Question about No stirrups work

[Aerial]

So last night i realized my core isn't nearly as strong as it should be. i lost my irons while doing a 2'9 course and was all over the place..didnt feel like i was going to come off but i was extremely unbalanced. The only problem is, this horse has a huuuuge huuuge trot and if worked on no stirrups on the flat, once again i'd be all over the place. So should i just work on no stirrups and stuff with the other horses i ride?? (who have normal gaits lol). I also have problems with posting (NS) because no matter how much leg i add, it just slips down furthur around the horses belly and then i just don't have enough space to post if that makes sense????

any advice?? ( and hoping to god that made sense lol)

[myalter1]

if you have other horses available with easier gaits, ride them without stirrups. You will feel all over the place, but that's the only way to get stronger. Also, if you have someone who can help you from the ground with a little, "Bring your leg forward, bend your knee, lean away from your hands, tuck your seat bones under, etc." it might help you as a reminder of what to do.

just my opinion

[HunterJumper106]

ride the other horses available to you until you get stronger then you will be able to stay with the bigger trot. and as for the posting thing that also has to do with strength. I agree that having someone on the ground telling you how to change your position is a good idea but you should be able to do it yourself after a little while. Once you get stronger through the legs and core you will find it is easier to post and eventually maybe even hold a two-point position without stirrups.

Make yourself a "no stirrups schedule" if you can. I generally try to cross my stirrups every time I ride--I do my whole hack then at the very end after I'm done cantering I do about 10 more minutes of no stirrups trotting. And once or twice a week I take them off my saddle completely and do a full hack without stirrups. Once or twice a month my trainer takes them away from me completely and I do a whole lesson without them.

Work yourself up to the point that you feel comfortable at every gate. Do things like trot over poles/crossrails, sit the trot, canter, circles etc. to keep it interesting and make it feel less like work/torture :lol: Good luck and have fun! Having a strong core is super important to all aspects of riding!

[IsolaBella09]

I used to ride a horse who had a HUGE trot, like you explained. I would still try and do some no stirrup work with him, and boy was it hard, but I think it made me a lot stronger than if I had done no stirrup work on horses with normal trots. At first, I was all over the place, but with time and consistent practice I was able to do courses without stirrups with him.

When doing no stirrup work, pretend that you still have your iron on the bottom of your foot. This allows you to think that you still have a base of support, but really, you work your legs a lot harder. I like to alternate between posting without stirrups to sitting trot without stirrups. Do posting stirrups around the outside, then go onto a 20m circle with sitting trot. I also like to take my inside hand and put it up between my shoulder blades to help strengthen my core and get my back straight. An equitation guru taught me this, and I use it to this day. I really recommend this.

I like to do no stirrup work every time I ride. I warm up my horse first, let him walk, and then focus on my position and strength. I usually shoot for at least 15 minutes. Even a small amount daily can help you strengthen your core.

Good luck! :D

[chawley]

I would do a lot of two-point at the trot until you can do it easily for 10 minutes nonstop. This will help build not only your leg strength, but your core and back as well. Once you can hold your two point at the trot for an extended period of time, riding correctly w/out stirrups will be much easier for you. Also, once you start your no-stirrup work, begin at the walk until your comfortable and then move to the trot and canter.

I personally don't like to see people riding without stirrups until they are strong enough to hold their position correctly. You can gain bad habits, such as pinching w/ the knee, if you aren't doing it correctly.

[Jaegermonster]

You can even do no stirrup work at the walk and it will make a difference.
Some days my back is really hurting (from an old injury) and there's no need to overdo, you know?
So I'll warm up and do my ride and then at the end I"ll work without stirrups for about 10 minutes or so, using my legs and so on, and believe me I can feel it. My whole point was I didn't want to make myself so sore I couldn't ride at all the next day. Start small.

Rome wasn't built in a day, don't kill yourself right off the bat. Start out slow and before you know it you will be trotting all around in two point with no stirrups.

[Pirateer]

Do as much NS work as you can while maintaining CORRECT position.

It does NO good to "practice" and train your body to "suffer" through or "hang on".

[Anyplace Farm]

This month's PH mag w/GM on the cover has a great exercise in there that is a core strengthener. I tried it this weekend and it killed my core and my butt. Can't remember the guy's name that did the article but it was very good and it was about finding your horse's center over fences. He gave what he called this 'bread and butter' exercise on the flat, then shared another to practice over fencese.

In two point, and 20-30 degrees in front of the vertical, using your jumping length stirrup (yes, a core strengthener WITH stirrups!) at the posting trot, sit one, hold for the rise for two. It was hilarious how hard this was to coordinate and how much of a workout it gave your bod. It reminded me of the thing you did where you patted the top of your head and rubbed your tummy at the same time. Very hard to coordinate and you definitely felt it in your core. The pix of the guy over fences were phenomenal. The guy's leg was SOLID.

I'm going to fold it into my routine.

[Go Fish]

I would do a lot of two-point at the trot until you can do it easily for 10 minutes nonstop. This will help build not only your leg strength, but your core and back as well. Once you can hold your two point at the trot for an extended period of time, riding correctly w/out stirrups will be much easier for you. Also, once you start your know stirrup work, begin at the walk until your comfortable and then move to the trot and canter.

I personally don't like to see people riding without stirrups until they are strong enough to hold their position correctly. You can gain bad habits, such as pinching w/ the knee, if you aren't doing it correctly.

Yep...grab mane if you have to. I totally suck at no-stirrups work because I tend to grip with my knees when I don't have stirrup support. This helped strengthen my leg and working without stirrups got easier, as a result.

Now, if someone could give some tips on how not to avoid this exercise because I'm lazy...:lol:

[Dixon]

You can even do no stirrup work at the walk and it will make a difference.

This is a very good point. Many people avoid no-stirrups work because it can be so darned difficult and uncomfortable at the trot. But if your horse's trot just doesn't facilitate no-stirrup work, then do it at the walk and canter. For example, warm up yourself and your horse at the walk with no stirrups. It's GOOD for your leg to hang long -- don't focus on keeping your knee bent. The long leg works your leg muscles better. Try a little two-point at the walk, and increase the time you're able to stay up each ride. After some walk on a long rein, then take up contact and ask your horse for a bit of lateral work at the walk with no irons. It may be a slow gait, but you can work your legs all the same. If his canter is more amenable to no-stirrups work than his trot, then practice at the canter. Downward transitions from canter to walk or halt without stirrups are especially good for your leg and overall position.

[chawley]

This month's PH mag w/GM on the cover has a great exercise in there that is a core strengthener. I tried it this weekend and it killed my core and my butt. Can't remember the guy's name that did the article but it was very good and it was about finding your horse's center over fences. He gave what he called this 'bread and butter' exercise on the flat, then shared another to practice over fencese.

In two point, and 20-30 degrees in front of the vertical, using your jumping length stirrup (yes, a core strengthener WITH stirrups!) at the posting trot, sit one, hold for the rise for two. It was hilarious how hard this was to coordinate and how much of a workout it gave your bod. It reminded me of the thing you did where you patted the top of your head and rubbed your tummy at the same time. Very hard to coordinate and you definitely felt it in your core. The pix of the guy over fences were phenomenal. The guy's leg was SOLID.

I'm going to fold it into my routine.

I just read this article last night! As soon as I'm back in the saddle (off for six weeks from surgery), this will be added to my two point at the trot exercise to whip me back into riding shape.

[juniorhunter15]

If you're going to start doing NS work, I'd suggest starting with just the sitting trot and the canter and focusing on gripping with your calves instead of pinching with your knee, doing the posting trot w/o stirrups can cause bad knee-pinching. So until your calves are strong enough, I wouldn't do posting trot.

[medical mike]

or some serial pics....

What you are describing is not necessarily a straight function of a "weak core".

Questions:
Do you lose your stirrups doing other heights?
Any joint pains?

What type of strengthening exercises do you use?

REgards,
Medical Mike
equestrian medical researcher
www.fitfocusedforward.us

[Aerial]

Thanks all! i took your guys advice and just took it easy and on a horse with normal strides today. Sat the walk trot and canter no stirrups. No two point at the canter but i was able to post a little bit NS at the trot. Just posted for a few strides and then sat. Oh. My. Gosh i was dieing by the end lol. But horse and i both got a good work out todaY!!!! =)

and Medical mike- no i almost never lose my stirrups because i usually ride with the nice "cheese grater" stirrups but i was riding in slippery (and it was raining so they were wet) safety stirrups yesterday and today. and nope, no joint pains, unless my back counts??? but my back always hurts even if i'm not riding that day.

[smm20]

I second the suggestion to do the "up, up, down" exercise - post up for two strides and then sit. This is very, very hard to do and builds your core and legs. I've added it to my non-lesson day routine and have found that this has really helped me with no-stirrups work in lessons but is a bit "safer" when just out hacking. If your horse spooks or you lose your balance, the stirrups are still there. Do that for a few weeks and then start on no stirrups work and you will feel more secure.

[medical mike]

INteresting that you have to use cheese graters to keep your feet in place.

Have you always used cheese graters or when you were first learning to ride did you use regular stirrups?

To that, have you always had back pain
or possibly
did the cheesegrater stirrups come along with the back pain?

I'm wondering if there is some type of secondary compensation due to the back pain that is more apparent when you didn't have the cheese graters?

Do you find yourself catching a toe when walking or maybe one leg feels "weaker" than the other?

I'm thinking that some exercises that tie in spinal muscle strengthening with lower extremity strengthening is probably needed.

What off horse exercises do you perform now/ have performed to keep up your back strength?

REgards,
Medical Mike
equestrian medical researcher
www.fitfocusedforward.us

[findeight]

Just off the top of my head here...

If you slipped out of the irons and your back hurts?

I'd guess your basic issue is not enough weight in the heels. You might be getting a little lazy about the weight and letting the iron hold you in.

Why do I think this? You are describing MY BIGGEST PROBLEM to a tee. I have found that when I am not properly in my heels, my back tells me because it's bearing too much of the weight (L5 vertabrae specifically).

When I feel that, I go to a full two point and really try to get that weight going down thru hip ahnd heel while being careful not to lead with the shoulder. Remember the line goes from shoulder thru hip to heel. If it does not, your lower back eats it because it is holding you up...if that makes sense.

IMO working with no irons is great for developing your inner thigh and seat which will stabilize your lower leg BUT only work in a PROPER two point is going to stretch and strengthen from the knee down...and you can do this without irons...eventually with alot of practice. But flatwork without irons will not fix a loose/weak/lazy heel and lower leg.

Trust me, I am the queen of no irons on the flat because I rode Western for 25 years, it will not help weight in the heel.

I also do use the cheese graters in a plain fillis iron. Have used the flexy ones, they still did not compensate for lack of weight in the heel.

And try stretching before riding to strengthen that lower back a little as well as loosen the thigh and hamstrings...a chiropractor can help that back and also explain how to align yourself between adjustments.

[lizathenag]

try riding with one stirrup. I find it way more difficult and useful than no stirrups. go both directions with both the inside and outside stirrup iron dropped (not at the same time)

[midnightdream]

Sounds like you need to do some work out of the saddle to develop a more solid core. It is important to do some endurance exercises for your core- things like crunches with a pause at the top, jackknifes, Russian twists, supermans, leg lifts with a hip thrust, etc- I can explain them if you would like more info- some balance exercises on the ground would help too. I started going to a bootcamp a few months ago that focuses alot on abdominal muscles and found that it greatly improved my balance when riding and has made no stirrup work alot easier. I ride a standardbred with a very bouncy trot and I do well posting no stirrups on him now whereas I couldn't before.

[laves81]

Sounds like you need to do some work out of the saddle to develop a more solid core. It is important to do some endurance exercises for your core- things like crunches with a pause at the top, jackknifes, Russian twists, supermans, leg lifts with a hip thrust, etc- I can explain them if you would like more info- some balance exercises on the ground would help too. I started going to a bootcamp a few months ago that focuses alot on abdominal muscles and found that it greatly improved my balance when riding and has made no stirrup work alot easier. I ride a standardbred with a very bouncy trot and I do well posting no stirrups on him now whereas I couldn't before.

I couldn't agree more! Strength training can really improve your riding. Planks on a swiss ball are my personal fav. but there are lots and lots of ways to get your core stronger- don't just focus on your abs- make sure you work your back too.

[hollyhorse2000]

Off-the-horse strengthening and stretching both sound in order. I have the good fortunate to have an "equestrian pilates" instructor nearby. She rides and has developed a program specifically for riders. I have a strong, stiff right side and a weak, flexible left side, which she's working to correct. All the no-stirrup work in the world wouldn't fix that (altho it helps in other ways.) I saw a difference after my first session. I also have low back pain and the stretching is extremely important for this ...

[RugBug]

This month's PH mag w/GM on the cover has a great exercise in there that is a core strengthener. I tried it this weekend and it killed my core and my butt. Can't remember the guy's name that did the article but it was very good and it was about finding your horse's center over fences. He gave what he called this 'bread and butter' exercise on the flat, then shared another to practice over fencese.

In two point, and 20-30 degrees in front of the vertical, using your jumping length stirrup (yes, a core strengthener WITH stirrups!) at the posting trot, sit one, hold for the rise for two. It was hilarious how hard this was to coordinate and how much of a workout it gave your bod. It reminded me of the thing you did where you patted the top of your head and rubbed your tummy at the same time. Very hard to coordinate and you definitely felt it in your core. The pix of the guy over fences were phenomenal. The guy's leg was SOLID.

I'm going to fold it into my routine.

My trainer told me about this on Saturday. I tried it from her description and had a very difficult time. :lol: I then read the article that night and tried again yesterday. I found it quite easy, actually, unless the horse need extra leg input. When I tried leg yielding, etc, it became difficult. :winkgrin:

On another note, while I liked the security and softness of the rider (Michael Tokaruk?) in the pictures, He looked top heavy to me. Could be that he's 6'2" but if you took the horse out from under him, it looked like he'd fall over. :shrug: