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View Full Version : Metal poles that look like regular wood poles?? (NOT GM related)



Dune
Apr. 7, 2009, 11:28 PM
Do you guys use these? I visited a friend's farm and the noise the horses made going over the poles was different. I investigated and the poles look to be metal, fairly light. Does anyone use these? Are they legal? What is the purpose of using them?

eqrider1234
Apr. 7, 2009, 11:34 PM
.... i think i hear the train coming :lol:

superpony123
Apr. 7, 2009, 11:57 PM
chugga chugga CHOO CHOO! :winkgrin:

fourmares
Apr. 8, 2009, 02:22 AM
Are you sure they weren't PVC? I've never seen people use metal poles that are the same size as regular poles.

_downpour_
Apr. 8, 2009, 04:49 AM
errr... i wouldn't...ever....especially after reading one of those old threads about an incident involving a metal pole.....

i believe the purpose of using metal poles is so they make a louder noise when they drop? e.g. the horse gets a fright from the 'clatter' of the pole? correct?

JustJump
Apr. 8, 2009, 07:20 AM
Oh stop.

Dune, it depends on what you mean by "metal pole." Do you mean a metal rail? Full sized, like a wood or PVC rail? On a single jump? Or every jump? Are you sure of what you are describing?

An offset? Your description isn't clear, lots of things are 'fair' to pose to an experienced horse that would be quite dangerous when used on a green horse. So many training decisions entail judgement, skill, and experience. Blanket statements are normally not correct all the time.

Maybe you meant a metal pipe, the size of a bamboo, resting on the top rail of a jump? A freaky accident happened with such a metal pole during a GM session a few years back in WPB, impaling the horse, causing its death. Using hindsight, precautions that could have been taken to make the exercise safer (tennis balls capping the ends of the poles) might have prevented the accident from being serious. Hindsight is great when you can use it.

(There, now the train has pulled out of the station, those who can't stop yourselves, just have at it.).

Actually accidents are not unheard of when using old PVC, which shatters, and can create very sharp edges. Accidents are not unheard of when using wood, particularly without safety release cups. And anything can be dangerous when approached without sufficient experience.

So the correct answer to your question is, "it depends."

gg4918
Apr. 8, 2009, 08:29 AM
I was just about to bring up the GM accident.

Dune
Apr. 8, 2009, 01:46 PM
Oh stop.

Dune, it depends on what you mean by "metal pole." Do you mean a metal rail? Full sized, like a wood or PVC rail? On a single jump? Or every jump? Are you sure of what you are describing?


First of all, thanks for stopping, or at least slowing down the "train". :winkgrin: They are FULL-SIZE POLES that look like regular wood poles. I never even would've known the difference, but when the horses hit them, they made a "ting" sound and I was like :confused: Upon further investigation, they seem to be made of metal, they are definitely not the light PVC poles. So, does that help? I'm genuinely curious here because I take my horse for schooling sessions and I wanted to do some cavaletti work there but I'm not familiar with the equipment and not sure if I want to use it or not. ???

An offset? Your description isn't clear, lots of things are 'fair' to pose to an experienced horse that would be quite dangerous when used on a green horse. So many training decisions entail judgement, skill, and experience. Blanket statements are normally not correct all the time.


Totally agree, which is the reason for the question. :yes:

Maybe you meant a metal pipe, the size of a bamboo, resting on the top rail of a jump? A freaky accident happened with such a metal pole during a GM session a few years back in WPB, impaling the horse, causing its death. Using hindsight, precautions that could have been taken to make the exercise safer (tennis balls capping the ends of the poles) might have prevented the accident from being serious. Hindsight is great when you can use it.

NO, no, no, that's not what I'm referring to at all. :no: (I know all about that incident, see explanation above)


(There, now the train has pulled out of the station, those who can't stop yourselves, just have at it.).

Actually accidents are not unheard of when using old PVC, which shatters, and can create very sharp edges. Accidents are not unheard of when using wood, particularly without safety release cups. And anything can be dangerous when approached without sufficient experience.

So the correct answer to your question is, "it depends."


Absolutely correct, so given the clarification, what do you think about this equipment and what is the reason for using it? Most of the jumps (including the cavaletti) are of this material (whatever it is) but there are a few that are wood. Why would you have those types of poles, I've never seen them anywhere else? TIA!

:)

HARROLDhasmyheart
Apr. 8, 2009, 04:03 PM
The only reasons I could think of to use metal poles would be because they are durable and wouldn't chip like wood, and would probably make a louder noise when hit or dropped. However, if you have PVC or wooden poles, I'd strongly suggest using those...while they are not 100% accident free, as they both can shatter and splinter into sharp edges, IMHO they are far safer than metal poles. As well as far more commonplace.

poltroon
Apr. 8, 2009, 04:46 PM
The only reasons I could think of to use metal poles would be because they are durable and wouldn't chip like wood, and would probably make a louder noise when hit or dropped. However, if you have PVC or wooden poles, I'd strongly suggest using those...while they are not 100% accident free, as they both can shatter and splinter into sharp edges, IMHO they are far safer than metal poles. As well as far more commonplace.

As someone who experienced significant lacerations from falling on a PVC jump, I think a full size capped metal pole would probably be safer... but it would also be heavy, inconvenient, and quite a bit more expensive than wood.

Dune
Apr. 9, 2009, 12:55 PM
Oh, so now that it's not a train wreck, no one is interested??:p Or is this barn the only one with these things? :confused:

eqrider1234
Apr. 9, 2009, 12:58 PM
I would imagine that they are used to sting their legs if they hit them and make the ping sound you heard again if they hit them. I personally wouldnt use them, i dont want to use something that is going to break or give if a horse hits them

Kenike
Apr. 9, 2009, 01:08 PM
metal? As in aluminum (which, I would think, would be lighter and easier to move with a lovely "ting" when hit or falling)? I remember the GM story, but am not sure I'd be comfortable with the idea of using something like this.....

But then, I don't like PVC, either.

Secretariat1194
Apr. 9, 2009, 01:14 PM
Metal poles? That is very unsafe. PVC is used a lot at the higher levels but the only problem is if they fall down, they roll and could cause injury. Best are 8 side ground poles made from wood. They tend not to roll or move as easily and if they fall they stay in one place.

poltroon
Apr. 9, 2009, 06:57 PM
I don't see why a heavy metal pole would be any less safe than a wood pole, especially if the ends were capped. The problem is with a lightweight pole that might do something other than drop immediately to the base of the fence if it falls - and that can create a hazard regardless of the material.

eqrider1234
Apr. 10, 2009, 12:41 AM
a metal pole isnt going to break if it needs to thats the problem.

enjoytheride
Apr. 10, 2009, 06:16 AM
How often do wood poles actually break then? The only time I've ever broken a wood pole is if it was rotten already.

eqrider1234
Apr. 10, 2009, 09:11 AM
ive broken a wooden pole, and it wasnt rotted. Somehow (dont ask me how because i honestly dont know) on an oxer i was jumping when my mare hit it, it jammed in the cups and split right in the middle, if that would have been metal she most likely would have flipped..

BigDreams07
Apr. 10, 2009, 09:50 AM
I've only seen one super nice good quality wooden pole break. At medal finals this year over the second to last jump (big white oxer) A horse went up and the decided not to jump and its hoof came down on the pole, snapping it in half

ExJumper
Apr. 10, 2009, 10:19 AM
I just think that even if you DID want metal poles for some nefarious reason, they would be prohibitively expensive! I can't imagine what a course of metal poles would cost, even if you only used them as the top rails.

As far as PVC and wood, I love PVC for ground rails and fill, but the rails in the cup are always wood. I find that some horses just clomp the PVC and don't care because it's too light. But for those of us at barn where we have to build and tear down our courses frequently, using some PVC elements makes life a lot easier!

Dune
Apr. 12, 2009, 11:55 AM
I just found out they are aluminum, does anyone here have any experience with them?

EastCoastJumps
Apr. 15, 2009, 10:58 PM
I would definitly agree with many here that metal is probably not a good idea. If you are using a 3-1/2" round pipe, its going to be considerably heavier then a wood rail, or especially PVC/plastic. If it was aluminum, one I can't imagine what that would cost a rail, two aluminum is extremely soft and can even splinter.
Metal, if really that large 'could be' a fatal mistake if a horse refused or didn't make a jump. Metal at that scale would take a great deal of force to bend, pvc would most likely spinter and the wood would hopefully give way or crack enough to relieve tension. If for whatever reason the cup pins failed, or weren't breakway, this could definitly be a bad decision.
All in all, metal is probably bst left for plumbing and flagpoles!

pinkpolkadot491
Apr. 15, 2009, 11:22 PM
I've seen a NUMBER of solid, wooden poles break. Considering the situations, I was happy to see the poles break (I'm one such situation, the horse
's knees came down on the top rail...having a metal rail in this situation would have been EXTREMELY dangerous!). I have some square rails at home that I find the horses respect pretty well. When they rub a square rail, it stings a little more than one of the ocatagonal rails. However, I find that my horses are more careful over every jump, despite the fact that only about half of my jumps have the square rails.