Competition-medication declaration & withdrawal times-need help!

[flshgordon]

My mare developed an abcess a couple days ago and of course we are scheduled for a show this weekend competing Fri, Sat & Sun. Vet was out yesterday, dug it out, seems to have provided some relief and hopefully we are on the right track to recovery now. He gave me Equioxx to use because mare is prone to ulcers and was already on Bute 2 days which I was not thrilled about.

I've never had a horse be on any medication even within a week of a show, so I want to know what the protocol is for "declaring"---if that is even the right word? I'm hoping that tomorrow would be her last dose of Equioxx, but there is a possibility she would need it Thursday morning. Do I need to notify the show of what she has been given and why? The vet told me at least 12 hours before competition because that is the USEF rule, for me that is cutting it too close and I'll go probably 24 at the minimum but do I still need to declare it and file some paperwork with the show?

[Reiter]

I think it is actually 24hrs before the show that the horse has to be taken off the substance.
I would call USEF and ask them about your particular case when in doubt. Better safe than sorry on this kind of thing! Good luck and speedy healing!

[Simkie]

Why don't you email the USEF drug people and ask?

http://www.usef.org/contentpage2.aspx?id=dm

Here's a release from them about firocoxib: http://www.usef.org/_IFrames/newsDisplay/viewPR.aspx?id=2228

[DMK]

I would read the rule carefully because you should not leave this stuff up to the interweb tubes, but my understanding of the rule is that equioxx and bute (as long as it doesn't exceed the legal limits) are legal to use together and through a show, no D&M form needed, no withdrawal time other than the usual requirement of not sooner than 12 hours out from each day of competition (meaning you can legally give both bute and equioxx each nigh before each day's competition). There are add'l duration limits on bute (not for more than 5 days in a row) and I believe the limits for equioxx are longer, but I haven't bothered to look at the rule since that drug was added.

The only rules against stacking are bute and banamine. For some unfathomable reason you are allowed to stack practically every other NSAID that has been introduced to the market. :rolleyes:

[touchstone-]

A second vote for calling USEF. The D&M people there are really nice about answering questions like this.

Both of those medications are permitted at therapeutic doses, but you're usually not allowed to use more than one NSAID medication at a time--it's considered stacking. In general, I've been told to wait at least one week for bute to "clear" the horse's system entirely. Giving the Equioxx Thursday is probably fine. But I'd worry about him testing positive for the bute--and hence both substances--at the show.

[horsepoor]

Contact the Drugs and Med people at USEF and ask them. They will know. Don't count on what your vet says -- my vet always tells me things that are not in line with USEF rules (he really doesn't know them) so I always check with them (USEF). I'm not sure on the withdrawal times, but having both bute and equioxx show up together would (I think) be a big no-no. But the USEF D&M folks are great about answering such questions.

[flshgordon]

Why don't you email the USEF drug people and ask?

http://www.usef.org/contentpage2.aspx?id=dm

Here's a release from them about firocoxib: http://www.usef.org/_IFrames/newsDisplay/viewPR.aspx?id=2228


Thanks, I have just emailed them for more info. It does specifically say 12 hours on their drug pamphlet, that part is not confusing. The confusing part to me is when you need to submit the medication report form that they have on the site. It asks for details of when, how much, who prescribed, reason, etc etc but doesn't say when/why you submit the form. Hopefully I will get an answer back soon!

Thanks :D

[flshgordon]

Contact the Drugs and Med people at USEF and ask them. They will know. Don't count on what your vet says -- my vet always tells me things that are not in line with USEF rules (he really doesn't know them) so I always check with them (USEF). I'm not sure on the withdrawal times, but having both bute and equioxx show up together would (I think) be a big no-no. But the USEF D&M folks are great about answering such questions.


I did check on this as well because she was on Bute for 3 doses before we switched to Equioxx. USEF says Nsaids will test for 7 days so I assume a tiny bit of Bute would still show up. Supposedly that is ok (according to their pamphlet) as long as you don't combine Bute & Banamine together. No idea why that is.

I'll let everyone know when they respond.

[DMK]

my purely speculative theory without so much as an ounce of truth or verifiable source is that the great variation on stacking NSAIDs is that the rule and any updates to said rule are not necessarily driven by vets. ;)

Once upon a time there was only bute and banamine and it was deemed they could not be stacked (and not without a fight). And then came ketaprofen and it was deemed stackable, and all was good in the world of showing. Then many other NSAIDs like arqual, surpass and equioxx came upon the land and it was deemed most excellent and everybody agreed to not look at that antiquated 2 drug no stacking rule because that would not be nearly as much fun but everyone agreed that no more than two seemed reasonable.

However all that aside, I do like the flexibility of the rule in responsible hands. I have an older horse who I like to give a little bit of help on his one hard school the weekend before a show. If I gave him bute that weekend, even if it was only 1 gram, that meant I couldn't use banamine at the show even if that might have been a better choice for that show. But the flexibility of the rule allows him to have equioxx the weekend before after that hard school, and that leaves me free to choose bute or banamine at a show.

But there's plenty of room for abuse in that rule as well.

[horsepoor]

On the forms -- I had a horse that was on antihistamines for allergies and we would stop giving them before the show, and I would fill out the form the day I arrived at the show (got the form from the steward back then, not online) and submit to the steward before my horse's first class. Of course, that was awhile ago and so it might have changed -- USEF will surely let you know when they answer your e-mail.

[flshgordon]

Just to let everyone know, there is no medication report required in connection with these Nsaids, I still don't know when that's required because they didn't answer that, just that I did not need one. And other than that, they just spit the drug pamphlet info back re: 12 hours pre-competition, etc.

thanks!

[Reiter]

You fill out the report at the show. The show office will have all the paperwork, but if USEF says you don't need to file then I guess that means you're good to go! Have a great show! :)

[mvp]

DMK, thanks for the informative post.

I loved the info, but especially the history, additional drugs deemed stackable being "good" "excellent" and "not to examined too carefully... just be quiet!"

I learned something, thought hard and laughed all in one post.