Anyone Used This Bit?!

[CatchMeIfUCan]

http://www.bitofbritain.com/St_bben_Golden_Wings_Snaffle_p/382.htm

My eventer has a VERY sensitive mouth. His entire nose and side of his face is white, and it always turns pink in the summer time (even with numerous applications of high SPF sport sunscreen) so the corners of his mouth are always getting rubbed. I have used vaseline and numerous different kinds of bits. Even the happy mouths or other plastic bits do it to him! I saw this bit on Bit of Britain, and it looked like it might do the trick! Anyone had experience with it?

Also, would it be legal for dressage? It wouldn't be the end-all-be-all if it wasn't as I use velcro bit guards for warm-up but it would be nice not to have to remember to take those off!

Thanks!!

[caevent]

It's a really nice bit and I haven't seen it rub any horses. Just make sure the length is sufficient to not squeeze the corners of his mouth. Does it help to only turn him out at night?

[CatchMeIfUCan]

He gets into trouble A LOT so for my own sanity, I would like a watchful eye on him all day long. (Most recent? A 4 inch long, 2 inch wide laceration on his hock that was 1 mm from severing his nerve and tendon. 4+ weeks of absolutely not leaving his stall!). He is still very sensitive in the winter time even when his nose is bright shiny white, so I think it is more of a "just the way he is" type of thing. Just looking for ways to make him even more comfortable! Thanks for the input!

[beeblebrox]

It is not legal for dressage

And it does rub some horses.

[sublimequine]

I'm not an eventer, just wandered over here to read the threads, but I have a pink-muzzled mare so I know what you're going through. I highly suggest getting a long-nosed fly mask, like the Crusader. It will REALLY REALLY help.

[Sabovee]

It's not legal for dressage, but this is the bit I used xc and love it.

[piaffeprincess98]

I use it as well. It is a good version of the Wonderbit for my guy since he has a sensitive mouth.

[sch1star]

That's a really interesting looking bit. I have a white mouthed guy too, thanks for the idea!

The other thing that's really helped with my little guy is to keep the bit sparkling clean. I guess it just removes other irritants to delicate skin? So his bit gets scrubbed right before every ride. Easy solution, but it works!

[Merle]

I use this bit and it's never caused any rubs on my sensitive skinned TB. I was told it's legal for dressage when I asked on here before (though I haven't used it at a recognized event yet):

http://www.adamshorsesupply.com/browse.cfm/4,5545.html

[Zu Zu]

Have you experimented with wrapping your bit with Latex - ? It comes in rolls - I use it on bits when starting colts - wrap the bit with a strip of latex and it cushions and gives them something soft to hold onto - can be found in most tack stores and around race tracks. Also can be easily removed if need be. Need more information just pm me.

[jules2001]

Hi! I tried this bit on my sensitive guy and he didn't care for it. I did check with the TD before an event and I was told it was legal for dressage. However, that was last summer when this bit was, I think, new to the market. Sent you a PM.

[Janet]

It is legal for straight Dressage (see pg 17 of the Dressage Equipment Booklet) but not for Eventing Dressage (it is considered a bit guard). If you do a search, there is a post from Malcolm Hook (msghook is his user name ) explaining that. (or at least, it wasn't at the time of the post. It COULD have changed but I haven't heard anything.)
http://chronicleforums.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=154308

Haver you tried eggbutt snaffles? or a full cheek? some of them have a similar profile.

[Saskatoonian]

I volunteered at an event last summer where the TD ruled this bit illegal for dressage - fortunately, the trainer had asked about it well before the rider tacked up and they'd brought a clearly legal spare.

wouldn't a fulmer serve the same purpose? Last time I looked at the legal bit pictures, they included one.

[cgray0983]

I use the gag version, and LOVE it - I have used the snaffle version and I think both are great. No rubs, and its a lot gentler when you have to make tight turns in the jumper ring.

[CatchMeIfUCan]

Thanks for all the replies and the other link! Maybe I will try the Stubben Wings one, the Herm Sprenger, latex, and a Fulmer to see what he like best. And unfortunately, eggbutts do the same thing to him. Horses can never be easy, right?!

[macsmum]

There are two versions of the Golden Wings bit...one is a plain snaffle (the one the OP linked to), the other is very similar to a Wonder Bit. The Wonder Bit version is illegal in dressage, but I would think the snaffle version would be fine. I think of the "golden wings" as integrated bit guards - and bit guards aren't illegal in dressage, are they? Anyway, I have the wonder bit type and my TB goes really well it, but it rubs him if I use it too often. We did Denny's camp last summer and jumped three days in a row, and my guy had little sores from the metal rubbing his lips. Now I only use the bit once or twice a week at most, when we jump. I definitely couldn't use the snaffle version as an every day bit for my horse.

[Janet]

I think of the "golden wings" as integrated bit guards - and bit guards aren't illegal in dressage, are they?
Actually, bit guards ARE illegal. For both straight Dressage and Eventing Dressage.

Dressage-
DR121.6. Martingales, bit guards, any kind of gadgets (such as bearing, side, running, balancing
reins, nasal strips, tongue tied down, etc.), any kind of boots (including “easy-boots”) or bandages
(including tail bandages) and any form of blinkers, earmuffs or plugs, nose covers, seat
covers, hoods are, under penalty of elimination, strictly forbidden.

Eventing -
Permitted for warm up
EV115 Saddlery.
1. EXERCISE AREAS. The following restrictions begin at 3:00 p.m. of the day prior to the
start of the entire competition and continue throughout the duration of the event. The following
are compulsory: an English type saddle and any form of bridle, including double bridle,
snaffle, gag or hackamores. Running martingales with rein stops, Irish martingales, bit
guards, boots, bandages, fly shields, nose covers, and seat covers are permitted. Side
reins are permitted only while lunging an unmounted horse, as are running reins and chambons.
Other martingales, any form of gadget (such as a bearing, running or balancing reins,
etc.) and any form of blinkers, are forbidden, under penalty of disqualification.
But not in the Dressage arena

EV 115.2 (DRESSAGE TEST) .e. Martingales, bit guards, any kind of gadgets (such as bearing, side, running or balancing
reins, etc.), reins with any loops or hand attachments, any kind of boots or leg
bandages and any form of blinkers, including earmuffs, earplugs, hoods, fly shields,
nose covers and seat covers are, under penalty of elimination, strictly forbidden.
However, under exceptional circumstances, fly shields may be permitted by the Ground
Jury.

[Saskatoonian]

FWIW, the bit nixed by the TD at the event I was at was the regular loose ring version - only potential issue was the "bit guard" part.

[beeblebrox]

This was my response from the last thread. I had emailed and called the USEA and usdf both told me USEF does the decisions and this was the answer: I was told not legal for REAL dressage shows and was told same thing by TD at event, TD said some people slide through because not all folks bit checking no what to look for but they are considered bit guards. I had spent some time asking as I had a student with a drafty cross who likes it a lot, and in the end she was told NO for both dressage shows and events.


beeblebrox
Working Hunter

Join Date: Jul. 22, 2005
Location: Washington state
Posts: 833
The bit is not legal for dressage in the real world the event usef rep is out today
Thank you for your inquiry below. Unfortunately, this bit pictured below is not legal for Dressage Competition as it does not conform to any of the bits pictured in DR Figure 1. I am only able to give you a clarification for the Dressage Discipline. Shealagh Costello is the Director of National Eventing and should be able to help you with this bit question relating to Eventing.

Thank you,

Jenny Van Wieren
United States Equestrian Federation, Inc.
Assistant Director of Dressage
Direct Dial: 859-225-6949
Fax: 859-231-6662


http://www.bitofbritain.com/St_bben_...ffle_p/382.htm

AND From
Is this bit legal


USDF does not govern which bits are legal for competition in dressage.
You would need to contact USEF and their phone number is 859 258 2472.
Thank you!


Sincerely,

Ms. Brydon Christensen
Competition Management Services Coordinator
United States Dressage Federation
4051 Iron Works Parkway
Lexington KY, 40511
Phone: 859-271-7886
Fax: 859-971-7722
USDF is "Going Green." Join us.


From Sharon:

The actually approval would have come from the USEF. I cannot remember
whether this met their approval or not. I will forward the photo (thanks for
including it) to Shealagh Costello, USEF Director of Eventing for
clarification.



Sharon Gallagher, Director
Sport Services
703.779.0440 x 3005

[macsmum]

Thank you , Janet! I stand humbly corrected. :)

[Janet]

Breetlebox,

You might want to check with the USEF again to see if they have changed their mind (for straight dressage) since 2005.

This document (dated 2008 - 2009)
http://www.usef.org/documents/FormsPubs/DressageEquipmentBooklet.pdf
shows examples of legal and illegal bits (for straight dressage).

The second bit on page 17, with the text "This type of loose ring snaffle is LEGAL for dressage." looks to me like a bit with "wings".

If it ISN'T legal, they should change the booklet.

[beeblebrox]

Janet

Take a closer look: The herm sprenger in that photo on Page 17 is nothing like the action of the
Stübben Golden Wings (with out gag holders) which really wraps around the mouth. The herm sprenger bit is very small in comparison. Look at the two bits together and you will see they are different and that is what the steward was trying in vein at show last weekend when dressage lady brought the picture on page 17.. To steward at this dressage show it is not the same thing... Very confusing indeed.


You can click on photo in this link to make it bigger to see how large wings are, almost like metal bit guards:
http://www.vtosaddlery.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=SGWSB

and look at the sprenger and see they are not the same thing: (this is bit from page 17 in your link)
http://www.adamshorsesupply.com/browse.cfm/4,5545.html

I guess it may just depend on WHO is checking your bit but what a shame to be eliminated for someone's mistake?

Lastly Janet the emails I posted from USEF, USDF and USEA were from fall 2008, so maybe changes since 2008?


Breetlebox,

You might want to check with the USEF again to see if they have changed their mind (for straight dressage) since 2005.

This document (dated 2008 - 2009)
http://www.usef.org/documents/FormsP...entBooklet.pdf
shows examples of legal and illegal bits (for straight dressage).

The second bit on page 17, with the text "This type of loose ring snaffle is LEGAL for dressage." looks to me like a bit with "wings".

If it ISN'T legal, they should change the booklet.

[Janet]

If you say so.

I have not seen the bits in person, but from the pictures it looks as if they are functionally the same, just different in size/proportion.

If that is the case, then it would be really helpful if they had TWO pidtures in teh guidelines- one saying "this is legal" and one saying "this is not legal".

[beeblebrox]

"Janet

I have not seen the bits in person, but from the pictures it looks as if they are functionally the same, just different in size/proportion.

If that is the case, then it would be really helpful if they had TWO pictures in the guidelines- one saying "this is legal" and one saying "this is not legal"."


If you saw them in person you would understand, one bit has HUGE metal guards and one is barley there in comparison. Although the pictures above are pretty good! But like I said you may get lucky but there is a WHOLE lot of confusion about it even sometimes from show steward to show steward. Which is why I took the time to email folks at the aforementioned groups! :-) I really could not guess but when I have emails from powers that be and Stewards saying no we just lost the bit because what it the point really you know! :-)

[msghook]

Approved for USEF Dressage, not approved for USEF Eventing Dressage.

Malcolm