Three Tenths of a stinking length

[JellyBeanQueen]

What a race. Rachel Alexandria won it by 3 tenths of a length over Mind That Bird. I was just about to go nuts. I wanted Mind That Bird to win it and be the next Triple Crown winner. What a race. Its great though that a filly won it.

[Scaramouch]

I hope they both run in the Belmont. *That* will be a race.

[Larksmom]

My fantasy would be for her to rest, she looked really tired, and Calvin get back on the Bird and win the Triple Crown! Well, Calvin would win anyway

[War Admiral]

My fantasy would be for her to rest, she looked really tired, and Calvin get back on the Bird and win the Triple Crown! Well, Calvin would win anyway

I agree completely. She looked tired, she didn't run her best, as some of us have said she is VERY light of bone. Hope she skips it.

[tradewind]

It was a very good race, and I was totally rooting for Mine That Bird...that of course takes nothing away from the effort of RA.

[anchorsaway]

I agree completely. She looked tired, she didn't run her best, as some of us have said she is VERY light of bone. Hope she skips it.

I concur. If MTB wouldn't have caught some of that traffic, I have few doubts that he would've beaten her.

[BabyGoose]

He almost caught her. It just confirms that he is a great little horse. To be that close to what some people call a superfreak af a racehorse, that makes him great and his connections should be so proud. I just hope they get the recognition they deserve.

[Catsdorule-sigh]

Mine That Bird is for real. Yes, would have been interesting had he not had to go wide. Things seemed to open up after he pulled out but you can't wait forever.

Congrats to the filly but for me, the Belmont is the real test of class. No one seems to know if the filly has the distance or not.

Meanwhile, MTB's trainer said early on the Belmont would be better for the horse and that the Preakness distance was not in his favor. Give the guy credit for knowing his horse.

I think the filly looked very tired after the race and I'm not sure she would get enough time between races to tackle the Belmont. Is the Belmont track deep also?

[Auburn]

Rachael Alexandra was the first horse, EVER, to win The Preakness from the 13th post spot.

Mares Rule (at least for today)!

Mine That Bird ran a good race. If the rail had opened up or the other horses had let him through or if there had been another three lengths, he probably would have taken her.

It just was RA's day. :D:D:D:D

[grayarabs]

Oh, that was so close. I so wanted MTB to win. If not win - then be in top five.
This race proved he is the real deal. So is RA. And I would have to add Musket Man - finished third in both races.
I, too, think that MTB could have beaten RA. And IMHO he is the better horse.

[Gestalt]

No one can really say that Mine That Bird would have won if, he hadn't had to go wide, if he had a bit more length, etc. The reality is, is that he didn't pass her. Calvin whacked RA a couple of times and she dug in at the very end. She was hand ridden for most of the race.

Don't take anything away from Rachel Alexandra. That filly came from the outside post and led the race. She is all class and heart. No wonder her jockey loves her so much.

And no horse "takes" the Triple Crown away from another horse. MTB is a fantastic gelding, but he just couldn't outrun the girl today. :)

[anchorsaway]

Mine That Bird is for real. Yes, would have been interesting had he not had to go wide. Things seemed to open up after he pulled out but you can't wait forever.

Congrats to the filly but for me, the Belmont is the real test of class. No one seems to know if the filly has the distance or not.

Meanwhile, MTB's trainer said early on the Belmont would be better for the horse and that the Preakness distance was not in his favor. Give the guy credit for knowing his horse.

I think the filly looked very tired after the race and I'm not sure she would get enough time between races to tackle the Belmont. Is the Belmont track deep also?

It's not called Big Sandy for nothin' ;)

[danceronice]

I hope they both run in the Belmont. *That* will be a race.

No, that will be a walkover. RA was done at the end of the Preakness--I doubt she could have gone the Derby distance and her connections are idiots if they send her to NY. I'm a little let down, though now that I looked at her record, really...if she's a superhorse, she should be undefeated at this point as she's only been running against fillies.

However, the group that should still be worried is Zenyatta's connections. Most races for f/m aren't longer than the Preakness.

[grayarabs]

Wasn't RA in the lead/in front most of the race - if not wire to wire?
Now, that is difficult to do. (but perhaps she had the better trip?).
MTB was caught behind some horses and was wider. If only there had been a gap!!!

[War Admiral]

No, that will be a walkover. RA was done at the end of the Preakness--I doubt she could have gone the Derby distance and her connections are idiots if they send her to NY.

Thank you, yes, glad someone else sees it.

However, the group that should still be worried is Zenyatta's connections. Most races for f/m aren't longer than the Preakness.

I agree with you on this, as well!

[3Dogs]

No one can really say that Mine That Bird would have won if, he hadn't had to go wide, if he had a bit more length, etc. The reality is, is that he didn't pass her. Calvin whacked RA a couple of times and she dug in at the very end. She was hand ridden for most of the race.

Don't take anything away from Rachel Alexandra. That filly came from the outside post and led the race. She is all class and heart. No wonder her jockey loves her so much.

And no horse "takes" the Triple Crown away from another horse. MTB is a fantastic gelding, but he just couldn't outrun the girl today. :)

Boy is this a tough crowd! I agree with you Gestalt - lot's of coulda, woulda, shoulda going on today! Whatever - it REALLY doesn't matter because RA won, and there it is. Woulda, Coulda , Shoulda is how some folks live there lives but hey, the reality is, she WON! Now, as to whether she is a Belmont horse, I have no clue.

[Galileo1998]

I was glad to see both of them run really well, but also think that if her connections are smart they will skip the Belmont. Mine That Bird is bred to, and runs like he will get every single inch of 1 1/2 miles, Rachel Alexandra not so much. I don't like to see good horses made to look common, and would bet dollars to donuts that is what will happen if she runs in the Belmont.

[Linny]

I would bet anything that RA wont be in the Belmont.

[farmgirl88]

the fact is, yes, she won. The fact is that Mine that Bird hunter her down like a cat....from last place. You dont see an ordinary horse come from last, burn through turns and obstacles like that and hit 5 more gears to catch up to what people are calling one of the greatest racehorses.

Thats the 2nd time he did that...in 2 weeks. No one was as composed and quiet as him and i must say the RA was extremely exhuasted after a little bit of pressure. Bottom line is that she got to the front of the pack from the outside post. her post did nothing but help her in the situation as they knew it would just put her on the outside where they wanted her.

Good race and win for RA....but for me; the credit goes to Bird. He's a heck of a horse and one more stride and he would've been nose to nose with her, and hes a gelding and only 15.1 compared to her monsterous 16.2+.

Bird was obviously the better horse, still completely relaxed, calm, quiet and not sweaty at the end. meanwhile she was drenched and exhausted. I think MTB will have the guts and drive to stalk everyone and have them stay out of his way for the mile and a half and then turn for home and let them have it. After RA's exhausting drive at only a mile 1/8 today, i highly doubt she'll prove much of anything in the belmont

[foggybok]

No one can really say that Mine That Bird would have won if, he hadn't had to go wide, if he had a bit more length, etc. The reality is, is that he didn't pass her. Calvin whacked RA a couple of times and she dug in at the very end. She was hand ridden for most of the race.

Don't take anything away from Rachel Alexandra. That filly came from the outside post and led the race. She is all class and heart. No wonder her jockey loves her so much.

And no horse "takes" the Triple Crown away from another horse. MTB is a fantastic gelding, but he just couldn't outrun the girl today. :)

Yeah, the way I look at it, if the filly had been in the 2 position she would have won by even more! Yeah MTB had some traffic, but the filly was runnng wide for a good portion of the race and came from the 13 spot....

I'm glad she won! And glad MTB did so well too!

[Mara]

Boy is this a tough crowd! I agree with you Gestalt - lot's of coulda, woulda, shoulda going on today! Whatever - it REALLY doesn't matter because RA won, and there it is. Woulda, Coulda , Shoulda is how some folks live there lives but hey, the reality is, she WON! Now, as to whether she is a Belmont horse, I have no clue.

Take one horse out (RA), and the race can set up completely differently. EVERYONE was watching this filly; she was the target.
It's anyone's guess as to who would have won if she hadn't been in it. (And I love MTB- he's one tough, gutsy little dude. I look forward to watching him run for a while).
And as for the Belmont being the "real test of class", I don't really think so, anymore. 9 furlongs or a mile & a quarter are the benchmark distances in US racing now. It's a tough, tough race, and it IS a test of class for horses who run all 3 TC races competitively (meaning they hit the board). But as a test of overall class, which 3YO really is the best? Not for many years, now.

[Filly85']

I would bet anything that RA wont be in the Belmont.

I agree with you on that one Linny.

RA is a freak. Everyone that was anywhere close to that pace today finished well back from her. I think she is a little bit better than what she looked today because the way that the track was playing. She also set some tough fractions in a race of that distance. The best horse won today. However, that race certainly took a lot out of her and I have faith that the connections will do right by her.

MTB is certainly not an ordinary horse either. I'm glad we have an underdog horse like this one running. The little gutsy gelding is easy to root for. In a funny way, I feel like I may be feeling what people felt back in the day when they watched Seabiscuit. Maybe this horse is what the sport needs right now. He's something to get excited about!

[grayarabs]

Thoughts:
Both MTB and RA raced two weeks ago - she had one day's more rest than he did.
She won by 20 - he by 6. How much was taken out of each horse in the Derby?
Wonder if she was in heat today.
Length of stride - MTB's vs RA? How does that factor? In effort?
Don't some of the gurus measure how many strides a horse takes in a race and how far a horse actually runs?

[JellyBeanQueen]

I must say I realy wanted a TC winner this year. We as a country need it. If not just to have something positive like the TC. HOWEVER, RA ran a good race and yes she was indeed tired after the race. 2 weeks can show alot of difference between winners and "losers". I realy dont think they will race her in the Belmont. I think that will push her way to hard and I am sure no one wants her to get hurt..

MTB has shown his stuff that is for sure. Remarkable little gelding (I wonder why he was gelded?) and I say he may have a long racing career. Coming in second I am sure still paid a nice purse. To bad he was nearly boxed in. I say he and RA woould be seriously battling it out.

[Acertainsmile]

Two different running styles...and the best horse today won. :)

[Laurierace]

I was there and thought both horses were wonderful, but I think Calvin would have won the race no matter which horse he chose. I could have won on Rachel, and MTB would have won with a rail trip IMO.

[Carol Ames]

What is RAs' breeding?

[akor]

If MTB had been #13 and had won, y'all would have been whooping it up like he was the best thing since sliced bread.

Many of you had a favorite, MTB, and well, he didn't win today. Blame it on whomever/whatever you want, he and his jockey were not #1 today. Doesn't mean he isn't a great horse. Doesn't mean he can't beat her under nearly exactly the same circumstances a different day.

But, today, RA won the preakness and he didn't. I think they have first, second, and third place for a reason in competitions. It's because someone wins and someone loses.

BTW, I do agree she looked a bit spent. But, she maybe never had to try so hard. Maybe it was more her mind than her body - I know my mare can be that way - mind tired.

Hey, I'm a mare person all the way, I'll admit I'm biased, and I'm here to say

"Girls Rule, Boys Drool"

[Mara]

What is RAs' breeding?

Sire - Medaglia D'Oro, by El Prado, who is by Sadler's Wells
Dam - Lotta Kim, by Roar, by Forty Niner
So it's Northern Dancer Line on top of Raise A Native line

[Foxtrot's]

A very exciting race whoever won: I saw Mine That Bird's head bob up while he was in the crush - he would have lost a few strides there, but the way he closed on the mare was truly awesome and if he had had those few more strides he would have made it.
It is not always the better horse who wins, it is often the luck of how the race unfolds.
In any case, they are both awesome. WooHoo - they are talking of breeding her to Curlin!

She is a big mare at l6.2 hh and fine legged - a long Belmont race would be hard on her.
At l5.2 hh MTB is the Seabiscuit of the century IMO. He is also a gelding so will not be sent to the breeding shed and we can see him run for a long time, hopefully.

[equescool]

I feel like I may be feeling what people felt back in the day when they watched Seabiscuit. Maybe this horse is what the sport needs right now. He's something to get excited about!
I agree. That is how I felt. I came out of my chair when that little gelding started moving up - just couldn't believe my eyes. She is a lovely filly, but oh my gosh is he a race horse~! EQ

[Atypical]

I don't think it's fair to simply say, well, without traffic, MTB would have beaten her. Neither one had a perfect trip. Rachel came from WAY on the outside, had to gun past everyone to get up to the lead, and then race wide around for quite a bit. The fractions were not easy, 46 and change at the half, and she held on?

And then on MTB's side, he was having to split horses, got in a little traffic trouble, had to swing wide. He was flying. I was watching him right before they hit the far turn just start to steamroll the rest. However, the quick fractions probably helped him, as, admittedly would a longer race. Had the pace been softer who knows? Maybe Musket Man would have given him a really good run?? There are too many variables, and neither horse had a perfectly ideal trip, so who's to say?

Fantastic race, either way.

[SLW]

Bird was obviously the better horse, still completely relaxed, calm, quiet and not sweaty at the end. meanwhile she was drenched and exhausted. I think MTB will have the guts and drive to stalk everyone and have them stay out of his way for the mile and a half and then turn for home and let them have it. After RA's exhausting drive at only a mile 1/8 today, i highly doubt she'll prove much of anything in the belmont

MTB has been amazing to watch in these two races. He gallops along the bulk of the distance then in the last quarter mile he runs like a Quarter horse.

[regret]

The plain and simple fact is that RA won. It would not matter if she had beat MTB by a nose. Last time I looked, it was the horse that was in first that was the winner. Who knows if MTB would have won if RA was not in the race. Another horse could have taken advantage of the opportunity. Back when Affirmed won the Triple Crown, I do not think that I heard that Alydar would have won if the race had been shorter, longer, etc. What happens happens.

[Mara]

At l5.2 hh MTB is the Seabiscuit of the century IMO. He is also a gelding so will not be sent to the breeding shed and we can see him run for a long time, hopefully.

I HOPE he is the Seabiscuit of this century, and not the next Funny Cide. I loved the big guy, but hated seeing him get embarrassed in allowance/optional claiming when he should've been retired.

[kdow]

I HOPE he is the Seabiscuit of this century, and not the next Funny Cide. I loved the big guy, but hated seeing him get embarrassed in allowance/optional claiming when he should've been retired.

One would hope that if that fate befalls MTB, one of the MANY people with OTTB experience I know who've been drooling over him would find out and snap him up. :D

(I think it's the attitude he seems to have - he doesn't seem to get overly wound up about stuff going on around him at all.)

[Acertainsmile]

I HOPE he is the Seabiscuit of this century, and not the next Funny Cide. I loved the big guy, but hated seeing him get embarrassed in allowance/optional claiming when he should've been retired.

Seabiscuit was retired due to injury, I would much rather see MTB run as long as he is sound and enjoys it... By the way, I've never seen an embarrassed racehorse! :)

[Zevida]

As a matter of fact, Rachel Alexandra won the Preakness by a full length, not 3/10ths of a length.

The official race chart can be reviewed here:

http://www.equibase.com/static/chart/pdf/PIM051609USA12.pdf

[danceronice]

One would hope that if that fate befalls MTB, one of the MANY people with OTTB experience I know who've been drooling over him would find out and snap him up. :D

(I think it's the attitude he seems to have - he doesn't seem to get overly wound up about stuff going on around him at all.)

I call dibs! (Just kidding, though I *am* wondering if I can scrounge up a mare, save my pennies, and hope they don't jack up Birdstone's fee TOO much.)

And yeah, talk about a cool customer--not only did he get pushed out, come from WAY out of left field, he did this after having the horse in the gate next to him flip out and throw his jockey. I want an OTTB with those kind of cool.

I think for some of us (me, anyway) there was so much hype about RA, if she was going to be the heroic spoiler she needed to do it decisively and show she was MUCH the best. Especially after winning the Oaks so completely decisively. She just didn't. She didn't seem to have ANY trouble or take any time getting from the outside to the rail, she was up front, if she were that great she should have been going away, but as one would expect with those fractions had Mine That Bird and Musket Man running her down at the end. I think her connections know that she didn't quite perform the way the hype (media-generated, true) indicated, which is why we're getting the talk about not liking the footing. I saw a good filly hanging on by less than a length in a short TC race, not a superhorse and not a horse I would think of sending to the Belmont, especially against Mine That Bird, who's bred for 1 1/2.

I was lead to believe she was something spectacular and she just wasn't. She won, but not impressively, and if I were going to get behind a spoiler it had to be great. It was just okay and nothing to make me believe she could handle male company in something like the Classic or the Belmont.

ETA: All I see on the chart is she "held" and MTB was "gaining" while Musket Man was "outfinished." He got in, she rallied, he was coming on. I also looked farther down--not really surprised with Friesan Fire but Pioneerof the Nile...ergh. Speaking of letdowns...also :( for General Quarters. I hope they pass on the Belmont, I like a good feel-good story but this is getting just feel-bad.

[Zevida]

I was lead to believe she was something spectacular and she just wasn't. She won, but not impressively, and if I were going to get behind a spoiler it had to be great. It was just okay and nothing to make me believe she could handle male company in something like the Classic or the Belmont.

Wow. Gotta love those sour grapes. :rolleyes:

"She won, but not impressively enough for me, so she's not all that."

No doubt if Mine That Bird had run the exact same race Rachel Alexandra did, you'd be singing his praises and declaring him a super horse. Gosh, and he couldn't even beat the filly who ran a "just okay" race.

[vineyridge]

I looked at the chart again and realized that I'd said something really stupid.

That's why I deleted the post.

[Zevida]

I looked at the chart again and realized that I'd said something really stupid.

That's why I deleted the post.

Nah, they can be tricky to read if you aren't used to them. :)

[Mara]

Wow. Gotta love those sour grapes. :rolleyes:

"She won, but not impressively enough for me, so she's not all that."

No doubt if Mine That Bird had run the exact same race Rachel Alexandra did, you'd be singing his praises and declaring him a super horse. Gosh, and he couldn't even beat the filly who ran a "just okay" race.

I have to think in some cases you are correct. I've been a racing fan for a long, long time and have been guilty of that myself when a horse I was crazy for got beat!

[gubbyz]

Hey even Micheal Phelps got beat today! Happens to the best of them! :D Rooting for the "Bird" in the Belmont!

[danceronice]

I think it's natural, but it's also in this case worse because she's not what the hype says. I didn't see a race from a horse who's a "superfreak". Just another TC spoiler who didn't come out looking like she could handle the Belmont distance and probably not even the Derby. Though in that case, I think she'd have faded, but since Borel would undoubtedly have been on her it probably wouldn't have been MTB who won as he wouldn't have had that rail trip (and then HE could have been the annoying spoiler in the Belmont with a five-week break.)

It would be easier to root for her without the hype. Next to the fillies, she looks impressive, next to the colts, she was just good, and for me that's not good enough for me to get behind when it's the Triple Crown. If she can manage to win convincingly at 1 1/2 miles and prove she really *IS* exceptional compared to males, then we'll talk great. And if her owners don't retire her ASAP. At least a gelding might hang around for a while. But they kept Curlin in training when a LOT of owners wouldn't have so maybe there's hope. (And maybe when they do try to breed a "superfoal" he'll put some endurance genes in. Even if he did get beat at distance by a distance-running girl.)

[Equilibrium]

Maybe it's only me, but I saw a filly who came from an impossible post position, had it taken to her, struggled with the track and still won. The mark of a really good horse is one who has the ability to overcome adversity. RA had it all against her today and still won. May not have been what people wanted to see, but she gutted it out. MTB ran a terrific race, no doubt about it, but he was tired too.

It was a very good race fought between 2 very good horses. But I hope they don't take the filly to the Belmont. Give her a little rest now and work on a fall campaign.

Terri

[vineyridge]

Dancer On Ice, you do realize that RA's great grandfather is Sadlers Wells who is the sire of some of the best European horses of this era--and they run long. Although El Prado was a short distance horse, he was able to sire classic distance horses like Medaglia D'Oro as many milers do. Sadler's Wells was second in the Arc and was also a champion miler.

She's got just as much distance in her pedigree as MTB does--maybe more.

[vineyridge]

Terri, I saw the same thing you did, along with a brilliant ride by Borel. I don't think he'd have mentioned her struggles with the track if he didn't believe it.

[outofthebox]

I agree with those who say RA did not exactly live up the hype... yes, she won, but it was not the fluid, effortless ride we saw in the Oaks. We were told that she has never been asked to really run before, well, she certainly was asked today! If her best effort was enough to win by a length, then she is a good filly, not a super filly. And I too am skeptical of the immediate excuse that the footing prevented her from running better, being that all of the horses had to deal with the same footing. Without a decisive win here, I feel they will not subject her to possible loss at Belmont and will now keep her in filly races. She has indeed proved herself today, why risk injury?

[Equilibrium]

Terri, I saw the same thing you did, along with a brilliant ride by Borel. I don't think he'd have mentioned her struggles with the track if he didn't believe it.

No he wouldn't have. Some horses give it up on a track they can't handle very well, others keep trying and gut it out.

I saw Jimmy Fortune on TV over here today (English Jock) making more excuses for our supposed super filly, Rainbow View. More blah blah blah, struggled with the ground when she got trampled in the GNS. This was well before the Preakness. My husband was muttering about how true that was and I quipped "A good horse runs on anything." I think I've yet to find a horse in England or Ireland who just gets beat, it's always the ground.

Terri

[FrenchFrytheEqHorse]

I think it's natural, but it's also in this case worse because she's not what the hype says. I didn't see a race from a horse who's a "superfreak". Just another TC spoiler who didn't come out looking like she could handle the Belmont distance and probably not even the Derby.

I'm probably the least educated individual on this forum, as I enjoy horse racing, but have no "dog in the fight"- either intellectually or physically. I would have been equally happy today had Mine That Bird beaten Rachel Alexander. However, I am not sure I can resist responding to this comment- of COURSE we didn't see a horse handling the Belmont distance, and we certainly didn't see a replay of the Derby with the filly running, so what's your point? Today she ran in the Preakness. She ran against a field she'd never competed with before, on a track that gave her some trouble. She's been working under a new trainer for the past week and a half. It's been two weeks since her last meet, and unlike many of the colts that ran today, she hasn't been training for the past half year with the triple crown meeting in mind.

Those who've said she ran her heart out today are seeing the exact same thing I saw. I also saw a hell of a show by Mine That Bird. His move was awe inspiring, and I think he's going to be a real contender in the Belmont. But I think both horses are examples of fabulous athletes that beat their respective odds to achieve greatness, and I think everyone should recognize that. Just as MTB has an inspiring story having come from the claiming path (with A LOT in his career since then), RA has changed ownership in the past week and a half, run against horses whose class she's never seen, and prepared therefore in foreign circumstances. Her story rocks, too, and just because she didn't get shipped to the meet by a man on crutches doesn't mean she can't be an inspiration to us all. She won. And that's what counted today.

[FrenchFrytheEqHorse]

P.S.- for those of you looking for a story, as I am myself, Calvin Borel still has a chance to win the Triple Crown on 2 different horses. If I am not mistaken, he will be the first jock to do so if RA doesn't run and he gets the ride on MTB. All of us saw him execute a textbook ride on MTB in the Derby, and a lot of us feel he rode wonderfully today- none of us can thumb our noses at his ride in the Oaks, so THERE'S THE STORY. We already know we don't have a TC winning horse this year, so let's root for the man behind the scenes who's given both his mounts PHENOMENAL rides for the past two weeks.

[BabyGoose]

I'm probably the least educated individual on this forum, as I enjoy horse racing, but have no "dog in the fight"- either intellectually or physically. I would have been equally happy today had Mine That Bird beaten Rachel Alexander. However, I am not sure I can resist responding to this comment- of COURSE we didn't see a horse handling the Belmont distance, and we certainly didn't see a replay of the Derby with the filly running, so what's your point? Today she ran in the Preakness. She ran against a field she'd never competed with before, on a track that gave her some trouble. She's been working under a new trainer for the past week and a half. It's been two weeks since her last meet, and unlike many of the colts that ran today, she hasn't been training for the past half year with the triple crown meeting in mind.

Those who've said she ran her heart out today are seeing the exact same thing I saw. I also saw a hell of a show by Mine That Bird. His move was awe inspiring, and I think he's going to be a real contender in the Belmont. But I think both horses are examples of fabulous athletes that beat their respective odds to achieve greatness, and I think everyone should recognize that. Just as MTB has an inspiring story having come from the claiming path (with A LOT in his career since then), RA has changed ownership in the past week and a half, run against horses whose class she's never seen, and prepared therefore in foreign circumstances. Her story rocks, too, and just because she didn't get shipped to the meet by a man on crutches doesn't mean she can't be an inspiration to us all. She won. And that's what counted today.

Well said! I just got so tired of the doubts and lack of respect that was thrown toward MTB. But I guess that is what it means to be the underdog!

[Glimmerglass]

Wow. Gotta love those sour grapes. :rolleyes:

"She won, but not impressively enough for me, so she's not all that."

I have to concur there.

No shoulda, coulda, woulda ... the race was run and she took the victory. This isn't the best 3 of 5 attempts. Borel said she didn't like the track and labored on it. That shouldn't be equated to say she was cooked or worse as some would seemingly like to go even further by inferring she's only good for a mle or mile and sixteenth.

You simply don't go from almost setting the stakes record in the Oaks and two weeks later - the shortest runback in her sophmore career - without the potential for some toll having been taken.

So Rachel's overall career isn't as an undefeated runner. The list of horses who lost at 2 range from Citation to Spectacular Bid to John Henry to Secretariat. Yep her first effort was off the board and two additional races at age two were good for 'just' 2nd. Less known is that she had an small ankle chip uncovered later and fixed.

Following that correction she put in the jaw dropping win in the Grade 2 Golden Rod in late Nov, setting the stakes record, then in 2009 with her return to the races set the stakes record for the Martha Washington Stakes, then in the next two graded stakes races she was completely geared down well before the wire. She just missed the stakes record for the Oaks for time and as we all know set the record for margin of victory.

Bestowing any "super" title this early in any horse's career is foolish but she has proven to be one hell of a runner.
It's one thing to be skeptical of how a horse might do in the future under the most grueling of demands with running in the Belmont after the Preakness. However don't for a moment be fooled into thinking her last six victories have been anything but impressive.

Winning Colors nor Genuine Risk could not accomplish what she did at Pimlico.

Mine That Bird ran his race - a damn solid one in my view - and proved a heck of a lot of doubting folks wrong that he was a one hit wonder. I happily scored the exacta with him and RA so I put my money where my mouth was ;)

[Equilibrium]

I agree with those who say RA did not exactly live up the hype... yes, she won, but it was not the fluid, effortless ride we saw in the Oaks. We were told that she has never been asked to really run before, well, she certainly was asked today! If her best effort was enough to win by a length, then she is a good filly, not a super filly. And I too am skeptical of the immediate excuse that the footing prevented her from running better, being that all of the horses had to deal with the same footing. Without a decisive win here, I feel they will not subject her to possible loss at Belmont and will now keep her in filly races. She has indeed proved herself today, why risk injury?

Why are you doubtful of struggling on the ground? Just curious. At the end of the day why did she need to run better? Anyone see the gallop out? The filly surged again where MTB did not. Yes I know hands were dropped, I do know racing, but when MTB got that bit closer off she went.

At the end of the day, the ground was not an excuse for her not winning by 30 lengths, it was a testament to her sheer class and the fact she's a very very good filly indeed.

Terri

[outofthebox]

My point is that if she was struggling with the footing, all of the rest of the horses must have also been struggling. I am not sure that any footing issues would have affected her. It would be interesting ask the other jockeys if they felt their horses were not at their best due to footing. I was just surprised that instead of his customary jubliation at a win, Borel seemed subdued and seemed quick to explain why she didn't do better.

[Go Fish]

I'm far from a race expert, but love the sport and watch it closely. My parents had race horses when I was kid, so I'm not a total idiot. I find it disappointing that some people on this thread are trying to diminish this great filly's win today with "coulda, shouda, if only," as if to say that she really didn't deserve to win. She ran against the boys and won...the fat lady sang today!

[Equilibrium]

My point is that if she was struggling with the footing, all of the rest of the horses must have also been struggling. I am not sure that any footing issues would have affected her. It would be interesting ask the other jockeys if they felt their horses were not at their best due to footing. I was just surprised that instead of his customary jubliation at a win, Borel seemed subdued and seemed quick to explain why she didn't do better.

What is easy for some horses to handle leaves others struggling. Just because one struggles doesn't mean they all do.

And in no way am I picking on you because you ask good questions. I just think overall it may be hard for people to understand it can be difficult and hard for horses to overcome a surface they aren't comfortable on, but yet still manage to win.

Terri

[Atypical]

I don't think that because one horse has trouble with a particular type of footing that they all will. Look back at the year Point Given ran. He ran an uninspiring what... fifth in the Derby? I didn't think it looked like he liked the track at all. Came back to win the Preakness in good fashion, the Belmont in really good fashion, and then on to win the Travers impressively, again back at a mile and a quarter. (okay, so much of this is speculation, but still you see my point).

She didn't like the footing, but she gutted it out and still won. Thats something. And by no means does that detract from MTB's run. Outstanding performances from both

[kcmel]

I agree with those who say RA did not exactly live up the hype... yes, she won, but it was not the fluid, effortless ride we saw in the Oaks. We were told that she has never been asked to really run before, well, she certainly was asked today! If her best effort was enough to win by a length, then she is a good filly, not a super filly. And I too am skeptical of the immediate excuse that the footing prevented her from running better, being that all of the horses had to deal with the same footing. Without a decisive win here, I feel they will not subject her to possible loss at Belmont and will now keep her in filly races. She has indeed proved herself today, why risk injury?

Well, she did something no filly has done since 1924, so that make her pretty special. She also did something no colt has ever done, which is win the Preakness from the 13th post.

However, the question remains, as always, is how good is this class of 3 YOs? I wasn't super-impressed with any of them coming in to the Derby. I doubt that MTB is as good as some of the Derby winners we have seen in the recent past. So there is always the possibilty that she is just better than her generation, and wouldn't have been competitive in other years (e.g., the Street Sense/Curlin year, which was probably the best in recent memory).

[Drvmb1ggl3]

Dancer On Ice, you do realize that RA's great grandfather is Sadlers Wells who is the sire of some of the best European horses of this era--and they run long. Although El Prado was a short distance horse, he was able to sire classic distance horses like Medaglia D'Oro as many milers do. Sadler's Wells was second in the Arc and was also a champion miler.


Not that it has anything to do with this thread, but Sadlers Wells was unplaced in the Arc.

[DLee]

My impression of Calvin (who I love) was he felt bad for having to kind of "get into her". I mean, he used the stick what, twice?? MTB was coming up under a pretty good whip.
I am a fan of both horses, it was like watching Curlin and Rags, they were both so spectacular, it didn't really matter who won. And great horses don't stay out of the Triple Crown just so the Derby winner can have a better chance. That's why it's so special.

[Filly85']

No he wouldn't have. Some horses give it up on a track they can't handle very well, others keep trying and gut it out.

I saw Jimmy Fortune on TV over here today (English Jock) making more excuses for our supposed super filly, Rainbow View. More blah blah blah, struggled with the ground when she got trampled in the GNS. This was well before the Preakness. My husband was muttering about how true that was and I quipped "A good horse runs on anything." I think I've yet to find a horse in England or Ireland who just gets beat, it's always the ground.

Terri

Also, you can watch her Preakness compared to her Oaks. In the Oaks, she glided over the ground and switched leads easily in the stretch. In the Preakness, she was running funny up to and around the first turn and Calvin really had to ask hard for her to switch leads in the stretch. That is a sign of a sore horse (which I don't think that she is) or a horse that is clearly not getting over the ground well. Not liking a track and still running your heart out will take everything out of you.

I also found a pattern in her PPs. Everytime they only gave her two weeks in between races as a two year old, she lost. I think Rachel is a horse that may need 4 weeks in between races to run her best. So she had to overcome that today too in addition from breaking from the 13 hole, being a target, going fast early, not liking the track, and having to hold off the little gelding that I love so much.

I also am not one to call a horse a freak or a great unless they really are. I don't buy into the hype unless I really feel that the horse is something special. This filly is special.

I also do not feel like this crop of three year olds is week. We've had a lot of injuries, and some of the horses like Papa Clem and Pioneer have ran one too many times and need a break, but Mine That Bird and Musket Man are both very, very good horses. I'm a sucker for a deep closer on dirt, and Mine That Bird has a little jet pack in those hocks.

[Filly85']

My point is that if she was struggling with the footing, all of the rest of the horses must have also been struggling. I am not sure that any footing issues would have affected her. It would be interesting ask the other jockeys if they felt their horses were not at their best due to footing. I was just surprised that instead of his customary jubliation at a win, Borel seemed subdued and seemed quick to explain why she didn't do better.

Not necessarily. Some horses struggle over the turf and others run brillantly over it. Some horses are brillant turf horses but can't run over the dirt. It is the same with tracks. Some dirt horses love Saratoga, some dirt horses hate it. It all depends on the individual animal and their liking to a particular surface or track.

Street Sense was a horse that absolutely loved the surface at Churchill Downs, but he didn't like other tracks as much.

Footing issues can affect any horse that doesn't like a particular surface. Most horses will give up and not even try if they don't like it. The good ones like RA and Curlin give it their all anyway. The footing did affect her. Just watch how she was moving in the Oaks compared to the Preakness. See my post above.

[akor]

Am I the only one surprised that someone wouldn't get that footing matters?

Some love hard ground, some are like, ew, owie! ew, owie! Deep sand slows some down, let me tell you, it made NO difference to a TB I had. I think she actually had more energy. And, mudders, yes, some LOVE the mud. Whether you are running on a race track or jumping a jump course - some just seem to "love" slopping about, while others are like "I'm not getting my feet dirty, ew, something splashed me!" "There's water on my belly and mud - ackk!" I have to say I really didn't understand "mudders" until I rode one.

Now, "all" might like a "near perfect" base in that they "all" feel secure in it (Think some really nice indoors). but, once you move out of "perfect", they do seem to have opinions. And, some deal with less than their optimal conditions differently than others.

Added: What struck me in his comments was that he was worried when her "ears" flicked about and so he took the stick to her, I interpreted it as getting focus back more than anything. He said some of them shut down when that happens. And, I bet that the stick was a shock to her, this is a generalization, but I'm a mare person and in general, they don't take the stick quite the same way as others do. Maybe I heard him wrong, but that's my take on it.

Now, I don't know racehorses well at all, but they can't be THAT much different than other horses on that.

Sometimes I wonder if part of what makes a top race horse IS their ability to run good, no matter the track. Be consistent no matter what is underneath the feet. I give that to MTB, he seems to be one of those. In that, is he "better" than RA? well, that could be a working hypothesis.

[AllyCat]

Jeez, this is a tough crowd. I think RA and MTB (and others in the field) are awesome horses who ran a nice race. Both RA and MTB had their obstacles to overcome in this race and did well. I think disparaging one over the other because this one "can't run in sand" and "this one has thin bones" etc is just stoopid at this point. Armchair QBs indeed.

Lets just wait and see what happens.

[regret]

I'm probably the least educated individual on this forum, as I enjoy horse racing, but have no "dog in the fight"- either intellectually or physically. I would have been equally happy today had Mine That Bird beaten Rachel Alexander. However, I am not sure I can resist responding to this comment- of COURSE we didn't see a horse handling the Belmont distance, and we certainly didn't see a replay of the Derby with the filly running, so what's your point? Today she ran in the Preakness. She ran against a field she'd never competed with before, on a track that gave her some trouble. She's been working under a new trainer for the past week and a half. It's been two weeks since her last meet, and unlike many of the colts that ran today, she hasn't been training for the past half year with the triple crown meeting in mind.

Those who've said she ran her heart out today are seeing the exact same thing I saw. I also saw a hell of a show by Mine That Bird. His move was awe inspiring, and I think he's going to be a real contender in the Belmont. But I think both horses are examples of fabulous athletes that beat their respective odds to achieve greatness, and I think everyone should recognize that. Just as MTB has an inspiring story having come from the claiming path (with A LOT in his career since then), RA has changed ownership in the past week and a half, run against horses whose class she's never seen, and prepared therefore in foreign circumstances. Her story rocks, too, and just because she didn't get shipped to the meet by a man on crutches doesn't mean she can't be an inspiration to us all. She won. And that's what counted today.

Thank you for that statement. I think we need a new rule in racing. A horse needs to win a race by more then one length, must like the surface and can not beat the sentimental favorite. If all of the above is not met, then the purse will be given to the horse that comes in second.

[Mara]

Not that it has anything to do with this thread, but Sadlers Wells was unplaced in the Arc.


Yes, he was. But he sired an awful lot of horses who got 1.5 miles easily.

[Angel Undercover]

Akor, that was my interpretation too. Some horses loose focus when they can't see any horses in front of them, and will snap back when someone passes them but it's often too late. I think Calvin meant that he thought that RA was starting to "play" a bit, like she was at the end of the oaks. In that case, she could have trotted across the wire and it wouldn't have mattered! However, he used to stick to remind her that the race wasn't over and she dug in.

Regret, LOL :lol: Best post of this thread!

[MintHillFarm]

I concur. If MTB wouldn't have caught some of that traffic, I have few doubts that he would've beaten her.

I agree. He lost at least 2-3 lengths in my opinion. What a gutsy horse; another 2 jumps he could have caught her I think...however she was the winner and ran her heart out. Both gutsy and both deserved of much praise.

Musket Man ran very well too...

[erinwillow]

P.S.- for those of you looking for a story, as I am myself, Calvin Borel still has a chance to win the Triple Crown on 2 different horses. If I am not mistaken, he will be the first jock to do so if RA doesn't run and he gets the ride on MTB. All of us saw him execute a textbook ride on MTB in the Derby, and a lot of us feel he rode wonderfully today- none of us can thumb our noses at his ride in the Oaks, so THERE'S THE STORY. We already know we don't have a TC winning horse this year, so let's root for the man behind the scenes who's given both his mounts PHENOMENAL rides for the past two weeks.

Fabulous! I second this!

[Essie]

Fabulous race and 2 fabulous horses!!!!! :D

[grayarabs]

Still thinking about Mine That Bird. I love that horse. (also bemoaning the 5 more pounds he had to carry.......)

[danceronice]

Still thinking about Mine That Bird. I love that horse. (also bemoaning the 5 more pounds he had to carry.......)

I totally forgot she got a weight allowance...

And I don't really care that Sadler's Wells sired horses good over distance on turf. That wasn't what I saw today. If her losses came after short breaks, that might be why she didn't run like a distance horse--she needs long breaks. (Yes, I would prefer to return to the days where they raced every two weeks or more, in addition to routinely having races well over a mile. Of course, then they would have to start breeding tough instead of pretty again.) She was good, she was getting tired, in a longer race she'd have been passed. If they do go in the Belmont he'll need that stick.

And yes, for her to be great for me, she'd have to win decisively, and over distance. I would also like to see her go on turf, against either gender, before I'm ready to say she's anything but good. She's good. MTB is good. Musket Man is winning me over (he's at least game.) No superstars yet.

Now, if she totally trounces Zenyatta or holds off at 1 1/4+ in a stretch duel with males, we'll talk.

[JellyBeanQueen]

As a matter of fact, Rachel Alexandra won the Preakness by a full length, not 3/10ths of a length.

The official race chart can be reviewed here:

http://www.equibase.com/static/chart/pdf/PIM051609USA12.pdf

Yes I know, they stated such after I posted. The call was at first 3/10s then went to a full length when the race was analyzed by officials.

I jumped the gun tofast.:winkgrin:

[Carol Ames]

http://blog.planetc1.com/2008/05/03/equine-chiropractic-for-horses-and-thoroughbreds/

[Galileo1998]

Yes, he was. But he sired an awful lot of horses who got 1.5 miles easily.

And equally as many that will only get 1 1/2 miles in a horsebox. :lol:

[ProzacPuppy]

Good race. No one got hurt. RA ran a great race. MTB really showed everyone that his Derby win was not a fluke and that he has one helluva late kick. No idea how tired either was but I hate it when they use "he didn't like the track" as an excuse. Almost all of the truly GREAT ones ran their race no matter what the surface.

My husband sees Jackson's purchase of RA as his opportunity for his "15 minutes of fame". I see more of a breeding motive behind the purchase. Anyone want to hazard an opinion/guess as to why the purchase?

[Laurierace]

Good race. No one got hurt. RA ran a great race. MTB really showed everyone that his Derby win was not a fluke and that he has one helluva late kick. No idea how tired either was but I hate it when they use "he didn't like the track" as an excuse. Almost all of the truly GREAT ones ran their race no matter what the surface.

My husband sees Jackson's purchase of RA as his opportunity for his "15 minutes of fame". I see more of a breeding motive behind the purchase. Anyone want to hazard an opinion/guess as to why the purchase?

Rachel is no Curlin so I would say they already have the fame part covered. They bought her because she is an awesome horse.

[regret]

No idea how tired either was but I hate it when they use "he didn't like the track" as an excuse. Almost all of the truly GREAT ones ran their race no matter what the surface.




The filly won. He was not using it as an excuse. He was stating she did not like the surface.

[vineyridge]

And equally as many that will only get 1 1/2 miles in a horsebox. :lol:

Sadler's Wells was essentially a miler. Some people who have written a lot about breeding have opined that milers are able to breed both long and short, depending on the mare and HER family.

One of his best distance horses is Northern Spur who now stands in New York. That horse won several races at 15f, which is no small potatoes.

[DLee]

I guess Affirmed wasn't REALLY a Triple Crown horse as his wins were so close?? :rolleyes:
Whatever. Two great horses each had their day.

[elsbet]

Well, I would definitely root for Calvin if the possibility of him winning the Triple came up, but I have read that if Rachel Alexandra doesn't go to the Belmont, and Mine That Bird does, Woolley is giving Mike Smith the ride. Calvin may not have a horse....

[omare]

I thought Calvin was uncharacteristically nervous before the race--he had a wardrobe malfunction before going to the paddock (forgot to zip up?)--he dropped his stick when talking to the owner in the paddock --and he was still fiddling with his goggles when just about ready to go in the gate (like maybe he did not get fiddling with them soon enough and waited to late?)I noticed quite a few had their goggles pulled down going on to the track-- He just did not seem centered to me--and I suspect he is not use to being nervous--(takes practice to realize what you need to do when you are nervous ;-) itherefore, I was afraid when I saw him hussle the filly go to the front (as if he had a choice)-- I was afraid she was going tooo quick once she got the lead --and I was afraid she would just flatten out in the stretch. So I was impressed that she won -I did not think she was going to until she got across the finish line first.

[ProzacPuppy]

regret - Not necessarily meant only RA but I've heard that comment made after many a horse fails to "bring it". RA won and she "didn't handle the track". Good for her.

Laurierace - I just wonder why he'd pay what is speculated to be multi millions for her unless he has breeding in mind. I would imagine that her racing career will be finished by the end of this year to retire her sound and healthy and ready to produce the "Uber-horse".

[Laurierace]

I never said he didn't buy her with the intention to breed her. I said he bought her because she was an awesome horse. They tend to breed those kind too.

[FatDinah]

I think he bought her because he has a lot of money and wanted to.
Sometimes, it is that simple.

[EponaRoan]

And if I had his kind of money, I'd be buying me some really nice horses too. :D I don't know if I could sell a horse as nice as Rachel Alexandra, but sometimes it comes down to estates and taxes and one's own mortality.

There have been a lot of owners and trainers and jockeys that I haven't liked. (I carried a grudge against poor LeRoy Jolley for years since I thought it was he who made the comment about Ruffian unbuckling but it was actually his father that made the comment.) As I've gotten older (much), I've come to the conclusion that it's better to generally ignore the human connections and rejoice in the horses themselves.

And I like both MTB AND RA. So there. :winkgrin:

[ProzacPuppy]

How about that jockey situation with MTB in the news this AM? Mike Smith has prior commitments. If RA runs I assume Calvin will be aboard.

[Carol Ames]

(I carried a grudge against poor LeRoy Jolley for years since I thought it was he who made the comment about Ruffian unbuckling but it was actually his _father_ that made the comment.) As I've gotten older (much), I'veI was trying to remember who had said that,:confused: thanks! :yes: obviously NOT:sadsmile: a horse lover.:no: