Who gets prizes/ribbons?

[PracticalCat]

Here's my question as the mom of a brand new eventer: When you ride someone else's horse and you and the horse owner split the entry fee, is there a rule or tradition about who gets the ribbon/prize?

[Dale Area 1]

I am a ribbon whore. LOL. If there is cash, saddle pads, etc. the rider can have it. I just want the ribbon. :)

[HER]

My owner used to pay all the bills but didn't care at all about getting the ribbons or prizes. I guess I was just lucky that way- I always assumed the person paying got the spoils. When you split bills I don't know- maybe alternate?
Now I have to pay all my own bills...
-Helen

[mvp]

Yes, whoever pays the fees. When I rode someone else's horse, I always offered them the spoils. The contest was, after all, about the horse and not me. Sometimes they took the ribbon and gave me the pad.

I guess it depends on how important the prizes are to each side. I'd opt for offering first and seeing if they don't return the favor.

[PracticalCat]

Maybe I'll just pay the next entry entirely. The rider has just turned 14 and is still completely enchanted by ribbons. If it were me riding, I wouldn't care, but the ribbons are still a big deal to her.

[WalkerEvntr]

It all depends on the owner. Some want the goods, some don't. I myself like the extra bling for the tack room. In the big picture though, the win is still on your record regardless of who has the ribbon.

[Jaegermonster]

Generally I think it's whomever pays the fees. When I was showing horses for other people sometimes they would give me the ribbons, sometimes not. They usually kept whatever year end prizes the horse won, unless it was one of those people who walked out with 5 sheets, 6 halters etc, then they would give me something. But I got to show nice horses for free so who cares?
Now that I'm the owner, I pay my trainer to show my horse (for lots of reasons, but that's another thread). I usually keep everything, since i paid for it (and I'm a ribbon ho too) and I figure my trainer gets herself out there riding a nice horse and being seen, so it works out. But I'm also not a "stand around with my camera" owner either. Usually she shows o/f and I do the flat classes, plus I also play groom for my horse and help out with the others.

**that said, if I were letting a kid show my horse, say in an eq class or if she needed the experience or whatever and it meant something to the kid I would let the kid keep the ribbons. I still have my ribbons from when I was a kid, and I'm almost 41, and they all still mean the world to me.

[PracticalCat]

The owner (who is not riding right now because of fear issues)says she looks at it this way: Her 6 year old horse is getting experience and show miles (plus points) and my 14 year old gets experience and show miles while her horse is in training.
I guess it's something we'll need to hash out together.
Tehy just went to their first recognized event and took a 5th and she said she'll allow my daughter to keep the booty at the first event but at the next, much bigger event she'd want it. I just wondered if there was a hard and fast rule that people went by.

[subk]

Maybe I'll just pay the next entry entirely. The rider has just turned 14 and is still completely enchanted by ribbons. If it were me riding, I wouldn't care, but the ribbons are still a big deal to her.
In my book 14 year old riders not only get to wear neon colors and petal bell boots but they also get to keep the $5 strip of satin! Ask the owner if daughter can keep the ribbons but give up any prizes that might be won to the owner.

[deltawave]

I'd think it pretty strange for a trainer to be making a fuss about keeping a ribbon when riding a kid's horse! Ditto for an owner. Let the person who enjoys the ribbon the most keep it. Money and actual swag goes to the person paying the entry fees. Not that this happens to me very often, but if any horse of mine wins something (Bonnie won $30 last year, woohoo!) with my trainer riding, the trainer gets a gift at some point. :) If there were a really nice piece of equipment or something, I'd offer it to the trainer/rider who actually won it. :yes:

[PracticalCat]

No trainer involved. It's my 14 year old daughter riding a 40 year old woman's 6 year old horse. My daughter's own horse is in training and not quite ready to event yet.

[deltawave]

I'm quite fond of ribbons but would feel like an ass insisting that a teenager give me the one they'd won on my horse. :)

[evans36]

OK so I've only been involved with show mgt on the local level, but have you thought about asking the mgt if you can just pay them for an extra ribbon if your daughter wins? I mean, most of the ribbons I know of just have the name of the farm on them, and whenever we do a show we always order extra. They might be fine with you each having one if you pay the $2 for an extra ribbon (especially if you explain to them it's about a 14 year old who likes pretty pieces of cheapo satin... we've all been there!).

[rivenoak]

Let the person who enjoys the ribbon the most keep it.

But in this situation, that assumes the owner doesn't care. And apparently she does, as she was only willing to give up the ribbon this one time. Who decides who enjoys it more?

I WISH I had all the ribbons my first hunter won with the lessees, and I might have enjoyed that satin more than they did, but they paid the entry fees. So, they kept the ribbons. As did the owners who paid entries for the various horses I showed.

Then, there was the one owner who, although I paid the jumper's entries, took the prize money. :eek::mad: (And I often counted on jumper winnings to pay for the hunter I'd have a show.)

She who pays, keeps-- or gets to give away at her discretion.

[LLDM]

Ribbons, in my experience, stay with the horse - who did the lion's share of the heavy lifting. So that would be the owner or the lessor of the horse at the time of the event. This is also (conveniently) the traditional "payer of show fees". But if not and it is not clear, then generally prizes (ribbons, money, stuff) go to the person who supports the horse (pays for feed, board, vets, shoes, etc., etc. etc.).

IMHO - if a 14 yo is lucky enough to be provided a mount to show/event, they should be grateful enough for the opportunity to have a mount capable of placing. :D I will say that the H/J kids learn this lesson early. Most owners will share, but it is not to be expected.

SCFarm

[deltawave]

Man, that is just cold. :) I agree that whoever pays ought to get the booty, but I personally would just feel like a selfish jerk demanding that a teenager hand over her fifty cent treasure. :rolleyes:

[Gnep]

were I come from, the horse wins the ribbon, money to the owner other loot to the rider

[LLDM]

Man, that is just cold. :) I agree that whoever pays ought to get the booty, but I personally would just feel like a selfish jerk demanding that a teenager hand over her fifty cent treasure. :rolleyes:

It's not meant to be cold at all. It USED to be that catch riders were pretty much Professionals and all fees were paid by the owners. The catch riders were also paid to ride by the owners. So it was quite clear. Then Ami's and Jr's started to catch ride, but owners were still paying. It started to get complicated - because owners were providing horses, not for fun, but to build the resume on horses - usually for sale. The ribbons were to go on horse's stall and in owners' tack-rooms to build resumes, farm and breeder reputations. Ami's and Jr's got free rides on really nice horses. Generous owner's usually shared something of the spoils, depending on WHY they provided the horse in the first place and what was appropriate to the situation. Kids were expect to understand how lucky they were to get a nice ride.

It's a badge of honor in H/J land for kids to hand the ribbons over to the owner. It means the kid is good enough to catch ride! I.e. ride free on nice horses.

Added - I realize that this model is weird for eventing - but all of eventing is weird these days.

SCFarm

[Robin@DHH]

I had always heard the same a the previous poster; ribbons and
prizes to the owner EXCEPT for classes in equitation where it
is the rider rather than the horse who is judged. In those classes,
the ribbon was to go to the rider. If for some reason both parties
would like to have the ribbon, perhaps the owner or rider would
be happy to have a photograph of the competitor with the ribbon
taken with the show logo as backdrop.

[joiedevie99]

I've always heard ribbons and prizes to the owner, regardless of who is paying. If the owner chooses to pass some of those things on, or give the rider a gift or thank you card instead, that is their choice.

[Kementari]

Traditionally, the loot goes to thems as paid the bills.

In my own life, though, I'm with deltawave: I can't imagine taking a ribbon away from a kid, no matter who paid the entry fees!

In fact, I've always had whoever showed my horse keep the ribbons and prizes (I don't think any of them have ever won anything in the way of money, so that's never come up), regardless of age. Honestly, I love my ribbons as much as the next person, but at the end of the day it IS a $2 bit of cloth, and I've got plenty. Plus, though the horse and I may have done a lot of work beforehand, he wouldn't have won that particular ribbon if the rider hadn't taken him in the class, ya know? If the rider doesn't want it, I'll take it, and happily, but if the rider wants it, it's theirs (one young rider's parents thought it was important that she give credit to the horse and owner by giving the ribbons up, and in that case we split them - I got half and she got half, so she was happy, I was happy, and the parents were happy!).

Of course, I also give the ribbons I win catch-riding other people's horses to them without a second thought (even when I've paid), so I guess I work both sides of the street. ;)

[joharavhf]

Maybe I'll just pay the next entry entirely. The rider has just turned 14 and is still completely enchanted by ribbons. If it were me riding, I wouldn't care, but the ribbons are still a big deal to her.

WOW :eek: I'm surprised the owner is having a hissy about a ribbon! Bad on her!

I would say in your situation I would see if she'll trade off for each competition. In a situation where the rider is being paid to ride then the winnings go to the owner. That obviously doesn't apply here. I'm just surprised a 40 year old person would be that silly about a ribbon. Hey, why don't you just call up hodges and have them print a duplicate and foot the bill for it??? You can usually do that for about $20.....(And THAT is a FANCY ribbon - I do year end awards for a local organization and our ribbons are gorgeous.)

[Gry2Yng]

I'm quite fond of ribbons but would feel like an ass insisting that a teenager give me the one they'd won on my horse. :)

Well put. LOL! Still LingOL! I mostly keep ribbons now for my 2 yo to play with. The pink and green ones get thrown on the grass pretty quickly?!?!?!? What's up with that?

Person who paid the entry gets the prize.

[Speedy]

Let me first say, I really think the kid should get to keep the ribbon. However, if this is a big deal to the owner, you may not want to rock the boat over it. The kid is getting a really, really nice benefit if she isn't paying to lease the horse, and should be grateful for the opportunity. It is a complete bummer that the adult isn't, well, an adult about the matter of the ribbon, but there are worse things in life and she could learn a valuable lesson from this if you discuss it in the right way with her. If I were you (or more to the point, the kid), I'd rather have a happy owner and a horse to ride than a ribbon. The kid is probably mature enough to do the adult thing, even if the adult isn't.

[4Martini]

When I half leased a horse that belonged to a 14yo I gave her all the booty even though I paid entries etc. It made her so happy that I couldn't imagine doing otherwise.

[IronwoodFarm]

About 10 years ago, I had a mare going to recognized HTs with an 18 year old catch rider. I paid for everything. I let her keep every ribbon she won. I couldn't imagine doing otherwise.

If the ribbon is a huge deal, I would ask the organizer if a second ribbon can be purchased. I wouldn't try going the Hodges route. Hodges will not sell ribbons from an account to someone who is not on that account without express permission from the account holder. It's going to be much cheaper to buy a second ribbon at the show.

[Jazzy Lady]

If the ribbon is going to be a big deal, switch off paying entry fees. Whoever pays for the fees at each show keeps the ribbon. Owner always keeps loot.

[Sebastian]

Sheesh... Yeah, the "tradition" comes from the fact that Catch Riders were pros or wanna-be pros...

BUT -- in this situation... 40 yr old owner is a total BE-OTCH for not letting the kid have the ribbons. Totally with dw on this one.

Seb :)

[PracticalCat]

Seriously, the owner is a very nice lady and a friend. I just wondered if there was a protocol to follow.
We both are getting a good deal: she is because she needs someone to ride the horse (my daughter is his only rider) and we pay a trainer to teach my daughter on the horse, and as the trainer says, the horse is being trained while they ride. Plus the horse (since he's young) is getting alot of exposure and will be more experienced when the owner and her 10 year old daughter move up to him.
My daughter gets a nice horse to ride this summer (plus last winter and spring) and to take her C2 USPC rating on which really lets her develop as a rider while her own horse comes along slowly and surely.
I think I'll ask event organizers to buy an extra ribbon. Sounds like a good idea. If she places of course.:D

[BarbB]

I've always heard ribbons and prizes to the owner, regardless of who is paying. If the owner chooses to pass some of those things on, or give the rider a gift or thank you card instead, that is their choice.

That's the way it has always been (traditionally). Horse shows, horse racing, dog shows.
That said, I cannot imagine any adult owner expecting a child who won a ribbon to hand it over....the idea comes from having professionals ride/handle your animal...they don't want your ribbons.

[hb]

I agree that whoever pays the entry fees gets the ribbons and prizes.

However, I can understand a 40 year old with fear issues wanting to keep the ribbons that her horse won if that is as close to showing as she is going to get for now.

And a 14 year old at the beginning of her riding career could be glad she is getting a good start and she could know she will have plenty of ribbons on her own horses by the time she's 40, and she could let the lady keep the ribbons so she has something from the experience.

Just another way to look at it. I imagine that the owner is not happy to be missing out on riding and showing, even if she doesn't say so, and she is very generous to let the kid have fun on her horse.

[sidepasser]

Well from my take, the owner is getting a deal in return, she has teen riding her horse and teen's mom paying trainer for lessons on her horse which is in turn training her horse that she is afraid to ride. So I'd say the two parties are about equal here.

I'm 50 and couldn't take a ribbon from a child rider. I'd take a PICTURE of said child with my horse and ribbon, frame it and hang it, that would be good enough for me as it seems those bits of cloth mean so much to children (I still have my ribbons from my teen years as they were hard to come by as I didn't have a coach or trainer and had to learn on my own on green beans that were cheap).

On another note, one of my boarders that stayed with me for 9 years gave me their bronze medal they won steeplechasing (pony steeplechasing) as he said I encouraged him to "go for it" on his one eyed half arab mare. Mare was a saint about everything and she was a "saved from the KB" mare because crapola owner didn't want to pay to treat an eye infection..sigh. I took mare, rehabbed her, sold her kid's parents for cost of treatment (cheap treatment at that) and said mare toted kid everywhere and he did well in eventing up to novice level with her. I still have that medal hanging in my office with his picture of the win..I'll never forget that he gave me his medal that he worked so hard for.

If owner absolutely must have the ribbon and the swag (of course that should go to owner), then buy a second ribbon for child to have, and take lots and lots of video and pictures of child with horse. Never know, you might have the next Olympian there - at any rate, it will mean a great deal to the child.

[LLDM]

I've thought about this thread all morning. It disturbs me a great deal. I guess I am just a meanie poo pants, but I can't believe that people here think the owner is out of line. This is why more people don't share their horses with young riders.

The owner risks the horse's soundness every time it goes out. We all know that one bad step can be career ending for a horse. Life is short and anything can happen. That ribbon may end up being the only thing the owner has to remember her horse. (Brought up by someone who has lost a young horse to illness.) At 14 years old and ready to rate up to a C2 on a nice borrowed horse, it is not too soon to be learning how lucky she is. Let alone how it is not all about the ribbons. Learning to be proud (or not) of one's own performance no matter what the final standings, is a lesson that can't, IMHO, be taught too young.

Yes, the owner is getting something out of this deal. But, IMHO, the kid is getting more. And she needs to understand at this point that the horse is winning the ribbon. No one is talking about taking her Pony Club prizes/ribbons/medals. They ARE earned by the Pony Clubber. And she is being provided a nice horse to do just that.

SCFarm

[PracticalCat]

Hey. Just so you know. The kid is grateful. Very grateful. I simply asked if there was a protocol involved because we're new to the sport and the owner is too. We didn't want to ask if it was out of line.

[LLDM]

Hey. Just so you know. The kid is grateful. Very grateful. I simply asked if there was a protocol involved because we're new to the sport and the owner is too. We didn't want to ask if it was out of line.

Hey, I am not annoyed at you - or your kid. I think it is fine to ask. I AM a bit annoyed at the posters making not-so-nice assumptions about the owner and calling her a "Be-otch" among other things.

I have spent a good deal of time around hunter folks, and this comes up frequently. It is generally used as a "teachable moment" - as any kid with a "gifted competition horse" is far enough along to get the "be grateful" speech.

I love my ribbons as much as the next person (or kid). And still have the one's I have from my youth I won on my horse and pony - who are long gone now. But there are other ribbons, from other horses who are long gone, that are with their owners too. And I am just as proud of those ribbons and am even happier they are where they are.

SCFarm

[PracticalCat]

I just wanted to be sure that no one thinks that my daughter is one of those "gimmee" kids. This girl has huge reasons to be grateful. Not only does she get to ride this horse, but her own horse is an immensely talented WB cross that was given to her by a breeder on another forum who said she admired my daughter's persistence and drive. My daughter knows she's one of the luckiest girls around. Luckily, she behaves like it too. She makes me very proud.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

Instead of ribbons...get her to focus on another "prize". Tell her that if she places...you will buy her one of her pictures. Then start an album of them and put the results under each picture. Also take a picture of her with the horse and the prizes. Make it a tradition.


Ribbons were never important to me...even as a kid...every person (and kid) is different. But what I think is important is some sort of keep sake.

[Risk-Averse Rider]

But in this situation, that assumes the owner doesn't care. And apparently she does, as she was only willing to give up the ribbon this one time. Who decides who enjoys it more?

She who pays, keeps-- or gets to give away at her discretion.When rivenoak's son rode The Princess in a lead line class, they got joint custody of the ribbon :D

She took it home initially because... I forget exactly why. Someone was coming into town or something, and she wanted to show off.

Now Billy Bob has it.

And he has his "own" horse, of course... whom he deigns to let rivenoak train for him :lol: :lol: :lol:

[LR1976]

I'm quite fond of ribbons but would feel like an ass insisting that a teenager give me the one they'd won on my horse. :)


:yes:

[Ilex]

The owner.

[VCT]

I agree with LLDM on this one. I think ribbons go to owners unless it's a paying Leaser. Maybe it's because I came up in H/J land, but I agree with LLDM totally on this.

Yes both parties are getting something nice out of the situation but it's still the owners horse and she's paying the horses bills.

I agree I find it troubling to see people being negative towards the owner because she wants the ribbons her horse earns.

I will admit when my horses were first showing I wanted their ribbons. I didn't have horses or the opportunity to show when I was younger and when I was in my early 20's I was riding other peoples horses. The owners got the ribbons. The nutty horse I owned at the time couldn't handle the show atmosphere. So yeah, I got to keep my first ribbon ever at the age of 29 and it was from someone else showing one of my horses. Thankfully the rider didn't care about the ribbons. But then she was a mature beyond her years teen with plenty of show experience and plenty ahead of her and knew it was the first time I was getting to bring one of my own horses to a show, even if I wasn't riding.

Now my back is doing better so hopefully sometime soon I'll be the one out there riding my own horse at shows! :)

[rivenoak]

When rivenoak's son rode The Princess in a lead line class, they got joint custody of the ribbon :D

She took it home initially because... I forget exactly why. Someone was coming into town or something, and she wanted to show off.

Now Billy Bob has it.

And he has his "own" horse, of course... whom he deigns to let rivenoak train for him :lol: :lol: :lol:

Say, isn't it time for the ribbon to go back to your house? We never did work out who gets it for summer break, Xmas, etc. :winkgrin:

[Peggy]

Coming from HJ land, the tradition in our barn is that the person who pays the class fee keeps the ribbon and any assorted loot.

I was extremely lucky to have the ride on a very nice horse (one that actually won flat classes:lol:) to take lessons on and show last summer and fall. Mine was laid up and they needed an o/f ride b/w the trainer ride and the owner's ride to get the horse better for the owner. Didn't pay a lease fee. Didn't pay training. Did pay to take the horse to some of the shows totally on my own dime, including trainer rides in open classes. Did buy the owner several photos of the horse in action with the trainer and with me and a number of bottles of really nice wine. At the finals show, the only one with what I would consider good loot (jackets, sweat shirts, saddle pads), I gave sweat shirts that the horse won to the owner and to both barn trainers, as well as to the person who got up at 5 am to hand walk my horse at home. The owner won a jacket on her horse which, to me, was the best part of the whole show. I paid all the fees, including the entry fee for the one and only class the owner showed in. Yes, I know how lucky I was for that opportunity.

[Balista]

This is the way I handled it many times......

$ ..... goes towards advancing the horse that won it ..... something he needed.
Stuff....if winning horse could use then he got it ...if not...given to someone who could....
Ribbon....rider.

As an owner, just watching my horses do well was the reward I wanted and needed. At the end of the day......success is measured in happiness. I was fortunate to have riders who respected my wishes. Now... if we'd won Rolex....may have been a little different:lol:

[gottagrey]

Generally the ribbons & prizes go to the owner (which is usually those who are paying the bills) as it's the Horse that's won EXCEPT in equitation classes where rider is judged. Having said that, I am an ower 40+ and have let jr. riders show my horse - no way would I want any of the ribbons or prices they won. But every person is different. I have a couple of friends also 40+ and I dont' know if they would give up a ribbon or not. i would suggest doing one of 2 things... should the pair place - offer up the ribbon to owner (who hopefully will say "no you keep it" or 2) hang it up on horses stall and if horse is anything like mine will destroy said ribbon in no time - leaving nothing to debate over:lol:

[nextyear]

Speaking from experience: As a junior rider I rode several horses that were not mine for owners that wanted the horse to have a "junior rider resume" it was a win win situation as at the time my horse was to young to compete and my other horse had just retired.

All ribbons and prizes were always handed over to the owners, I never even gave it a second thought as I knew it was not my horse. As an aside: There was always a win photo that I kept (or a copy of) and that was a better treasure than a piece of polyester (silk in those days).

[goodpony]

All Ribbons and Prizes technically belong to the owner of the horse. I have a young girl who I adore who just started eventing my pony for me...she has no interest in prizes only in furthering her skill as a rider--I honestly don't think I could do better. I do what I can for her by providing lessons and training that is mutually beneficial for her and for my own interests as the owner. This is them this weekend, they took third at training level and we were thrilled.