120 and I have taught groups
of 4-5 beginners there without a problem. But do keep in mind
that you will not own the facility forever; consider going with
a 70 wide by as long as you can afford and at least 15' height
(to the bottom of the rafters, not measured to the top of the
sidewall). Also remember to budget for the lights as that can
add a bit of cost to your building. Plan to put an expansion truss
on one end of the building if it is not at least twice the width in
length so you (or the next owner of the farm) can make the
building longer if desired. We have wood supports and I am
quite happy with them. The only drawback of steel would be
that you need to pour footings. I think the decision for steel
vs. wood is purely economic, which is cheaper for you. Both
are quite workable.

[cottonwood]

Thanks everybody for your input. I was thinking of 70x125x16, hopefully that will be affordable. It sounds like it will be satisfactory for my uses...

Are wood-frame structures less expensive than all-steel buildings? Are they as good? Anybody have any further input there?

I like the idea of siting it so that we could add on one end at a later date, actually where we plan to put it that could be done. My husband is already talking about orienting it to be able to mount solar panels, once they get efficient and affordable - so we can power the whole farm from this building ;) I guess! We will have to hit the lottery!

[Bluey]

I would go with steel, as ours built in 1947 are still standing and like new, others built with wood many years later we finally, thankfully, replaced with metal ones.
The upkeep in wood can be hefty, at least it was for us, we were always patching on them and a good tornadic wind finally did them in, but didn't the metal ones.

Since you are going to ask for bids, something you can do today over the internet or phone, why not ask builders of both kinds?

Those two I gave you links to will give you a tentative quote on your specifications right over the phone, they did us, as we are right now putting together some plans to cover our roping arena this winter.

Be sure to ask if their prices are turnkey, everything done to the last stitch.

[IslandGirl]

Go for as much width as you can possibly afford. My arena is 84 x 154 x 20, and is wonderful. It rides much better than longer, narrower arenas and the extra eave height really makes it feel larger than it is. With the extra width, you don't always feel like you're turning on the short ends.

http://www.silverchasefarm.com/gallery.htm (scroll down to the fourth picture)

Mine is wood framed with metal siding and (insulated) roof. Plus, I have TONS and TONS of natural lighting, and 16 operable windows. With metal, you lose anywhere from 2 to 4 feet of rideable space due to the supports. Have you considered a fabric-covered arena (such as Coverall)?

[Bluey]

Go for as much width as you can possibly afford. My arena is 84 x 154 x 20, and is wonderful. It rides much better than longer, narrower arenas and the extra eave height really makes it feel larger than it is. With the extra width, you don't always feel like you're turning on the short ends.

http://www.silverchasefarm.com/gallery.htm (scroll down to the fourth picture)

Mine is wood framed with metal siding and (insulated) roof. Plus, I have TONS and TONS of natural lighting, and 16 operable windows. With metal, you lose anywhere from 2 to 4 feet of rideable space due to the supports. Have you considered a fabric-covered arena (such as Coverall)?

That is a beautiful place, no question about that.:cool:

Although all that wood, having been in two barn fires, gives me the willies.:eek:

It is true that you lose about a foot with the larger colums in metal barns, but you don't have to go as high on the eaves, as when you use trusses, because of the pitch of the roof, compared with the flat bottom of the trusses being the same all along the whole structure.
Unlesss there is roping to be done, metal beams clear spans are fine with 16' eaves, that gives some 20'+ peak true clear span underneath.
Now, if you will be roping, as we are, we will be building with 18' sides.
You also may have a problem with birds and cowwebs with trusses, that are minimal problems with a true clear span.

[IslandGirl]

Thanks, Bluey. I'm pretty darn happy with it!!!

[Equinoxfox]

OH Island Girl.. Now that is a lovely facility and it looks very horse friendly.
Great job and if I am ever in your neck of the woods .. I want to stop in...:yes:

[IslandGirl]

Equinoxfox, come on by!!!

Bluey: Barn fire is a HUGE fear of mine, so I incorporated as much prevention as possible, as well as an emergency evacuation plan.

The OP might find a pole structure less expensive than a steel structure in the size she's considering. One also has to consider excavation costs; a (somewhat) larger excavation area is required for the steel building in order to achieve the same rideable area that one would get with a pole structure. Believe me I would have LOVED to go with steel (so I could have gone even wider!), but the additional excavation costs were prohibitive (my property is no where NEAR flat).

[Bluey]

Yes, most barns in the East are built with wood and relatively few burn down, for the many out there.
That they do burn is a concern of mine because of my experiences, but everyone's threshold for risk is different.:)

Management is important and today we know enough to really weight the odds in our and our horse's favor.

Those wood barns are really beautiful.:cool:

I don't quite understand why a metal barn needs any different ground preparation than a wood one.
That has not been a concern any place I have been and a barn was built or any we have built, and we have built with both materials over the years.:confused:

I will still say that today, building with metal will give the longest lasting, less maintenance needed, practically none, compared with building with wood.
Metal barns can be made just as pretty today as wood ones, but of course, the more wood we may add to the inside, the more fuel we also provide in case of fire.
Now, all that may not be a concern of whoever wants to build a structure today, each one of us have our own priorities.:)

[Guilherme]

When we built we went for 20m x 60m. Magic numbers, eh? ;)

The OP does not indicate where they are. If they are in the South or South West they might do better with a covered arena vice an indoor. The cover is not necessarily cheaper to build but it is cheaper to maintain and operate (no need for fans, doors, fewer dust issues, etc.).

The money is in the width in clear span structures. The OP is likely better off to build wide and a bit short, as they can add length later on.

I've seen some nice, wooden indoors but think metal is probably the better way to go, even if a bit more money. Less worries from fire, insect damage, etc.

Build to code. Find out what the specs for the area are and comply with them. First, it's the law. Second, if you don't, come sale time you'll have an issue (likely when you least want it).

Shop around. When we did ours in 2000 the bids ran from just over $50,000 to more than $120,000. There was little difference in quality (construction or materials).

Last, but not least, this is business; get a written contract from the contractor before you put out the first dollar. Check the contractor's bona fides including, but not limited to, licensure, insurance, etc. View some of the projects they've done. Talk to prior customers, if possible.

This is big step; good luck in taking it! :)

G.

[cottonwood]

I appreciate the input from everybody - thanks all for the good advice.

IslandGirl, your place is fabulous! Maybe I'll just come live with you! Just lovely!

we are in Northeast Missouri and winters regularly get down to zero and below so the roof only is not a good option, unfortunately...We plan to put 16' sliding doors on each of the 4 sides for air flow in the summer because it can get hot here also -

We are pricing both wood and steel frame structures; there are lots of Morton buildings around here but lots of steel framed buildings as well. The fire issue is something I hadn't really considered... this will be a stand-alone arena, a pretty good distance from the other barns and not used for housing horses...so I'm not sure if fire thing will be a deciding factor or not. Something to think about though.

[2DogsFarm]

I have the 16' sliders on all 4 sides of my indoor (one directly into the attached barn). The ventilation I get with all 4 open is quite nice.

My builder - FBI - now offers the option of adding a horizontal slider along the long walls of the arena for even more open-air feeling.
I'm probably not describing it well, but it is like a slider about 1/4 of the wall height that you can open for air/light and lock shut for warmth.

Also go for the largest eavelights you can afford - they now come in a clear material as well as translucent. I got 2' and wish I'd gotten 3', even so I rarely need to switch on my lights unless I'm riding after dark.

On the subject of lighting: I went with cold-ballast fluorescent - no annoying halogen buzz or warmup time. Hit the switch and the lights are on.

Keep us posted on your progress!

[feather river]

70 feet is too narrow. You will hate it. I have ridden in 20 by 40 meter rings in Germany. Like riding in your garage. Your 20 meter circles are wall to wall.

80 feet is way different. You would be amazed at the extra 10 feet, so I would consider 80 by 120 as a minimum, with 80 by 140 as pretty good--the extra 10 feet is wonderful, and you have rougly a 2/3 dressage court for length.

3 riders can ride in this at one time without getting in each other's way.

[feather river]

My indoor is 60X120 - built for my use only.
I may be wrong, but I think it is nearly the size of a small dressage ring.
My builder suggested an eave height of at least 14' for jumping - I went with 16'.

I find it adequate for both horses - my Big Guy (17h+) is handy enough to manage the turns at the short ends and the smaller horse (my Hunter) has no problem jumping a mini-course of 3 to 4 fences (2'6"-2'9") set on the long walls and diagonal.

Nope, 70 by 140 feet would roughly be a 20 by 40 meter ring. But your builder was right--14 foot eave height is a minimum. Good choice to do 16 foot.

[feather river]

Go for as much width as you can possibly afford. My arena is 84 x 154 x 20, and is wonderful. It rides much better than longer, narrower arenas and the extra eave height really makes it feel larger than it is. With the extra width, you don't always feel like you're turning on the short ends.

http://www.silverchasefarm.com/gallery.htm (scroll down to the fourth picture)

Mine is wood framed with metal siding and (insulated) roof. Plus, I have TONS and TONS of natural lighting, and 16 operable windows. With metal, you lose anywhere from 2 to 4 feet of rideable space due to the supports. Have you considered a fabric-covered arena (such as Coverall)?

Well this place proves money can buy happiness! What a great indoor jumping arena! I think I have gone to heaven.

[Bluey]

Well this place proves money can buy happiness! What a great indoor jumping arena! I think I have gone to heaven.

Great place for the owners, but I would be happy just working in such an awesome place.
The architectural detail is excellent also.

I wonder about all those light panels, how they are holding up?
We may be covering our roping arena this winter and that is what I was thinking for the top of the North side, where heat from them in the summer would not be an issue and we would get so much light, but the erector, my neighbor, is questioning that, as he said someone put them and said in two years was replacing them with metal, they didn't hold up.
He may have used very cheap ones and that is why they failed?

We are checking into that, as I really wanted that light, or at least every third panel or so, if at all possible.

I wonder if someone has been using light ones under the eaves for long now and how are they holding up?

[IslandGirl]

Bluey (and feather river), thanks for your kind comments.

The transparent light panels (as opposed to translucent) actually hold up very well, and they don't yellow like the translucent ones do. We get some vicious weather here sometimes, and I have yet to have a problem with them. I highly recommend them. I don't know who the manufacturer is, but I can probably find out.

If you want to work here, I'm looking for a new barn manager!!! Mine is leaving to pursue some non-working time with her significant other, so I'm on the hunt for her replacement.